Opened Bangkok Bank Account, tried to X-fer from US, trial ACH deposits failed

[trademarkedTM]

Joealx; im pretty sure we've determined that new links just aren't going to happen

 

 

On a schwab note, i had to call to confirm my wire and now they are they saying 3 free domestic wires only and that the 2 previous employees who said international would be free were incorrect.  They suggested I wire to the BKKB domestic routing #. 

[Pib]

14 hours ago, joealx said:

Was your name In the US bank the same name with Bangkok Bank? That could be the problem.

While that can sometimes be a problem in an "actual" transfer of funds from an established ibanking transfer link...that is, you already have the ibanking transfer link setup/approved and then transfer money...say the actual transfer of $1000...$5,000, etc., that is "not" the problem occurring.   

 

The problem is you can no longer setup a "new" ibanking transfer link to a Bankgok Bank account "using the trial deposits setup method" as Bangkok Bank "New York branch" will reject the attempt....kick the trial deposits back to your sending bank with a rejection notice. The trail deposits never reach your "in-Thailand" Bangkok Bank branch for rejection or deposit, because the Bangkok Bank "New York branch" never relayed them to your in-Thailand branch.    

 

Bangkok Bank is now rejecting "trial deposits', repeat, trial deposits only because they are trying to stop additional people from setting-up new ibanking ACH transfer links at their U.S. banks as Bangkok Bank tries to figure out if there is anyway they can continue to allow "Domestic ACH Transfers" (the current method used to transfer funds to Bangkok Bank) without having to use the U.S. govt mandated "International ACH Transfer."     The Intenational ACH Transfer file format includes additional info in the transfer that the Domestic ACH Transfer format does not include. 

 

So, you may be thinking, "Then OK, use the International ACH Format for transfers."  Problem is U.S. banks do not use the International ACH Transfer format for trail deposits or actual transfers on retail accounts.   No need to because Domestic transfers are for money staying within the U.S., but Bangkok Bank has been using the method for a long, long time to also flow the funds outward to a person's Bangkok Bank account in Thailand. 

 

While this was not breaking any govt rules at the time because of apparent loopholes/workaround in the regulations, apparently Bangkok Bank had reached a limit in being able to continue using past loopholes/workaround due to U.S. govt tightening-up the monitoring of funds that leave and enter the U.S. 

 

It's not just the U.S. govt doing this, even the EU/UK govts have been tightening up the flow of funds entering and exiting...like how about this time last year the use of the Bankgok Bank "London" branch for BACS transfers (UK version of U.S. ACH) had to tighten-up...a fairly easy process got replaced with a hard process...a process that got so onerous I doubt many UK folks use it any more...instead they just switched to using International Wire/SWIFT or money transfer services like Transferwise as these kinds of transfer include all the info govt regulation now require.

 

Approx two months ago is when ThaiVisa U.S. members started reporting in multiple threads their attempts to setup a new ibanking transfer link at their U.S. bank/credit unions to their Bangkok Bank account were being rejected by the Bangkok Bank NY branch.  That's also about the same time all the detailed info that "use" to be on the Bangkok Bank website regarding Sendings using U.S. ibanking services was replaced with below short and sweet statement.  

 

 

 

Summary:

At this time actual transfers from already established U.S. ibanking transfer links are not being rejected (yet); only setup of new ibanking transfer links which use the trial deposit method are being rejected.  If your bank also allows other ways to setup a new transfer link which "does not," repeat, does not use trial deposits then the transfer link will setup.  But the majority of banks only use the trial deposits method.

 

At this time transfers from already established transfer link continue to go through no problem....how long that will continue time will tell. 

 

Also, U.S. govt benefit payments such as social security, military retirement, etc., continue to go through and I doubt they will be affected because those transfers include additional info that probably meet the info requirements of the International ACH Transfer format plus they flow to special Direct Deposit accounts which have some restrictions on use.

 

 

Edited July 17, 2018 by Pib

[Pib]

16 minutes ago, trademarkedTM said:

Joealx; im pretty sure we've determined that new links just aren't going to happen

 

 

On a schwab note, i had to call to confirm my wire and now they are they saying 3 free domestic wires only and that the 2 previous employees who said international would be free were incorrect.  They suggested I wire to the BKKB domestic routing #. 

So their pricing schedule posted earlier is correct.  Don't you just love it when some CSRs at any financial institution give bad info. 

 

A few years ago when I called Capital One about a certain credit card payment policy I got totally different answers from 3 different CSRs over approx a one week period when I made the various calls. In the final call I finally got the correct info from a CSR who know her stuff.   And in that 3d call a CSR who I had talked to earlier (who gave bad info early) was also involved in the call...we had a 3 person call going...and also got to learn the "correct" info.

 

Yea, some CSRs can give incomplete or completely wrong info for whatever reason....maybe misunderstanding of what the customer was asking, maybe poor training, etc.   Seems some bankster policies and fees are so vague and complicated that sometimes even their own CSRs can't full understand them.

 

 

 

 

 

[TallGuyJohninBKK]

1 hour ago, Pib said:

So their pricing schedule posted earlier is correct.  Don't you just love it when some CSRs at any financial institution give bad info. 

 

 

That's very bad on Schwab's part, as Trademarked and I both got the same apparently wrong advice from Schwab reps on the "free intl wires" issue totally independent from each other.  And then had that apparently wrong advice later contradicted by other Schwab reps who said "no so."  That's bad...

 

The only good part is, Schwab does in fact, really, offer international wire transfers for a $25 fee, which is about as good as it gets for publicly, generally available U.S. accounts that I'm aware of. If anyone knows of a lower intl wire fee institution for a generally available account, please mention it here.

 

 

 

[TallGuyJohninBKK]

Back on BKK Bank, I thought I'd just mention this as a bit of an informational update:

 

Last Friday, the day I spoke on the phone with BKK Bank's New York branch and then posted the recap of that info here, I also sent a pair of emails to BKK Bank posing essentially the same basic questions in writing. (Neither of those emails bounced back indicating any delivery problem).

 

One of those emails was sent to the listed email address for BKK Bank's New York branch. The other identical email was sent to the email address listed on BKK Bank's web page for the section related to changes occurring with their NY ACH process.

 

As of the close of business today, it's been 3 business days since I sent both of those emails. And thus far, have not received any emailed response (or any other response) to either of them.  Should that change any time in the future, I'll share any updated info here.

[Pib]

13 minutes ago, TallGuyJohninBKK said:

Back on BKK Bank, I thought I'd just mention this as a bit of an informational update:

 

Last Friday, the day I spoke on the phone with BKK Bank's New York branch and then posted the recap of that info here, I also sent a pair of emails to BKK Bank posing essentially the same basic questions in writing. (Neither of those emails bounced back indicating any delivery problem).

 

One of those emails was sent to the listed email address for BKK Bank's New York branch. The other identical email was sent to the email address listed on BKK Bank's web page for the section related to changes occurring with their NY ACH process.

 

As of the close of business today, it's been 3 business days since I sent both of those emails. And thus far, have not received any emailed response (or any other response) to either of them.  Should that change any time in the future, I'll share any updated info here.

 

Sounds almost identical to Bangkok Bank's speed of responding to my inquiry in early June....where I first got a response from Bangkok Bank saying they had  forwarded my inquiry to their NY branch.   It took 12 days from my initial request to the Bangkok Bank until I got the final NY branch's response.  Below is the NY branch response from 19 June with my name redacted.  Don't be surprised if the response you get is very, very, very similar.

 

And just to repeat for others listening in, so far only "ACH trial deposit transfers" used by most U.S. banks/credit unions to setup new ibanking transfers links are being rejected.   ACH transfers from established ibanking transfer links and U.S. govt benefit payments to Direct Deposit account are still unaffected (not to imply they will not be affected at some point, especially ibanking transfers). 

 

Personally, I do not expect U.S. govt benefit direct deposit payments to be affected since they include additional info and special Direct Deposit accounts.  Plus Bangkok Bank has not changed the info on their website regarding how to do those U.S. govt transfers like how they changed their info for ibanking transfers.   But that is just my gut feel....I could end up being wrong.

 

Quote

 

Dear XXXXXXXXXX,

 

With our sincere apologies for any inconvenience you may have experience with respect to Transfer money from USA to Thailand via the US Automated Clearing House system (US ACH) and Bangkok Bank's New York branch.

 

Recently, NACHA updated the Operating Rules to reflect of cross-border transfers, required foreign payments to be classified with the International ACH Transactions (IAT designation), the payment using US ACH or via Bangkok Bank New York to Bangkok Bank in Thailand involving a financial agency’s office that is not located in the territorial jurisdiction of the United States, the file would be required to be formatted as an IAT transaction. You will no longer transferring funds from US Bank to Bangkok bank account in Thailand using ACH domestic method. 

 

However, to remit funds to your Bangkok Bank’s account in Thailand via Bangkok Bank, New York, you must inform the sending’s Bank in US to originated the funds using IAT Standard Format to Bangkok Bank, New York in their payment instruction which requires the name, account number and full address and country of the receiver in Thailand.  Otherwise, the initiate funds transferring from US Bank to Bangkok Bank’s account in Thailand though Bangkok Bank, NY will be automatically rejected. 

 

Please notes that US Bank may charges an International ACH Transactions (IAT), please check the relevant fees and charges from your bank in US. 

 

We apologize for any inconvenience and appreciate your understanding.

 

Should you require any further assistance, please do not hesitate to contact us. You can also contact our phone banking center at +66-2645-5555 (from the overseas) or 1333 (from within Thailand), a 24/7 service to acquire more information. Thank you.

 

Sincerely,

 

Web operations

 

 

 

Edited July 18, 2018 by Pib

[TallGuyJohninBKK]

Just now, Pib said:

 

Sounds almost identical to Bangkok Bank's speed of responding to my inquiry in early June....where I first got a response from Bangkok Bank saying they had  forwarded my inquiry to their NY branch.   It took 12 days from my initial request to the Bangkok Bank until I got the final NY branch's response.  Below is the NY branch response from 19 June with my name redacted.  Don't be surprised if the response you get is very, very, very similar.

 

Well, I don't think it can be too similar, because as I've previously posted here, my contact at the NY branch said that they've already abandoned pursuing the IAT method as a future solution, because basically no U.S. banks offer it to their consumer account holders. So that would knock out a good portion of their email response to you.

 

Also, my emailed questions to them were very specific and conscious in asking simple YES or NO questions that hopefully would not lead to open-ended, vague meandering answers. Such as...

--Are you planning to end the current domestic ACH system?

--Have you already cut off new account linking trial deposits?

--Are you going to use the IAT system as a replacement service (which I now know they're not)?

--Will the current Social Security direct deposits remain unaffected?

 

You hadn't mentioned before, as best as I recall, that it took them 12 days to finally respond to the substance of your email... So, I'll hang in there a bit longer waiting.  Mainly, I'd just like to see them confirm in writing what their New York branch staff person already told me over the telephone last week. So everyone here hopefully will be able to see and read the exact same info/answers.

 

 

[JimGant]

Quote

My source advised that U.S. customers right now who try to create NEW ACH links between their U.S. bank accounts and the BKKB New York branch WILL NOT be able to do so any longer. [Did they mean to include even those links that don't require trial deposits? Hmmm]

You posted this last Friday, so maybe I just slipped in under the wire, as I successfully set up a transfer link from USAA last Wed, using the "no signature authority, push only" feature (i.e., no test deposits). Took the standard three days for USAA to establish the linkage, then Sunday I sent a test deposit, which arrived this Tuesday. But we know it hasn't been a problem with the push only accounts; the near hysteria has been with the push/pull test deposit accounts.

 

Here's a stab at just what might be going on.

 

Years ago, Bangkok Bank would reject trial deposits and notify the sending bank (USAA in this case) the following:

"Unfortunately, your financial institution [Bangkok Bank] notified us that this is a credits-only account -- withdrawals aren't allowed. Based on this information, we've added this account to your funds transfer list for deposits only. Please contact your financial institution if you have questions about the account."

Had they allowed the test deposits, USAA would have set up the transfer template as push and pull, thus in my drop down "transfer from" block, I would have seen my Bangkok Bank account as one of the choices. And pulling from a financial institution in a foreign country has long been a no no (but maybe no longer, as long as IAT criteria is in place......... dunno).

 

But Bangkok Bank was losing business from those whose couldn't set up transfer linkage without trial deposits. So, they allowed trial deposits (even without returning the small amounts), and thus many push/pull transfer linkages were set up -- theoretically at least 'cause we don't know if you could actually mechanically accomplish a pull (Bangkok Bank never actually said you couldn't mechanically do it, only that you would be in trouble if you tried it).

 

So the money laundering police found out Bangkok Bank had customers who potentially could "pull" foreign funds into the US ACH system. And BB was told to no longer establish such transfer linkage. (And stay tuned for what happens to those linkages already established.)

 

And IAT is mainly concerned with the potential for bad money coming into (not leaving) the US:

 

Quote

Why is the implementation of IAT necessary?

 

In the current environment, many U.S. financial institutions are receiving international payments that cannot be properly identified. These unidentifiable payments enter the U.S. through correspondent banking relationships and are often difficult to trace or accurately process as international payments. The new IAT code supports the end of anonymity and promotes traceability of international electronic payments.

 

So maybe doing away with the (potential) pull ability from Bangkok Bank accounts in Thailand into the US ACH system would solve the problem (certainly they could build some kind of blockage so that all those already established push/pull linkages don't have to be closed or re-wickered.....).

 

And as for sending (pushing) to Thailand.....certainly the US Treasury is not going to close down the Direct Deposit route, resulting in waiver requests for paper checks. And actually, as currently set up, all ACH transfers, Federal and private, are converted to SWIFT transfers at BB NY, and SWIFT encoding contains those data elements required by IAT (well, maybe not all, as I don't recall seeing "reason for transfer" on the data printout I requested; but that's wasted space, since do you think your drug dealer will put "for buying 10,000 kilos of meth" rather than "for living expenses"?). Anyway, I somehow think the pushing aspect is not the main event in this ruckus. But, we'll see. Sending fewer, but larger chunks of change via SWIFT wire won't be a big deal.

 

 

 

[TallGuyJohninBKK]

9 minutes ago, JimGant said:

So maybe doing away with the (potential) pull ability from Bangkok Bank accounts in Thailand into the US ACH system would solve the problem (certainly they could build some kind of blockage so that all those already established push/pull linkages don't have to be closed or re-wickered.....). 

 

 

Jim, regardless of how the initial linking is/has been done via BKKB NY, AFAIK, it's always been a one-way system, U.S. to Thailand.   AFAIK, there's never been any ability to move money the opposite direction via BKKB NY.

 

As I know I've posted at least a half dozen times here in the past week, current ACH transfers with already linked accounts thru the NY branch should have no problems for the immediate future.  But the current domestic ACH system thru the NY branch is coming to an end. It's only a matter of time, and what if any replacement system BKKB will try to devise.

 

As BKK Bank noted in their somewhat flawed English email that Pib posted above:
 

Quote

You will no longer transferring funds from US Bank to Bangkok bank account in Thailand using ACH domestic method. 

 

 

Edited July 18, 2018 by TallGuyJohninBKK

[Pib]

5 minutes ago, JimGant said:

You posted this last Friday, so maybe I just slipped in under the wire, as I successfully set up a transfer link from USAA last Wed, using the "no signature authority, push only" feature (i.e., no test deposits). Took the standard three days for USAA to establish the linkage, then Sunday I sent a test deposit, which arrived this Tuesday. But we know it hasn't been a problem with the push only accounts; the near hysteria has been with the push/pull test deposit accounts.

 

Yeap, only ibanking transfer links setup using "trial deposits" are being rejected at this point. 

 

Fortunately, USAA offers two methods to setup an ibanking transfer link. 

- Method 1: for Deposit & Withdraw which uses trial deposits (but never try to withdraw from Bangkok Bank because it will be rejected). 

- Method 2: for Deposit Only...trial deposits not used....Bangkok Bank NY never placed in the loop since no trial deposits are sent....3 business days later the transfer link goes active. 

 

The wife setup such a USAA ibanking link to her Bangkok Bank account using Method 2 about a week ago...link went active 3 business days later.

 

But USAA is in the minority when it comes to also offering Method 2 for ibanking transfer link setup....most banks/credit unions only offer Method 1.

[Pib]

17 minutes ago, TallGuyJohninBKK said:

 

Well, I don't think it can be too similar, because as I've previously posted here, my contact at the NY branch said that they've already abandoned pursuing the IAT method as a future solution, because basically no U.S. banks offer it to their consumer account holders. So that would knock out a good portion of their email response to you.

 

Also, my emailed questions to them were very specific and conscious in asking simple YES or NO questions that hopefully would not lead to open-ended, vague meandering answers. Such as...

--Are you planning to end the current domestic ACH system?

--Have you already cut off new account linking trial deposits?

--Are you going to use the IAT system as a replacement service (which I now know they're not)?

--Will the current Social Security direct deposits remain unaffected?

 

You hadn't mentioned before, as best as I recall, that it took them 12 days to finally respond to the substance of your email... So, I'll hang in there a bit longer waiting.  Mainly, I'd just like to see them confirm in writing what their New York branch staff person already told me over the telephone last week. So everyone here hopefully will be able to see and read the exact same info/answers.

 

I know you asked some more specific questions in your email to them and your call indicated their eyes were know a little more opened about how banks don't use IAT for retail accounts, but my money is still on the bet the answer you get will be very, very similar to what I got in June.

[TallGuyJohninBKK]

37 minutes ago, JimGant said:

You posted this last Friday, so maybe I just slipped in under the wire, as I successfully set up a transfer link from USAA last Wed, using the "no signature authority, push only" feature (i.e., no test deposits). Took the standard three days for USAA to establish the linkage, then Sunday I sent a test deposit, which arrived this Tuesday. But we know it hasn't been a problem with the push only accounts; the near hysteria has been with the push/pull test deposit accounts.

 

As Pib correctly noted above, most U.S. banks do use the trial deposits system for confirming ACH links, and a relatively smaller number make available the other, no trial deposits method.

 

So right now, anyone trying to do a NEW trial deposits link to BKKB NY probably is out of luck.

 

But if you're one of those who uses USAA or another bank that allows non-trial deposit linking, then you've still got some time left to create a new BKKB NY ACH link.

 

But in the end, at some future point, all the current system of domestic ACH transfers thru BKKB are going to cease working -- regardless of how the links were created.  We just don't know exactly when, and whether something else will replace the current system.

 

 

Edited July 18, 2018 by TallGuyJohninBKK

[TallGuyJohninBKK]

Just now, Pib said:

 

I know you asked some more specific questions in your email to them and your call indicated their eyes were know a little more opened about how banks don't use IAT for retail accounts, but my money is still on the bet the answer you get will be very, very similar to what I got in June.

 

I'll be interested to see, and promise to share here!

[lopburi3]

Tried Transferwise this week from USAA and a Colorado bank and worked very well - USAA did not require deposits as you sign on internet banking (but receipt of funds slow to Transferwise - suspect computer issue as never got send confirmation from them).  For Colorado had 2 small deposits put into my account.  Funds were immediately forwarded when I reported amount.  Both were deposited into Bangkok Bank account today at about 1400.  Very positive experience from Transferwise and they sent email the USAA transfer was delayed a day due longer than expected in receiving funds.

[Pib]

Just an update on my Transferwise account I opened last month so I can have a Plan B/another method to send funds without relying on ACH/International Wire/SWIFT, I have done three transfers so far. 

 

First two for small amounts and third one for several thousand dollars.  Transfers were to two different Thai banks...Bangkok Bank and Krungsri Bank.  First transfer took 4 business days, second and third transfers 2 business days. Each transfer was funded by ACH Debits from my U.S. bank account.   First transfer took longer due to the initial verification process for new members which the Transferwise says can happen on their website.   

 

Been very pleased with Transferwise so far, but I probably will not be doing any more transfers for a while as these three transfers were really test transfers so to speak to I could evaluate their system and develop peace of mind in their system.   Firm up another way to transfer funds from my U.S. banks/credit unions to "any" Thai bank; not just Bangkok Bank.

 

Since I have multiple no foreign transaction fee cards that also reimburse ATM fees I can swing by an ATM and have money in hand within a few seconds....all of my cards allow $1000 per transaction/day which exceeds the Thai ATM Bt30K max per ATM transaction.  Just these cards pretty much negate any need to do wire-type transfers, except if I would need a big amount of money quick.   Plus, I can still use SWIFT/International Wire from my U.S. banks (along with their healthy sending fee) and, until something changes, I can still use the low cost ACH to Bangkok Bank method since I have established ibanking transfer links.

 

Yeap, Transferwise works pretty well.  And if you are transferring around $2,000 or less it's cheaper to go that route than going the Bangkok Bank ACH route....plus, as mentioned, you can send to "any" Thai bank.  Something to consider if for nothing else to have a backup method for funds transfers.

 

 

 

 

[Pib]

7 minutes ago, lopburi3 said:

Tried Transferwise this week from USAA and a Colorado bank and worked very well - USAA did not require deposits as you sign on internet banking (but receipt of funds slow to Transferwise - suspect computer issue as never got send confirmation from them).  For Colorado had 2 small deposits put into my account.  Funds were immediately forwarded when I reported amount.  Both were deposited into Bangkok Bank account today at about 1400.  Very positive experience from Transferwise and they sent email the USAA transfer was delayed a day due longer than expected in receiving funds.

And was the "Description/Reference" of the transfer on your Bangkok Bank ibanking statement "International Transfer"....that's how the transfers were described on mine.   I like that....might help in the future if you need to move money out of Thailand.  Plus you also have a receipt from Transferwise detailing the transfer, but I expect what the Thai bank reflects in they system carries more weight when wanting to repatriate money.

 

But on my Krungsri Banking ibanking statement it just reflected the Transferwise 10 digit transfer control number which is based on the total number of attempted/cancelled/actual transfers you have done so far with Transferwise.

 

Guess each bank picked different data from transfer coding to display on your account.   I expect all my transfers to both banks had "International Transfer" and the "control number" in the coding, but each bank extracted different data to reflect on your statement to describe the transfer.

 

 

[lopburi3]

17 minutes ago, Pib said:

And was the "Description/Reference" of the transfer on your Bangkok Bank ibanking statement "International Transfer"

Indeed they were - which was a pleasant surprise.  

[Thailand J]

You'll need Schwab's One International account to enjoy free foreign transfers. ..yes the fee schedule (updated July 2018) says domestic, but It doesn't make sense to offer global investors free  US domestic transfers.

 

I keep over US$100,000 in my account.  I made two transfers out of US on Monday July16, both were free.

[Pib]

45 minutes ago, lopburi3 said:

  Both were deposited into Bangkok Bank account today at about 1400.  

Regarding time of day arrival ditto for me.  Both my transfers to Bangkok Bank arrived a little after 1400.   For the one transfer to Krungsri Bank it arrived a little after 1330.   

[KhunFred]

Same situation here. I even got a translator to go to the bank with me and when we left, everything had apparently been set up. The process never worked. I gave up after that. The bank officials kept babbling about "work permits" when I kept telling him I was retired. I got the idea that they simply don't give a damn about our money, and think we are a joke. The lady I took with me to translate seemed very upset when I told her that nothing had changed.

[TallGuyJohninBKK]

1 hour ago, Thailand J said:

You'll need Schwab's One International account to enjoy free foreign transfers. ..yes the fee schedule (updated July 2018) says domestic, but It doesn't make sense to offer global investors free  US domestic transfers.

 

I keep over US$100,000 in my account.  I made two transfers out of US on Monday July16, both were free.

 

That could explain why there's been a lot of confusion/contradictory advice handed out by Schwab's reps on this issue lately.

 

But FWIW, the Schwab reps who first told both me and the other member here about the supposedly free international transfers clearly knew we had U.S. accounts (not international ones), and so did the subsequent Schwab reps who separately told both of us that the earlier advice was wrong and there are no free international transfers for U.S. accounts.

 

The thing that might put some folks here off of opening a international Schwab account, as opposed to a domestic one, is the international version last time I checked had a $10K opening balance requirement, whereas the U.S. version has none.  But the international wires, if true, is a nice perk.  There also are restrictions or an outright ban on trading U.S. mutual funds in their intl account, as best as I recall.

 

 

 

Edited July 18, 2018 by TallGuyJohninBKK

[TallGuyJohninBKK]

2 hours ago, Thailand J said:

You'll need Schwab's One International account to enjoy free foreign transfers. ..yes the fee schedule (updated July 2018) says domestic, but It doesn't make sense to offer global investors free  US domestic transfers.

 

I keep over US$100,000 in my account.  I made two transfers out of US on Monday July16, both were free.

 

OK, the story that won't die... Here's one more piece, FWIW...

 

I just got off the phone with Schwab's "Move Money Solutions" team, and spoke first with a regular rep there, and then later with a supervisor, who both related the same version of what they said is their policy (which we went over in excrutiating detail), as follows:

 

They are saying that regardless of if you are a Schwab U.S. or a Schwab international account holder, the waivers of wire transfer fees for those with $100,000 or greater household balances ONLY applies to domestic wires (meaning Schwab to U.S.-based account). Three free per quarter if initiated thru Schwab.com. And no automatic free international wires (to non-U.S. accounts), regardless of account balance.

 

However, as the supervisor put it, that's the way their system is set to work by default. He added that if an account holder is working directly with a Schwab broker at a branch or thru some other means, he said it's possible for the brokers to grant their accountholders various perks on an individual basis that could include various extra fee waivers. And the same in some kinds of corporate linked accounts.

 

Now, how that relates to the experience you've related in your prior post, I have no idea.

 

BTW, the Schwab people I was speaking with seemed to be saying that even if you're an international Schwab account holder, that the cash balance in your account is being held in the U.S. So a Schwab international account holder would still have reason to do free domestic wires from their Schwab account to other U.S. accounts.

Edited July 18, 2018 by TallGuyJohninBKK

[Thailand J]

I have an international brokerage account  and an IRA account with Schwab, nothing would entitle me to special treatment. I have made 7-8 free transfers this year.

If you call them again, ask to be transfer to the wire transfer department, you may get a different answer.

 

 

[Pib]

Even though you said you have an International Schwab account were above considered "domestic" wire transfers....that is, transfers to/from U.S. banks, repeat, U.S. banks?   And do you have $100K or more balance with Schwab?   If your answer is yes to both then I can understand the free transfers based purely on the pricing guide wording.

 

Purely based on the wording in their International Brokerage account pricing guide, which appears to be the exact same pricing guide for a U.S. Brokerage account, a person would get three free "domestic" transfer per quarter if having at least a $100K household balance with Schwab.

 

But also on their main webpage there is a note just before they refer a person to their international pricing guide link they say "Waivers may apply" which opens up all kinds of pricing possibilities.

 

http://international.schwab.com/public/international/accounts_products/accounts/brokerage_account

[NancyL]

I set up a new ACH transfer between my U.S. credit union and a Bangkok Bank account -- no problem.  I used the credit union's online bill payment system and input the Bangkok Bank routing number and the account number for the destination account at Bangkok Bank, which wasn't an account in my name, but rather that of an organization I wanted to pay.  I set up the new account and made the transfer on Friday evening Thai time and receive an SMS from the organization yesterday (Wednesday) that they received my donation from the U.S.

 

So, all the hullabaloo about how Bangkok Bank isn't accepting new ACH deposits doesn't seem to be true, at least those from my credit union.  Of course, there wasn't any nonsense about trial deposits or anything.  It was a simple one-time transfer.  Perhaps if I had requested it to be a recurring transfer there may have been a problem, but I doubt it.

[trademarkedTM]

Schwab said that their test deposits don't require a pull back, so I don't think that's the probably that's stopping the account links. 

 

They did charge the $25 international wire fee but waived it due to an unrelated complication. 

 

I sent $8500 and I received the equivalent of $8444 at BKKB today.  Is all that difference in exchange fees?  Neither Schwab nor BKKB show a breakdown.  

 

Can any ATM other than Krungsri do a 30k withdrawl?  I've tried almost all of them and they max out at 20k.  

[Pib]

Comparison between a Transferwise and Bangkok Bank ACH transfers.  Based on exchange rates at Transferwise and Bangkok Bank websites as of 19 July at 10:10am.

 

[Pib]

16 minutes ago, trademarkedTM said:

I sent $8500 and I received the equivalent of $8444 at BKKB today.  Is all that difference in exchange fees?  Neither Schwab nor BKKB show a breakdown.  

 

Can any ATM other than Krungsri do a 30k withdrawl?  I've tried almost all of them and they max out at 20k.  

Can you spell out your personal math in how you reached the $8,444 equivalent amount like what exchange rate you used in your math?

 

TMB  ATMs do 30K.  I use both Krungsri and TMB ATMs here in Bangkok to withdraw 30K at a whack.

[trademarkedTM]

4 minutes ago, Pib said:

Can you spell out your personal math in how you reached the $8,444 equivalent amount like what exchange rate you used in your math?

 

TMB  ATMs do 30K.  I use both Krungsri and TMB ATMs here in Bangkok to withdraw 30K at a whack.

Sure,

 

I transferred 8500USD and 281,700THB appeared.  I punched 281,700 into the XE app, but since a few hours ago that rate has changed and it is now 1 THB = 0.0299 which makes my transfer theoretically worth $8435.  I'm not sure of the rate a few hours ago, but obviously slightly better. 

 

Regarding the 30k ATM, I did try TMB and got a 20k limit, and I know it's not my account, but I will try again.   Thanks!

[Pib]

4 minutes ago, trademarkedTM said:

Sure,

 

I transferred 8500USD and 281,700THB appeared.  I punched 281,700 into the XE app, but since a few hours ago that rate has changed and it is now 1 THB = 0.0299 which makes my transfer theoretically worth $8435.  I'm not sure of the rate a few hours ago, but obviously slightly better. 

 

Regarding the 30k ATM, I did try TMB and got a 20k limit, and I know it's not my account, but I will try again.   Thanks!

You made a common mistake in using a forex rate like XE.com.  Bankgok Bank, nor any Thai bank, uses the mid market/wholesale forex rate.  The banks use their own rate which includes a market-up on the forex mid market rate....by mark-up I mean they use a slightly lower rate so they can make some profit.

 

Here's how Bangkok Bank converts and applies fees when a foreign currency arrives:

 

Say $8500 actually arrived with no intermediary bank fees...and I'm assuming you did an international transfer to Bangkok Bank's "SWIFT" code, repeat, SWIFT code and you didn't do a domestic wire transfer to their ACH/ABA routing number.

 

Bangkok Bank converts the received foreign currency to baht using their TT Buying Rate in affect at the time.  TT Buying Rate is used for incoming international transfers.  For this morning their TT Buying Rate was 33.20.   

 

- 8500 times 33.20 gives 282,200 baht.  

 

- Now, the bank 0.25% (Bt200 min, Bt500 max) receiving/conversion fee is applied before posting to  your account.  0.25% times 282,200 gives a Bt705.50 fee, however that is rounded down to the "max" fee of Bt500. 

 

- 282,200 minus 500 leaves 281,700 baht which is then posted to your account.  Matches what you got exactly.

 

Their receiving/conversion will not appear anywhere on your ibanking statement/passbook as it was applied before posting to your account which fools many into thinking no fee was applied but indeed it was.   Ditto for those who transfer via the Bangkok Bank NY ACH routing method plus the NY branch fee which is sliced off as the funds flow thru them.