Questions About Qualifications

[Aperture]

Hey, merlin! Thanks for asking. With a master's degree, you'll have a lot of the medium-range options open to you- especially university work, where you may even find a position teaching sociology (though TEFL or English is more likely). For university work, the Master's is more important than the TEFL. Unfortunately, the baseline salary for most universities is rather low, in the high 20s per month- on the other hand, class load is small and there are very long paid vacations, plus extra work is readily available for much better pay. If you have other sources of income, this can be an excellent way to get beer money plus a visa.

Having the master's degree will also overcome your not having TEFL in many elementary/high schools, though not all- most of the "upper crust" ones will want to see some experience in teaching, plus a TEFL if that's your subject. You shouldn't rule out teaching social studies (in English) in one of the more advanced EP programs, of which there are not too many- but the pay for the ones which exist is very generous compared to your average Thai school program (even into the 50s and 60s range).

If you do have a lot of teaching experience, you could theoretically apply even for the international schools here, though sometimes if you're applying locally it doesn't matter HOW good your qualifications are (they're kinda prejudiced against us locals) they still won't take you.

Naturally, the schools which will take ANYone will still be available, at the industry standard rate of 25-30K, usually without paid vacations or legitimate paperwork.

"Steven"

"Naturally, the schools which will take ANYone will still be available, at the industry standard rate of 25-30K, usually without paid vacations or legitimate paperwork."

In my situation, I will have

-Bachelors of Science in Economics

-TEFL Cert

-40 hd addon in Business English to TEFL cert

-no teaching experience

With these stats, can I get into a school fresh off the boat making more than the industry standard? Ive read a lot of conflicting info about this- some say you'll make $25k, some say a lot more. Im not sure which is true. Can you please help?

Any info is greatly appreciated.

-Ap

[mbkudu]

To put things into perspective for you. Ten years ago (maybe even 15 years ago) 25,000 baht a month teaching, any English teaching, was considered bottom of the barrel salary. With the qualifications you have, you should aim for at least 40,000 baht per month. You could make more than that teaching business English with your education background being economics.

[PeaceBlondie]

To clarify my remarks about being illegal: maybe nowadays a fairly well qualified teacher like yourself would get lucky and be legal within 60 days. Most of us were not legal in two years. Some schools lie to you. Some employers do not know how to make you legal. Many more run afoul of the latest change in the non-existent rules. OTOH, there appear to be a fair number of employers who not only know how, but wish for you to have a proper B visa extended with a work permit, a proper waiver or whatever for the Thai culture course (but I doubt you qualify for a waiver), etc.

Here's hoping you get lucky, show up on time for all your interviews properly dressed, give a good interview and demo class, tell the wrong schools you are not interested, get along famously with Ajarn Pachanatakopf, have little darlings in cute uniforms, etc. What are the chances things will fall into place like that in the first year or two? Slim, I think.

[Aperture]

To put things into perspective for you. Ten years ago (maybe even 15 years ago) 25,000 baht a month teaching, any English teaching, was considered bottom of the barrel salary. With the qualifications you have, you should aim for at least 40,000 baht per month. You could make more than that teaching business English with your education background being economics.

thank you and thank you peaceblondie. good info!

-Ap

[rastlin]

Hello Everyone:

I hope I am posting in the correct spot. If not, I apologize.

I see that most of the discussion on this forum is related to the teaching of English. My teaching questions, however, are related to the teaching of technical subjects. I suppose I would be teaching these in English as I do not yet speak Thai, but they would not be English language courses. I will explain my background, training and teaching interest.

I currently am a practicing physician in the U.S. who intends to retire to Thailand in about four years. (I plan ahead, thus am beginning to work out the details of my post-retirement life now.) I am cutting my career short, as I have had enough of this stressful life, and will be retiring on or about the age of 50. While I am looking forward to getting out of medicine and the long hours that my career calls for, I doubt that I will be happy if I find myself without some sort of work. I have either been in school or working for my entire life after all. And I know myself. I think I will miss doing some work and the Thai language class that I plan on taking might not be enough to keep me sufficiently "busy". I have, therefore, been giving though to part time or maybe even full time work teaching medicine in particular or sciences in general. (Part time would probably be better, at least at first.) I have also thought about teaching medical terminology-as you may know there is a rapidly growing "medical tourism" market. There might be a demand for teachers who can help Thai doctors and other personnel understand the terminology, cultural expectations and nuances of communicating with English speaking patients.

I have some background in medical education. Before going into private practice I held an academic postion for a year at a well known University in which I taught full time to medical students and residents. After going into private practice I continued with some part time teaching for a couple of years. (It became too much to keep doing.) In terms of education I have a B.A. in Physics and an M.D. I also have a variety of other academic creditionals, certifications and licenses, however, I do not have a degree in education nor do I have any sort of teaching certificate. While I feel capable of teaching medicine or science right now, I am not against getting additional credentials if this would be needed to teach abroad. Heck, I have been getting credentials of one sort or another my whole life. Getting a few more would be a bit of work, to be sure, but not something that would really deter me.

In terms of the position itself, I would be looking at lifestyle more than salary. What I mean by this is I would want a position that allowed me to teach but was not an 80 hour a week job. Please don't misunderstand me, I am not lazy. I just want to have some life outside of work. 20-30 hours a week, 6-8 months a year, would be ideal. Also, I do not want to practice medicine. Frankly, if I wanted to do that I would just stay in the states. I am, I guess, burned out on this career and happy to leave it behind. I envision that I would be teaching undergratuates, Grad. level students, or adult professionals. (I have no experience with teaching younger people.) In terms of compensation, I am not really looking at salary at all. Fortunately, I am in a postion where I can retire without working. Any money I make is just extra fun money. I am more interested in working as something to keep me from becoming bored. And I would like to think that I could do a good job too. In terms of location, I suppose the Bangkok would be the obvious site to work. While I am not set against this option, I would probably prefer something to the north, like Chiang Mai.

As this post is already longer than I intended, I will wrap up with a few specific questions. 1) Do I need additional degrees, training or certification to teach science/medicine? 2) In particular, if I am not teaching English, do I need an education degree or the TEFL course? (Please note, I have already decided that it would be wise to take a TEFL course whether or not it was required.) 3) Is there much of a demand for teachers of technical subjects, especially on a part time basis? Most of what I have read is related to English teaching. 4) Are there any particular steps I would need to take now to begin to lay the groundwork for future teaching? I do have a few years to prepare. 5) Am I being unrealistic? If my desire to teach science/medicine is not something that is realistic let me know. Give it to me straight, I can take it. 6) Is anyone familar with firms (headhunters) that place people in professional positions in Thailand and if so does anyone have any comments on these firms? If firms are not used (that is how I have always found positions) how does one locate potential jobs of this nature?

I am sorry for the long winded post. I certainly do not expect any one person to address everything I have listed, I was just trying to be complete. And I probably listed more questions than I should have. Again, I apologize. Any suggestions, tips or comments are appreciated. I thank you in advance for your time.

Best Regards,

Rastlin

P.S. I am a science fiction fan, thus my pen name. And yes, it should have been Raestlin.

[icequeen]

If I were to obtain an online batchelors degree from an accredited university either in the UK or the US plus a TEFL certificate obtained in Thailand would this be sufficient to obtain a teachers licence. I have time to study for a couple of years before I need to get a job and staying in Thailand is no problem for me as I am here as a dependant of my husband. Failing this is it possible to get an internationally recognised BA from a university in Thailand. All help greatly appreciated, many thanks.

[aussiestyle1983]

Most likely is the answer to your question. Nothing is certain in Thailand and things always change. I am doing a degree through an open uni, it's not an online degree but it's via distance education, so something similar. As long as the degree is from a real university, it should be fine. It wouldn't matter how you studdied for the degree. The only difference between a degree done on campus and the same degree done via distance education from the same university is in the person holding the degree. They will both be recognised the same. And yes, you can do a degree in an international program in a Thai uni. Just remember, get your degree from the place that you think is best. If you think a Thai degree will bring the most benefits to you, do it there. If you want a degree from a western country, do a degree online or via distance education from a western uni. Yes again, you could do a TEFL there in Thailand and use it, just as you can use a TEFL certificate obtained from anywhere. But the degree takes longer, focus on that. A degree without a TEFL is most likely better than a TEFL without a degree. And, people can get leagle without degrees and TEFL certificates anyway, but I think these days are numbered;

so the degree should be the first thing on your list. A tefl can be done in 4 weeks, you need at least a few years for a degree. 1.5 years is the least ammount of time a bachelors degree (3 years full time degree done at 200% work load) can be done in AFAIK. Good luck.

[Loaded]

IF the degree or transcripts state 'Distance Learning', you may have a problem. I was told a few years back by a Thai staff member of the British Council that Thailand won't accept distance learning degrees. However, who really knows in Thailand? Life all depends on the alignment of the stars and your past karma anyway.

[Ijustwannateach]

I am aware of at least one person with a degree from the OU (UK) who has no problem here.

[zaphodbeeblebrox]

I know people without a BA and just a TEFL who have been hired. I know people who have no real degrees, just fake ones from KSR, who have been hired. It just depends how much job and residency security you want.

[aussiestyle1983]

IF the degree or transcripts state 'Distance Learning', you may have a problem. I was told a few years back by a Thai staff member of the British Council that Thailand won't accept distance learning degrees. However, who really knows in Thailand? Life all depends on the alignment of the stars and your past karma anyway.

Yes, make sure if you do a distance degree it is recognised the same as an on-campus degree. If so, the degree or transcripts would be identicle to on campus students and not say anything about distance education on them; not that there is any big significance expect for the fact that you just don't have face to face contact in distance education. I chose my method of studying because the degree I'll be awarded comes from a real uni, is identicle to the same on-campus degree, and does not say anything about having to listen to lectures from the CD rom instead of attending the lecture hall. Make sure your degree doesn't say online degree or anything like that.

[icequeen]

Thanks for all your replies everyone. I must admit it is very tempting to just do a TEFL and see if I can get hired but a waste of money if I can't. Plus the fact that I want to do things properley (work permit and all that) so I will look into what universities offer online courses bearing in mind of course the advice I have been given. Many thanks again for all your help.

[cash]

Thanks for all your replies everyone. I must admit it is very tempting to just do a TEFL and see if I can get hired but a waste of money if I can't. Plus the fact that I want to do things properley (work permit and all that) so I will look into what universities offer online courses bearing in mind of course the advice I have been given. Many thanks again for all your help.

Do a TEFL and apply at one of the big schools like Sarasas. They take care of their no degree teachers.

My friends been with them two years now. No Visa troubles, no monthly border runs. Two months paid holidays and all.

[Loaded]

A new Sarasas has just opened in Chiang Mai. It's along the road that you take to get to the train station.

[PeaceBlondie]

Not to be slagging off the huge franchise chain, but I have heard there may be a dozen such Sarasas schools, and that they differ greatly in how they are run. Some campuses are huge, others less so. I spent hours on a bus last year listening to a guy who taught in the primary school of one of the .....less well run....Sarasas schools. Yet even his story was not a horror story.

I have also heard that some of the Sarasas schools pay decently. Let us hope the one in Chiang Mai pays over 30K and knows how to process visas and work permits.

A new Sarasas has just opened in Chiang Mai. It's along the road that you take to get to the train station.

[aussiestyle1983]

From my experience with Sarasas, the smaller the school the better.

Yes, they do look after their non-degreed teachers and make them legal without asking teachers to get fake papers like some other schools do, well, I haven't heard of any non-degreed Sarasas teacher being asked to supply fake degrees where I worked. Sarasas is one school that you don't need to lie to in order to get a job, in fact, if they find out you have a fake degree and lied, they will most likely fire you as that has happened to afew people. Sarasas is not a bad place to work if you want to get some experience under your belt and lack a degree or other qualifications. If I return to LOS, and have my degree then and other job options, I'll still return to Sarasas for a year or two, the branch I worked in was excellent.

[orchidlady]

I am a 53 year old female (who can easily pass for 40 thanks to Botox) native speaker of English, taught English as a Second Language (grammar, reading, composition, Business English) for almost 3 years in my first job out of college-30 years ago--unfortunately there are no records available. Everyone I worked with has retired or died-school is of no help. This was at a University ESL program in the US. The majority of the students came from the Middle East and other OPEC nations (Indonesia and Brunei).

Then I got an MBA in Business working in Finance for twenty years and later a California State POST-SECONDARY PROVISIONAL ADULT EDUCATION Teaching Credential qualified for business subjects ( business, economics, accounting) and psychology ( I have BA in Psychology). I taught three years part time (50%) on that credential. It expired IN 1995 after 5 years but is renewable if I take some educational theory classes and so it is currently listed on the CA State teachers website and is verifiable.

I also have a current CA State Secondary SUBSTITUTE Teaching Credential plus over 1 year of substitute experience in grades 6-12 verifiable. I had to get my fingerprints checked by FBI and go through background check to get the Substitute Credential and take CBEST(reading, writing and math test). Presently I am waiting for the results of the CSET Math test (CA subject education test) due next week which if I pass would qualify me to teach Algebra and Geometry math courses in CA high schools on an emergency basis. Except they just instituted budget cutbacks in CA so there are not really any new trainee positions available locally--besides I have been to Thailand and want to teach there....

I am planning on coming back to Chiang Mai in May to go to Chiang Mai University to get a TESOL certificate just for review really (through TEFL international/Chiang Mai University). With my background what kinds of teaching positions are realistic to look for in Bangkok?....I would prefer Chiang Mai but I know they won't pay anywhere near what Bangkok does. I have a friend who worked at Ruamrudee in the early 90's and is willing to write a reference for me. I have also met several Thai people (Doctors and business people) in the US who have offered to help with references-would this be of any help?

[otherstuff1957]

Check your message box.

[PeaceBlondie]

Wangsuda is the resident California-credentialed teacher in these parts, so you might send him a PM or wait on his posting here.

I haven't had any face surgery since 1965 (wish I had, though). Anyway, some of my teaching experience on my resume dates to 1961 (talk about being dated; nobody's dated me lately), and nobody has questioned me about it. However, I have my local references for the last five years, and hope that continues to help.

I think you can get a job teaching English at a uni or rajabat. What do the rest of y'all think?

[garro]

I think it might help if you mention what type of student you are looking to teach. Adult or child? Do you wish to teach in university, secondary school, primary, public, or private? The answer to these questions will determine your options. For example; as far as I know, you don't presently need a teacher's license to teach in university. Your resume does sound impressive to me. Maybe others can offer better advice.

[BigSnake]

I am a 53 year old female (who can easily pass for 40 thanks to Botox) native speaker of English, taught English as a Second Language (grammar, reading, composition, Business English) for almost 3 years in my first job out of college-30 years ago--unfortunately there are no records available. Everyone I worked with has retired or died-school is of no help. This was at a University ESL program in the US. The majority of the students came from the Middle East and other OPEC nations (Indonesia and Brunei).

Then I got an MBA in Business working in Finance for twenty years and later a California State POST-SECONDARY PROVISIONAL ADULT EDUCATION Teaching Credential qualified for business subjects ( business, economics, accounting) and psychology ( I have BA in Psychology). I taught three years part time (50%) on that credential. It expired IN 1995 after 5 years but is renewable if I take some educational theory classes and so it is currently listed on the CA State teachers website and is verifiable.

I also have a current CA State Secondary SUBSTITUTE Teaching Credential plus over 1 year of substitute experience in grades 6-12 verifiable. I had to get my fingerprints checked by FBI and go through background check to get the Substitute Credential and take CBEST(reading, writing and math test). Presently I am waiting for the results of the CSET Math test (CA subject education test) due next week which if I pass would qualify me to teach Algebra and Geometry math courses in CA high schools on an emergency basis. Except they just instituted budget cutbacks in CA so there are not really any new trainee positions available locally--besides I have been to Thailand and want to teach there....

I am planning on coming back to Chiang Mai in May to go to Chiang Mai University to get a TESOL certificate just for review really (through TEFL international/Chiang Mai University). With my background what kinds of teaching positions are realistic to look for in Bangkok?....I would prefer Chiang Mai but I know they won't pay anywhere near what Bangkok does. I have a friend who worked at Ruamrudee in the early 90's and is willing to write a reference for me. I have also met several Thai people (Doctors and business people) in the US who have offered to help with references-would this be of any help?

ISAN AUA

[Scott]

You are very well qualified and you can pretty much pick where you want to teach. Most schools will take you in a heartbeat. The salary issue might still be a problem, but with a little time and effort you should get what you want.

[Ijustwannateach]

Moved to Questions about Qualifications.

[orchidlady]

My preference is to work in at a Private, International school, for high school or middle school age students. University work would be a second preference. I do not have any interest in teaching younger children.

[CarlyChia]

These may help, a little out of date but most of them should still be current:

UNIVERSITIES THAT OFFER INTERNATIONAL PROGRAMMES

Asian University of Science and Technology

Huay Yai, Bang Lamung, Chon Buri

Tel.: (038) 754450

Business Adm, Engineering

Assumption University (ABAC)

682 Ramkhamhaeng 24, Hua Mark, Bang Kapi, Bangkok

Tel.: 3004543 – 62 ext. 2507-8, 2513, 2520 Fax: 7191509

E-mail: [email protected]

Web site: www.au.ac.th

Bus Adm (BBA), Eng’g (B Eng), Arch (B Arch), BS (Sc & Tech),

BA (Comm Arts), Law (LL , Nursing Sc (BNS), BA (Arts),

Biotechnology (BS), Risk Mgmt & Ind Svcs

Bangkok University International College

40/4 Rama IV Rd., Khlong Toey, Bangkok 10110

Tel.: 6717300-48, 6717535, 3503500 ext. 609, 610

Fax: 2401819

E-mail: [email protected]

Accounting, Business Admin, Comm, Humanities

Chulalongkorn University

254 Pyathai Rd., Pathumwan, Bangkok 10330

Tel.: 2150871-3 Fax: 2154804

Arts in Euro Studies (MA), Bus Adm (MBA), Bus & Managerial Eco (MA),

Envi & Natural Resource Eco (MS), Health Dev (MS), Health Econ (MA),

Int Eco & Finance (MA), Mgmt (MM), Petrochem Tech & Polymer Science (MS,PhD), Thai Studies (MA)

Dusit Thani College

902 Moo 6, Srinakarin Rd., Nongbon, Prawet, Bangkok

Tel.: 3617805

Industry Admin

Eastern Asia University

200 Rangsit Rd., Thanyaburi District, Pathum Thani

Tel.: 7212345-8

Business Admin

Kasem Bundit University

99/101 Phatthanakan Rd., Suan Luang, Prawet, Bangkok

Tel.: 3216930-9

Acct (BA), Finance & Banking Mgmt (BA),

Finance & Business Computer (BA), Marketing (BA)

Khon Kaen University

123 Friendship Highway Rd., A. Muang, Khon Kaen 40002

Tel.: (043) 242331-47 Fax: (043) 241216

Web site: www.kku.ac.th

Rural Development Management (MA)

King Mongkut’s Institute of Technology (North Bangkok)

1518 Pibulsongkram Rd., Bang Sue, Bangkok 10800

Tel.: 9132500-24 ext. 2408 Fax: 5874350

E-mail: [email protected]

Comp & Info Tech (MS), Applied Sc in Stat [M.App.Sc(Stats)]

Kirik University

43/1111 Ram Inthra Rd., Bang Khen, Bangkok

Tel.: 5523500-9

Business Admin., Communication Arts, Law

Mahanakorn University of Technology

51 Moo 1 Kratumlai Nong Chok District, Bangkok

Tel.: 9883666

Engineering, Business Admin., Veterinary

Mahidol University

198/2 Somdej Pra Pinklao Rd., Bang Plad, Bangkok 10700

Tel.: 4337103 Fax: 4337083, 4358319

E-mail: [email protected]

Public Health, Institute of Population and Social Research

National Institute of Development Administration (NIDA)

Klong Chan, Bang Kapi, Bangkok

Tel.: 3758798

Grad. Studies in Bus. & Dev Admin.

Prince of Songkla University

71/1 Moo 5, Karnjanavanich Rd., Hat Yai, Songkla

Tel.: (074) 211030-49

Web site: www.psu.ac.th

Epidemiology (MS)

Ramkhamhaeng Rd., Hua Mark, Bang Kapi, Bangkok

Tel.: 3180903

E-mail: [email protected]

Bus. Admin., Economics, Educ., Humanities, Law, Science

Rangsit University

52/347 Muang-Ake, Lakhok, Phaholtothin Rd.,

Muang District, Pathum Thani 1200

Tel.: 5339020-4, 9972200, 9972345 Fax: 5339470

E-mail: [email protected]

International Business (BBA), Philosophy, Politics and Economics (BA),

Tourism & Hotel Management (BBA)

Siam University

235 Phet Kasem Rd., Phasi Chareon, Bangkok

Tel.: 8685015-7

Business Admin., Hotel & Tourism Management

Sripatum University

Bang Khen Campus, Bldg #1 Rm, 313,

61 Phaholyothin Rd., Ladyao, Chatuchak, Bangkok

Tel.: 5799120-39, 9401300-49 ext. 1432, 1147 Fax: 5611721

E-mail: [email protected]

International Business Communication (BA)

Stamford International College

Cha-am Rd., Ch-am District, Phetchaburi

Tel.: (032) 520789

St. John’s College

1110/5 Vibhavadee Rangsit Rd., Chatuchak, Bangkok

Tel.: 9387058-68

Business Admin., Liberal Arts

Thammasat University

2 Phrachan Rd., Bangkok

Tel.: 2216111-20

Web site: www.tu.ac.th

Business Adm (BBA,PhD), Eco (BE, ME, PhD),

Engineering (SIIT), International Relations (MIR),

Marketing (MIM)

The University of the Thai Chamber of Commerce (UTCC)

126/1 Vibhavadee Rangsit Road, Din Daeng, Bangkok 10400

Tel.: 6923050, 2761040 ext. 2110, 2802-4 Fax: 2762126 ext. 1710

Web site: www.utcc.ac.th

Int’l Business Mgmt (BBA), Business Comm (MBA), Int’l Business (MBA),

English for Business and Technology (MA), Int’l Banking and Finance (MBA)

Webster University (Thailand)

Moo 5, Nongsano, Sampraya Sub District,

Cha-am District, Phetchaburi

And please who keeps un-pinning this topic and why?

Do you know which is the best for law?

From the aspects of reputation, results......

[Ijustwannateach]

Depending on which flavour of politics you like, Chula or Thammasart are considered the top *THAI* (as in Thai language) law programs. I don't know about the quality level of any of the English-language legal programs at these places, though.

[Paps]

Hi there,

Before registering, I have been reading a few topics and find some really interesting.

I'll finish later this year (once I'm done with my internship) my bachelor of business majoring in both International Business and Management.

I studied most of my degree at AUT Univeristy in Auckland, New Zealand but for the last semester I came in Thailand to study at Chula as part of an exchange they have with AUT.

Currently, I'm working in Bangkok (internship). The thing is that my internship will be completed in about a month and after 8 lovely months here I really would like to stay a bit longer.

Therefore, I was wondering if with my current qualifications I could find a job as an English or French teacher or something more specialised such as computer studies or anything else.

And if so, does anyone got any lead?

Thank you in advance

Cheers

Paps

[Ijustwannateach]

Maybe ask your bosses at the internship to ask around for you??

[Paps]

Depending on which flavour of politics you like, Chula or Thammasart are considered the top *THAI* (as in Thai language) law programs. I don't know about the quality level of any of the English-language legal programs at these places, though.

Concerning Chula, I haven't studied law there and don't think they do provide a stream in English so, I’d recommend you to check for it.

However, I have studied there for a semester (BBA program) and frankly academically speaking it is a real shame, a big joke!!!

The quality isn't there at all... No referencing needed, no significant reports or essays; nothing learned!!! While often teachers don’t show up at all or on time... So personally, I would avoid it in the future but again, I don't know anything about their law faculty... But based on my experience, I’d recommend you to look somewhere else if your goal is to learn something that has some academic values…

Otherwise, my boss being a westerner that started recently doesn't have much contact with locals and couldn’t give me some hints…

Any suggestion welcome

Cheers

Paps

[Ijustwannateach]

It's getting kind of hard to do subject teaching without some sort of related degree- with your degree in business, you might be able to do some kind of business English teaching, but that usually requires some basic English teaching experience (it's not an entry level job). If TEFL is really the way you want to go, a college degree is about all you need to start; I'd also recommend a TEFL training course (you can search TV or the web for more info on those) and you'll have at least a few rough, poorly-paid years of paying your dues before you find anything that might be worth building on. I don't recommend it.

Basically, at this point in your life, I'd take your degree back to your home country and use it to get some experience, more money, and possibly invest in an M.Ed./PGCE if you are really serious about teaching jobs here (as opposed to business jobs). That way you won't be trapped in the low end and you'll have time to consider other options.