Permanent Residency in Thailand: Worth It?

 

Some of you may already listen to the Bangkok Podcast, if not you should check it out

 

This week's episode is about applying for Permanent Residency and is well worth listening for anyone who is considering PR  in Thailand: https://www.bangkokpodcast.com/permanent-residency-in-thailand-worth-it-season-3-episode-25/

Very informative and confirms my decision not to do PR...

Horses for courses.

 

I got Thai PR more than 2 decades ago.

 

From the date of approval:

 

- I have never had to apply for any visa or extension etc.

- I have never done a border run, etc.

- I have never done 90 day reports.

 

Lots of time and money saved.

 

But for me the most important point is knowing that there is a 99.999% guarantee I will never be separated from my Thai family because of visa / changing visa regulations.

 

 

Benefits -  Your children born in Thailand can be granted Thai nationality.

 

Never heard this before, any comments?

Scorecard: Do you need to get re-entry stamp for travel outside Thailand? 

 

1 minute ago, scorecard said:

Benefits -  Your children born in Thailand can be granted Thai nationality.

 

Never heard this before, any comments?

If you married to a Thai then your kids get Thai nationality, regardless of visa status.

1 minute ago, kaufmanski said:

Scorecard: Do you need to get re-entry stamp for travel outside Thailand? 

 

Yes I do. I get a multi-entry stamp good for one year. 

When it's expired I wait until I need it then a week or so in advance of my flight I renew it multi entry for one year? 

7 minutes ago, kaufmanski said:

If you married to a Thai then your kids get Thai nationality, regardless of visa status.

Yes but that's a their natural birth right because one of their parents is a Thai citizen. I'm not understanding how this connects to PR.

 

In this circumstance the Thai nationality of one parent is the factor which automatically gives the child / children Thai nationality. It seems to me whether the other parent (non-Thai) is holding PR or not holding PR is irrelevant.

 

 

Edited September 12, 20187 yr by scorecard

7 minutes ago, scorecard said:

Benefits -  Your children born in Thailand can be granted Thai nationality.

 

Never heard this before, any comments?

If both parents of the child are not Thai but they hold PR when the child was born, that child will be granted Thai citizenship.

It was a good balanced discussion in my view but my position is exactly that of Scorecard.PR becomes very attractive when one becomes aware - for better or worse - that Thailand is likely to be a permanent home, and that "security of tenure" becomes very important.IN my case I loathe dealing with bureaucracy so that's another plus.

 

Interesting point made about success at PR a matter of box ticking while citizenship much more discretionary.Don't know about citizenship (which for reasons I can't fully explain to myself I would not apply for) but I don't think PR is simply box ticking.If they don't like the cut of your jib I wouldn't assume success just because you "qualify".Another thing is that Immigration will tell you at an early stage if you're not going to make it.

 

Unless I misheard it was stated that you needed a tabien baan to qualify.Don't think that's right.Once you have PR you must however be entered on a tabien baan.It was also stated that with PR you are on the same level as non PR people when applying for a work permit.The conventional wisdom is however that the process is less rigorous for those with PR.Others will know better than I about this.

I have been told by someone knowledgeable that you do not stand a chance of completing this process without paying over 300k baht in "special fees".

 

Has anyone here completed this process recently and able to comment on this?

13 minutes ago, jayboy said:

It was a good balanced discussion in my view but my position is exactly that of Scorecard.PR becomes very attractive when one becomes aware - for better or worse - that Thailand is likely to be a permanent home, and that "security of tenure" becomes very important.IN my case I loathe dealing with bureaucracy so that's another plus.

 

Interesting point made about success at PR a matter of box ticking while citizenship much more discretionary.Don't know about citizenship (which for reasons I can't fully explain to myself I would not apply for) but I don't think PR is simply box ticking.If they don't like the cut of your jib I wouldn't assume success just because you "qualify".Another thing is that Immigration will tell you at an early stage if you're not going to make it.

 

Unless I misheard it was stated that you needed a tabien baan to qualify.Don't think that's right.Once you have PR you must however be entered on a tabien baan.It was also stated that with PR you are on the same level as non PR people when applying for a work permit.The conventional wisdom is however that the process is less rigorous for those with PR.Others will know better than I about this.

 

- Agree: The PR application form / process is not difficult at all. Yes it's pretty much a check-list.

 

- Agree: Never before heard of having to be in a Tabien Baan book before you can apply for PR. I certainly wasn't and the Imm. officer (spoke excellent English), checked all the documents very carefully and no mention of needing any existing entry in a TB book.

 

Re: Work Permit. From my experience it's the same for PR holders and non PR holders. Where there is a difference is that after you get the WP, you don't need to use the WP to gain a one year visa - already have what is essentially a lifetime visa.

 

 

Edited September 12, 20187 yr by scorecard

13 minutes ago, timendres said:

I have been told by someone knowledgeable that you do not stand a chance of completing this process without paying over 300k baht in "special fees".

 

Has anyone here completed this process recently and able to comment on this?

No comment today.

 

Twenty years back (arguably overall more corruption than today) I offered no tea money and none was requested.

 

 

 

Edited September 12, 20187 yr by scorecard

5 minutes ago, scorecard said:

No comment today.

 

Twenty years back (arguably overall more corruption than today) I offered no tea money and none was requested.

 

 

 

Interesting on TM and you may well be right but my very experienced Thai lawyer told me recently that his impression was the opposite, ie less formerly than now.Like you I neither offered TM nor did I ever get even the slightest sense it was expected.

2 minutes ago, jayboy said:

Interesting on TM and you may well be right but my very experienced Thai lawyer told me recently that his impression was the opposite, ie less formerly than now.Like you I neither offered TM nor did I ever get even the slightest sense it was expected.

When did you complete the process?

I obtained PR about 17 years ago.

No further visas of any kind required unless travelling outside the country and wishing to return. A simple process to obtain the necessary re-entry stamp valid for 1 year which allows you to retain the PR upon return.

No bribes were required, or ever hinted at.

PR was granted at that time based on either of 2 qualifications...marriage to a Thai national, or for business reasons. The latter fixed fee being double the former...B198,000 at the time; and the latter required a WP by default.

The number of PRs granted per year was, and perhaps still is limited...100 rings a bell...

I think there was a period recently when the process was suspended, but is now resumed.

Applications were once per year in December...took about 13 months for the result.

Once PR is granted, if for business purposes, and if you later on stop working, then no other visa is required to stay in Thailand.

During the application process you needed to understand, either by reading, or by listening, some questions, and correctly select from multiple choice answers - in Thai language. You also had to explain by speaking in Thai language a few things about yourself, your background and situation...4 or 5 sentences, whilst being video recorded.

House Reg not required...didn't have one; wasn't on one.

 

Citizenship, and thus a Thai passport is a different affair altogether. Very few apply and are granted. I don't know the current requirements in terms of years required to have held a PR to qualify to apply for citizenship, but you do have to be absolutely fluent in understanding speaking Thai when grilled by a panel of 20 or so people. You are expected to have demonstrated  some charitable work for the country also.

51 minutes ago, kaufmanski said:

If you married to a Thai then your kids get Thai nationality, regardless of visa status.

Married where?  Thaland of farangland?

 

I don't think that a permanent resident has no more rights or privileges then I do with my Non :O: visa  on  retired.status.

18 minutes ago, jkcjag said:

I obtained PR about 17 years ago.

No further visas of any kind required unless travelling outside the country and wishing to return. A simple process to obtain the necessary re-entry stamp valid for 1 year which allows you to retain the PR upon return.

No bribes were required, or ever hinted at.

PR was granted at that time based on either of 2 qualifications...marriage to a Thai national, or for business reasons. The latter fixed fee being double the former...B198,000 at the time; and the latter required a WP by default.

The number of PRs granted per year was, and perhaps still is limited...100 rings a bell...

I think there was a period recently when the process was suspended, but is now resumed.

Applications were once per year in December...took about 13 months for the result.

Once PR is granted, if for business purposes, and if you later on stop working, then no other visa is required to stay in Thailand.

During the application process you needed to understand, either by reading, or by listening, some questions, and correctly select from multiple choice answers - in Thai language. You also had to explain by speaking in Thai language a few things about yourself, your background and situation...4 or 5 sentences, whilst being video recorded.

House Reg not required...didn't have one; wasn't on one.

 

Citizenship, and thus a Thai passport is a different affair altogether. Very few apply and are granted. I don't know the current requirements in terms of years required to have held a PR to qualify to apply for citizenship, but you do have to be absolutely fluent in understanding speaking Thai when grilled by a panel of 20 or so people. You are expected to have demonstrated  some charitable work for the country also.

A couple of additional notes:

If you are into buying property, then with PR your funds do not need to come from outside of Thailand.

For PR based on business reasons you need to show consecutive years of having paid income tax from your employment...used to be 2, I think it's more now maybe.

retirement visa is so easy and cheap. I cant see the point in risking a wad of cash to try for PR. I just got my thai girl NZ residency. Was about 70  000THB,  fairly straight forward and she can work here if she wants. If it was the same for me in Thailand I would have done it as I spent many hundreds of thousands of THB on visas and work permits over the 10 years I was there.

1 hour ago, scorecard said:

Yes I do. I get a multi-entry stamp good for one year. 

When it's expired I wait until I need it then a week or so in advance of my flight I renew it multi entry for one year? 

have PR,

must apply for permission to enter LoS before leaving

 

dont really see the point of having PR

 

1 minute ago, melvinmelvin said:

must apply for permission to enter LoS before leaving

It is not asking for permission. It is only a formality to keep PR valid when entering the country. 

PR is good since that is about the only thing you will ever have to do at immigration. The only other thing is when your residence book gets full.

8 minutes ago, melvinmelvin said:

have PR,

must apply for permission to enter LoS before leaving

 

dont really see the point of having PR

 

Not quite like that.

 

Holders of many types of visas and PR holders need to get an exit and re-entry authorization stamp in their passport (PR holders also need to get this stamp duplicated into their PR book). The standard process is to get this stamp a few days ahead of leaving or at least at the airport before you leave.

 

If you don't have this stamp then the current visa cancels when you exit.

 

In other words the exit/reentry stamp authorization means your current visa continues on your return. Getting this stamp into you passport etc., is a nuisance but not difficult.

 

Seems to me it's a valid point 'why do PR have to have this same process'? I don't know any answer to this point.

 

 

 

 

11 minutes ago, ubonjoe said:

It is not asking for permission. It is only a formality to keep PR valid when entering the country. 

PR is good since that is about the only thing you will ever have to do at immigration. The only other thing is when your residence book gets full.

Agree. In regard to residence book is full, the holder must go to an immigration office and request a new / replacement book.

 

There is no need for re-approval of PR status, just get a new book, very simple process, all the main details on the the first couple of pages of full book are written into the replacement book, all done. 

 

 

What if it is based on Benefit to the Kingdom of Thailand or Thai Government based on a certified letter from a Minister?

 

What are the qualifications and hoops? Are they the same as married or work related in Thailand, or are they totally different?

If not working in Thailand direct, do you have to show income or not? Or is the information of why you quality and the certified letter enough?

 

 

3 hours ago, scorecard said:

Benefits -  Your children born in Thailand can be granted Thai nationality.

 

Never heard this before, any comments?

This comment needs complementation; this is only the case if BOTH partners hold a PR status. Children from a mixed couple (Thai/Non-Thai) get Thai citizenship automatically, so it is of relevance only if both parents are non-Thai but both hold a PR status.  

56 minutes ago, holy cow cm said:

What if it is based on Benefit to the Kingdom of Thailand or Thai Government based on a certified letter from a Minister?

 

What are the qualifications and hoops? Are they the same as married or work related in Thailand, or are they totally different?

If not working in Thailand direct, do you have to show income or not? Or is the information of why you quality and the certified letter enough?

 

 

 

Benefits to the Kingdom of Thailand. Like what?

 

 

 

 

19 minutes ago, scorecard said:

 

Benefits to the Kingdom of Thailand. Like what?

 

 

 

 

Helping directly with Dept of Commerce helping export Thai products on the outside. Among many other various things.

I have had permanent residence twice. I lost it both times because I didn't return to the country within one year. I did not bother to  re-apply for it for the third time.  I really don't think it was worth the effort and cost. It's so easy to get a retirement visa. It usually only takes me 20 minutes. And the 90 day reporting is a non-issue. Nowadays you don't even have to fill in a form, anyone can do it for you and you can do online or post it. If you can afford the cost of PR then you could possibly afford the cost of an agent to do all your visas for you. There is one drawback with having a PR, and that is you have to file an income tax return. You have to pay tax unless you have a double taxation agreement with your source of income. Dealing with the tax Department can be more of a hassle than the Immigration Department! If you want to get Thai citizenship it is much easier having PR and if you don't.

8 hours ago, ubonjoe said:

It is not asking for permission. It is only a formality to keep PR valid when entering the country. 

PR is good since that is about the only thing you will ever have to do at immigration. The only other thing is when your residence book gets full.

 

I do not share your views on this.

 

I do not have PR but ext of stay (ret). When I renew this I normally do a multiple re-entry at the same time.

 

The papers that I have to do is a 2 page application with a moderate stack of supporting copies and a photo of myself

and I have to list when I plan to leave and come back to LoS.

And the stamp in my passport clearly says entry permit.

And this is no formality, nothing  I can demand, but I can apply.

 

To me, this is applying for permission to enter Thailand again.

 

If there had been a box on my ext-stay application that I could just tick in order to get re-entry permit, then OK formality.

 

If I had PR this scheme would have left a bad taste in my mouth, now I just feel uncomfortable.