Most Thais Think Economy Bad, Getting Worse

[mogandave]

Even low end cars are way more expensive than in the west. 

For example?

What does a Nissan March cost here and what does it cost in the West?

[mogandave]

 
"financial data and is well served by able officials in the responsible ministries and the Bank of Thailand."
 
This was by far my favourite line of the post. Comedy gold...

If there were a lack of trust in the financial data, the Baht would not be strong.

[spidermike007]

4 minutes ago, thaibeachlovers said:

The staples in LOS are rice, vegetables, native Thai fruit, with a small amount of seafood and chicken/ pork. The examples you give are not staples.

I go by what I have to pay. when the same food I ate in early 90s has only increased by 15 baht, that is not a large increase. Pattaya baht bus increase 0%.

Last time I stayed in Pattaya, rooms still cost 400 to 600 for reasonable place. A small increase in 30 years.

If everyone didn't buy food that is unreasonably expensive the price will come down. No one is forcing you to buy watermelons or Pomelos.

People eat far too much meat which causes cancer and is generally bad for us in excessive amounts. Plus it's against Buddhism. Chicken and pork are still cheap. If one doesn't want to pay a lot for meat, eat those instead of beef and lamb.

Does anyone think prices haven't increased in every country? Does no one remember the 1980s?

Seafood is contaminated by sea pollution and is being overexploited. people should eat less of it. Wheat and dairy are bad for us- Thais didn't normally get fat before they became easily available.

Before Thais became more affluent, the average person ate a much healthier diet, and only rich people became obese.

Beer: alcohol is one of the worst commonly available drugs, causing disease, violence and poverty. Anything that reduces use of it in any form is welcome, IMO.

Sorry, I was not looking for a sermon from the pulpit. Please keep your moral beliefs on food to yourself. We just do not need to hear it. We eat and drink what we choose to. It is not your place to try to change the world, and if you want to, do it on your own time, and in privacy. However, I highly encourage you to focus that effort on yourself. We all need to improve. 

 

All we can go by is what I eat and drink, and I see that going up all around me, not only here, but around the world. Especially in the US, where inflation is rampant right now, despite what the government hooligans say.

[spidermike007]

3 minutes ago, thaibeachlovers said:

The worst thing that has happened to LOS in the time I have been visiting is the increase in cars that has exceeded the capacity of the roads to accommodate. Singapore has had to take drastic methods to stabilise car numbers, and most Thai towns/ cities are just as bad as Singapore, but nothing is done to stop the increase of cars on the road.

Anything that stops people in towns/ cities buying cars is a good thing.

This is true. Nothing is being done in the way of traffic mitigation, to cope with the massive increase in the number of vehicles on the road. Hope they get their act together soon, with the high speed trains. 

[thaibeachlovers]

25 minutes ago, Eric Loh said:

Even though Thailand debt to GDP over the years has been managed reasonably well, there are few concerns in my opinion.

 

The biggest concern is that we will be running a budget deficit for next few years and technically will not able to pay and service the debt. The GDP growth over the years have also been uninspiring under junta rule. Thailand need an elected government to bring in more investments local and abroad. Lastly government spending will increase especially the aging population needs and the military lavish, increasing and wasteful spending seem unabated. 

What does the government spend money for old people on, other than health care, which is of very poor quality ( I have the experience of my MIL getting ill and hospitalised )? Families are expected to look after their elder members on their own.

[hzarry]

20 hours ago, Peterw42 said:

I can see @spidermike007 point, Its often hard to believe the official inflation figures when you see groceries and things going up, I dont watch prices to much but even I notice some significant price rises for the once a week groceries at the supermarket or basic Thai meal at the local restaurant. Things dont go up by 2-3%, its often 20-30%.. I can find 6-8 things, that I know of, at 7/11, that have gone from say 20 baht to 30 baht.

Our standard weekly shop use to cost 2,000 baht, its now 2,500.

Boxed wine went up from B790 to B 999 recently.

[BritManToo]

17 minutes ago, simoh1490 said:

I'm unsure, the price of chicken has remained flat for several years, as has the price of milk. Rice increased because of supply problems and now the price is falling, pork prices appear flat also. Watermelon doubling from 12 to 24 baht over 10 years suggests the price was probably too low at the outset, the other items I don't know but certainly not even close to 10% overall..

When I was here in 2016, Tesco chicken breasts were 34bht for 400gm.

When I came back this year I found they are 34bht for 300gm.

 

I make that an increase of 33% in two years. A portion of cooked rice, still 5bht for 200gm.

Most Thais I meet appear to be eating rice, plus a little flavouring.

If rice prices increase there may be a problem.

The poor seem to manage without much else.

[mogandave]

I’ve been buying Pepsi Max at “seven” for years. It has been THB18 all the time.

Yesterday it was THB15.

This proves that inflation is actually NEGATIVE 18%!!!!

[lvr181]

Never known of a military general (cerainly not the incumbent one) who understands and can demonstrate their understanding of economics.

 

But the hiso, elite and rich are okay, so why would they care, unfortunately? 

 

Despite any rhetoric to the contrary (and Thai 4.0) the kingdom still functions as a feudal society (let's keep the peasants in check). 

Edited June 7, 2018 by lvr181
Additional wording

[dallen52]

17 hours ago, spidermike007 said:

Restaurants, hotels, gift shops, and travel agencies, that cater to tourists. All are saying the same thing, in the resort areas. I am not making this up.

True.

We collectively who live in sin city and not rural areas, do get exposed to the daily real life costs a farang encounters. 

NOT the Thai 300 baht a day wage people.

2009 i used to get 33 baht to the Aussie  $ plus huge benefits from my employer. Living allowances.

Brits got almost 70 to the £.

Today i get 24 and the U.K. expats get 42.

These are the factors that we see and affect many of us.

And are crippling us.

 

Thailand has no unemployment rate so to speak.

Minimal taxes paid. 

Hardly any social security system. 

A high level of ignorance about what they are entitled to. 

No Thai lady pursues maintenance of children from ex thai men.

Even though i understand the law says they must pay until age 20.

 

Aged Thai people dont claim the low earnings allowances or benefits card, because THEY have no idea about it. 

They pay almost as much in hospitals as we do now.

Pay day loans are rife.

10% a day./month.

Its a massive industry. 

I know some Thai people who dont eat some days.

Because the man has drunk the money or gambled it, or used it with his second wife or girlfriend. 

 

Thailand talks about revaluation again.

 

Some tourist data says 70% of families dont come to pattaya. 

Its not a family place.

Tourism may be reported as on the increase.

But its not spending money here.

Its not tipping the locals. 

My friend has dropped staff to 6 from 8 in both his bar restaurants. 

Just pays ot if needed. 

Thats 25% staff reduction. 

 

I try to tip well everywhere. 

Because they are doing 26 day months and 9 hours a day, for around 9000 a month. Zero benefits. 

 

We all read and we all laugh about the official government line. (Lies)

 

But we all are captives in this Thai economic system. 

 

[Cranky]

4 hours ago, connda said:

The customer base for bars and massage and those types of venues are predominately farang.

Thai hotelier and the TAT have essentially come out and said that farang are now persona non grata, are not really sought after,  and inconsequential to Thailand's tourist strategy and that the Chinese are now their preferred customer base. 
Farangs and Westerners support the bar, nightclub, massage industry and a sub-set of the guesthouse, hostel, condo, B&B, and service apartment industry.
The bar, nightclub, massage industry supports street vendors.

The regime is going out of it's way in targeting street vendors for extinction and eliminate the competition in favor of large restaurant chains and malls that accommodate Chinese group tours.

The regime is going out of it's way in targeting the guesthouse, hostel, condo, B&B, and service apartment looking for ways to shut them down and eliminate the competition in favor of large hotels and venues that accommodate Chinese group tours.
So these sets of businesses and services heavily dependent on farang and Westerners for it's livelihood are  being targeted and decimated.
The monies that used to flow through those business and it employees now fails to make it back to rural Thailand for the support of low-class and needy families.
So yeah, with the farang told that they are no longer wanted or needed, and the money supporting that segment of Thai society drying up and effecting families throughout the kingdom adversely, it's not difficult to see how the manta on the street is now, "Slow, no customer..." and from the villages that, "Economy bad".
It's pretty evident that the regimes slogan, "Happiness to the People" primarily means those in the upper segments of Thai society and the lower class be damn.

Nonsense.  Most go-gos are overrun by Asian sex-tourists.  Years ago you would never see an Asian sitting in a go-go bar; Japanese kept to their own areas, Koreans were very few, Chinese practically zero.  Today is totally different, hard to even find a seat, or a round-eye, in some bars and for good reason - they are happy to pay as bonking in their home countries is ten times the price of here.  High-end massage joint patrons are nearly all Thai or Asians. 'Farang' (Western) tourists are mostly bargain hunters and contribute a small percentage of the income and wont be missed.  The other end of the market - zero-dollar Chinese tour groups - also contribute next to nothing.

 

When Pattaya dries up like the desperate old dame it is, it will not be missed. What cracks me up is how its farang residents actually believe Pattaya and Thailand are somehow related.

[BritManToo]

34 minutes ago, Eric Loh said:

The biggest concern is that we will be running a budget deficit for next few years and technically will not able to pay and service the debt. The GDP growth over the years have also been uninspiring under junta rule. Thailand need an elected government to bring in more investments local and abroad. Lastly government spending will increase especially the aging population needs and the military lavish, increasing and wasteful spending seem unabated.

 

We?

We expats/tourists/foreigners are running Thailand?

What reality are you living in, 'we' live here on sufferance of the Military, it isn't my business how Thais run their country.

[thaibeachlovers]

4 minutes ago, spidermike007 said:

Sorry, I was not looking for a sermon from the pulpit. Please keep your moral beliefs on food to yourself. We just do not need to hear it. We eat and drink what we choose to. It is not your place to try to change the world, and if you want to, do it on your own time, and in privacy. However, I highly encourage you to focus that effort on yourself. We all need to improve. 

 

All we can go by is what I eat and drink, and I see that going up all around me, not only here, but around the world. Especially in the US, where inflation is rampant right now, despite what the government hooligans say.

Oh, don't misunderstand me, I'm the last person to "moralise". people can eat whatever they choose and drink whatever is legal. I was trying to point out that an unhealthy lifestyle cost more than a healthy one. As a sugar lover my diet was incredibly unhealthy, though I'm a sitter for diabetes and have cut way down.

However, the overexploitation of the oceans is not sustainable and everyone should have a conversation and do something before it is too late.

 

You can eat whatever you like, but the examples you give are specific to your choices and do not, IMO, indicate a serious inflation problem for the vast majority of Thais, and as it's Thailand, they are the only ones that count in any discussion on here.

[BritManToo]

Just now, dallen52 said:

2009 i used to get 33 baht to the Aussie  $ plus huge benefits from my employer. Living allowances.

Brits got almost 70 to the £.

I was here in 2009, still have the exchange records, between 50 and 52bht for the British pound during that year.

[simoh1490]

21 minutes ago, Eric Loh said:

Bond is a debt. Budget deficit is a key issue in paying debt. Simply put, where the extra cash to pay debt. 

The debt doesn't have to be paid in full until the redemption date of the bonds, 25 years or more in the future. In the meantime the government has to make dividend payments on the bonds, around 5% or so and that can be financed out of the budget deficit.

[thaibeachlovers]

5 minutes ago, BritManToo said:

When I was here in 2016, Tesco chicken breasts were 34bht for 400gm.

When I came back this year I found they are 34bht for 300gm.

 

I make that an increase of 33% in two years. A portion of cooked rice, still 5bht for 200gm.

Most Thais I meet appear to be eating rice, plus a little flavouring.

If rice prices increase there may be a problem.

The poor seem to manage without much else.

The poorest Thais tend to live in the rural areas, and they can grow vegetables alongside the road if they don't have enough land of their own. They eat a more healthy diet that Thais that live in urban areas, who eat trucked in food that is poisoned by chemicals. Villages have markets where they can buy fresh food from local farmers.

[mogandave]

Never known of a military general (cerainly not the incumbent one) who understands and can demonstrate their understanding of economics.
 
But the hiso, elite and rich are okay, so why would they care, unfortunately? 
 
Despite any rhetoric to the contrary (and Thai 4.0) the kingdom still functions as a feudal society (let's keep the peasants in check). 

Yes, it’s getting almost as bad as the EU.

[Cranky]

Just now, BritManToo said:

I was here in 2009, still have the exchange records, between 50 and 52bht for the British pound during that year.

Everybody focuses on the 'way it was' when it comes to exchange rates.  What most overlook is that the Baht was pegged at 25 to the US dollar for many years.  When it collapsed in '97 it was 36 to the Pound.  It then peaked to around 54 and 90, up and down like a tart's drawers (like all currencies) and now pretty stable somewhere near the middle. 

[BritManToo]

3 minutes ago, dallen52 said:

Aged Thai people dont claim the low earnings allowances or benefits card, because THEY have no idea about it. 

They pay almost as much in hospitals as we do now.

I know quite a few poor elderly Thais, they pay ZERO in Thai government hospitals.

One 50 year old lady being treated for breast cancer receives excellent health free care, wasn't expecting to still see her around.

Several others with various elderly complaints, High blood pressure, diabetes. They don't pay anything for hospital visits, stays, or drugs.

All free.

[lvr181]

2 minutes ago, simoh1490 said:

The debt doesn't have to be paid in full until the redemption date of the bonds, 25 years or more in the future. In the meantime the government has to make dividend payments on the bonds, around 5% or so and that can be financed out of the budget deficit.

In 25 years the kingdom is likely to be a territory of China!

[Eric Loh]

5 minutes ago, simoh1490 said:

The debt doesn't have to be paid in full until the redemption date of the bonds, 25 years or more in the future. In the meantime the government has to make dividend payments on the bonds, around 5% or so and that can be financed out of the budget deficit.

So a never ending debt from budget deficits. 

[mogandave]

 
We?

He has a mouse in his pocket...

[Cranky]

5 minutes ago, thaibeachlovers said:

The poorest Thais tend to live in the rural areas, and they can grow vegetables alongside the road if they don't have enough land of their own. They eat a more healthy diet that Thais that live in urban areas, who eat trucked in food that is poisoned by chemicals. Villages have markets where they can buy fresh food from local farmers.

What a romantic notion to think that 'local' farmers don't poison their crops. Where do you think the stuff that is getting trucked into towns comes from? 

[simoh1490]

14 minutes ago, BritManToo said:

When I was here in 2016, Tesco chicken breasts were 34bht for 400gm.

When I came back this year I found they are 34bht for 300gm.

 

I make that an increase of 33% in two years. A portion of cooked rice, still 5bht for 200gm.

Most Thais I meet appear to be eating rice, plus a little flavouring.

If rice prices increase there may be a problem.

The poor seem to manage without much else.

I mentioned this earlier but I'll repeat here:

 

We thought our shopping bill was getting expensive so we checked another nearby supermarket, chicken breasts, since you mention them, 56 baht down to 38 baht for the same measure; cheese dropped from 188 baht to 161 baht; chiang beer from 54 to 51...and that's all I can recall right now. We changed our supermarket, I suggest you do the same.

[BritManToo]

1 minute ago, Eric Loh said:

So a never ending debt from budget deficits. 

It seems to work for America and Europe.

[thaibeachlovers]

7 minutes ago, dallen52 said:

Brits got almost 70 to the £.

Today i get 24 and the U.K. expats get 42.

These are the factors that we see and affect many of us.

And are crippling us.

True, but that's nothing to do with THAI inflation.

 

 

7 minutes ago, dallen52 said:

No Thai lady pursues maintenance of children from ex thai men.

Even though i understand the law says they must pay until age 20.

True, but nothing to do with inflation.

 

 

 

 

 

7 minutes ago, dallen52 said:

I know some Thai people who dont eat some days.

Because the man has drunk the money or gambled it, or used it with his second wife or girlfriend. 

True, but nothing to do with inflation

 

8 minutes ago, dallen52 said:

Some tourist data says 70% of families dont come to pattaya. 

Its not a family place.

Pattaya was really prosperous back in the 90s when families did not look on Pattaya as a good destination. It has become less prosperous as the authorities try to make it a family destination.

 

 

8 minutes ago, dallen52 said:

Tourism may be reported as on the increase.

But its not spending money here.

Its not tipping the locals. 

My friend has dropped staff to 6 from 8 in both his bar restaurants. 

100% correct.

Blame the government policy to increase Chinese tourism.

That does possibly have something to do with inflation as more visitors seek accommodation. Obviously prices rise.

[mrmicbkktxl]

21 hours ago, bkk6060 said:

Where you hear those complaints?  Some of the 1000 bars or massage shops in Pattaya?  "Slow, no customer"...

I am hearing/seeing just the opposite at many businesses.  Growth is at a five year high, people are coming here in droves, and the economy is doing well.

Most Thais have no education on economics and would have no clue what the "economy" is.  But, people love to wallow in negativity and sadness for themselves in some odd way it makes them feel empowered.

 

If the hotels are full it doesn't mean the economy running well,also the average thai has nothing to do with hotels and tourists

[thaibeachlovers]

1 minute ago, BritManToo said:

It seems to work for America and Europe.

Only for now. It's guaranteed to end in tears for many. IMO 2007 but worse.

[dallen52]

12 minutes ago, BritManToo said:

I was here in 2009, still have the exchange records, between 50 and 52bht for the British pound during that year.

 

[Panda13]

Oh great, TV economy experts now. Cause economists worldwide have done such a great job screwing up every country that we should believe that any of them know what the hell they are talking about.