How Much Do Govt. Schools Get For Foreign Teachers?

[MrPatrickThai]

Asking for a friend, who is a teacher. I heard that the government pay schools something like 40k baht a month per foreign teacher. This was probable 10 years ago.

 

My question is, do they still pay the wages for every foreign teacher and how much do they pay to the school?

 

I'd imagine that some schools hire teachers for less than the government pay, having a cushy little sideline.

[allane]

My information dates from 1996.  To my knowledge, it is still correct. If anyone can provide more recent information, and cite a source for same, I would be pleased to stand corrected. In my early days here, one saw many advertisements for foreign teachers offering a salary of B 25,780/mo. At that time, the B 780 paid the income tax; the B 25,000 was the actual salary to the teacher. I asked why.

It was explained to me that a regulation had been passed some years prior to prevent govt. schools, colleges and universities from getting into bidding wars for expensive foreign teachers. Institutions were, and are, free to pay more, but if they choose to do so, they must raise the portion in excess of B 25,000 from the students (or the parents of the students, when the students are minors.)

You can imagine anything you want but posting it here serves no purpose.  Evidence, in contrast, would be welcomed.

[Issangeorge]

I have no idea what the government pays the school. I do know however 6 years ago when I was teaching, in Isaan, very few teachers were making more than the 30 to 35k range. I knew a couple that after a raise every year for about five years, teaching in a MEP program, where the students were paying big money, managed to get to 42k a year, and then the next year rather than give them a raise or even the same, the school canned them, and started with a new crop. When I was teaching the rumour was the schools were allocated 40k, but who knows?

 

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[Norrad]

Back in 2008 it was pegged to the Dollar (30/1 was the figure thrown around at meetings) and I remember the big government teaching projects at the time (Nonthaburi project as an example) were requesting 30000 Baht per month from the government for each foreign teacher hired through the project. The schools could also charge the students up to 500 Baht per month for English lessons to supplement their income. That became a standard for Bangkok and the Central provinces and all government schools started putting in for 30K per month for each foreign teacher. I'm not sure if it works the same in other provinces though.

 

Now that might not seem a lot, but remember the students are also charged for lessons with foreign teachers and it varies from school to school. Most charge a small 800 Baht per semester or 1600 Baht per year each (some schools charge a lot more). So do the Maths on what schools make off their foreign teachers.

[Loaded]

It's highly unlikely a foreign EFL teacher would have access to this information. They only have access to gossip which becomes 'fact'.

 

 

[bkkcanuck8]

16 minutes ago, Loaded said:

It's highly unlikely a foreign EFL teacher would have access to this information. They only have access to gossip which becomes 'fact'.

 

 

Not only that but we don't know how much overhead that is included in that amount (even assuming no corruption).

[Norrad]

18 minutes ago, Loaded said:

It's highly unlikely a foreign EFL teacher would have access to this information. They only have access to gossip which becomes 'fact'.

 

 

I was in the meetings at Chula for the Nonthaburi project. It was an interesting look into how education is run in Thailand.

[allane]

What is, or was, "the Nonthaburi project"?

[Norrad]

58 minutes ago, allane said:

What is, or was, "the Nonthaburi project"?

It was a large government project that was supposed to put Native English Speaking teachers in every school in Nonthaburi and the surrounding areas. Things didn't go according to plan though and, because of lots of internal politics, it ended up with mostly Filipinos taking up the positions.

[phantomfiddler]

I wasn,t aware that Govt. schools were selling foreign teachers ?

[quandow]

2 hours ago, phantomfiddler said:

I wasn't aware that Govt. schools were selling foreign teachers ?

I'll take two cute ones, please!

[TPI]

Ten years ago I was teaching in a low class high school in Bkk, I was being paid 40K a month and was contracted for 3 years! At the end of my time I was offered 25K as that was all they were paying Philippians. Sorry about that...I moved on! 

[ozmeldo]

My suspicion is at least in BKK it's 40k, but there's all sorts of money sloshing about. If you're a good teacher, keep you office hours, attend to extracurriculars, grades in on time you really should be asking and expecting far more. 40k buys only a responsible warm body these days.

 

You can immediately understand any job posting under 45k for 18 hours to run away from fast and far. Even dodgy agencies are offering 40-45k.

 

I don't understand the sentiment about salaries being stagnant. Many posts on Ajarn are for 45++ jobs. I've always asked for and rec'd 15% each time I changed jobs.

 

Don't believe that bs from Jenny5000 about Khrusapa not liking it. Their job is to process paperwork. If you ate a hot commodity and have good paper and your school has some stature, you'll be fine.

 

If it blows up, go to Vietnam or China so what.

 

But there's the rub. If you really are just bullshitting your way through and you either can't or won't do the job properly you've no right to complain about 30-35k.

 

Further, ten years ago 35k was worth more in real terms, but that's cold comfort.

 

I'm going to say 40k based on my experience in publics and constant culling Ajarn to stay abreast of wages and hiring - I look daily.

 

 

Edited June 29, 2018 by ozmeldo

[MrPatrickThai]

On 6/27/2018 at 2:21 PM, Loaded said:

It's highly unlikely a foreign EFL teacher would have access to this information. They only have access to gossip which becomes 'fact'.

 

 

Why? I have friends who have worked as teachers for 30 years, they have many Thai friends who know.

I heard from one today that 40k was what the government paid the school.

[puukao]

I think 40,000 is a good guess, almost certainly above 35,000.  

 

30,000 six years ago might have been OK, but with online teaching (I've never done it) I'm sure they must pay closer to 35,000 or 40,000 just to get average teachers who like to be around people and don't mind activities that doesn't involve teaching (which is great, kids are great).  

 

If you do the math, it's pretty easy to save 16,000 a month if working in London at a young age (20's).  In Thailand at 30,000, you are saving like 5,000 if you are paying attention to your expenses...who does that in their 20's?  they can keep Filipino salaries low (around 20,000) because they aren't native speakers, but i'm pretty sure they are increases the salary to Farangs (35 to 40k).  

 

I've noticed many schools are now easily paying 35000 where just a year ago 30000 was the norm.  i'm pretty sure in 5-years, 50000 will be the norm but it will still be hard to get good teachers......many other countries paying more.  

 

no point, just rambling....lol

[ozmeldo]

I'd suspect there are rankings to schools as well. If the school is just a broken POS upcountry school, lacking resources doubtful it receives the same funding as the upper tier schools in Bangkok. Might be 35k, I could see that.

 

Don't see how making 35k pm is worth the effort. Clothes, laptop, printer, scooter, scooter mnt, materials, in/direct visa and WP, incidental costs, Costs incurred looking for employment ($$).

 

Teachers never factor in their initial visa run, usually to Lao. For most noobs I bet this is at least 15k. If I recall correctly cheapest I'd ever done it (double TR) was 9k. Trains, hotels, food, visa. I guess you could sleep in a dorm ...ugh.

 

Rob Peter, pay Paul

 

[SlyAnimal]

9 hours ago, ozmeldo said:

Teachers never factor in their initial visa run, usually to Lao. For most noobs I bet this is at least 15k. If I recall correctly cheapest I'd ever done it (double TR) was 9k. Trains, hotels, food, visa. I guess you could sleep in a dorm ...ugh.

 

Rob Peter, pay Paul

 

Depends a lot on where they're going from and how much they drink while there.

When I went there for my original non-b (Which wasn't my first visit, as had been travelling there before as a tourist), it wasn't too expensive.  I'd have probably spent under 5000, with a few beers included.  Other teachers that I've taught with have been there/back for less than that as well I'd say.  My original trips as a tourist would have been quite a bit more, but they included more than just a few beers lol.

In general, teachers are often pretty good at managing their money, or so I've found anyway.  With families/kids it's often a lot more difficult, but if they're single or even have a partner but no kids, they usually don't spend a lot unless it's on beers, as are used to managing on a set salary.

Edit:  Oh and that's of course travelling from Isaan, not from Bangkok etc.  From Bangkok I'd imagine you'd fly to an embassy or get your visa type changed at Chang Wattana.

Edited July 3, 2018 by SlyAnimal

[My Thai Life]

This question is based on a wrong assumption about how government schools are funded, and in particular about how foreign teachers in government schools are funded.

 

I won’t go into all the details, but putting it simply: Thai “permanent” teachers are employed and paid by the government / MoE; Thai and foreign contract teachers are employed and funded by the schools, and different schools fund these teachers in different ways.

[jenny2017]

On 6/26/2018 at 12:28 PM, allane said:

My information dates from 1996.  To my knowledge, it is still correct. If anyone can provide more recent information, and cite a source for same, I would be pleased to stand corrected. In my early days here, one saw many advertisements for foreign teachers offering a salary of B 25,780/mo. At that time, the B 780 paid the income tax; the B 25,000 was the actual salary to the teacher. I asked why.

It was explained to me that a regulation had been passed some years prior to prevent govt. schools, colleges and universities from getting into bidding wars for expensive foreign teachers. Institutions were, and are, free to pay more, but if they choose to do so, they must raise the portion in excess of B 25,000 from the students (or the parents of the students, when the students are minors.)

You can imagine anything you want but posting it here serves no purpose.  Evidence, in contrast, would be welcomed.

Sorry, but I think that it wasn't 780 baht for tax, it was 750 baht for the social security. Even when the ss act states that it has to be a percentage of the salary, all foreign, no matter if they have 25 K, or 50 K/ as a salalry per month, all teachers pay 750 baht, and the same amount has to be paid by the school.

Edited July 19, 2018 by jenny2017

[jenny2017]

On 7/3/2018 at 3:07 AM, ozmeldo said:

I'd suspect there are rankings to schools as well. If the school is just a broken POS upcountry school, lacking resources doubtful it receives the same funding as the upper tier schools in Bangkok. Might be 35k, I could see that.

 

Don't see how making 35k pm is worth the effort. Clothes, laptop, printer, scooter, scooter mnt, materials, in/direct visa and WP, incidental costs, Costs incurred looking for employment ($$).

 

Teachers never factor in their initial visa run, usually to Lao. For most noobs I bet this is at least 15k. If I recall correctly cheapest I'd ever done it (double TR) was 9k. Trains, hotels, food, visa. I guess you could sleep in a dorm ...ugh.

 

Rob Peter, pay Paul

 

But this particular visa run has only to be done in the beginning. Once you've got your 90 days, the rest is then done in Thailand's Immigration offices. 

[ozmeldo]

21 minutes ago, jenny2017 said:

But this particular visa run has only to be done in the beginning. Once you've got your 90 days, the rest is then done in Thailand's Immigration offices. 

But it's still once and amortized over a year that is for most teachers presumably about 1k per month. Less the other incidentals I'd mentioned. Then after three years needing to do some type of school for the full license. Taxes, etc...2k?

 

So that's about 6k with the runner. While it's true it's 1x a year, some teachers due to bad agency and school paperwork do it 2-3x.

 

So if you're making 32k, that's roughly 28k net before living expenses which I'd estimate at 17.5k. A bit of booze at home, a dental cleaning 2x a year and a livable flat with decent Thai food.

 

So let's say being charitable, 10k which will need to cover:

Short, long term savings

Medical emergencies and chkup

Trip to home country

Any further job search ($$)

Any entertainment

 

I can see doing the job for 36-38 starting out but you'd really have to be nuts to take this salary after 3+ years imo. I don't see how it's in any way profitable.

 

I'd estimate my daily costs at a cheap b300 a day including creaky old laptop, public transport, misc expenses like photocopies, snacks/lunch and clothes. I walk a lot for health, but it saves 70b in mototaxis as well.

 

If you are not paid Oct and or March and or April it's truly a fools errand.

 

Funny, no one ever factors in their degree.

Edited July 19, 2018 by ozmeldo

[ozmeldo]

I think I'd done that trip about half what I'd originally stated.

 

Maybe 6000 from BKK. 2nd class fan sleeper. Decent room near the river (500b). Double TR 2k. Food is kinda pricey in Lao as they have no economies of scale. Beer was cheap, but even a few years back on holiday I'd found that was no longer the case. I walk everywhere in Vientiane.

[allane]

13 hours ago, jenny2017 said:

Sorry, but I think that it wasn't 780 baht for tax, it was 750 baht for the social security. Even when the ss act states that it has to be a percentage of the salary, all foreign, no matter if they have 25 K, or 50 K/ as a salalry per month, all teachers pay 750 baht, and the same amount has to be paid by the school.

I am not going to quibble over 30 baht/mo. relating to information that I was given 22 years ago.

[DILLIGAD]

I am not going to quibble over 30 baht/mo. relating to information that I was given 22 years ago.

He’s right though.


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[allane]

Over a 21 year period, I taught at four different Thai high schools, two government and two private, in three different provinces. I never paid into Thai Social Security, and was never asked if I wanted to.

[DragonQuest]

I think 50K and the schools pocket the change, but they will never tell you lol.

[puchooay]

On 7/19/2018 at 5:16 PM, jenny2017 said:

Sorry, but I think that it wasn't 780 baht for tax, it was 750 baht for the social security. Even when the ss act states that it has to be a percentage of the salary, all foreign, no matter if they have 25 K, or 50 K/ as a salalry per month, all teachers pay 750 baht, and the same amount has to be paid by the school.

Actually the rule is 5% of salary with  a maximum of 750 baht a month. 

[jenny2017]

On 7/20/2018 at 8:42 AM, allane said:

Over a 21 year period, I taught at four different Thai high schools, two government and two private, in three different provinces. I never paid into Thai Social Security, and was never asked if I wanted to.

That's indeed very sad. I'm currently working for an agency without any sort of insurance offered, but I could continue with my Thai social security on a private basis. Only 438 baht/month gives you full coverage. Perfect for somebody near retirement age,  who needs a cheap insurance that pays for all, also for motorbike accidents. 

Edited July 23, 2018 by jenny2017

[jenny2017]

On 7/20/2018 at 6:32 AM, allane said:

I am not going to quibble over 30 baht/mo. relating to information that I was given 22 years ago.

It wasn't about 30 baht at all. It was about the Thai social security, also called Prakaan Sankuhm, and not about tax. 

[DILLIGAD]

That's indeed very sad. I'm currently working for an agency without any sort of insurance offered, but I could continue with my Thai social security on a private basis. Only 438 baht/month gives you full coverage. Perfect for somebody near retirement age,  who needs a cheap insurance that pays for all, also for motorbike accidents. 

Unfortunately, I can confirm about the motorbike part of above. Whoops!!! (Thanks for the visit jenny2017 & the singing tranny!)

Appreciated even though I was a bit spaced out!!!

 

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