Schengen visa (France) for Thai wife

[lemonjelly]

Sorry if this has already been covered, but I couldn’t find a recent update. Anyway, I’m from the UK, want to take the missus to France to visit my mum. Questions:

Is it really worth using an agent?

can someone give me a rundown of docs required (I did read that she wouldn’t have to show employment or funds etc as she’s my spouse)

As she’ll be traveling with me and visiting my mother, will she need to show hotel bookings?

Many thanks in advance and if there’s anything more you can add, very much appreciated, i’ve been trying to get info online but getting dizzy with it all.

[rasg]

Definitely not worth using an agent!

 

Is she your wife and what visa does she currently have? Does she have a BRP? Are you both in the UK now?

 

Give you better information if you can answer those questions.

[lemonjelly]

21 minutes ago, rasg said:

Definitely not worth using an agent!

 

Is she your wife and what visa does she currently have? Does she have a BRP? Are you both in the UK now?

 

Give you better information if you can answer those questions.

We’re both in Thailand, she doesn’t have British residence permit, we’re legally married in Thailand. She’s never been to The uk before, she had a thai agent quote her 16,000 baht !!!.... I put the brake on that one straight away!!!

[theoldgit]

Providing  you intend travelling before the UK leaves the EU then, yes, your wife can apply for a visa using the Freedom of Movement Directive, this is issued free of charge and should be issued promptly.

 

You should provide evidence of your marriage, evidence that you're an EU national and that you're either travelling together or meeting in the member state.

 

You do have to supply flight details but not accomodation, insurance or financial details.

 

Some Consulates, including the French it would seem, require that "Marriage certificate legalized by the embassy of the country of the spouse (if the marriage took place in Thailand), or by the competent authority of the country of the spouse" , I don't believe this is a legal requirement, but something some Consulates insist on. The UK Embassy will not do this, maybe you'll have to get it done at the Thai MFA.

 

https://fr.tlscontact.com/th/BKK/page.php?pid=Family_EU_less90

[lemonjelly]

Providing  you intend travelling before the UK leaves the EU then, yes, your wife can apply for a visa using the Freedom of Movement Directive, this is issued free of charge and should be issued promptly.

 

You should provide evidence of your marriage, evidence that you're an EU national and that you're either travelling together or meeting in the member state.

 

You do have to supply flight details but not accomodation, insurance or financial details.

 

Some Consulates, including the French it would seem, require that "Marriage certificate legalized by the embassy of the country of the spouse (if the marriage took place in Thailand), or by the competent authority of the country of the spouse" , I don't believe this is a legal requirement, but something some Consulates insist on. The UK Embassy will not do this, maybe you'll have to get it done at the Thai MFA.

 

https://fr.tlscontact.com/th/BKK/page.php?pid=Family_EU_less90

Thank you so much ol’git, especially for that link...does anyone have any more info on this “legalizing of marriage” or any other info that might be useful .......I want to get all my ducks in a row as I’m 16 hours from BKK and can’t be going to and fro

 

 

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[theoldgit]

2 minutes ago, lemonjelly said:

Thank you so much ol’git, does anyone have any more info on this “legalizing of marriage” at the MFA, I want to get all my ducks in a row as I’m 16 hours from BKK and can’t be going to and fro

To be honest, my suggestion that the MFA might do it is little more than a guess.

 

The French, or at least their agents, are saying that your marriage certificate has to be legalised by the Embassy of the spouse, which is you, I know that the UK Embassy won't do it, probably because it's not a legal requirement.
The FCO legalises documents in the UK, but I'm not sure that they have the authority to legalise a Thai document, again a guess though.

 

Member Donutz is the expert on matters Schengen, he has an informative pinned topic on the subject, but he lives in the Netherlands and probably won't be online for a while.

 

Hopefully another member may, as you've asked, gone through this.  

[cornishcarlos]

I also heard that the French embassy made things difficult (EU Freedom of Movement Directive) but last posts on that subject were quite a while ago.

Technically, you should be able to rock up at the French embassy, with your U.K passport, marriage certificate and a flight to France.

Technically, they should issue your wife with a visa, as Old Git says, free of charge and quickly.

 

In practice, who knows what will happen ? If they still insist on this marriage certificate being authenticated by the U.K embassy, then you're stuck...

 

Please let us know how you get on, as I said there have been no posts for a while about this, well not that I have seen anyway ?

[lemonjelly]

Now I'm starting to worry, ..... Arrrgghhh


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[theoldgit]

Now I'm starting to worry, ..... Arrrgghhh

Worst case scenario is that your wife could apply as a regular tourist, but she would need to supply details of finances, accommodation, travel and insurance, along with the reasons for the visit.
Maybe this is what the French officials are trying to make your wife do by flouting the rules of the directive.

[rasg]

I haven’t chipped in further to this as I only have experience of applying for a Schengen visa for Iceland for my wife in the UK and they did it while we waited and it was free. It should take no more than 15 days.

 

If you haven’t already done it, it might be an idea if you get your marriage certificate translated into French. At least they can read and understand it.

 

Try sending a PM to Donutz. He is very knowledgeable about Schengen visas.

[lemonjelly]

Thx rasg, i’ve just contacted TLS (they handle schengen applications) stating my issue and they emailed me back saying I just need translation of and copies plus original marriage certificate


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[Donutz]

There is little I can add to what has already been written.  Yes you are covered by  EU Directive 2004/38 (freedom of  movement), yes a legal en genuine marriage should be sufficient, if both the EU national and Thai national provide ID (passport copies) and the paperwork that shows one is legally married, and something that shows that the couple is traveling or joining eachother (flight ticket reservations are the most easy evidence here but a written and signed statement should also be accepted or any other evidence should be considered).

 

The maritial papers CAN (and probably will, the French aren't laid back) be requered to be translated in a language that the embassy understands, aswell as proper legalisation of the Original document and official translation. The French cannot demand that the marriage is registrated or acknowledged in the EU member state of origin, that's against EU law. But some members (Spain!) don't give a damn. If possible it's best to comply (and consider a formal complaint to the EU member and  notyfying EU Home Affairs and the EU Ombudsman Solvit). As we know Britons cannot possible comply even if they wished to do so!  I would either include a short, polite  note in simple English explaining that the directive 2004/38 doens't require the marriage to be registrated in the EU and that the French embassy probably is very much aware that Britons cannot comply with this demand since this is simply not possible for Britons. Point out that which evidence you have included of a legal and genuine marriage (documents, translations, legalsisation stamps) and that if they have any questions about it being a genuine marriage they are free to contact you.

 

The only reason the could refuse the visa (besides failing to provide ID, evidence of a legal marriage etc.) is there is sufficient reason to suspect fraud (sham marriage etc.) or if the alien is a national security risk.

 

Or try sending the French a friendly e-mail to confirm the above . Be sure to contact the embassy and not the optional service provider. Perhaps combine a e-mail requesting a free application at the embassy with a request to acknowledge that they won't ask for the marriage to be registrated in the UK.

 

https://th.ambafrance.org/Visas

 

Good luck!

 

PS:

MGB is also just as knowledgeable  (if not more?) on Schengenvisas but his visits unfortunately became rather infrequent.
 

 

Edit: (I left this page open for an hour, just saw this reply just now):

Quote

 

Edit:

Thx rasg, i’ve just contacted TLS (they handle schengen applications) stating my issue and they emailed me back saying I just need translation of and copies plus original marriage certificate


Sent from my iPhone using Thaivisa Connect

 

They are optional, you don't have to apply via them (saving you an service fee). But glad to hear they say you won't need any more documents than what is legally required.

[lemonjelly]

2 hours ago, Donutz said:

There is little I can add to what has already been written.  Yes you are covered by  EU Directive 2004/38 (freedom of  movement), yes a legal en genuine marriage should be sufficient, if both the EU national and Thai national provide ID (passport copies) and the paperwork that shows one is legally married, and something that shows that the couple is traveling or joining eachother (flight ticket reservations are the most easy evidence here but a written and signed statement should also be accepted or any other evidence should be considered).

 

The maritial papers CAN (and probably will, the French aren't laid back) be requered to be translated in a language that the embassy understands, aswell as proper legalisation of the Original document and official translation. The French cannot demand that the marriage is registrated or acknowledged in the EU member state of origin, that's against EU law. But some members (Spain!) don't give a damn. If possible it's best to comply (and consider a formal complaint to the EU member and  notyfying EU Home Affairs and the EU Ombudsman Solvit). As we know Britons cannot possible comply even if they wished to do so!  I would either include a short, polite  note in simple English explaining that the directive 2004/38 doens't require the marriage to be registrated in the EU and that the French embassy probably is very much aware that Britons cannot comply with this demand since this is simply not possible for Britons. Point out that which evidence you have included of a legal and genuine marriage (documents, translations, legalsisation stamps) and that if they have any questions about it being a genuine marriage they are free to contact you.

 

The only reason the could refuse the visa (besides failing to provide ID, evidence of a legal marriage etc.) is there is sufficient reason to suspect fraud (sham marriage etc.) or if the alien is a national security risk.

 

Or try sending the French a friendly e-mail to confirm the above . Be sure to contact the embassy and not the optional service provider. Perhaps combine a e-mail requesting a free application at the embassy with a request to acknowledge that they won't ask for the marriage to be registrated in the UK.

 

https://th.ambafrance.org/Visas

 

Good luck!

 

PS:

MGB is also just as knowledgeable  (if not more?) on Schengenvisas but his visits unfortunately became rather infrequent.
 

 

Edit: (I left this page open for an hour, just saw this reply just now):

They are optional, you don't have to apply via them (saving you an service fee). But glad to hear they say you won't need any more documents than what is legally required.

Hartstikke thanks for the input donuts, I think I might use the service, not expensive and them posting that email to me, maybe I can hold them to it if needed 

[domdom]

Hello

 

I am french and I think that the embassy will ask for a certificate confirming you will go to your mother s place..

It is simple to obtain but your mother has to go to the Mairie of the town or village where she lives, get it and send it to you..

Ask the embassy but I think they will want that. You also should join an explanation letter and a proof of your incomes..

I heard it is sometimes not that simple to get a visa from french embassy

Have a nice week end

[abrahamzvi]

On 7/12/2018 at 11:31 PM, lemonjelly said:

We’re both in Thailand, she doesn’t have British residence permit, we’re legally married in Thailand. She’s never been to The uk before, she had a thai agent quote her 16,000 baht !!!.... I put the brake on that one straight away!!!

She needs to get a Schenegen Visa. I would suggest that she gets it in the French Embassy and it should be free of charge. Why not contact the French embassy asking for the required documents - wife of EU citizen traveling with him.

[domdom]

Hello

 

Go on internet on..... france-visas.gouv.fr

There you can enter your details and they give you the list of documents required.. The cost of the visa is 60 euros (as you are not a french national).. As told before the certificate your mother has to ask in the Mairie is required..

It is called "certificat d hebergement"..

Then there are other documents as proof of income etc etc..

Have a ice day

[Peter Denis]

Hi, I was in a somewhat comparable situation a couple of months ago.  I was with my thai girlfriend in Thailand and wanted her to come with me to Belgium, my home country, and a couple of other Schengen countries for a 5 week holiday.

Belgium and France are both EU Schengen countries, so the requirements will be very close if not identical.

Anyway, there is absolutely NO NEED for taking an agent.

The VISA application process for a SCHENGEN visa is streamlined and very efficient.

You will find the requirements when you make the application on-line, if you need more info on how to do it just contact me.

The only difficulty I had was that some documents need to be provided by the municipality of the EU citizen that will invite the thai lady.  As I was in Thailand, I could not go myself to the municipality, so I asked my father to invite my thai girlfriend (on my behalf) and get all the required documents.

So in your case, I would suggest that your mother - who lives in France, and who you intend to visit - goes to the municipality of her home-town and gets the required papers (in Belgium the required documents are free of charge, and delivered same day).  And then these papers have to be sent to Thailand.  If you use EMS this takes 6 days.  In our case, I had them sent to Bangkok so that we could pick them up and then do the VISA application at the VISA center.  Everything went quite smoothly, and the visa was in her passport the day after we made the application.

 

[sawadee1947]

On 7/13/2018 at 5:24 AM, lemonjelly said:

Thank you so much ol’git, especially for that link...does anyone have any more info on this “legalizing of marriage” or any other info that might be useful .......I want to get all my ducks in a row as I’m 16 hours from BKK and can’t be going to and fro

 

 

Sent from my shed using Thailand Forum - Thaivisa mobile app

Legalizing of marriage will be done by your UK embassy only. A Thai marriage certificate is not sufficient. So let your certificate be translated by a certified translator (list will be given by UK embassy) and send both (Thai and English translation) to your embassy for legalisation. No sweat. 

[Donutz]

1 hour ago, domdom said:

Hello

 

I am french and I think that the embassy will ask for a certificate confirming you will go to your mother s place..

It is simple to obtain but your mother has to go to the Mairie of the town or village where she lives, get it and send it to you..

Ask the embassy but I think they will want that. You also should join an explanation letter and a proof of your incomes..

I heard it is sometimes not that simple to get a visa from french embassy

Have a nice week end

 

1 hour ago, domdom said:

Hello

 

Go on internet on..... france-visas.gouv.fr

There you can enter your details and they give you the list of documents required.. The cost of the visa is 60 euros (as you are not a french national).. As told before the certificate your mother has to ask in the Mairie is required..

It is called "certificat d hebergement"..

Then there are other documents as proof of income etc etc..

Have a ice day

Dear Domdom, the topic starter is a UK national traveling to an other EU/ EEA state with his non-EU wife. Therefor EU detective 2004/38 applies and items such as evidence of accommodation, insurance and sufficient cannot be requested by the embassy. The French therefore cannot request a letter such as you describe, and they cannot charge a 60 euro fee. This visa is issued as soon  as possible, without a visa free and with minimum paperwork.

 

Your comments only apply to regular Schengen visa applications rather than the special EU family member visa (as per Directive 2004/38).

 

 

10 minutes ago, sawadee1947 said:

Legalizing of marriage will be done by your UK embassy only. A Thai marriage certificate is not sufficient. So let your certificate be translated by a certified translator (list will be given by UK embassy) and send both (Thai and English translation) to your embassy for legalisation. No sweat. 

The French very much are legally required to accept a legal and genuine Thai marriage document (plus official and legalized translation so they can understand the contents of the Thai document) as sufficient evidence. All they can demand is that one shows evidence of a legal and genuine marriage, the place or places where it is registered or acknowledged are irrelevant under this EU directive 2004/38.

[sawadee1947]

14 minutes ago, Donutz said:

 

Dear Domdom, the topic starter is a UK national traveling to an other EU/ EEA state with his non-EU wife. Therefor EU detective 2004/38 applies and items such as evidence of accommodation, insurance and sufficient cannot be requested by the embassy. The French therefore cannot request a letter such as you describe, and they cannot charge a 60 euro fee. This visa is issued as soon  as possible, without a visa free and with minimum paperwork.

 

Your comments only apply to regular Schengen visa applications rather than the special EU family member visa (as per Directive 2004/38).

 

 

The French very much are legally required to accept a legal and genuine Thai marriage document (plus official and legalized translation so they can understand the contents of the Thai document) as sufficient evidence. All they can demand is that one shows evidence of a legal and genuine marriage, the place or places where it is registered or acknowledged are irrelevant under this EU directive 2004/38.

No. Try and error 

[Peter Denis]

1 hour ago, Peter Denis said:

> See my previous post

Why not simply apply for a short-stay visa (= max 3 months) for your wife to visit France.

It's a very smooth process (have done it several times already) but it will require that your mother (or a friend/relative) gets some necessary documents from the French municipality where they live and send them over (originals are required).

The fact that you are married will be a 'bonus' to have the application easily approved, but it is not a requirement.

My girlfriend - we are not married - did come over to EU already several times.

 

 

 

[jimn]

Donutz is the recognised expert on this forum so follow his advice. For your information I am a UK national and I have 3 times via the freedom of movement directive gained a free of charge visa in the last 4 years. The first was from The Netherlads for 3 months the second and third was from the Swedish emabassy. Once for 4 months and the other with a year validity. All I had to show was (1) Intended travel dates (copy of proposed intiniary) (2) Proof of marriage (Marriage document and translation. Legalised by the Thai MFA. Not UK. (3) Copy of passports in same name. (4) Proof that you were travelling together. Sworn letter from me. 

The French cannot under the directive demand anything more. In fact The British Embassy Bangkok will not legalise a Thai marriage certificate because it recognises it already. It should however be legalised by the Thai MFA. Although not a requirement under the Freedom of Movement directive it does help.

The other misconception is about registering a marriage in Thailand in the UK. This is not now possible as a legal Thai Amphur marriage is recognised in the UK.

I hope this helps.

[domdom]

Thank you for info..  Hopefully it works like you say...  Sorry if I gave a wrong info. 

Have a nice day 

[theoldgit]

Legalizing of marriage will be done by your UK embassy only. A Thai marriage certificate is not sufficient. So let your certificate be translated by a certified translator (list will be given by UK embassy) and send both (Thai and English translation) to your embassy for legalisation. No sweat. 

I’m sorry but that’s not correct, the UK Embassy isn’t required to legalize such a document, and neither will they do so.

[theoldgit]

No. Try and error 

I’m sorry but I don’t understand what you mean.

[theoldgit]

Why not contact the French embassy asking for the required documents - wife of EU citizen traveling with him.

Or the OP could simply follow the link in post four where the list of documents is already listed.

[jojothai]

6 hours ago, jimn said:

The British Embassy Bangkok will not legalise a Thai marriage certificate because it recognises it already. It should however be legalised by the Thai MFA. Although not a requirement under the Freedom of Movement directive it does help.

The British Embassy will not legalize a UK marriage certificate never mind a Thai one. You would have to get it sent to the right place in UK and then to the Thai Consulate in London. So you dont want to get involved in that.

I suggest that you get the thai certificate translated and certified by the MFA as jimn advised.

 

I got a schengen visa for visit to Italy with my thai wife a couple of years ago.

No problems and I did not have to pay.

However it took all morning queuing up. Service was terrible. Also took a long time to collect afterwards.

On the requirements for the visa it was clearly stated that i must have insurance for my wife,

to the amounts stated in the details. Appropriate acceptable companies were also noted.

Check what is required.

[Kalasin Jo]

You are entitled to ask the French Embassy Bangkok but they prefer you to use  THEIR official agency as many countries do now. This is also n Bangkok. You start online at TLS CONTACT hen assemble the paperwork, then take an appointment at TLS office to hand over copies of what is wanted which are checked against originals. After that it takes about a week and they can post it to you. Your wife will be fingerprinted and passport photo needed. You do need your Thai marriage certificate officially translated in to English, then have both documents certified at Thai MOF.They will stick them both together at the top r.h. corner and  put stickers in English which say " seen at Ministry of Foreign Affairs" with a diplomatic officer's signature Then take this document to the British Embassy Bangkok which will legalise the English version. Do not say you want a marriage certificate legalised, they will say they can't. Simply say you want a document that has been stamped as seen by MOF legalised. It is simply the signature on the MoF sticker that they are confirming is genuine . The British Embassy will put a sticker saying "certificate of legalisation" signed by a BE consular official, stamp it and impress it with a British Embassy seal. You are then good to go with the French, as many times as you like! It is I can assure you tedious and all takes a while, but is a once off, and no chance without this. 

 

I'm not sure if you yourself are NOT resident in France that you can get a spouse visa. I went through all this because although British I am a French resident.My wife has now had 3 multiple entry short stay " family" Schengen visas valid one year. Note even though valid 1 year  she can still only spend 90 days in every 180 days in the Schengen area..

 

Having said all that if you only want to go once, get her a tourist visa. , Good luck!!!

[LukKrueng]

On 7/13/2018 at 10:24 AM, lemonjelly said:

You do have to supply flight details but not accomodation, insurance or financial details.

 

a couple of years ago the German consulate in Chiang mai insisted on insurance. Also, being a consulate and not the embassy they charged 1700 thb

[keithcresswell]

I'm not sure how strict they are on proof of marriage but I got a schengen visa for my Thai girlfriend for France. I followed someone else's advice and enclosed a supporting letter saying that as an EU citizen (British) I was inviting her to stay with me in Paris. We actually went to Spain as well with no problem.