Nationwide U.S. protests planned if Trump fires Mueller or Rosenstein

[webfact]

Nationwide U.S. protests planned if Trump fires Mueller or Rosenstein

By Andrew Hay

 

FILE PHOTO - Special Counsel Robert Mueller (R) departs after briefing members of the U.S. Senate on his investigation into potential collusion between Russia and the Trump campaign on Capitol Hill in Washington, U.S., June 21, 2017. REUTERS/Joshua Roberts

 

(Reuters) - U.S. progressive groups are gearing up for nationwide protests if President Donald Trump fires the special counsel investigating Russian meddling in the 2016 U.S. election, or replaces the Justice Department official overseeing the probe.

 

An ouster of Special Counsel Robert Mueller would signal that Trump was acting as if he was above the law, said MoveOn.org, which is planning 800 demonstrations across the country.

 

Every state will have at least one "Nobody Is Above The Law" rally and at least 320,000 people have pledged to attend so far, according to MoveOn's website.

 

Trump would also trigger protests if he fired Deputy U.S. Attorney General Rod Rosenstein, who is responsible for overseeing the Russia probe, or if he pardoned associates targeted in the investigation, such as former Trump campaign director Paul Manafort, MoveOn said.

 

Trump has been critical of the Mueller investigation, calling it a "witch hunt". He threatened to fire Mueller after the Federal Bureau of Investigation raided his personal lawyer's offices on Monday, based partly on a referral by the special counsel.

 

U.S. House Speaker Paul Ryan said on Wednesday he had been assured Trump did not intend to fire Mueller.

 

Other groups behind the planned protests include Friends of the Earth, the American Federation of Teachers, and veterans organizations, MoveOn said.

 

"We can't have the highest office of the land exempt from abiding by the law," Friends of the Earth U.S. President Erich Picha said by telephone, adding that his group would support impeachment of Trump should he fire Mueller.

 

MoveOn said Mueller's firing would create a constitutional crisis and compared the action to President Richard Nixon's move to oust officials investigating the Watergate scandal.

 

The White House said on Tuesday that Trump "believes he has the power" to fire Mueller, who has widened his probe into whether the Trump campaign colluded with Moscow.

 

Russia has denied that it meddled in the election, and Trump has said there was no collusion between his campaign and Russia.

 

MoveOn is urging U.S. lawmakers to consider impeachment proceedings against Trump should he fire officials involved in the Russia probe, the group's campaign director David Sievers said by phone.

 

(Reporting By Andrew Hay in New Mexico; editing by Frank McGurty and David Gregorio)

 

-- © Copyright Reuters 2018-04-12

[smedly]

Is anyone else fed up to the back teeth with this ongoing never ending investigation/witch hunt, for god sake either do something or drop it

[lovelomsak]

America land of protests. Trump supporters should protest all these investigations are taking to long. May be because they are just red herrings.

[starky]

39 minutes ago, smedly said:

Is anyone else fed up to the back teeth with this ongoing never ending investigation/witch hunt, for god sake either do something or drop it

I believe it could only be classed as a " witch hunt" if Trump really had nothing to hide. Personally the orange one doth protest too much methinks. 

Edited April 12, 2018 by starky

[jimmyyy]

They would have found it already if any evidence exists, they are only dragging it out through the mid term elections so the cucks on the left can take shots at the republicans on tv.  This is all it is.

[attrayant]

Witch Hunt!

 

[FreddieRoyle]

This couldn't get any more farcical if they made Trump hold a red hot iron bar to prove innocence or guilt. At least that would be faster.

[attrayant]

12 minutes ago, jimmyyy said:

They would have found it already if any evidence exists

 

How do you know they haven't?   Do you expect Mueller to publish his evidence daily, as he finds it, so we can all see it and do our backseat driving of his investigation?

[jimmyyy]

i know because they can't keep secrets, its impossible it would have leaked and the probe would have been closed by now.  It only discredits the DOJ by continuing this effort which has produced zero evidence that trump colluded with Putin or any Russians during the election.  Which is what Mueller's mandate is.  His only mandate mind you. 

[starky]

16 minutes ago, jimmyyy said:

They would have found it already if any evidence exists, they are only dragging it out through the mid term elections so the cucks on the left can take shots at the republicans on tv.  This is all it is.

Not sure how they could have found it already when they just raided the lawyers yesterday. Donald might be a lot of things but I reckon he is no goose. Any dirt they do eventually find, and they will, will be buried good and deep.

[attrayant]

Every time something breaks we get another glimpse into how entangled this corrupt mess is.  For example, we now know that Michael Cohen was working out of the Squire, Patton & Boggs law offices, which just happen to be Lawyers for Cambridge Analytica and are lobbyists for Russia's Gazprom oil company.

 

When revelations like that turn up, it's going to take some time to untangle all the corruption.

[starky]

Just now, jimmyyy said:

i know because they can't keep secrets, its impossible it would have leaked and the probe would have been closed by now.  It only discredits the DOJ by continuing this effort which has produced zero evidence that trump colluded with Putin or any Russians during the election.  Which is what Mueller's mandate is.  His only mandate mind you. 

Uhm no, he now wants to fire Mueller cos his lawyers office got raided.

[jimmyyy]

no, they only did this to scare his attorney and by doing so broke 2 statues of the bill of rights.  Either way, its fruitless and no just a drain on resources better spent on prosecuting the real criminals.  Just my view point on it.  I am sure others with have different opinions which is fine.

[jimmyyy]

1 minute ago, attrayant said:

Every time something breaks we get another glimpse into how entangled this corrupt mess is.  For example, we now know that Michael Cohen was working out of the Squire, Patton & Boggs law offices, which just happen to be Lawyers for Cambridge Analytica and are lobbyists for Russia's Gazprom oil company.

 

When revelations like that turn up, it's going to take some time to untangle all the corruption.

not of it will be admissible as in the gathering of evidence they cast the net to wide and now they will be barred from using any of it due to attorney client privilege.  Had this happened to a democrat the ACLU would be sharpening their knives to go after the prosecutor.  It will end up in the supreme court which will see it for it is.  So in the end we spend millions of dollars for nothing.

[starky]

1 minute ago, jimmyyy said:

no, they only did this to scare his attorney and by doing so broke 2 statues of the bill of rights.  Either way, its fruitless and no just a drain on resources better spent on prosecuting the real criminals.  Just my view point on it.  I am sure others with have different opinions which is fine.

Half pie with you mate the yanks deserve everything they asked for only problem is that balding orange git poses problems for all of us potentially. 

[jimmyyy]

I voted for him, and will again in 2020.....

[attrayant]

2 minutes ago, jimmyyy said:

i know because they can't keep secrets, its impossible it would have leaked and the probe would have been closed by now.  It only discredits the DOJ by continuing this effort which has produced zero evidence that trump colluded with Putin or any Russians during the election.  Which is what Mueller's mandate is.  His only mandate mind you. 

 

Please stop lying, or perhaps you aren't lying and are just woefully uninformed, in which case here's Mueller's appointment letter:
 

 

I'd like you to highlight the part where it says what his "only mandate" is, or any language that explicitly limits Mueller or puts up boundaries as to what he can and can't investigate.

 

[jimmyyy]

just watch it play out, you will see in the end who is correct.  Congress is gonna have a field day with mueller and the DOJ.  His only mandate is Russia, the other two are prosecuting attorney law, he has the option to file charges for any legal matters that cross US code of law. As a prosecutor that is his duty. His mandate is Russia, but he is a prosecutor so the others automatically apply.  Go ask a US attorney, he will tell you the same thing.

[lannarebirth]

10 minutes ago, jimmyyy said:

i know because they can't keep secrets, its impossible it would have leaked and the probe would have been closed by now.  It only discredits the DOJ by continuing this effort which has produced zero evidence that trump colluded with Putin or any Russians during the election.  Which is what Mueller's mandate is.  His only mandate mind you. 

 

The mandate is a little broader than that. You are correct that evidence of Russian collusion is the mandate of the investigation, but there is a rider that states roughly: "or anything else the special prosecutor encounters arising from his investigation". That catch all gives Mueller wide latitude to investigate pretty much anything he wishes so long as he can demonstrate the investigative chain of discoveries that led him there.

[lovelomsak]

12 minutes ago, attrayant said:

 

Please stop lying, or perhaps you aren't lying and are just woefully uninformed, in which case here's Mueller's appointment letter:
 

 

I'd like you to highlight the part where it says what his "only mandate" is, or any language that explicitly limits Mueller or puts up boundaries as to what he can and can't investigate.

 

What I read here is authorized to do things but I do not see any proof so he was appointed and his mandate  is as jimmyyy says  in my humble opinion.

[bristolboy]

11 minutes ago, jimmyyy said:

just watch it play out, you will see in the end who is correct.  Congress is gonna have a field day with mueller and the DOJ.  His only mandate is Russia, the other two are prosecuting attorney law, he has the option to file charges for any legal matters that cross US code of law. As a prosecutor that is his duty. His mandate is Russia, but he is a prosecutor so the others automatically apply.  Go ask a US attorney, he will tell you the same thing.

"As a prosecutor that is his duty. His mandate is Russia, but he is a prosecutor so the others automatically apply. "

If the others automatically apply, then why even bother to spell it out? Perhaps to forestall the objections of those who would assert thusly:

"It only discredits the DOJ by continuing this effort which has produced zero evidence that trump colluded with Putin or any Russians during the election.  Which is what Mueller's mandate is.  His only mandate mind you. "

[attrayant]

5 minutes ago, jimmyyy said:

not of it will be admissible as in the gathering of evidence they cast the net to wide and now they will be barred from using any of it due to attorney client privilege.

 

And with this comment you reveal your fundamental ignorance of the legal system and the Bill of Rights.  Do you really think that criminal activity can be so easily protected?  If that were true, then Trump could say his attorney is always representing him, every minute of every day, and therefore nothing that ever happens between them could be the subject of a criminal investigation.  They could, essentially, carry out any sort of criminal activity behind the scenes while screaming "attorney-client privilege!"

 

Michael Cohen, the attorney-client privilege, and the crime-fraud exception

 

Quote

That question brings us to something known as the crime-fraud exception to the attorney-client privilege. It is, if you will, an exception to an exception that allows the government to read, review, compel production of and compel testimony of an attorney and his or her records. It arises if, and only if, the client uses the attorney’s services to commit a crime. 

 

[attrayant]

1 minute ago, lovelomsak said:

What I read here is authorized to do things 

 

That's some technical legal language!  Authorized to do things.  Well, is he not doing things?

[attrayant]

16 minutes ago, jimmyyy said:

His only mandate is Russia, the other two are prosecuting attorney law, he has the option to file charges for any legal matters that cross US code of law. As a prosecutor that is his duty. His mandate is Russia, but he is a prosecutor so the others automatically apply.  Go ask a US attorney, he will tell you the same thing.

 

So you're saying that what he's doing is okay?  Because that's what he's doing.  In the course of his Russia investigation he came across some Michael Cohen misdeeds and referred them off to the appropriate jurisdiction.  What should he have done, taken care of it himself?

[attrayant]

10 minutes ago, lovelomsak said:

his mandate  is as jimmyyy says  in my humble opinion.

 

Can you find the word "mandate" anywhere in the appointment memo?

 

Can you cite the language that shows a limited, restrictive "mandate"?

 

Can you cite anything besides your "humble opinion"?

 

Here's the part I like:

 

"...to ensure a full and thorough investigation..."

 

That statement in the appointment letter clearly grants him a great deal of latitude.

 

p.s. whatever you do, don't look at paragraph c or you might experience some uncomfortable cognitive dissonance.

 

 

 

 

Edited April 12, 2018 by attrayant

[ballpoint]

1 hour ago, lovelomsak said:

America land of protests. Trump supporters should protest all these investigations are taking to long. May be because they are just red herrings.

Although the term "red herrings" is quite an apt description of his republican supporters - a bunch of minnows who congregate to spread disinformation and disruption to every Trump thread (but, but Hillary! But, but, mandate!  But, but cucks/snowflakes/witch hunters/nothing burgers!  This thread should be closed down because I don't like it, make it go away!), I don't think they will take kindly to your use of it.

[Chomper Higgot]

30 minutes ago, jimmyyy said:

i know because they can't keep secrets, its impossible it would have leaked and the probe would have been closed by now.  It only discredits the DOJ by continuing this effort which has produced zero evidence that trump colluded with Putin or any Russians during the election.  Which is what Mueller's mandate is.  His only mandate mind you. 

Firstly, just because restricted information on what crimes Mueller's investigation has uncovered hasn't made it to your ears does not mean that Mueller hasn't uncovered any crimes. (There are a whole bunch of indictment's, guilty pleas and a conviction that I'll accept you are probably totally unaware of, even though they have been widely reported).

 

Likewise your claims regarding Mueller's mandate, I accept that you are not deliberately telling a lie when you make the statement above, there is a reasonable chance that you are not at all aware of what Mueller's mandate actually is:

 

Let me help you out: Here is the letter appointing Mueller to the post of Special Council -

 

https://www.documentcloud.org/documents/3726408-Rosenstein-letter-appointing-Mueller-special.html

 

Pay particular attention to item iii) in the letter, this clause mandates wide scope of investigation:

§ 600.4 Jurisdiction.

(a)Original jurisdiction. The jurisdiction of a Special Counsel shall be established by the Attorney General. The Special Counsel will be provided with a specific factual statement of the matter to be investigated. The jurisdiction of a Special Counsel shall also include the authority to investigate and prosecute federal crimes committed in the course of, and with intent to interfere with, the Special Counsel's investigation, such as perjury, obstruction of justice, destruction of evidence, and intimidation of witnesses; and to conduct appeals arising out of the matter being investigated and/or prosecuted.

 

 

Now I've helped you out with understanding exactly what Mueller's mandate is, and that it is very much more than you claimed it is, please refrain from posting uniformed nonsense - you are now informed of Mueller's powers, there is no longer any excuse for your denials of his mandate.

 

[Peabody]

41 minutes ago, jimmyyy said:

no, they only did this to scare his attorney and by doing so broke 2 statues of the bill of rights.  Either way, its fruitless and no just a drain on resources better spent on prosecuting the real criminals.  Just my view point on it.  I am sure others with have different opinions which is fine.

Maybe they were already scared, because Mueller's team has either indicted or gotten guilty pleas from 19 people and three companies so far.

[Chomper Higgot]

36 minutes ago, jimmyyy said:

just watch it play out, you will see in the end who is correct.  Congress is gonna have a field day with mueller and the DOJ.  His only mandate is Russia, the other two are prosecuting attorney law, he has the option to file charges for any legal matters that cross US code of law. As a prosecutor that is his duty. His mandate is Russia, but he is a prosecutor so the others automatically apply.  Go ask a US attorney, he will tell you the same thing.

I agree, let's watch it play out.

 

Hands of Mueller, let him finish his investigation.

[dorchester]

This Russian investigation is looking like the Extraordinary chambers of Cambodia and the never ending trial for the Khmer Rouge.The only time it stops is when they run out of money.Then the international begging bowl is produced

 

Edited April 12, 2018 by dorchester