Firestick or Android Box?

[jakestevernson]

Hi all, I will be over in August and am debating whether to buy a unblocked firestick or Android Box. The firststick would easier to transport. However, I was just thinking would I be better to but one of these in Bangkok at Plantip Plaza?

 

Any information or advice would be appreciated.

 

JS

 

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[DPGumbypgh]

If is only to be used when travelling or as a bedroom one, a Firestick is adequate for your needs. Buy before you come as more expensive here. If you want something for everyday use when you are not here get an android box. For a better quality one ie $100 or above buy in your home country to get a warranty and the correct plug on the power supply. If you just want a cheap one that is about same price as a firestick then buy here but may not last too long. I would also try to get one that has an Air mouse included as navigation is so much easier. Android boxes would also let you watch downloaded movies and TV shows on a USB stick. 

[jakestevernson]

Thanks great detailed response. Much appreciated. JS

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[dotpoom]

Great stuff...(if only I knew what a Firststick, Airmouse and an Android box were used for) ...getting old I guess 555.

[StevieAus]

I have been using an Amazon Firestick for over a year after that well known Thai Expat TV facility was closed down

Whilst it may not be for everyone I reckon it’s great, provided you download the correct add ons, which are free you can virtually watch anything and as already stated you can take it anywhere and just plug it into the TV.

You will never run out of things to watch.

[jakestevernson]

Thanks Steve I will buy one in the next week or two and then just bring it across with me in August.

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[Jaybott]

Thanks for all the good information. Its good to hear the Firestick is now supported in Thailand. When I inquired about it (about two years ago) Amazon told me it wasn't supported yet.

 

Just for some general info, I'm using a Roku stick.  It works great for me. I use it mainly for YouTube and Netflix.  Where will you stay in Thailand, will you have a decent internet connection? If you stay at a hotel you could have some issues with a solid, steady connection. Plus logging in could be a problem. As long as you have the "user name/password" log in, you'll be OK. If you get sent to a web page type of log in, you won't be able to log in.

 

Definitely get it in your home country. Test it, be sure it works & get the updates & add-ons done.

[jakestevernson]

Jaybott, I will be in a good apartment block in Bangkok and have been told that the wi-fi is very good there. What are the advantages of buying a Roku stick over a firestick?

JS

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[Jai Dee]

Topic moved to AV forum.

 

/Moved.

[TallGuyJohninBKK]

  On 6/26/2018 at 2:42 AM, Jaybott said:

Thanks for all the good information. Its good to hear the Firestick is now supported in Thailand. When I inquired about it (about two years ago) Amazon told me it wasn't supported yet.

 

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Depends on what you mean by supported.

 

Actually, there are two different, separate versions of the Firestick -- one intended for U.S. use with U.S. Amazon Prime Video, and the other sold and intended for international use that, in Thailand, has a very crippled/limited version of APV. The U.S. version comes with a voice remote and can access Alexa. The international "basic" version does not come with a voice remove, AFAIR, and cannot access Alexa.

 

The U.S. version is perfectly usable in Thailand, but works better/best when combined with a U.S. IP address via VPN or other method. And there are several VPN apps now available via the Amazon app store directly to use on the device.  But lately, Amazon also has been getting very aggressive in blocking VPN access to its Amazon Prime video service, in a way that the videos will be listed, but be shown as "not available in your location." Other U.S. centric streaming services will also require a U.S. IP address to function properly.

 

But, whether you're using the U.S. or international version of the Firestick, there still are lots of downloadable apps that can be used with a local Thai IP address, if that's all you happen to have. Netflix, YouTube, Spotify, others, both free and paid.

 

Fire TV devices are not especially easy to buy or obtain in Thailand, so buying one in advance and bringing it along is the better route.

 

[TallGuyJohninBKK]

  On 6/26/2018 at 5:16 AM, jakestevernson said:

Jaybott, I will be in a good apartment block in Bangkok and have been told that the wi-fi is very good there. What are the advantages of buying a Roku stick over a firestick?
 

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One difference is with Roku, you're limited to the admittedly very large base of apps in the Roku Store. With a Fire Stick, you not only can use apps from the Amazon app store, but also download and use a lot/most regular Android apps via sideloading. No sideloading with Roku devices.

 

With Roku, you also have to be careful where and how you set up the device originally after purchase, because that location, good or bad, will determine what kind of apps your device will be able to use in the future. I.E, a Roku device set up in the U.S. with a U.S. based account is going to have broader access to content than a device setup in Thailand, AFAIK.

 

As in always the case in these discussions, a lot depends on the particular person using the device and just what exactly they want to do with it.

 

 

 

[Mattd]

  On 6/26/2018 at 2:42 AM, Jaybott said:

Its good to hear the Firestick is now supported in Thailand

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Whilst in Thailand unless you find a way around the geoblocking then what you will find is that certain content will work, most will not, this includes a lot of the stuff you can pay for.

I have a UK Amazon Fire TV box and Prime membership, this alone gives access to some free content, but by no means all.

To get around this I have used SmartDNS, which after a bit of messing around manages to get around the blocks and allows me to watch the UK content, I've tried using a VPN (paid) but most VPN servers are now known to be such, so the content was still blocked.

I have also sideloaded several other TV apps, such a Mobdro etc. 

[TallGuyJohninBKK]

  On 6/26/2018 at 8:15 AM, Mattd said:

 I've tried using a VPN (paid) but most VPN servers are now known to be such, so the content was still blocked.

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Quite a few of the more prominent VPN services are now offering what are variously called "streaming IPs" or "custom IPs" where they give you an individual IP address in your desired location, and you're the only one using it. As such, it typically won't come in for blocking by various providers. And if it does, typically, the VPN provider guarantees to give you a different custom IP as replacement that will work. These kinds of services tend to be a bit more expensive than just a regular shared dynamic IP VPN account, but are well worth it if out-of-area streaming is your priority. And they do work...

 

[Mattd]

  On 6/27/2018 at 4:06 AM, TallGuyJohninBKK said:

 

Quite a few of the more prominent VPN services are now offering what are variously called "streaming IPs" or "custom IPs" where they give you an individual IP address in your desired location, and you're the only one using it. As such, it typically won't come in for blocking by various providers. And if it does, typically, the VPN provider guarantees to give you a different custom IP as replacement that will work. These kinds of services tend to be a bit more expensive than just a regular shared dynamic IP VPN account, but are well worth it if out-of-area streaming is your priority. And they do work...

 

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Thanks and I am sure this is correct, though right now the DNS solution I have works well and allows all content to be viewed as if I were in England and for a relatively small monthly cost, if this stops, then will look at this option for sure.

I mainly wanted the OP to know that without some form of VPN or DNS solution the majority of Amazon TV stuff won't be able to be viewed.

[jakestevernson]

Hi Guys, how much do these VPNs roughly cost?
JS

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[TallGuyJohninBKK]

I'd say on average $5-$10 a month, depending on the provider.  And usually, a lot of them have substantial promotions around the Black Friday time after Thanksgiving where one year or longer plans are often heavily discounted. So that's usually a good time to take out a longer subscription, once you have checked thru free trial or short term subscription that a particular provider meets your needs.

 

But again, it really depends on what you're needing a VPN or Proxy Redirect service for. For generic use, there are lots of choices and lots of services. But if you're aiming at the U.S. streaming market, because of the lengths providers like Amazon, Netflix and Hulu have gone to identify and block VPN connections, the range of services that actually work is much narrower and you have to be more focused and delve in.

 

[jakestevernson]

Tallguy thanks for the very quick reply.

Basically I would like to use the firestick to watch bbciplayeer, Premiership football, series such as Westworld and Netflix. Paying 10-15 dollars month is fine for me. Is there much lag time? Is the picture/sound quality ok?

JS

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[TallGuyJohninBKK]

  On 6/27/2018 at 5:35 AM, jakestevernson said:

Tallguy thanks for the very quick reply.

Basically I would like to use the firestick to watch bbciplayeer, Premiership football, series such as Westworld and Netflix. Paying 10-15 dollars month is fine for me. Is there much lag time? Is the picture/sound quality ok?

JS
 

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So then basically you want a primarily UK focused provider?  That's not my area of geo expertise.

 

But as to your other questions, I do fine with a 3BB fiber connection dealing with U.S. content for everything up to full HD. I don't have a 4K TV and there's not a lot of 4K streaming content anyway.

 

As for the overall connection, obviously using Ethernet vs wifi is going to be better if possible in your residence for the streaming device. But if you need to use wifi, either a 5 GHz connection and/or AC band wifi is going to be better than N wifi / 2.4 GHz. Those details can make a big difference in getting the best out of whatever connection you have.

 

Also, not all VPN services are created equal when it comes to speed. Some actually can give you faster speeds than a direct connection, while others can substantially slow down your connection. All depends on your location and their networks and what server you're connecting to. Largely a process of trial and error, though reading VPN user reviews online for particular services can also be helpful.  And asking UK folks here in one of the VPN threads probably would elicit some UK specific recs.

 

[Mattd]

  On 6/27/2018 at 5:35 AM, jakestevernson said:

Tallguy thanks for the very quick reply.

Basically I would like to use the firestick to watch bbciplayeer, Premiership football, series such as Westworld and Netflix. Paying 10-15 dollars month is fine for me. Is there much lag time? Is the picture/sound quality ok?

JS

Sent from my Moto G (4) using Tapatalk
 

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I view Amazon Prime UK content on the Amazon box by using a DNS proxy service (SmartDNS), to do this is not exactly easy depending on several factors.

 

The ISP that the condo you are in is using, True are renown for this, as they use a Transparent proxy, if 3BB or similar then not so much an issue, though you would have to change the DNS settings in the Amazon box in order for it to work.

Even if going the VPN route, it would mean side loading a VPN to the box, the ones that are available via the official app store on Amazon do not work (IP Vanish for example)

 

Premiership football would be an issue on the Fire TV, the only way to watch this would be to side load something like Mobdro to the Fire TV and the quality isn't that great.

 

It might be worth you checking around on the net and seeing if you can get a streaming service for UKTV via an Android set top box, there are some good and some bad providers, a box would cost around 3,000 Baht from Panthip plaza, I do use one of these providers here and the service is fine, depending on how long you want this for the cost ranges from about 900 Baht to 650 Baht per month and gives you all the channels that Sky & Freeview would, plus 7 day playback, I'll PM the link for this to you, for a short term option, this may work out to be the best, just requires the app downloading, installing on the Android box then an activation code, you can also side load the app to an Amazon Fire TV box (not sure about the stick, probably can)

[jakestevernson]

Thanks Mattd, it's really good information. So I guess I will wait until I get to Bangkok to buy a android box and use that. If you could send the link that would great.

Really appreciate the advice guys.

Wes

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[TallGuyJohninBKK]

Maybe the UK folks here can correct me if I'm wrong...

 

But it's worth adding to what I mentioned above, that the U.S. is not the only country where Amazon offers official Amazon Prime subscriptions and related services, including the direct sale of its streaming devices. I believe that the UK is one of those countries where you can get a UK purchased Firestick and official Amazon Prime subscription. And various other European countries are the same.

 

So AFAIK, what that means then is for Thailand purposes, all you really then need to do is get your Fire TV device to believe it's having a UK IP address. At least for the U.S. market, there are various VPN apps you can download from the Amazon app store directly. And failing that, if you have access to a decent wifi router of your own, it's possible that router will have a built-in VPN client you can use with your chosen VPN provider and/or use a DNS redirect service and enter its settings in your wifi router.

 

BTW, on the subject of Android devices, the Xiaomi MiBox Android TV device just this week has gotten its OTA firmware update to Oreo OS from Google/Xiaomi, and it's a very capable reliable streaming device that usually retails for $60-$70. It doesn't have Amazon apps or Amazon Prime built-in, but those can be sideloaded. It's an actual small box that connects to your TV via HDMI cable instead of an HDMI stick like the Firestick or Roku streaming stick.

 

 

 

 

 

[Mattd]

  On 6/27/2018 at 6:22 AM, TallGuyJohninBKK said:

Maybe the UK folks here can correct me if I'm wrong...

 

But it's worth adding to what I mentioned above, that the U.S. is not the only country where Amazon offers official Amazon Prime subscriptions and related services, including the direct sale of its streaming devices. I believe that the UK is one of those countries where you can get a UK purchased Firestick and official Amazon Prime subscription. And various other European countries are the same.

 

So AFAIK, what that means then is for Thailand purposes, all you really then need to do is get your Fire TV device to believe it's having a UK IP address. At least for the U.S. market, there are various VPN apps you can download from the Amazon app store directly.

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This is correct, in that if you purchase an Amazon Fire TV box with Prime membership you get to access the UK content (free or purchased) and you have to trick it in to thinking that you are in the UK for most of the content to work (some will work even if it knows you are in Thailand, The Grand Tour is one programme).

The biggest issue I had was tricking it to think I was in the UK, if you use any of the VPN apps off the Amazon store, they are known to Amazon, BBC etc. and do not work.

To use the DNS route means changing the DNS settings in the box to the ones recommended by the DNS provider, the default are Google DNS servers, when I tried this, the box would keep reverting back to default, never did get to the bottom of why.

  On 6/27/2018 at 6:22 AM, TallGuyJohninBKK said:

if you have access to a decent wifi router of your own, it's possible that router will have a built-in VPN client you can use with your chosen VPN provider and/or use a DNS redirect service and enter its settings in your wifi router.

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This would mean an open source router, such as DD-WRT, this does work, but takes a bit of knowledge to setup, especially if going through True as the ISP.

The BTW is how I managed to get around it with True and DNS, worth it for me as I live here, not sure though for shorter term, as it works out quite costly and time consuming.

[TallGuyJohninBKK]

  On 6/27/2018 at 6:34 AM, Mattd said:

 

The biggest issue I had was tricking it to think I was in the UK, if you use any of the VPN apps off the Amazon store, they are known to Amazon, BBC etc. and do not work.
 

To use the DNS route means changing the DNS settings in the box to the ones recommended by the DNS provider, the default are Google DNS servers, when I tried this, the box would keep reverting back to default, never did get to the bottom of why.
 

This would mean an open source router, such as DD-WRT, this does work, but takes a bit of knowledge to setup, especially if going through True as the ISP.

The BTW is how I managed to get around it with True and DNS, worth it for me as I live here, not sure though for shorter term, as it works out quite costly and time consuming.

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Couple things on your comments above.

 

A wifi router doesn't have to be open source / DD-WRT in order to support its own internal VPN client in its firmware. Most ASUS routers have internal VPN client capability, as well as often having the ability to install individual VPN client applets into their firmware. But not all of the router brands do, you need to check the brand/model.

 

As for DNS redirects, that's a bit complicated in Thailand, mainly because at least True Online has always used an anonymous proxy feature in its service that basically negates the DNS redirect services. The other Thai ISPs, however, don't do that, as best as I recall. True and DNS redirects are basically incompatible AFAIK. Not so with the others.

 

But if you are going to use a DNS redirect here, mostly, you'd want to make that settings change at the wifi router level, not at the streaming device level, where as you said, it will tend to default back to the Google DNS addresses. In the settings of the wifi router, however, once you enter and save new DNS values, those will be retained absolutely.

 

[Mattd]

  On 6/27/2018 at 6:45 AM, TallGuyJohninBKK said:

A wifi router doesn't have to be open source / DD-WRT in order to support its own internal VPN client in its firmware. Most ASUS routers have internal VPN client capability, as well as often having the ability to install individual VPN client applets into their firmware. But not all of the router brands do, you need to check the brand/model.

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This is true, but would should be unnecessary if a VPN works and this can all be done in the device being used, more applicable if the VPN cannot be loaded to the device, however it would mean all devices would be going through the VPN if activated in the router.

 

  On 6/27/2018 at 6:45 AM, TallGuyJohninBKK said:

As for DNS redirects, that's a bit complicated in Thailand, mainly because at least True Online has always used an anonymous proxy feature in its service that basically negates the DNS redirect services. The other Thai ISPs, however, don't do that, as best as I recall. True and DNS redirects are basically incompatible AFAIK. Not so with the others.

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it is more complicated for sure, True can be worked, as I've done it recently, here is a quote of how I managed it taken from another thread and it is not something I'd recommend for the OP.

  Quote

For those interested, I have finally got the SmartDNS setup to work in the condo using True as the ISP!

 

Not particularly easy or cheap in the end, however, as I stay in most weekday evenings, then it is worth it, here is how I did it.

 

1. Purchased a new Linksys WRT1200AC router, although this could be any router that is easy to flash DD-WRT firmware on, Linksys WRT ones are very easy to do and easy to recover if it goes wrong.

2. Downloaded the correct DD-WRT firmware for the above and then uploaded it in to the new Linksys router.

3. Initial setup of the now DD-WRT router, which involves setting the connection to a fixed IP and gave it an IP address that was within the True modem router's range (192.168.1.35 in my case)

4. Made the Linksys router IP address 192.168.0.1 (it has to be on a different subnet to the True router)

5. Followed the instructions to the letter on the SmartDNS support site on how to enable bypassing a transparent proxy using the Linksys router running DD-WRT, this involves changing a few DHCP settings, putting some DNS settings in and running a start up  / firewall command in the DD-WRT settings Administration/Command Shell (Linksys router)

6. Login to the True DOCSIS Modem Router (Humax HV100-02) and enable DMZ and add in the LAN IP address of the Linksys router (192.168.1.35), so that the Linksys router is now bypassing the True firewall.

7. Hard wire the True router to the Linksys router, using the ethernet port on the True to the Internet port on the Linksys.

7. Reboot everything router wise.

8. Connect the computer to the Linksys WiFi network.

8. Enable the IP address in the SmartDNS login.

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This was in the condo I rent in BKK for weekdays.

  On 6/27/2018 at 6:45 AM, TallGuyJohninBKK said:

But if you are going to use a DNS redirect here, mostly, you'd want to make that settings change at the wifi router level, not at the streaming device level, where as you said, it will tend to default back to the Google DNS addresses. In the settings of the wifi router, however, once you enter and save new DNS values, those will be retained absolutely.

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At my home in Chonburi, I can use SmartDNS on my computer by simply changing the DNS settings in the IPv4 settings of the Wifi connection, this is using 3BB Fibre, the only issue is that you do have to keep activating the IP adddress with SmartDNS, as 3BB change it several times over a session, otherwise it work just fine for BBC iplayer etc.

[TallGuyJohninBKK]

Also, just a tip on VPN apps for the Fire TV and Android TV devices.

 

The VPN apps that are directly available for those devices in either the Amazon app store or the Google Play Store for Android TV ARE very limited.

 

However, in the case of both devices, you can absolutely sideload regular Android VPN apps used for phones and tablets -- which often are not available in the TV app stores -- and they will work perfectly fine on both the Fire TV and Android TV devices typically.

 

The one issue you might encounter if sideloading regular VPN Android apps to either of the TV platforms is the mobile apps are touch oriented and not meant for use with the TV remote clickers. So often, you'll need to use a connected USB mouse or air mouse to control those regular Android apps on the TV platforms. That can open up a lot of additional VPN options beyond what just the TV app stores provide.

 

As an example, one of my favorite VPN services that does work with the various US streaming sites does NOT have an app in either the Amazon or Android TV app stores. But they do have a regular Android app, both in the regular Google Play app store and also available for download directly from their own website. And that regular app works perfectly fine on both my Fire TV and Android TV devices.

 

That said, for me, the absolute most efficient and flexible way to avoid geoblocking is thru setting up a VPN service on your own wifi router, even if its only an internal client that only allows PPTP connections. Those are fast, ideal for streaming, and basically all you're needing is your VPN ID and password and the desired server address from your VPN provider. A few clicks and boom, you're done -- if your wifi router support that VPN client feature.

 

I've used the DNS redirect services before with both True and 3BB, and wasn't going to go thru the horrible process you mentioned above of avoiding True's restrictions, and with 3BB, got tired real fast of constantly having to renew the DNS redirect thru the provider's website.

 

For someone living here, a VPN compatible wifi router absolutely is the best approach. For someone traveling or visiting, I'd probably look to sideload a regular Android VPN app onto my Fire TV or Android TV and not be limited by the very few available in the official TV app stores.

 

 

[Mattd]

  On 6/27/2018 at 7:13 AM, TallGuyJohninBKK said:

The one issue you might encounter if sideloading regular VPN Android apps to either of the TV platforms is the mobile apps are touch oriented and not meant for use with the TV remote clickers. So often, you'll need to use a connected USB mouse or air mouse to control those regular Android apps on the TV platforms.

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Yes, this is usually an issue, I use a wireless mouse on the Fire TV box to get around this, as have several Android apps loaded.

A lot of folks don't realise that the Amazon box is in reality an Android box with the 'Amazon' front end on top.

[skippy121]

just something to be aware of, firesticks are not rooted and even if you sideload a vpn app onto it, sometimes it appears to be working but not all traffic is being tunneled through the vpn, the vpn app does not have root access so has trouble changing the routing tables on the android system.

 

 

[TallGuyJohninBKK]

  On 6/27/2018 at 7:26 AM, Mattd said:

Yes, this is usually an issue, I use a wireless mouse on the Fire TV box to get around this, as have several Android apps loaded.

A lot of folks don't realise that the Amazon box is in reality an Android box with the 'Amazon' front end on top.

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There also are a couple of apps you can install to get mouse functionality on the Fire TVs through the remote clicker or thru an Android mobile device touch screen on the same wifi network. A bit kludgy, but they do work. The one that installs directly on the device is called Mouse Toggle.  The one that installs on your Android mobile device is available from the Amazon app store, can't recall the name right now. But basically it pairs with your Fire TV, and then becomes a touch screen controller on your phone.

 

I have a Fire TV box and an MiBox Android TV, and when I need it, I just use an attached USB mouse.

 

[TallGuyJohninBKK]

  On 6/27/2018 at 7:39 AM, skippy121 said:

just something to be aware of, firesticks are not rooted and even if you sideload a vpn app onto it, sometimes it appears to be working but not all traffic is being tunneled through the vpn, the vpn app does not have root access so has trouble changing the routing tables on the android system.

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I've never encountered that kind of problem on my Fire devices.

 

[lamyai3]

Bear in mind that since last year it's illegal to import any streaming devices into the country without a licence. Although the risk of getting caught may be negligible, customs could make an issue of it... in that regard it might be better to get something locally through Lazada or similar.