ขอรับ

[nakriian]

For male speakers, we use ครับ as a polite particle at the end of our setences. When we are speaking to friends, we can use คับ for short. However, is there any modern place for ขอรับ

I was told it was from the past and that it was used by servants when addressing their masters. Can someone enlighten me on ขอรับ

[loong]

Well I imagine that it can be used by either gender at the beginning of a statement as "Would like" maybe in a posh restaurant.

I have heard it used at the end of a sentence by Thai males, but it seems to be in a joking way. Also heard, or so it seems by those who like to overpronounce and roll the RRRRR.

Is this where Khrup originated from?

[meadish_sweetball]

Can someone enlighten me on ขอรับ

I usually don't get around much in high society so I only hear it used jokingly or in TV series depicting life back in the day. Not sure to what extent it would is used among the upper class or in more formal situations.

[Rikker]

<--- Back from the dead

I understand that ครับ comes from ขอรับ. So I think using it in a modern context sounds archaic/overformal, hence the comedic effect that Loong and Meadish mentioned. Not sure where it is used in a modern context non-ironically.

I haven't read up on these things, but I also think ค่ะ must come from some form of the word ข้า (slave/servant), as used in former times at the end of sentences as part of เจ้าข้า or พระเจ้าข้า (comparably to 'my lord' in English), and still seen in the modern words ข้าพเจ้า (from ข้าพระเจ้า, literally something like '(my) lord's servant') and ข้าราชการ (civil servant).

Then there's the uber-formal particle พะยะค่ะ used by either gender when speaking with (some levels of?) royalty.. I went to see the new movie about King Naresuan last week and heard that one quite a bit. I wonder exactly where it comes from, though I imagine the ค่ะ part still comes from ข้า...

Edited February 13, 2007 by Rikker

[katana]

...Then there's the uber-formal particle พะยะค่ะ used by either gender when speaking with (some levels of?) royalty.. I went to see the new movie about King Naresuan last week and heard that one quite a bit...

Hi Rikker,

Sethaputra states that พะย่ะค่ะ is a male-only particle (and เพคะ female).

Are you sure about that?

[Rikker]

I'd trust Sethaputra, then.

[mike_l]

For male speakers, we use ครับ as a polite particle at the end of our setences. When we are speaking to friends, we can use คับ for short. However, is there any modern place for ขอรับ

I was told it was from the past and that it was used by servants when addressing their masters. Can someone enlighten me on ขอรับ

As far as I know, in essence it comes from a contraction of the particle ข้าพระพุทธเจ้าขอรับใส่เกล้าใส่กระหม่อม, used when speaking to the highest levels of royalty. You can break that down as ข้าพระพุทธเจ้า, "I, the servant of Your Majesty", ขอรับ "ask to receive (your royal service/job)", ใส่เกล้าใส่กระหม่อม "at a revered level above my head". A marginally less formal variation used with less high ranking members of royalty is the particle (ข้าพระพุทธเจ้า) ขอรับกระผม, with basically the same meaning although without เกล้า and กระหม่อม is sounds a little less formal. With further shortening of ขอรับกระผม as the relative status of the person you're talking to, you get the ขอรับ/ครับผม/ครับ as particles.

กระผม/ผม as male personal pronouns come from a contraction of using เกล้ากระหม่อม as "I" when speaking to royalty, เกล้ากระหม่อม > กระหม่อม > กระผม > ผม. There's a similar thing for the female ฉัน too, with เกล้ากระหม่อมฉัน > หม่อมฉัน > ฉัน.

As for modern day usage of ขอรับ, I've only heard it used in an overly-polite/sarcastic way too.

I haven't read up on these things, but I also think ค่ะ must come from some form of the word ข้า (slave/servant), as used in former times at the end of sentences as part of เจ้าข้า or พระเจ้าข้า (comparably to 'my lord' in English), and still seen in the modern words ข้าพเจ้า (from ข้าพระเจ้า, literally something like '(my) lord's servant') and ข้าราชการ (civil servant).

I agree, I think in the long run it's a derivation from the archaic particle พระพุทธเจ้าข้าขอรับ to พระพุทธเจ้าข้า > เจ้าข้า > เจ้าค่ะ > ค่ะ.

[meadish_sweetball]

In Laos, the North and North East เจ้าข้า > เจ้า (in the North an exclusively female particle, but in Lao, used by both men and women).

[tonchan]

กระผม/ผม as male personal pronouns come from a contraction of using เกล้ากระหม่อม as "I" when speaking to royalty, เกล้ากระหม่อม > กระหม่อม > กระผม > ผม. There's a similar thing for the female ฉัน too, with เกล้ากระหม่อมฉัน > หม่อมฉัน > ฉัน.

As for modern day usage of ขอรับ, I've only heard it used in an overly-polite/sarcastic way too.

From my little research with some dictionaries, it looks like กระผม is not the result of contraction of กระหม่อม. And those words have different origin.

กระหม่อม comes from ขม่อม, this word means "head"(modern day only used as anatomical word). So this "กระ" comes from "ข". เกล้ากระหม่อม is only used to special loyalties who have the name of กรม. and กระหม่อม is used for other royalities who don't have. Sometime กระหม่อม is used as the constraction of ขอรับกระหม่อม.

In the mean time, กระผม is กระ+ ผม. I'm not sure the meaning of this กระ. But im sure that it's not the one which was transformed from other letters. Maybe it has some function to make its sound more beautiful. เกล้ากระผม is used for the Executive or high-ranking officer, and กระผม is used for showing more politeness than ผม.

I think the process of changing is like this.

เกล้า + ผม > เกล้าผม > เกล้ากระผม > กระผม

ขหม่อม > กระหม่อม > เกล้ากระหม่อม

It's nothing more than guesswork, but i like to think the origin of each word.