Help With Tribunal

[Deanuk]

Hi all

Having just sent 2 months in thailand with my wife consoling ourselves over her latest refusal we now have the paperwork for the appeal.

It states...

"the tribunal directs that you file by 28th may 2007, a copy of the notice of decision to which the notice of appeal relates, and any other document giving reasons for that decision, together with any application form, record of interview, or any other unpublished document to which you rely upon. You must serve, on the appellant, a copy of all the documents, except for documents which you have already sent to the appellant"

Any ideas as to what "additional info" i could supply??

It just seems that after the 1st refusal they have got it in for us!

Dean

p.s

its a settlement appeal

[GU22]

The info they mean is any additional evidence you that was not included in the original application.

The tribunal will be considering if the refusal was correct or not based on your situation at the time of the application. So, you can submit new evidence to the appeal, but only if it pertains to your situation at the time of the application. Any change in your circumstances since the application are irrelevent.

See Asylum and Immigration Tribunal

[the scouser]

Dean,

Have a look at the letter again. I think it probably states that it is the respondent who has to file this information by 28 May, and, in this matter, it is the ECO in Bangkok who is the respondent. Should this be the case, the deadline does not apply to the appellant (i.e. your fiancée/wife) and you need do nothing at the moment.

Once the ECO's documents (called a bundle) have been received, you will be sent a copy, and this then enables you to formulate your case. The AIT will write to you giving a date for the appeal hearing to take place and you should then prepare your bundle which should be placed before both the AIT and the Home Office Presenting Officer at least 5 days in advance of the hearing. Your bundle should consist of witness statements for both you and your wife, a skeleton argument which addresses the requirements of the immigration rules and how you think your fiancée/wife qualifies, and copies of any additional documents upon which you seek to rely.

Scouse.

[atlastaname]

The info they mean is any additional evidence you that was not included in the original application.

The tribunal will be considering if the refusal was correct or not based on your situation at the time of the application. So, you can submit new evidence to the appeal, but only if it pertains to your situation at the time of the application. Any change in your circumstances since the application are irrelevent.

See Asylum and Immigration Tribunal

Not quite i'm afraid. Whilst they will be considering if the refusal was correct at the time the decision was made , subsequent documentation/information about the continuing state and strength of your relationship WILL be taken into account. They take the view that even if they find the refusal was correct, if they can be persuaded that the same application would now be approved they can order it so. Depends on the adjudicator . So its worth taking more up to date proof along with you as you will be allowed to present it .

[Deanuk]

Guys

Once again thanks for the information youve provided me with, i was basically at a loss as to what further info i could provide them with. But now at least ill have some kind of clue as to what more these people want from us with regards to there refusal.

In the refusal letter before they were basically stating that we hadnt spent enough time together although ive visited her 12 times in 15 months. Hopefully if they take into consideration my last visit (from december 2nd-1st feb) they might be able to open there eyes as to the seriousness of our marriage!!

Once again thanks for all the replys.

Dean

[the scouser]

Dean,

Have a look at the letter again. I think it probably states that it is the respondent who has to file this information by 28 May,

So, Dean, what is the reality of the situation? You seem to believe that the various decision-making authorities are synonymous, and against you? If they are , why bother to appeal?

Scouse.

[Deanuk]

And, Dean, one day, I hope you will understand: until then, you will never really appreciate the process.

All the best,

Scouse.

So, Dean, what is the reality of the situation? You seem to believe that the various decision-making authorities are synonymous, and against you? If they are , why bother to appeal?

Scouse.

Hi scouse

what do you mean by 1 day i hope you understand?

I am bothering to appeal because she is my legitimate wife... weve been together for over 2 years...married for 7 months.. i shadowed the sticky at the top of this forum virtually word for word adding only my information thus resulting in over a ream of paperwork and still she was refused.

My wife is genuinley shy and i seriously think that the ECO took this as a sign of her not knowing enough about me..fortunatly i am not.

I have served my country (armed forces for over 10 years) never been in trouble with the law always pay my tax bill ontime etc etc etc and yet they choose to refuse my wife entry to my county... thats why im bothering to appeal.

I could choose to disolve my business and go and live in thailand but i want better than that for us (I can make more £ in a month than i can do in thailand in a year)

When the appeal comes around in the uk this time, they can ask me all the questions they choose (like i said im not shy)

so hopfully i will be able to give them the answers that they are longing for.

sorry for the ramble Scouse... ive been out for a few beers trying to numb the pain of having to wait for the authorites to decide our fate.

Dean

[the scouser]

Apologies for my perhaps too forthright comments last night, but I was replete with Belgium's finest brew.

The point I was trying to make is that the appeal process is not part of any conspiracy to deprive your wife of her visa. The Asylum and Immigration tribunal is there to objectively consider the cases of those refused, amongst other things, visas. However, you can't expect the AIT to decide in your wife's favour unless you actually make your case to them. So, as part of this process, you will have to supply the AIT with legal argument which states the reasons why you think your wife qualifies for the visa.

When you filed the appeal form did you say you wanted either the matter considered on the basis of the papers, or that you wanted an oral hearing?

Scouse.

[Deanuk]

Apologies for my perhaps too forthright comments last night, but I was replete with Belgium's finest brew.

The point I was trying to make is that the appeal process is not part of any conspiracy to deprive your wife of her visa. The Asylum and Immigration tribunal is there to objectively consider the cases of those refused, amongst other things, visas. However, you can't expect the AIT to decide in your wife's favour unless you actually make your case to them. So, as part of this process, you will have to supply the AIT with legal argument which states the reasons why you think your wife qualifies for the visa.

When you filed the appeal form did you say you wanted either the matter considered on the basis of the papers, or that you wanted an oral hearing?

Scouse.

Hi Scouse

I too was slightly worse for wear last night and i too apologise for my abrupt response.

On the appeal form i said that i wanted an oral hearing, so i guess i will have to build a new case depending on what case they have against us.

Regards

Dean

[erikr_]

Apologies for my perhaps too forthright comments last night, but I was replete with Belgium's finest brew.

The point I was trying to make is that the appeal process is not part of any conspiracy to deprive your wife of her visa. The Asylum and Immigration tribunal is there to objectively consider the cases of those refused, amongst other things, visas. However, you can't expect the AIT to decide in your wife's favour unless you actually make your case to them. So, as part of this process, you will have to supply the AIT with legal argument which states the reasons why you think your wife qualifies for the visa.

When you filed the appeal form did you say you wanted either the matter considered on the basis of the papers, or that you wanted an oral hearing?

Scouse.

Hi Scouse

I too was slightly worse for wear last night and i too apologise for my abrupt response.

On the appeal form i said that i wanted an oral hearing, so i guess i will have to build a new case depending on what case they have against us.

Regards

Dean

AIT does not have a case against you. They give both you and the ECO the chance to show the evidence to justify the decisions. You just have to show based on what evidence and what regulation you believe a visa should have been given. If they agree they will decide in your favor

[atlastaname]

Dean,

I can't tell you how refreshing it is to see someone else (apart from me ) who has the balls to stand up for what they believe in and actually SAY it (rarely happens on this forum i can tell you).

Seriously, the AIT is not part of the British Embassy and is run by independant adjudicators/judges who most definately do NOT have it in for you . If you are genuine and make your case convincingly you stand a great chance . Personally i would pay for representation. Its very expensive but the BE will be represented by a lawyer ( Barrister?) set on upholding your refusal so sometimes it is worth paying to have a lawyer represent you.

I can't see that anyone else has bothered to tell you , but did you know that you will not be given the result of your appeal on the day . The agony will be dragged out for a few days , week or two sometimes, before you hear. Not trying to increase your stress levels at all, just telling you so you know.

Amazing they think 12 times in 15 months is not enough. Difficult to see how you could have done anymore without living in Thailand .

[the scouser]

...the BE will be represented by a lawyer ( Barrister?)....

Not so. The ECO will be represented by a Home Office Presenting Officer of HEO grade who, as a general rule, will not be legally qualified.

Scouse.

[atlastaname]

I stand corrected . The principle remains the same though, you should consider legal representation to make the most of your case

[Deanuk]

I can't see that anyone else has bothered to tell you , but did you know that you will not be given the result of your appeal on the day . The agony will be dragged out for a few days , week or two sometimes, before you hear. Not trying to increase your stress levels at all, just telling you so you know.

Amazing they think 12 times in 15 months is not enough. Difficult to see how you could have done anymore without living in Thailand .

hi atlastaname

I wasnt aware that this was the case that i wouldnt find out until maybe a week or two after...thanks for pointing that out.

Amazing it is...but the ECO said that in the 15 months and 12 visits there i could have been to visit anybody.

Regards

Dean

[Deanuk]

Hi

i think in hindsight what i should have done was leave on the date whilst taking pictures on my digicam............ well perhaps after his response about our Yahoo chat conversations he would have said that we'd doctored the pictures using photoshop!!

Dean