THAI plans swift upgrade of fleet to reverse losses

[bluesofa]

4 hours ago, ukrules said:

Why not increase the prices to make more money?

Years ago I went to a beer bar where the prices were more expensive than neighbouring bars. I casually asked the owner why that was. The answer: "No ferangs, so need to charge more to make money."

 

[Wiggy]

4 minutes ago, BoganInParasite said:

A fleet upgrade is but one factor in a recovery. I've half a work lifetime in airlines and once flew Thai quite regularly. My top of the head recovery list would include:

• Fleet upgrade and rationalization (newer aircraft, less types)
• Half the board, the CEO and at least half the top execs to be experienced and foreign airline execs
• Reduced government ownership and removal of government participation in decision making
• Cut prices now (to chase volume)
• Drastic reduction in free VVIP/VIP tickets
• 25% staff numbers reduction
• Refresh on-board product and lounges (hard and soft elements)
• Retrain customer facing staff in providing genuine customer service
• Sell loss making subsidiaries

Or just sell it to Singapore Airlines.

You are pretty much spot on.

[Wildliferescue]

The solution is easy and right on this page. The ThaiVisa members have clearly shown they know all the answers to this problem of Thai Airways! I suggest we make the ThaiVisa bunch the new board of directors, problem solved. 

[Laza 45]

..it reminds me of a couple of guys from a country I won't mention.. they decided to start a home delivery service selling vegetables..  after a year they were loosing money.. Solution.. buy a bigger truck...

 

[Wiggy]

2 minutes ago, Wildliferescue said:

The solution is easy and right on this page. The ThaiVisa members have clearly shown they know all the answers to this problem of Thai Airways! I suggest we make the ThaiVisa bunch the new board of directors, problem solved. 

I honestly don't think we could do any worse. It often pays to listen to your customers.

[Darkside Gray]

5 hours ago, ukrules said:

Why not increase the prices to make more money?

if they did, they would price themselves out of the market.

[Bangkok Basha]

Thai International's prices are completely uncompetitive with other (better) carriers, including ANA and Singapore. Every time I try to give Thai a chance, their prices are often double those of other carriers in Economy class, and Business is even higher. Their service isn't bad, and their Economy Class service is highly ranked by Skytrax and other agencies, but their prices are out of hand. They don't need a bunch of new planes, but as someone pointed out, that's the only way the senior executives can line their pockets quickly before they lose their jobs to the next government-appointed management team. I'm sure their payroll is bloated with political appointees.

 

[worrab]

2 hours ago, BobbyL said:

They really are a bunch of clowns. They are still one of the most expensive airlines listed for a very second rate service.

 

They were as usual the most expensive to LHR when I booked recently and when we booked Japan for xmas they were more than ANA and Japan Airlines. 

Back you up on that. Booking for a visit to the UK next July and Thai are by far the most expensive. Decided for the first time to not fly direct due to even BA being expensive as well so flying Air India who are THB 14000 cheaper than Thai and THB 11000 cheaper than BA. Timings are okay for me as well so will be a new experience on another airline.

[Pilotman]

2 hours ago, falang1969 said:

BA uses ancient 18 year old 777's LHR-BKK and are always full and making money. Buying new planes is not the answer.... reduce your prices to compete.

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-G890A using Thailand Forum - Thaivisa mobile app
 

BA are hardly a role model of efficacy.  Leasing new aircraft is a big part of the answer.  Fuel costs are the biggest single cost for an airline and the new generation of aircraft and 'leased by the hour ' engines are more that 50% more fuel efficient .  You dont have to be an aviation guru to do the maths.  Thai needs to be in the private sector to have a future, but that is never going to happen.   

[Creasy]

If they decided tomorrow to order new planes. How long would it take to receive them ? Years ?

[aircooledflat4]

I’d like to use Thai as they’re a direct flight for me but since they can’t be arsed to park at a gate like a normal airline and just drop you on the tarmac and shuttlebus you to the gate..  and not even close to immigration where you’d expect to be dropped off... oh no.... that’s a bit much to ask.... still gotta walk half mile through the walkways just to rub it in.... bloody rude.. never again will I use their so called service.

[Eric Loh]

Singapore Airlines work on 2 simple strategies to be profitable and they have been profitable since founding in 1972. Yet SIA is also the lowest cost airline among its key competitor. Their differentiation is service and low costs. Service improvements through recruitment procedures, intensive training and of course a well-developed culture combined with continue innovation. Low cost maintained with new fleets, rigorous standardization, low maintenance costs, outsourcing and productivity. Of course they also have world class managers. A new fleet for Thai Airways without a complete overhaul of the structure and culture is a waste of time and money.  

[TheFishman1]

Few thoughts come to my mind Buy More Planes Someone Will Make A Lot Of Money and for the Thai that they are always the Best at everything lol TIT

[Laza 45]

They have 19 fuel guzzling 747s and 32 ....777s.. probably time to at least replace the 747s.. and save a lot on fuel ..

https://www.airfleets.net/ageflotte/Thai Airways.htm

[CockneyGit]

Maybe if they weren't almost double the price of most other airlines, more people would book?

Just a thought! ?

[Pilotman]

7 minutes ago, Eric Loh said:

Singapore Airlines work on 2 simple strategies to be profitable and they have been profitable since founding in 1972. Yet SIA is also the lowest cost airline among its key competitor. Their differentiation is service and low costs. Service improvements through recruitment procedures, intensive training and of course a well-developed culture combined with continue innovation. Low cost maintained with new fleets, rigorous standardization, low maintenance costs, outsourcing and productivity. Of course they also have world class managers. A new fleet for Thai Airways without a complete overhaul of the structure and culture is a waste of time and money.  

Agreed.  I worked for another Asian airline for a few years and they were the same.  

[Wiggy]

8 minutes ago, Laza 45 said:

They have 19 fuel guzzling 747s and 32 ....777s.. probably time to at least replace the 747s.. and save a lot on fuel ..

https://www.airfleets.net/ageflotte/Thai Airways.htm

Yes, and those 747s at 19+ years old are going to need a D-check every 6 years rather than 12 for newer aircraft. And that doesn't come cheap (several million dollars) and takes three to six weeks. Ouch.

 

Edited September 21, 2018 by Wiggy

[Pilotman]

9 minutes ago, Creasy said:

If they decided tomorrow to order new planes. How long would it take to receive them ? Years ?

Months, not years.  They dont need to buy, just lease and there are plenty around to lease. 

[Dazinoz]

4 minutes ago, aircooledflat4 said:

I’d like to use Thai as they’re a direct flight for me but since they can’t be arsed to park at a gate like a normal airline and just drop you on the tarmac and shuttlebus you to the gate..  and not even close to immigration where you’d expect to be dropped off... oh no.... that’s a bit much to ask.... still gotta walk half mile through the walkways just to rub it in.... bloody rude.. never again will I use their so called service.

A bit off topic but I can never understand why so many empty gates with air bridges and they do this. Took my baby son to Oz earlier this year. Had him in his stroller, a bag with his feeds, diapers, change of clothes,etc and also carrying a large pillow. Down the air bridge and was directed to a bus, down flights of stairs carrying all the stuff and no one helped down the stairs, in or out the bus and up the stairs into the plane. 

[Dibbler]

5 hours ago, webfact said:

Somkid says THAI needs a new business strategy that can turn around its business amid increased competition in the airline industry and that would require buying new planes to increase customer satisfaction. 

Why?  THAI is already rated the best economy product.  Such a strategy would put THAI much deeper in the red.  Sounds like a strategy to make the phuyai happy.  Refit existing aircraft with better seat configurations and improve service will improve the customer experience and help save costs.

 

 

[Orton Rd]

They need to cut staff and improve their customer service, as well as stop giving so many free flights to the well connected

[Pilotman]

Just now, Dazinoz said:

A bit off topic but I can never understand why so many empty gates with air bridges and they do this. Took my baby son to Oz earlier this year. Had him in his stroller, a bag with his feeds, diapers, change of clothes,etc and also carrying a large pillow. Down the air bridge and was directed to a bus, down flights of stairs carrying all the stuff and no one helped down the stairs, in or out the bus and up the stairs into the plane. 

The simple answer is that they don't care about the customer, just about their own needs and where they want to position the aircraft for their convenience.  Bangkok is the only airport I know where the major state airline in residence doesn't  get the pick of the best gates available and that says  it all.  They don't get them because they don't want them. 

[aircooledflat4]

4 minutes ago, Pilotman said:

They don't get them because they don't want them. 

You mean they don’t want to pay for them

[Pilotman]

3 minutes ago, Dibbler said:

Why?  THAI is already rated the best economy product.  Such a strategy would put THAI much deeper in the red.  Sounds like a strategy to make the phuyai happy.  Refit existing aircraft with better seat configurations and improve service will improve the customer experience and help save costs.

 

 

sorry, but it will not.  Its all about fuel efficiency and  yield management.  Economy flies on the back of business class, always been that way.  No good putting new seats and having a better service if your aircraft is guzzling fuel.  If low cost airlines have shown anything, its that these rules till apply. Sod the seats and the service, just fill up a  fuel efficient aircraft, actively yield manage your seat costs  and you make money.   Norwegian are now proving that  fact on longer haul flights. 

[Naamblar2014]

Reduce fares, more bottoms in seats.  Just had one of those adds in my browser.  Jetstar to Darwin Australia.  One way 5090 baht.  Thai probably 15000-18000.

[Dibbler]

57 minutes ago, BoganInParasite said:

A fleet upgrade is but one factor in a recovery. I've half a work lifetime in airlines and once flew Thai quite regularly. My top of the head recovery list would include:

• Fleet upgrade and rationalization (newer aircraft, less types)
• Half the board, the CEO and at least half the top execs to be experienced and foreign airline execs
• Reduced government ownership and removal of government participation in decision making
• Cut prices now (to chase volume)
• Drastic reduction in free VVIP/VIP tickets
• 25% staff numbers reduction
• Refresh on-board product and lounges (hard and soft elements)
• Retrain customer facing staff in providing genuine customer service
• Sell loss making subsidiaries

Or just sell it to Singapore Airlines.

They could also improve the FF program, reduce miles needed for upgrade and flight awards, and make it easier to get to Star Alliance Gold.  Currently with Royal Orchid Plus it takes 50K miles in one year to get Gold for only one year then you have to requalify.  With Asiana you only need 40K miles accumulated in 2 years and you get an additional 2 years at Gold status.  

[Eric Loh]

8 minutes ago, Pilotman said:

Agreed.  I worked for another Asian airline for a few years and they were the same.  

Especially the South East Asia airlines like MAS or Garuda. Same problems like TA. I was quite surprised that Cathy which has been a stellar profitable airline had a loss last year. Tough industry especially with the increase in budget airlines. Even they are not spared in terms of profitability like AA and Nok. The increase in fuel costs will further erode their bottom line.  

[scorecard]

44 minutes ago, Bangkok Basha said:

Thai International's prices are completely uncompetitive with other (better) carriers, including ANA and Singapore. Every time I try to give Thai a chance, their prices are often double those of other carriers in Economy class, and Business is even higher. Their service isn't bad, and their Economy Class service is highly ranked by Skytrax and other agencies, but their prices are out of hand. They don't need a bunch of new planes, but as someone pointed out, that's the only way the senior executives can line their pockets quickly before they lose their jobs to the next government-appointed management team. I'm sure their payroll is bloated with political appointees.

 

Bangkok to Ho Chi Minh City in Vietnam a good example of fares:

 

- At times, one way on a budget carrier - as low as 2,000Baht including luggage.

 

- At times on Thai inter, one way, including luggage, as much as 25,000Baht. 

 

 

[lanista]

And how many times has  K. Somkid flown free with THAI ?

Hundreds of current and retired  airforce brass, government officials and influencial families travel free in 1st class and other premium classes.Many get multiple freebies annually.

Economy class is very expensive because it has to subsidize those crooks sitting up front.

 

20 years ago there was a job advertised  in the Bangkok Post  for a senior position at THAI.

One of the requirements was you must divulge your criminal history.

Its OK to kill someone as long as you're honest about it.

 

TIT.

[scorecard]

26 minutes ago, Dazinoz said:

A bit off topic but I can never understand why so many empty gates with air bridges and they do this. Took my baby son to Oz earlier this year. Had him in his stroller, a bag with his feeds, diapers, change of clothes,etc and also carrying a large pillow. Down the air bridge and was directed to a bus, down flights of stairs carrying all the stuff and no one helped down the stairs, in or out the bus and up the stairs into the plane. 

 

Welcome to Thai cabin crew / ground crew arrogance.