Has the quality of air become that worse in the last 2-3 years?

[Cheesekraft]

Beijing: 65

Chiang Mai: 181

[cardinalblue]

It is really a northern Thailand problem not just CM....

 

What's so attractive to live in a city with some of the worst air pollution  in the world for now three months? For many people with families, one cannot pick up and move for 3 months like a single person farang. It is really a tragic situation downplayed by the gov b/c they have no simple answers or solutions....

 

The health effect is bad short and long term physically and psychologically. I sure hope individuals show their displeasure by vacating the polluted area whether one week , 3 months or re-locate to a higher quality living area permanently....

 

  

Edited April 24, 2018 by cardinalblue

[chado]

how can beijing be only 65? it's one of the most pollutated cities on Earth.

[beau thai]

12 hours ago, chado said:

how can beijing be only 65? it's one of the most pollutated cities on Earth.

Past tense Chado.  All factories were closed and relocated, the prolific coal burning in home was banned,etc etc and they now have clean air

Not sure that could be achieved in any other country. It took a determined authoritarian approach with consequences for disobeying!

Dont see that working in Thailand any time soon.

[WinnieTheKhwai]

Quote

Has the quality of air and air pollution become of a bigger issue in the last 2-3 years?

 

No.

 

(Well.. : bigger 'issue' in terms of awareness and attention: Yes, thankfully.  But has the air become worse:  No.)

 

And also not in the last 20 years.   In fact it's getting a little better, very slowly.

 

But looking at the last couple years, focusing on January-April mostly so that this year fits in the graph (April value is to-date) : 

 

 

Or the long-term view: 

 

 

So that goes back to 1996, more than 20 years.

 

 

Edited April 25, 2018 by WinnieTheKhwai

[WinnieTheKhwai]

On 4/21/2018 at 10:56 PM, chado said:

is that due to increasing number of the cars?

 

No.

 

If it was then you'd have great air in Fang or Mae Hong Son right?   But you don't.

 

On 4/23/2018 at 5:31 AM, piewarmer said:

It used to be 3 weeks of smoke, now it's 3 months.

 

LOL,  no. 

 

Often people only notice if after becoming more aware of the issue, or sometimes people who didn't have health effects can develop them as they grow older.  Looking at the air though it's roughly the same period every year. 

 

(Although the definition of 'bad' has most definitely evolved.  It used to be that 'bad' days were defined as PM10 going over 120 ug/m3, and the government still uses that as their main indicator although it's shifting there too.   Right now that level is considered an atrocious day, and 'bad' is now measured by PM2.5, with most people considering it bad when the US AQI scale goes into the red which is at 56 ug/m3 PM2.5   

 

So that's good; tougher standards and higher expectations are good.

 

On 4/23/2018 at 4:18 PM, mrmillersr said:

This year is most certainly worse than last year as I have the statistics to back it up. 

 

Everyone has the statistics, you can download it online.   Last year was relatively good, compared to the long term average.  This year is a lot more average: worse than last year but not worse than the years before that.

[chado]

4 hours ago, WinnieTheKhwai said:

So that goes back to 1996, more than 20 years.

 

where did you get that diagram from?

[mrmillersr]

Anyone who posts the air quality is not getting worse is in total denial of the facts. The reality is the dangerous elevated PM 2.5 levels are occurring earlier and lasting longer than the recent past.  Also, it  is not just a matter of contending with this for 1 or 2 months and then happy days are here again.  During the last year,  the only months when PM 2.5 levels averaged in a reasonably safe level were June through October - a total of 5 months out of 12. 

 

For those that don't want to admit the problem is getting worse probably are not able to move or just prefer to live in a state of denial.  For others, I suggest you get out while you can and only reconsider moving back to CM if they ever take this matter seriously and do something about it.  I wouldn't, however,  hold my breath on that though - no pun intended.
 

[WinnieTheKhwai]

1 hour ago, chado said:

 

where did you get that diagram from?

 

It's compiled from the yearly summaries that are available here: http://air4thai.pcd.go.th/webV2/download.php 

 

The graph has to use PM10 because that data goes back further, and for the Mae Rim station which has been in operation the longest.  That was back when Chiang Mai only had one station, and only measured PM10.   (Actually the rest of the world also used PM10 back then, the move to PM2.5 measuring is more recent although Thailand is behind there.)

 

 

1 hour ago, mrmillersr said:

Anyone who posts the air quality is not getting worse is in total denial of the facts. The reality is the dangerous elevated PM 2.5 levels are occurring earlier and lasting longer than the recent past.

 

Well: No.  Unless you mean compared to last year only.

 

 

Quote

Also, it  is not just a matter of contending with this for 1 or 2 months and then happy days are here again.  During the last year,  the only months when PM 2.5 levels averaged in a reasonably safe level were June through October - a total of 5 months out of 12. 

 

Feel free to define 'reasonably safe' any way you like, but if 'moderate' air quality (yellow on the index as per the US AQI scale) is not to your liking then Asia is just not for you.  Coastal Australia is good, the Canadian Atlantic coast, the alps.. those sort of places.   Note that any other place in Thailand and actually the entirety of Asia doesn't get better air consistently.  

 

Quote

For those that don't want to admit the problem is getting worse probably are not able to move or just prefer to live in a state of denial.  For others, I suggest you get out while you can and only reconsider moving back to CM if they ever take this matter seriously and do something about it.  I wouldn't, however,  hold my breath on that though - no pun intended.

 

Here we agree.  Haze in Northern Thailand in Feb-April goes back decades and within our lifetimes we can only reasonably expect a very small improvement.  March/April will remain a great time for a holiday, or for fussing around with air filters around the house. 

Edited April 25, 2018 by WinnieTheKhwai

[simoh1490]

An inversion layer is determined in part by temperature, the hotter the air, the more likely and frequent the inversion layer will occur - inversion layers trap pollution and temperatures are increasing.

[orang37]

1 hour ago, simoh1490 said:

An inversion layer is determined in part by temperature, the hotter the air, the more likely and frequent the inversion layer will occur - inversion layers trap pollution and temperatures are increasing.

If only your rather simplistic descriptions of "inversion layers" were accompanied by statistics based on verifiable meteorological data for Chiang Mai.

 

~o:37;

[simoh1490]

1 hour ago, orang37 said:

If only your rather simplistic descriptions of "inversion layers" were accompanied by statistics based on verifiable meteorological data for Chiang Mai.

 

~o:37;

It's not essential that you agree with the answer I put forward, if you don't like it you can feel free to disagree with it or challenge it in meteorological terms, but don't expect me to give you chapter and verse at a detail level and supply all the supporting data, this is not a thesis for a Phd!

[simoh1490]

Some extracts from Wiki, a simple and easily locatable guide to inversion layers!

 

"the air near the surface of the Earth is warmer than the air above it, largely because the atmosphere is heated from below as solar radiation warms the Earth's surface, which in turn then warms the layer of the atmosphere directly above it, e.g., by thermals (convective heat transfer).^[2]".

 

"Temperature inversion stops atmospheric convection (which is normally present) from happening in the affected area and can lead to the air becoming stiller and murky from the collection of dust and pollutants that are no longer able to be lifted from the surface. This can become a problem in cities where many pollutants exist. Inversion effects occur frequently in big cities such as: chiang mai".

 

"An inversion is also produced whenever radiation from the surface of the earth exceeds the amount of radiation received from the sun, which commonly occurs at night, or during the winter when the angle of the sun is very low in the sky. This effect is virtually confined to land regions as the ocean retains heat far longer. In the polar regions during winter, inversions are nearly always present over land".

Height (y-axis) versus temperature (x-axis) under normal atmospheric conditions (black line). When the layer from 6–8 kilometres (4–5 miles) (designated A-B) descends dry adiabatically , the result is the inversion seen near the ground at 1–2 kilometres (1–1 mile) (C-D).

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Inversion_(meteorology)

 

From the above we can see that as temperatures increase the height of the inversion layer is reduced as it occurs closer to the ground, the effect of which compresses the already trapped pollutants in the air. Assuming the volume of pollutants remains constant or increases each year, the associated PM levels will increase as a result.

 

And this is what an inversion looks like, look familiar:

[evenstevens]

Last tuesday ,everywhere i drove  around Beverly Hills,  Maerim there were fires being lit  everywhere,the following morning (WEDS) clear visibility was down to approx 800 metres,(worst morning of this burning season) ,around 3pm or so we had a little rain which made conditions better,

one can put up stats , or this or that,   until the cows come home  but  99% of the smog is down to the Thai,s lighting fires ,our  only  saviour, is plenty of rain and widespread is needed, to morning is as i post ,conditions are not good ,but nowhere as bad  as y/day morning,but slowly coming in again, its been the same for a decade or more ,some years  are worse then others,, thats the full guts of it

[rumak]

 

“Wisdom tells me I am nothing; love tells me I am everything: between the two, my life flows.” Nisaragadatta

 

I think the inversion layer is when your opinion is above and someone else's is below.....and in between the two is where

life flows