No More ED Visa's

[OZJAY]

Currently on 3rd ED visa, went back to Australia for 5 days to see sick mother. This morning I'm coming back through Suvarnabhumi immigration with a single re-entry permit and the imm officer closed his booth and asked me to follow him. I was taken to another section in the airport and handed over to another imm officer, he opened up my passport and started flicking through the pages. I then struck up a conversation with him in Thai and gave him the run down on where I study etc.. I also let him know, I live with my partner who is Russian, and we have an 18 month old baby who was born here in Thailand.. Within seconds of hearing all this, he turned and said to me "today you go home". I replied "yes, I can't wait to get in a taxi and go home to see my son". Then he said "NO", you go home to Australia, you not stay Thailand anymore.

 

For the next 45 minutes I was asked about what I did for work and how I got my money to stay in Thailand.

 

I told him we lived off a mix of my savings and revenue from an e-commerce business.

 

Anyway this went on for another 30 minutes and the conversation was never based on my ability to speak to Thai, and that yes I really was a student in Thailand who is studying the Thai language. It was all about, how I made my money whilst studying Thai in Thailand.

 

They then asked for a copy of my son's passport which states he was born in Thailand, so I showed them that as well as his birth cert which is in Thai. They then said we will let you in but this is the last time and they also said they were leaving some notes against my name on the system.. This all went down at 2am this morning, so as soon as I heard they were letting me in, I gave "wai's" all round, grabbed my passport and got the hell outta there..

 

I'm heavily tattooed including my neck, so I am sure I was initially singled out because of this. But why after speaking "almost" fluent Thai, was that not enough to satisfy the imm officers that I was indeed a student in Thailand?

 

Am I missing something here or is it really the end of the ED Visa, even for those who actually want to study Thai?

 

 

 

 

[lopburi3]

Believe the issue is working in Thailand and suspect your explanation of e-commerce was not a positive - any commercial energy expended in Thailand requires a work permit and that would not be allowed on an ED visa entry.  Do not believe they were questioning your study but your non-study time (which appears to include internet work).  Unfortunately there does not appear to be a valid visa option for many such net nomads.

[overherebc]

20 minutes ago, lopburi3 said:

Believe the issue is working in Thailand and suspect your explanation of e-commerce was not a positive - any commercial energy expended in Thailand requires a work permit and that would not be allowed on an ED visa entry.  Do not believe they were questioning your study but your non-study time (which appears to include internet work).  Unfortunately there does not appear to be a valid visa option for many such net nomads.

Elite visa for 500,000 seems to be the only option.

Edit.

UBJ can probably answer on the possibility of a multi 0 based on being the parent of a Thai registered son. I'm not 100% sure.

Edited July 23, 2018 by overherebc

[lopburi3]

11 minutes ago, overherebc said:

UBJ can probably answer on the possibility of a multi 0 based on being the parent of a Thai registered son.

Son is not Thai so that would not be an option AFAIK - and does not appear to be a marriage so status of mother also seems to not be available.

[thedemon]

9 minutes ago, overherebc said:

Elite visa for 500,000 seems to be the only option.

 

That doesn't solve the (lack of) Work Permit issue though.

 

It would seem that as things stand now Immigration doesn't put Elite visa holders under the same kind of scrutiny regarding income/working as they do for other visas/extensions. But will that remain the case? I wouldn't count on it.

[overherebc]

3 minutes ago, thedemon said:

 

That doesn't solve the (lack of) Work Permit issue though.

 

It would seem that as things stand now Immigration doesn't put Elite visa holders under the same kind of scrutiny regarding income/working as they do for other visas/extensions. But will that remain the case? I wouldn't count on it.

As elite visa holders don't use the regular Imm' lines and from what I gather you are 'helped' through Imm' by their staff I would be surprised if any great scrunity would happen.

[OZJAY]

So does immigration expect that everyone who is in Thailand studying Thai for 3 years, must have saved enough money to see them through the entire 3 years?

 

No incoming funds are allowed from any investments or businesses that are either based in another country or any from of e-commerce business?

[overherebc]

8 minutes ago, lopburi3 said:

Son is not Thai so that would not be an option AFAIK - and does not appear to be a marriage so status of mother also seems to not be available.

I was thinking on the lines of the son having a Thai birth certificate, but, as I said, not sure.

If the cert' states Thai National would that have a bearing?

 

[lopburi3]

 

Just now, overherebc said:

I was thinking on the lines of the son having a Thai birth certificate, but, as I said, not sure.

If the cert' states Thai National would that have a bearing?

 

Yes if a Thai National but being born in Thailand does not make child Thai unless one of parents is Thai.  

[ubonjoe]

1 minute ago, overherebc said:

I was thinking on the lines of the son having a Thai birth certificate, but, as I said, not sure.

If the cert' states Thai National would that have a bearing?

 

Mother is Russian and Father is from Australia so the child is certainly not a Thai national.

There is no visa or extension that can be obtained for having a child born here that is not Thai. If they were old enough to go to school one for being their parent could obtained.

[sanemax]

4 minutes ago, overherebc said:

I was thinking on the lines of the son having a Thai birth certificate, but, as I said, not sure.

If the cert' states Thai National would that have a bearing?

 

The Birth Certificate would have "Not Thai citizen" written on it

[overherebc]

7 minutes ago, OZJAY said:

So does immigration expect that everyone who is in Thailand studying Thai for 3 years, must have saved enough money to see them through the entire 3 years?

 

No incoming funds are allowed from any investments or businesses that are either based in another country or any from of e-commerce business?

I was under the impression that ED visas now require proof of funds or income for the term of the visa.

Nothing to stop you having income  from Oz transferred to Thailand.

 

[sanemax]

3 minutes ago, ubonjoe said:

Mother is Russian and Father is from Australia so the child is certainly not a Thai national.

There is no visa or extension that can be obtained for having a child born here that is not Thai. If they were old enough to go to school one for being their parent could obtained.

Is there a Visa available for parents of non Thai ,Thai born  Thai school going children ?

 

[OZJAY]

2 minutes ago, overherebc said:

I was under the impression that ED visas now require proof of funds or income for the term of the visa.

Nothing to stop you having income  from Oz transferred to Thailand.

 

I have never been asked to prove funds or show proof of an income source for the previous 2 years of ED visa's.

 

I think the problem is that they can't get their head around the fact that some people can live in Thailand & study Thai whilst deriving an income from sources outside of Thailand.

 

And the fact that we are both farangs and have a child that was born here, threw them right off.

[OZJAY]

5 minutes ago, sanemax said:

Is there a Visa available for parents of non Thai ,Thai born  Thai school going children ?

 

I think ubonjoe answered this already - the answers is yes, once the child is going to school, but they only give the visa to one of the parents.. Not sure of the logic there or who came up with that idea lol

[ubonjoe]

2 minutes ago, sanemax said:

Is there a Visa available for parents of non Thai ,Thai born  Thai school going children ?

 

Yes

One parent of any foreign child on a extension stay for attending school can get a extension of stay. The parent must have 500k baht in a Thai bank for 30 days for the first extension and then 90 days after that.

Some embassies and consulates may issue a multiple entry non-o visa on the same basis.

[Tanoshi]

10 minutes ago, OZJAY said:

I think the problem is that they can't get their head around the fact that some people can live in Thailand & study Thai whilst deriving an income from sources outside of Thailand.

Whilst the income may be earned from sources outside Thailand, your work is conducted in Thailand.

[Suradit69]

9 minutes ago, OZJAY said:

 

I think the problem is that they can't get their head around the fact that some people can live in Thailand & study Thai whilst deriving an income from sources outside of Thailand.

Probably because so many people in the past obtained ED visas for reasons that have nothing to do with learning anything.

 

Generally if you find immigrations appearing to "crack down" on something, it's because they've found so many people abusing the rules and regulations ... not that they can't get their heads around something.

[sanemax]

10 minutes ago, OZJAY said:

I think ubonjoe answered this already - the answers is yes, once the child is going to school, but they only give the visa to one of the parents.. Not sure of the logic there or who came up with that idea lol

As UJ added , that visa is only available to parents whose child is here on a visa , I was asking about children here without a visa , stateless kids .

[overherebc]

6 minutes ago, sanemax said:

As UJ added , that visa is only available to parents whose child is here on a visa , I was asking about children here without a visa , stateless kids .

In this case surely the son will be either Australian or Russian? just born in Thailand.

[jenny2017]

 

 

I'm heavily tattooed including my neck, so I am sure I was initially singled out because of this. But why after speaking "almost" fluent Thai, was that not enough to satisfy the imm officers that I was indeed a student in Thailand?

 

   I also let him know, I live with my partner who is Russian, and we have an 18 month old baby who was born here in Thailand.

 

     They were not concerned about your Thai speaking skills. 

 

     

[OZJAY]

30 minutes ago, Tanoshi said:

Whilst the income may be earned from sources outside Thailand, your work is conducted in Thailand.

None of the work is conducted in Thailand, it's an Aussie website where Aussies buy products. The website was set-up in Australia, is hosted in Australia and is managed from Australia. 

 

[OZJAY]

12 minutes ago, jenny2017 said:

 

 

I'm heavily tattooed including my neck, so I am sure I was initially singled out because of this. But why after speaking "almost" fluent Thai, was that not enough to satisfy the imm officers that I was indeed a student in Thailand?

 

   I also let him know, I live with my partner who is Russian, and we have an 18 month old baby who was born here in Thailand.

 

     They were not concerned about your Thai speaking skills. 

 

     

My point exactly!

[Cletus]

Threads's title is misleading. You're on your 3rd ED visa and cannot show the source of the income that allows you to live in Thailand without working. The fact you can speak good thai is irrelevant in your case, they want to be sure you're not working illegally.

They let you in this time and I think you've been lucky.

The title should have been no more ED visa for me!

[FritsSikkink]

1 hour ago, overherebc said:

I was thinking on the lines of the son having a Thai birth certificate, but, as I said, not sure.

If the cert' states Thai National would that have a bearing?

 

the cert will not state Thai National as he isn't one.

[FritsSikkink]

34 minutes ago, OZJAY said:

None of the work is conducted in Thailand, it's an Aussie website where Aussies buy products. The website was set-up in Australia, is hosted in Australia and is managed from Australia. 

 

Doesn't matter, you work while you are living in Thailand. You officially need a work permit to do that and pay tax over your earnings while you are working in Thailand.

[OZJAY]

3 minutes ago, Cletus said:

Threads's title is misleading. You're on your 3rd ED visa and cannot show the source of the income that allows you to live in Thailand without working. The fact you can speak good thai is irrelevant in your case, they want to be sure you're not working illegally.

They let you in this time and I think you've been lucky.

The title should have been no more ED visa for me!

For the last 2 years I have never been asked to show proof of income, as I believe it's not a requirement if you are in Thailand on ED Visa/extension.

 

When I mentioned I have savings and also had an online business, they had the opportunity to ask for proof there and then, which they did not.

 

They couldn't use my lack of Thai language skills, the basis of why I am here in the first place, so in the end they had nothing!

 

I think it was a case of "many tattoo" = farang criminal, not the first time and won't be the last.

 

All things aside, we plan to stay in Thailand long term and will probably go the Thai company/work permit route in the near future.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

[Mattd]

25 minutes ago, FritsSikkink said:

Doesn't matter, you work while you are living in Thailand. You officially need a work permit to do that and pay tax over your earnings while you are working in Thailand.

This would depend, if, as the OP says "None of the work is conducted in Thailand, it's an Aussie website where Aussies buy products. The website was set-up in Australia, is hosted in Australia and is managed from Australia" and it truly is autonomous from the OP apart from him having a legal revenue from it, then no work permit would be required, I'm sure that may people stay in Thailand and have a business interest elsewhere that provides revenue without any need for them to participate in that business.

If the OP remits funds to a Thai bank from this revenue stream, then this may be subject to Thai tax, that would depend on when it was earned versus remitted.

Unfortunately the options long term for visas are very limited.

[Ned]

If you have an income, don't you have to pay tax somewhere?

[ChouDoufu]

looks more like your time may be up.  don't think anyone can argue that ED visas were intended for long-term stays....essentially endless...but for studying a year or two....unless you could show you were in a 4-year degree program.  you might could argue the regulation doesn't give a limit, but we don't make the determination.  immigration officer looks at a passport with three ED visas and decides that's long enough, that you're abusing the system, and feels it's time for you to apply for the appropriate visa.