Questions About Qualifications

[Ijustwannateach]

I've got a PhD. in Computing - What should I be expecting in terms of pay / benefits etc..?

For teaching English? Same as the rest of us. As I mentioned to the previous poster, the salary is typically set by the job, not by the qualifications. The qualifications only increase your chance of getting certain jobs. Assuming that you've had some teaching experience, you could probably wiggle your way into the middle-range TEFL jobs in Bangkok running at about 35-40K. On the other hand, if you could (and were willing to) teach math and/or science to primary school/high school age, you could easily pull down 40-50K.

There may be openings for you in the "real" international schools, but as a local hire you'll take a pay cut compared to people hired through "the network" internationally- not too shabby, though, probably in the 70-80K range plus benefits. Finally, if you actually want to work in computers, there are a number of international firms here that will hire you as an international worker for the standard expat rates, assuming they need you, they want you, and you can do the job.

"Steven"

[mango]

My friend came over from England six months ago, he had no degree and no TEFL <deleted>, anyway he went to Kho san road bought a degree from Manchester and a TEFL from England and is now teaching in BKK and getting paid B54,000 per month.

Cheers Mango

[phormio]

My friend came over from England six months ago, he had no degree and no TEFL <deleted>, anyway he went to Kho san road bought a degree from Manchester and a TEFL from England and is now teaching in BKK and getting paid B54,000 per month.

Cheers Mango

His first job? How many interviews did he do?

Were the authenticity of the documents ever challenged by anyone?

Sounds like rich pickins. See ya in December.

Ciao.

[Ijustwannateach]

It is possible to fake it here, especially if one is actually intelligent enough to do so- I have no functional beef with people who do so effectively enough that no one knows the difference. However, your friend should be warned that if he is in the position of teaching students who know more about the subject than he does (especially in math, science, etc.) he may be found out rather quickly- I've heard of more than one case where the teacher was fired over this kind of issue, especially at the sort of schools that pay more.

Ironically, it's not impossible to get work at the better schools without a degree and ADMITTING it, assuming the right kind of experience and connections- and then there's no danger of being debunked.

I'll be much, much, much more impressed if you report that this same friend KEEPS his job for a whole calendar year and even gets rehired.

"Steven"

[kenkannif]

Who is unpinning this?

[phormio]

Who is unpinning this?

It sure as he11 ain't me, dude .

What's the brit equiv of "dude", dude?

[mbkudu]

Mate?

[nokmdk]

Steve:

I think i posted a question in wrong area before so perhaps you can answer it here for me

What is the Teachers License? process for them to get it? pro's and con's? Will it help me land that nicer job for 50k rather than my private school at 35k now. Thank you for all infomation you can give me on this.

[kenkannif]

I've answered your question in your other post!

There's no 'real' advantage in obtaining one (your school will generally (always?) need to help you to obtain it) as there's two, one for you and one for the school, so when you do get a different job they'll still need to apply for their one anyway. I don't think it will in any way at all improve your chances of finding better paid work!

[janeny]

Hi! I'm quite new in this teaching stuff, although I'm teaching for like 4 months now, i have bachelor of arts degree major in mass com. and im teaching english com in a technology school here in issan, recently my school sibmitted my papers to moe in order to obtain my teacher license for my wp, im wondering if up to when do i have to wait for this teacher license because now i have a non immig b and i need to have my wp before it expire which will be in around 21/2 months, and my other question is if moe will find my degree "qaulified" to teach english?

thanks

[nokmdk]

Hi! I'm quite new in this teaching stuff, although I'm teaching for like 4 months now, i have bachelor of arts degree major in mass com. and im teaching english com in a technology school here in issan, recently my school sibmitted my papers to moe in order to obtain my teacher license for my wp, im wondering if up to when do i have to wait for this teacher license because now i have a non immig b and i need to have my wp before it expire which will be in around 21/2 months, and my other question is if moe will find my degree "qaulified" to teach english?

thanks

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

I'm not trying to be mean or anything, but... are you asking if they will find out it is fake?? just a question no need to freak out from what i was told it should take 2 days for MOE to give the school the license. then they take that to get your work permit and that should be around 45 days maybe less maybe more.

[janeny]

Hi! I'm quite new in this teaching stuff, although I'm teaching for like 4 months now, i have bachelor of arts degree major in mass com. and im teaching english com in a technology school here in issan, recently my school sibmitted my papers to moe in order to obtain my teacher license for my wp, im wondering if up to when do i have to wait for this teacher license because now i have a non immig b and i need to have my wp before it expire which will be in around 21/2 months, and my other question is if moe will find my degree "qaulified" to teach english?

thanks

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

I'm not trying to be mean or anything, but... are you asking if they will find out it is fake?? just a question no need to freak out from what i was told it should take 2 days for MOE to give the school the license. then they take that to get your work permit and that should be around 45 days maybe less maybe more.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Its ok...the degree is not "fake" though, im just wondering because the school where im teaching got no absolutely any idea because since im the first foreign teacher there...if it just take 45 days more or less then ill be ok ...thanks for your reply

[nokmdk]

Its ok...the degree is not "fake" though, im just wondering because the school where im teaching got no absolutely any idea because since im the first foreign teacher there...if it just take 45 days more or less then ill be ok ...thanks for your reply

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

as long as all your paper work is in order, there should not be any problems for your school obtaining anything you need. The MEO is actualy coming to my school this coming week and i can ask them a few questions about it all. I am still wondering some things myself about new rules i have been hearing. i will let you know what is said.

[janeny]

Its ok...the degree is not "fake" though, im just wondering because the school where im teaching got no absolutely any idea because since im the first foreign teacher there...if it just take 45 days more or less then ill be ok ...thanks for your reply

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

as long as all your paper work is in order, there should not be any problems for your school obtaining anything you need. The MEO is actualy coming to my school this coming week and i can ask them a few questions about it all. I am still wondering some things myself about new rules i have been hearing. i will let you know what is said.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

thanks a lot!!!

[kenkannif]

What new rules? Share please!

[nokmdk]

What new rules? Share please!

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

News i have heard from the staff of MOE during their visit to School.

Starting next year at start of School year, (i only heard this from MOE staff!! not the big wig)All new English Teachers that have not gone through the proper procedures of applying and obtaining their work permits previously will have to obtain a certified letter from their Embassy stating their degree is real, will have to sign a document at school for MOE giving permission for them to receive documents from graduating University. Then license will be processed for work permit. (after they have recieved confirmation from University) maybe this is all old news for some of you but thought i would share what they told me. A push to curb the tourist teachers?????

I would like to thank the person from here that helped me with some lesson plans for M5 classes but i can not remember your nick name here but thanks again.

[kenkannif]

What new rules? Share please!

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

News i have heard from the staff of MOE during their visit to School.

Starting next year at start of School year, (i only heard this from MOE staff!! not the big wig)All new English Teachers that have not gone through the proper procedures of applying and obtaining their work permits previously will have to obtain a certified letter from their Embassy stating their degree is real, will have to sign a document at school for MOE giving permission for them to receive documents from graduating University. Then license will be processed for work permit. (after they have recieved confirmation from University) maybe this is all old news for some of you but thought i would share what they told me. A push to curb the tourist teachers?????

I would like to thank the person from here that helped me with some lesson plans for M5 classes but i can not remember your nick name here but thanks again.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

^ Should be a laugh!

Tourist teachers generally don't have WPs (which is well bad and illegal and that!), so doubt it will effect them.

[Ajarn]

What new rules? Share please!

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

News i have heard from the staff of MOE during their visit to School.

Starting next year at start of School year, (i only heard this from MOE staff!! not the big wig)All new English Teachers that have not gone through the proper procedures of applying and obtaining their work permits previously will have to obtain a certified letter from their Embassy stating their degree is real, will have to sign a document at school for MOE giving permission for them to receive documents from graduating University. Then license will be processed for work permit. (after they have recieved confirmation from University) maybe this is all old news for some of you but thought i would share what they told me. A push to curb the tourist teachers?????

I would like to thank the person from here that helped me with some lesson plans for M5 classes but i can not remember your nick name here but thanks again.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

I think it's a HUGE leap forward if the MoE actually starts properly verifying credentials. I sincerely hope it hapens. It would go a LONG way in improving the teaching profession here, I believe.

[kenkannif]

It would go a long way to stopping a lot of kids getting English lessons as well, which is the sad thing!

[Ijustwannateach]

Yes... there will be a painful transition period for many schools, no doubt, but in the end it will help the profession and help the real teachers- who must put up with so many mickey-mouse schools that refuse to process the correct paperwork! It shouldn't take years to get a proper job with proper paperwork (as it did for me here!)

"Steven"

[Ajarn]

It would go a long way to stopping a lot of kids getting English lessons as well, which is the sad thing!

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Ken, why do you think that?

[kenkannif]

Well because as a lot of people have said those with teaching degrees (to me checking that someone's histroy degree is real, still isn't going to help the 'quality' of teachers improve here so I assume this is only for those with a specific teaching qualifications?) won't work in Thailand for the money that is paid. So you're going to end up with a few teachers at the better paying schools, and zero teachers elsewhere (i.e. at lower paying schools).

Personally I think there should be some kind of tier (sp?) to teaching so those with specific teaching quals would be top of the heap, those with unrelated degrees and a TEFL and/or experience should be next (maybe with TEFL holders with a fair amount of experience on an even level with them) and then TEFL holders with no degree/quals could be working and earning the slightly lower wages. Thus the 'better' paying schools get the 'better' teachers and the 'lower' paying schools can still get a good teacher, for a reasonable wage. Although there should still be some kind of test or something by the MoE to make sure the teachers are at the very least capable of teaching.

At the moment due to fake degrees, etc. you can and do have qualified teachers earning a lot less than a KSR degree holder.

[mbkudu]

Personally I think there should be some kind of tier (sp?) to teaching so those with specific teaching quals would be top of the heap, those with unrelated degrees and a TEFL and/or experience should be next (maybe with TEFL holders with a fair amount of experience on an even level with them) and then TEFL holders with no degree/quals could be working and earning the slightly lower wages. Thus the 'better' paying schools get the 'better' teachers and the 'lower' paying schools can still get a good teacher, for a reasonable wage. Although there should still be some kind of test or something by the MoE to make sure the teachers are at the very least capable of teaching.

[/quote Kenkannif]

This really makes a lot of sense. I'm glad someone finally said it. A TEFL or CELTA

should be the minimum required to obtain a work permit to teach. Of course big international schools will require more, but it would enable the small schools and language schools to hire teachers and still be legal, teacher is legal/ school is legal.

[Ajarn]

Friom my view, checking degrees will weed out most of the General Bullshitters among teachers, which in itself is a positive advancement in the profession, in my book. People who've invested the years and time getting a tertiary degree signal, to me, a person with the drive and willingness to follow through with things in life, and they might offer me a more honest employee who is maybe more capable and willing in an academic setting.

Weeding out the B.S. folks will also serve to make more work available when applicants are more even... I really don't agree that the salaries here are so low, especially when you compare the cost of living and quality of life here. There are plenty of worse places to teach, like China, Japan, Korea, in my experience.

The only way to save money in most entry-level English teaching gigs is to live as cheaply as possible. With an average salary of 250,000 yen per month in Japan for newbies (govt minimum salary), they'll be eating mostly warm noodles anyway, and forget about saving any real money at that level... Living costs in Korea are also quite high, and the governments and societies in Japan, Korea, and China are much less 'free' than Thailand's, in my experience.

For the career teacher, there will continue to be growing opportunities in Thailand, I believe, with considerably higher salaries than is the common starting point here now.

I feel the only negative effect for students will be likely increases in study fees in response to the introduction of better-qualified teachers.. But, this is the nature of all education as costs increase across the board...

Overall, I believe it will be a boom for teachers and students, but lets not forget that all this talk is still strictly in the rumour stage, TiT

I also like Ken's idea of a 'tier' system of sorts for teachers. Different qualifications for different teaching needs....

[kenkannif]

They'd also have to do away with the one WP to one classroom rule as this can stop even the most qualified teachers from getting a WP! They need to look at realistic solutions to the problems here, rather than sweeping rules that in the long run, while looking and sounding good, don't really help anyone (schools, teachers and students!).

[nokmdk]

I'm hoping that if they do in fact get a system like this in place that one major thing would happen.

I would love it if they do make the requirment to check the degree before any paper work is started but.... anyway to make it so once this is all done you never have to do it again?? I mean, why not make a registry with all them that have done it and then they have no need to re-do WP ect... maybe im just in dream land

[PeaceBlondie]

I try not to get excited by any rumors about MoE requirements, unless they come from local (provincial) authorities who actually regulate my own employment. I've only been here 18 months, and can't see that this beautiful kingdom is based upon the rule of law. I can admire a well-run governments but don't see it here, which is okay.

What percent of the farang teaching ESL in Thailand have the proper visa, work permit, and teacher's license? Less than 25%, I'll guess. What % have a real bachelor's degree, related to what they teach? Less than 20%, maybe.

I think we have a tier system in Thailand for ESL. The big international schools, the better universities, the best private language school positions - and everything else.

[mbkudu]

I try not to get excited by any rumors about MoE requirements, unless they come from local (provincial) authorities who actually regulate my own employment.    I've only been here 18 months, and can't see that this beautiful kingdom is based upon the rule of law.  I can admire a well-run governments but don't see it here, which is okay.

What percent of the farang teaching ESL in Thailand have the proper visa, work permit, and teacher's license?  Less than 25%, I'll guess.  What % have a real bachelor's degree, related to what they teach?  Less than 20%, maybe.

I think we have a tier system in Thailand for ESL.  The big international schools, the better universities, the best private language school positions - and everything else.

What's interesting to me is that the "everyhting else," jobs pay more than government universities and language schools.

[Ajarn]

I try not to get excited by any rumors about MoE requirements, unless they come from local (provincial) authorities who actually regulate my own employment.    I've only been here 18 months, and can't see that this beautiful kingdom is based upon the rule of law.  I can admire a well-run governments but don't see it here, which is okay.

What percent of the farang teaching ESL in Thailand have the proper visa, work permit, and teacher's license?  Less than 25%, I'll guess.  What % have a real bachelor's degree, related to what they teach?  Less than 20%, maybe.

I think we have a tier system in Thailand for ESL.  The big international schools, the better universities, the best private language school positions - and everything else.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

What's interesting to me is that the "everyhting else," jobs pay more than government universities and language schools.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

How many such examples of 'Thai Style' can you think of?

[treefrog]

Hi Steven,

Thanks for this very informative thread - I have been reading with great interest. I'd like to ask your advice. I'm coming out to BKK in Jan with my family (husband & 2 small kids) becaue he's on secondment there for 2 years. I have a BA and CTEFLA, plus about 3 years' experience, mainly in general and business English. I've taught all ages. I haven't taught since 1999, being a full-time mother, but I'd like to get back into teaching at least part-time. We'll be based somewhere near Ekamai. What sort of schools do I have the best chance of getting work in?