As Trump attacks, Canada goes to Plan B: same as Plan A

[bristolboy]

2 minutes ago, dave_boo said:

My post was tongue in cheek. Other than those Canadians that even other Canadians just tolerate they're great people. 

 

Numbers are kind of my thing. There are 193 nations in the UN. One of those provides over 50% of the illegal immigrants to the US. So 191 have to provide the remaining. If the distribution was equal, there would be ~34,000 from each of the countries. Obviously countries like Mongolia won't be fairly represented so it should be obvious that a country sharing a land border will take up the slack. Think of it this way; if there's a liter of cola and I take 500 ml and leave the rest for 10 people than you taking 55 ml, which is a really small portion, makes you the second largest consumer.

 

As an aside, I wish that the whole of the world was as amicable as Canada and the US is. Just the snowbird example you listed being applied across the board would make life better.

 

And nope, my memory doesn't go that far back as I was born nearly a decade after that war.

"As an aside, I wish that the whole of the world was as amicable as Canada and the US is."

Maybe you mean "as amicable as Canada and the US" was?

Edited June 12, 2018 by bristolboy

[dave_boo]

Just now, bristolboy said:

"As an aside, I wish that the whole of the world was as amicable as Canada and the US is."

Maybe you should put that wish in the past tense?

The US forgave Canada for Celine Dion and Justin Bieber...I hope they can forgive Trump.

[pegman]

55 minutes ago, bristolboy said:

"As an aside, I wish that the whole of the world was as amicable as Canada and the US is."

Maybe you mean "as amicable as Canada and the US" was?

A former American diplomat says:

 

"

Heyman believes the relationship can recover, with the caveat that the U.S. will have to take the initiative.

"It's kind of like … if you were sitting with a friend and then out of the blue, you just punched them in the face," he said. "The wounds will heal, but the questions [is] how does the relationship get impacted?

"That's what happened here. These guys just pulled away and punched Canada in the face, and I think it was a line crossed and a bridge too far," Heyman said.

"They owe you an apology.""

 

http://www.cbc.ca/news/politics/trump-twitter-trudeau-trade-tariffs-ambassador-bruce-heyman-1.4701773

 

[pegman]

57 minutes ago, dave_boo said:

The US forgave Canada for Celine Dion and Justin Bieber...I hope they can forgive Trump.

Homeboy Neil Young and Joni Mitchell made up for them two.

[GOLDBUGGY]

11 hours ago, spidermike007 said:

Are you listening to Trump again? Sad. Canada did not invade the US in 1812. Canada was not even a nation until 50 years later. Britain invaded the US at that time, and burned down the White House. Please. Check out google. It is an amazing source of information. Whatever you do, do not reflect the ignorance of Tiny Don. 

It was only meant to be a joke but okay I will play along with you.. 

 

Britain was in conflict with the United States in the War of 1812 on other issues but it did not come to a full head until the United States wanted to annex Canada. A country you said did not exist until 50 years later. These invasion forces came from Canada and not by ship from Great Britain and like during the American Revolution. Canada was a nation then with its own territories and borders separate from the United States. 

 

To say Canada was not a nation then based on them not gaining full independence from Great Britian until 1867 is rediculous. Canada has always had close ties with Great Britian and never even had there own Flag until 1965, or 100 years later. The Head of State is not Trudeau but in fact it is the Queen of England. So maybe in your eyes Canada still is part of Great Britian and not even a Nation now? 

 

So who were these so called Canadians back in 1812? Many were  "Loyalists" who came from American Colonies, who did not want to fight against the King in the American Revolution, (1775 to 1783) and in many cases against there American Brothers. So to avoid this conflict they moved North to what was then called Upper and Lower Canada. They got dragged back into a war when the USA wanted to annex Canada in 1812. Some 30 years later.   

[GOLDBUGGY]

10 hours ago, mfd101 said:

Yes, I remember arguing with my Canadian cousins back in 2004/2005 at a time the US Congress was placing or threatening to place duties on imports of Canadian timber ('lumber'). I pointed out that the whole world was short of timber - Japan, China, Korea, India, Europe ... - and Canada had it in abundance. So how come the Yanks had them over a barrel instead of the other way round?

 

My cousins agreed that Canada had perhaps become complacent & lazy ...

Yes I remember this time also and good points.

 

I forget now which Hurricane it was, but once it came through the USA there became a huge shortage for lumber, and high demand for Canadian Timber, and thus these Tariffs never did come into play. But I agree with you in that this should have been a wake up call for Canada. 

[GOLDBUGGY]

9 hours ago, bristolboy said:

No, he doesn't mean the snowbirds. He might mean, for example

 

"It seems that an army of Canadian citizens — despite coming from a place of relative affluence and opportunity – live illicitly in the U.S. One research institute estimates the total at 100,000, while a recent American government report said nearly that many Canadians outstayed their legal welcome — and failed to leave – in one year alone."

http://nationalpost.com/news/world/northern-aliens-around-100000-canadians-live-under-the-radar-in-u-s-as-illegal-immigrants

Well I have been down to the United States plenty of times and I honestly never heard of a Canadian jumping a fence in the dark of night and found later begging on the streets of New York, or picking cotton or tabacco without a Work Permit.  In fact the last time I crossed by car it was only a cattle gate between us and them. But who knows? 

 

Whow! Over-staying there Visa! Gosh! I wonder if that happens here? Looks like Gretzky will have to come home soon as he only has duel citizenship, thus still Canadian. Maybe Celine Dion to? 

 

But then in return The USA gave Canada Charles NG, who along with Leonard Lake raped, tortured, and murdered between 11 to 25 people in California. He was a guest of Canada for about 6 years and caused one of the most costly court cases in Canadian History. All free to him of course. 

 

Then there was also the 4,000 or so Sioux Indians left over from Custers Last Stand, who found refuge in Canada hiding from the US Calvary, and of course the thousands of Loyalists coming from the US during the American Revolutioon. Or those countless Draft Doggers during the Vietname War. So I guess this makes us even.  Or we will take back our 100,000 if you agree to take back your 5,000,000 or so. 

[GOLDBUGGY]

2 hours ago, dave_boo said:

My post was tongue in cheek. Other than those Canadians that even other Canadians just tolerate they're great people. 

 

Numbers are kind of my thing. There are 193 nations in the UN. One of those provides over 50% of the illegal immigrants to the US. So 191 have to provide the remaining. If the distribution was equal, there would be ~34,000 from each of the countries. Obviously countries like Mongolia won't be fairly represented so it should be obvious that a country sharing a land border will take up the slack. Think of it this way; if there's a liter of cola and I take 500 ml and leave the rest for 10 people than you taking 55 ml, which is a really small portion, makes you the second largest consumer.

 

As an aside, I wish that the whole of the world was as amicable as Canada and the US is. Just the snowbird example you listed being applied across the board would make life better.

 

And nope, my memory doesn't go that far back as I was born nearly a decade after that war.

Yes! Good Points!

 

My Main Point has been that a Border has two ways you can go. Enter or Exit. There are more people entering Canada than leaving, and the same holds true for the USA.

 

Our Border, and one of the largest in the World has always been open for both parties. I hope it stays this way. 

[pegman]

5 hours ago, GOLDBUGGY said:

It was only meant to be a joke but okay I will play along with you.. 

 

Britain was in conflict with the United States in the War of 1812 on other issues but it did not come to a full head until the United States wanted to annex Canada. A country you said did not exist until 50 years later. These invasion forces came from Canada and not by ship from Great Britain and like during the American Revolution. Canada was a nation then with its own territories and borders separate from the United States. 

 

To say Canada was not a nation then based on them not gaining full independence from Great Britian until 1867 is rediculous. Canada has always had close ties with Great Britian and never even had there own Flag until 1965, or 100 years later. The Head of State is not Trudeau but in fact it is the Queen of England. So maybe in your eyes Canada still is part of Great Britian and not even a Nation now? 

 

So who were these so called Canadians back in 1812? Many were  "Loyalists" who came from American Colonies, who did not want to fight against the King in the American Revolution, (1775 to 1783) and in many cases against there American Brothers. So to avoid this conflict they moved North to what was then called Upper and Lower Canada. They got dragged back into a war when the USA wanted to annex Canada in 1812. Some 30 years later.   

Yes, the British colony Quebec was divided into the 2 Canadas in 1791. In 1792 the 1st Parliment of Canada (Upper) meet in Newark, now Niagara on the Lake. There were 14 elected Members, my Great-Great-Great.......Grandfather (about 10 generations back) being one of them. He had fought the domestic terrorists in the American colonies and moved north around 1783. His family had been with the Puritans that left England for the Boston area in 1631. His father, a Vermont magistrate, had been harassed by the thug Ethan Allan and his hooligan gang and died at a fort in New York. I too think they thought of themselves as Canadiain of British citizenry.

[Beats56]

8 hours ago, GOLDBUGGY said:

It was only meant to be a joke but okay I will play along with you.. 

 

Britain was in conflict with the United States in the War of 1812 on other issues but it did not come to a full head until the United States wanted to annex Canada. A country you said did not exist until 50 years later. These invasion forces came from Canada and not by ship from Great Britain and like during the American Revolution. Canada was a nation then with its own territories and borders separate from the United States. 

 

To say Canada was not a nation then based on them not gaining full independence from Great Britian until 1867 is rediculous. Canada has always had close ties with Great Britian and never even had there own Flag until 1965, or 100 years later. The Head of State is not Trudeau but in fact it is the Queen of England. So maybe in your eyes Canada still is part of Great Britian and not even a Nation now? 

 

So who were these so called Canadians back in 1812? Many were  "Loyalists" who came from American Colonies, who did not want to fight against the King in the American Revolution, (1775 to 1783) and in many cases against there American Brothers. So to avoid this conflict they moved North to what was then called Upper and Lower Canada. They got dragged back into a war when the USA wanted to annex Canada in 1812. Some 30 years later.   

The other thing here is the British were in Canada because or the furs. Beaver felt hats were fashionable in the UK. As for the Canadian flag I remember very well about it. They were trying to decide on the color. .blue or red. Also we sang God save the Queen in class every morning. And the Queens pictures are in every classroom and  business. A good show on Netflix is about the Hudson Bay Company and the fur trade called Frontier.

[pegman]

2 hours ago, Beats56 said:

The other thing here is the British were in Canada because or the furs. Beaver felt hats were fashionable in the UK. As for the Canadian flag I remember very well about it. They were trying to decide on the color. .blue or red. Also we sang God save the Queen in class every morning. And the Queens pictures are in every classroom and  business. A good show on Netflix is about the Hudson Bay Company and the fur trade called Frontier.

I remember standing for God Save the Queen at movie theaters too just as done in LOS now.

[GOLDBUGGY]

9 hours ago, Beats56 said:

The other thing here is the British were in Canada because or the furs. Beaver felt hats were fashionable in the UK. As for the Canadian flag I remember very well about it. They were trying to decide on the color. .blue or red. Also we sang God save the Queen in class every morning. And the Queens pictures are in every classroom and  business. A good show on Netflix is about the Hudson Bay Company and the fur trade called Frontier.

Yes, I remember all those days to. Probably still can recite the words to "God Save Our Gracious Queen" today as well. But perhaps what I remember most was saluting our Flag the first time in 1965, as it was on my Birthday on Februaty 15th.  

[bristolboy]

17 hours ago, GOLDBUGGY said:

Well I have been down to the United States plenty of times and I honestly never heard of a Canadian jumping a fence in the dark of night and found later begging on the streets of New York, or picking cotton or tabacco without a Work Permit.  In fact the last time I crossed by car it was only a cattle gate between us and them. But who knows? 

 

 

I know there's supposed to be a thing called gaydar where gay people recognize other gay people in a way straight people can't.

Are you contending that there's also a thing called Canadiandar?

[GOLDBUGGY]

20 minutes ago, bristolboy said:

I know there's supposed to be a thing called gaydar where gay people recognize other gay people in a way straight people can't.

Are you contending that there's also a thing called Canadiandar?

No! I admit that I am assuming a lot of things here. 

 

Like if I saw a man climbing a fence on the Canadian side of the Border, to get into the American side of the Border, I assume he is Canadian. But then I also assume that not all Canadians are Gay, which I can't prove here either. 

[unblocktheplanet]

The US doesn't realise how great they have it to have Canada as its closest neighbour. I don't personally care, if it's Trump or Obama or if it's Trudeau, Jr. (emphasis on the junior) or Stephen Harper.

 

Trump just told Canada--to its face--that the drooling little lapdog approach ain't working for Canadians. So Justrin-boy, quit being a p.ssy and behave with style and independence, like your old man.

 

They need us waaay more than we need them! America: wanna know where you can put your pipeline???

[pegman]

8 hours ago, unblocktheplanet said:

The US doesn't realise how great they have it to have Canada as its closest neighbour. I don't personally care, if it's Trump or Obama or if it's Trudeau, Jr. (emphasis on the junior) or Stephen Harper.

 

Trump just told Canada--to its face--that the drooling little lapdog approach ain't working for Canadians. So Justrin-boy, quit being a p.ssy and behave with style and independence, like your old man.

 

They need us waaay more than we need them! America: wanna know where you can put your pipeline???

Looks like things will heat up in July. Expect pickets and demonstrations in front of all Walmart stores for starters.

 

http://nationalpost.com/opinion/john-ivison-the-great-patriotic-trade-war-against-the-u-s-begins-on-canada-day

 

http://nationalpost.com/opinion/john-ivison-public-anger-at-trumps-bully-tactics-creates-conditions-for-boycott-america-campaign#comments-area

 

[GOLDBUGGY]

45 minutes ago, pegman said:

Looks like things will heat up in July. Expect pickets and demonstrations in front of all Walmart stores for starters.

 

http://nationalpost.com/opinion/john-ivison-the-great-patriotic-trade-war-against-the-u-s-begins-on-canada-day

 

http://nationalpost.com/opinion/john-ivison-public-anger-at-trumps-bully-tactics-creates-conditions-for-boycott-america-campaign#comments-area

 

This looks more like and argument between 2 Boys, and not 2 Countries. Big Business in Canada and the USA are so intertwined that you can't separate them now. 

 

Alcan Aluminum was perhaps Canada's Largest Aluminum Producer with the huge mining complex in Kitimat B.C. But today Alcon Aluminum is not even Canadian anymore. It now belongs to Rio Tinto which is a British-Australian Multi National Company. 

 

The Automibile Industry is pretty much the same thing. Some Plants in Canada make car and truck parts for vehicles made in the United States. How do you separate that? Tyer Producers like Good Year, have huge factories in Canada. One is next door to a huge Carbon Black Complex needed to make tyres. Wanna buy a made in American Car without Parts or Tyres? 

 

I don't think there is any point to argue who needs who more here. I think we both need each other and why our trade with each other over many years would reflect and prove that. But maybe it is time to scrap this Free Trade Deal as I never saw any benefit to Canada from this anyway. But with all those New Factories build on the Mexican- American Border, then obviously somebody did. 

 

Maybe use Trump's logic that if an American Product is cheaper than it is being made in Canada, then slap a Tariff (Tax) on it to keep Canadian Products more competitive. At least then I can see the Canadian Government earning some more Tax Dollars that doesn't come out of my pocket, and perhaps create more jobs in Canada. As Free Trade certainly didn't seem to do that.