Brexit has created chaos in Britain – nobody voted for this

[Eloquent pilgrim]

1 hour ago, RuamRudy said:

I can assure you that there is nothing faux about my outrage when it comes to racists, fascists and xenophobes. 

You forgot about islamaphobe’s, Nazis and burkaphobe’s; you'll loose your PC badge if your not careful

[RuamRudy]

8 minutes ago, Eloquent pilgrim said:

You forgot about islamaphobe’s, Nazis and burkaphobe’s; you'll loose your PC badge if your not careful

No worries - I suspect that I could rely upon you to keep my senses sharpened.

[The Renegade]

Quote

and that NI will remain part of the CU and SM

 

45 minutes ago, tebee said:

It's in the withdrawal bill that just been passed.

Sure it is tebee, especially if you are prone to delusions.

 

So do you suffer from delusions or can you refute this by posting the relevant part of the Withdrawal Bill that you apparently refer to ?

 

 

[billd766]

19 minutes ago, Eloquent pilgrim said:

 

Because it's about all that’s left in Grouse’s severely depleted arsenal

 

He never had that much to start with and a lot of that was dud anyway.

[SheungWan]

1 hour ago, The Renegade said:

Did you attend a special school tebee ?

Hopefully not yours.

[Eloquent pilgrim]

2 hours ago, RuamRudy said:

And drivel? Why do you consider it drivel? The definition of drivel is 'silly nonsense'. What aspect of his tweet is silly nonsense?

All of it, but that's exactly what you get from James O’Brien. Obsessive political correctness to feed his insatiable ego, and pander to the left wing groupies that hang on his every word.

 

He is a pious, smug, sanctimonious, condescending champagne-socialist public schoolboy remoaner, right up there with Geldof, Allen, JK Rowling and the crisp salesman. I’m not very keen on him myself, by the way.

[The Renegade]

3 minutes ago, SheungWan said:

Hopefully not yours.

Another outstanding contribution -- Let me guess, a remainer, right ?

 

For the benefit of any doubt, let me repost this:

 

 

Quote

and that NI will remain part of the CU and SM

 

It's in the withdrawal bill that just been passed.

 

17 minutes ago, The Renegade said:

Sure it is tebee, especially if you are prone to delusions.

 

So do you suffer from delusions or can you refute this by posting the relevant part of the Withdrawal Bill that you apparently refer to ?

Perhaps you could help him out ? Did you attend the same school ?

[Kieran00001]

50 minutes ago, BritManToo said:

All the British who used to go fruit picking, now claim welfare while Poles and Romanians do the work.

There's probably more Brits suitable and available for 'spud bashing' than there are for 'aircraft manufacture'

 

Most natives of any country seek menial low paid work.

Once you take that away from them, their only choices are welfare, drugs and petty crime.

 

 

 

Not true, over 50% of British born workers are in higher skilled jobs and a similar percentage is seen across Europe.

[tebee]

23 minutes ago, The Renegade said:

 

Sure it is tebee, especially if you are prone to delusions.

 

So do you suffer from delusions or can you refute this by posting the relevant part of the Withdrawal Bill that you apparently refer to ?

 

 

It's in amendment  25 - indeed it may force a soft brexit after all on the whole country

 

http://www.businessinsider.com/this-brexit-bill-amendment-could-force-britain-to-stay-in-the-single-market-customs-union-2018-6

[HAKAPALITA]

3 minutes ago, BritManToo said:

Most of the Brits I meet would find it hard sweeping the floor.

Get out of Soi 6 then.!

[SheungWan]

22 minutes ago, Eloquent pilgrim said:

All of it, but that's exactly what you get from James O’Brien. Obsessive political correctness to feed his insatiable ego, and pander to the left wing groupies that hang on his every word.

 

He is a pious, smug, sanctimonious, condescending champagne-socialist public schoolboy remoaner, right up there with Geldof, Allen, JK Rowling and the crisp salesman. I’m not very keen on him myself, by the way.

Actually, listening to James O'Brien's programs where he has to deal with the myriad fruitcake Hard Brexiteers and various Conspiracy Theorists throwing their wobbles on the phone-in is absolutely great and hilarious to boot. Odd how so many forum Brexiteers seem to be cut from the same cloth.

 

Edited June 22, 2018 by SheungWan

[The Renegade]

3 minutes ago, tebee said:

It's in amendment  25 - indeed it may force a soft brexit after all on the whole country

 

http://www.businessinsider.com/this-brexit-bill-amendment-could-force-britain-to-stay-in-the-single-market-customs-union-2018-6

Tebee

 

What has the this article got to do with 

 

Quote

and that NI will remain part of the CU and SM

 

It's in the withdrawal bill that just been passed.

I do not want to see an article about the Lords from 14 June, which has been preceded by events in the HoC on the 18 - 20 June.

 

I want to see the Governments Withdrawal Bill that you stated contained '' NI will remain part of the CU and SM ''

[Ron19]

A post against forum rules and an answer to it have been removed.

 

9) You will not post inflammatory messages on the forum, or attempt to disrupt discussions to upset its participants, or trolling. Trolling can be defined as the act of purposefully antagonizing other people on the internet by posting controversial, inflammatory, irrelevant or off-topic messages with the primary intent of provoking other users into an emotional response or to generally disrupt normal on-topic discussion.

 

11) You will not post slurs, degrading or overly negative comments directed towards Thailand, specific locations, Thai institutions such as the judicial or law enforcement system, Thai culture, Thai people or any other group on the basis of race, nationality, religion, gender or sexual orientation.

[RuamRudy]

19 minutes ago, Eloquent pilgrim said:

All of it, but that's exactly what you get from James O’Brien. Obsessive political correctness to feed his insatiable ego, and pander to the left wing groupies that hang on his every word.

 

He is a pious, smug, sanctimonious, condescending champagne-socialist public schoolboy remoaner, right up there with Geldof, Allen, JK Rowling and the crisp salesman. I’m not very keen on him myself, by the way.

With all due respect, that is a most infantile answer. If you are unable to refute his point then we can drop this now and accept that you don't like those who are willing to stand up to your beliefs. It doesn't make them wrong though.

[HAKAPALITA]

14 minutes ago, RuamRudy said:

With all due respect, that is a most infantile answer. If you are unable to refute his point then we can drop this now and accept that you don't like those who are willing to stand up to your beliefs. It doesn't make them wrong though.

Geldof, is he realy noticed by anyone.?. On par with that Abbot woman to most Europeans.

[Eloquent pilgrim]

24 minutes ago, RuamRudy said:

With all due respect, that is a most infantile answer. If you are unable to refute his point then we can drop this now and accept that you don't like those who are willing to stand up to your beliefs. It doesn't make them wrong though.

The only point he made in the tweet that you posted was that if anyone stops paying their rent, they will be better off financially. I accept that I cannot refute that point, and can only marvel at its profundity. Still, I’m sure that many of his less well educated disciples and groupies that did not previously understand that, will be grateful for the edification.

[Grouse]

1 hour ago, transam said:

That is incredibly funny......

Having no control of our own borders?

 

Massive inequality?

 

Inability to train engineering and technical staff?

 

Poor civil society?

 

Broken housing system?

 

Broken health system?

 

Poor pensions?

 

I could go on for pages

 

I'm astonished that you find it amusing

[Eloquent pilgrim]

36 minutes ago, SheungWan said:

Actually, listening to James O'Brien's programs where he has to deal with the myriad fruitcake Hard Brexiteers and various Conspiracy Theorists throwing their wobbles on the phone-in is absolutely great and hilarious to boot. Odd how so many forum Brexiteers seem to be cut from the same cloth.

 

 

You actually listen to James O’Brien; don't give me your hard luck stories.

 

You also appear to have a problem with your Caps Lock, or are you deliberately using upper case letters to add extra emphasis to some words, in the way that some people shout when they are speaking ?

[RuamRudy]

Just now, Eloquent pilgrim said:

The only point he made in the tweet that you posted was that if anyone stops paying their rent, they will be better off financially. I accept that I cannot refute that point, and can only marvel at its profundity. Still, I’m sure that many of his less well educated disciples and groupies that did not previously understand that, will be grateful for the edification.

I shall avoid the opportunity for a cheap shot, but I will point out the obvious basis for his comment - that being the Brexit dividend that Rees Mogg highlights as being the result of no further payments being made to the EU and which he promises will return the UK to its former glories, will be insufficient to offset the losses that UK industry will suffer as a consequence of Brexit. I think most people actually realise this, but sometimes a pithy analogy helps reinforce the message.

[tebee]

17 minutes ago, The Renegade said:

Tebee

 

What has the this article got to do with 

 

I do not want to see an article about the Lords from 14 June, which has been preceded by events in the HoC on the 18 - 20 June.

 

I want to see the Governments Withdrawal Bill that you stated contained '' NI will remain part of the CU and SM ''

"Nothing in [sections of] this Act authorises regulations which ... create or facilitate border arrangements between Northern Ireland and the Republic of Ireland after exit day which feature physical infrastructure, including border posts, or checks and controls, that did not exist before exit day and are not in accordance with an agreement between the United Kingdom and the EU."

 

The only way this can be done is by NI remaining in the SM and CU

[Grouse]

1 hour ago, BritManToo said:

All the British who used to go fruit picking, now claim welfare while Poles and Romanians do the work.

There's probably more Brits suitable and available for 'spud bashing' than there are for 'aircraft manufacture'

 

Most natives of any country seek menial low paid work.

Once you take that away from them, their only choices are welfare, drugs and petty crime.

 

 

Education? It's free!

[Grouse]

1 hour ago, dick dasterdly said:

 

And you continue with the 'generalised' insults!.....

 

Surely you're not 'trollling' - hoping for personal insults in response - that you can report to the mods. in the hope of getting the thread closed again.... ☹️ ?

Not in the slightest! Nothing wrong with spud bashing but getting an education is preferred IMHO.

 

I am only pointing out that nobody seems to complain about foreigners taking U.K. Highly paid engineering and technology jobs. 

[RuamRudy]

20 hours ago, nontabury said:

Sorry,but you are wrong. Scotland did not try to break up the union, that was an attempt by the SNP and their bigoted supporters.

Bigoted against who, exactly?

[The Renegade]

2 minutes ago, tebee said:

Nothing in [sections of] this Act authorises regulations which ... create or facilitate border arrangements between Northern Ireland and the Republic of Ireland after exit day which feature physical infrastructure, including border posts, or checks and controls, that did not exist before exit day and are not in accordance with an agreement between the United Kingdom and the EU."

That does not say, as you previously stated

 

Quote

NI will remain part of the CU and SM ''

 

This is YOUR interpretation

 

4 minutes ago, tebee said:

The only way this can be done is by NI remaining in the SM and CU

Let me highlight this part for you

 

5 minutes ago, tebee said:

that did not exist before exit day and are not in accordance with an agreement between the United Kingdom and the EU."

That is the important part, so let me paraphrase Barnier

 

'' There is no agreement until everything is agreed ''

 

 

[Grouse]

1 hour ago, Kieran00001 said:

 

Not true, over 50% of British born workers are in higher skilled jobs and a similar percentage is seen across Europe.

Everyone a remainer to a man! ?

[tebee]

2 minutes ago, The Renegade said:

That does not say, as you previously stated

 

 

This is YOUR interpretation

 

Let me highlight this part for you

 

That is the important part, so let me paraphrase Barnier

 

'' There is no agreement until everything is agreed ''

 

 

If you can find a legal way of doing it without NI(at least) staying in the SM and CU. then you have a brilliant career ahead of you as international negotiator  - I suggest you contact TM directly, she could do with some help.

 

The '' There is no agreement until everything is agreed '' is irrelevant, this is enshrined in UK law now, no matter if we leave with an agreement or without one.  

[SheungWan]

9 minutes ago, tebee said:

If you can find a legal way of doing it without NI(at least) staying in the SM and CU. then you have a brilliant career ahead of you as international negotiator  - I suggest you contact TM directly, she could do with some help.

The '' There is no agreement until everything is agreed '' is irrelevant, this is enshrined in UK law now, no matter if we leave with an agreement or without one.  

The Ireland border is the Achilles Heel for the Hard Brexiteers. Overthrowing Theresa May would force them to take ownership of the Irish problem and nobody on the HB side is prepared to drink that poisoned chalice, so they prod away hoping to wound her until some more propitious moment which may never come other than post-Brexit when they will start screaming betrayal.

[Jip99]

3 hours ago, tebee said:

 

I was addressing the comment to those that want a hard brexit. It is the their instance on having nothing to do with the EU that causes the problem. A soft brexit could avoid it

 

 

I don't think anyone in their right mind would favour a hard Brexit...unless it was absolutely necessary (not going to debate what constitutes 'necessary' as people will come in at different levels). However, the EU has to do more to recognise that there will be a life after Brexit and the best chances of the EU project remaining intact is to cooperate in making a 'soft' Brexit more attractive. The time for the bigger dick competition is over and it is long overdue for Britain and the EU to work together -  and for those who did not vote for Brexit to get behind and support the UK in moving forward.

 

Only continued conflict will bring about a hard Brexit; cooperation all round is more likely to result in a practical outcome  -  that will, of course,  be diluted from what the right might like to see, but a workable solution invariably takes compromise on both sides, Working together to achieve that compromise, rather than creating obstacles, is a huge step that the EU can take to help move towards a successful outcome.

[The Renegade]

30 minutes ago, tebee said:

If you can find a legal way of doing it without NI(at least) staying in the SM and CU. then you have a brilliant career ahead of you as international negotiator  - I suggest you contact TM directly, she could do with some help.

 

The '' There is no agreement until everything is agreed '' is irrelevant, this is enshrined in UK law now, no matter if we leave with an agreement or without one.  

I see now why you are so confused tebee.

 

You are 2 weeks behind where you should be.

 

Quote

The attempt to secure a “meaningful vote” that could have potentially given MPs the power to stop Britain leaving the EU without a deal has been defeated. The final obstacle to the EU withdrawal bill was removed as MPs voted 303 to 319 against an amendment tabled by the former attorney general Dominic Grieve

https://www.theguardian.com/politics/live/2018/jun/20/brexit-theresa-may-faces-meaningful-vote-crunch-day-politics-live

 

The Lords amendments were already dealt with the week previous.

 

And here is the Withdrawal Bill

 

https://publications.parliament.uk/pa/bills/cbill/2017-2019/0005/18005.pdf

 

Perhaps now you can quit speculating and posting YOUR thoughts as FACTS

[tebee]

1 minute ago, Jip99 said:

 

 

I don't think anyone in their right mind would favour a hard Brexit...unless it was absolutely necessary (not going to debate what constitutes 'necessary' as people will come in at different levels). However, the EU has to do more to recognise that there will be a life after Brexit and the best chances of the EU project remaining intact is to cooperate in making a 'soft' Brexit more attractive. The time for the bigger dick competition is over and it is long overdue for Britain and the EU to work together -  and for those who did not vote for Brexit to get behind and support the UK in moving forward.

 

Only continued conflict will bring about a hard Brexit; cooperation all round is more likely to result in a practical outcome  -  that will, of course,  be diluted from what the right might like to see, but a workable solution invariably takes compromise on both sides, Working together to achieve that compromise, rather than creating obstacles, is a huge step that the EU can take to help move towards a successful outcome.

There are people on here - and in the government (JRM,Borris) who are advocating a hard Brexit - it's mad I know, but that is what they want.

 

The EU is legalistic and it doesn't see the necessity to bend those laws for the benefit of a country  which will be leaving. If our government could decide what it wants and where it's red lines lie we could maybe arrange something, but It's so divided now I can't see it happening in time.

 

Simmerly I could probably probably get behind something like an EEA Brexit, though any flavor is going to be worse than what we have, but us remainers are reluctant to support any Brexit when we don't know what it means.