1 hour ago, Esso49 said:

I'll give you a clue - The country that first developed concentration camps

Ah..you are Spanish?

 

Whilst concentration camps are not a new phenomenon...the fact is the term came to Western attention when used by General Valeriano Weyler in 1896 during the Cuban Insurrection.

 

Closely followed by the British (Boer War) and the Americans (Philippine Insurrection) followed by the Germans..in the Herero War.

All in the space of 10 years.

1 hour ago, Chopperboy said:

The Official Red Cross figures of 271k were correlated with the death certificates meticulously issued by the Germans for each death and subsequently seized by the Russians.

 

Incidentally the figure also closely matches the energy budget (coke deliveries) required to cremate that number of bodies at 30-40Kg per body + coke for heating and cooking. 

Your claim that the Red Cross gave that figure as an official number of those murdered is not true. 

 

Read and learn. 

 

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Criticism_of_Holocaust_denial#International_Committee_of_the_Red_Cross

 

 

Edited October 6, 20187 yr by Bluespunk

1 hour ago, Chopperboy said:

The allies deliberately bombed the supply railway lines thus creating situation where they had no food supplies and were starving.

 

My father was at the liberation of Bruckenwold and the scenes of starvation were so horrific he could hardly speak about it till he died in his 90's. They were so weakened that one decent meal could kill them.

And such a subject should not be taken lightly irrespective of victimsms race, religion or colour  but to put things into perspective, and apologies for going off topic, the picture below was taken in 1899 at Bloemfontain concentration camp. That is as horrific as those refered to by yourself after the liberation in 1945, a mere 46 years apart. Nothing ever is learned from history other than history will indeed repeat itself.

 

7 minutes ago, Esso49 said:

And such a subject should not be taken lightly irrespective of victimsms race, religion or colour  but to put things into perspective, and apologies for going off topic, the picture below was taken in 1899 at Bloemfontain concentration camp. That is as horrific as those refered to by yourself after the liberation in 1945, a mere 46 years apart. Nothing ever is learned from history other than history will indeed repeat itself.

 

It needs to be pointed out that the girl above suffered and died from typhoid and the photo was used for propaganda purposes and it wasnt a typical photo .

   From the same camp V

 

3 minutes ago, sanemax said:

It needs to be pointed out that the girl above suffered and died from typhoid and the photo was used for propaganda purposes and it wasnt a typical photo .

   From the same camp V

 

She was in a concentration camp for goodness sake. malnourishment was typical. she died from hunger . Stop trying to justify the death of children in these circumstances was anything other than inhuman treatment. Same as suffered by the Jews.

 

Extract for documents are  "Emily Hobhouse tells the story of the young Lizzie van Zyl who died in the Bloemfontein concentration camp: She was a frail, weak little child in desperate need of good care. Yet, because her mother was one of the "undesirables" due to the fact that her father neither surrendered nor betrayed his people, Lizzie was placed on the lowest rations and so perished with hunger that, after a month in the camp, she was transferred to the new small hospital. Here she was treated harshly. The English disposed doctor and his nurses did not understand her language and, as she could not speak English, labeled her an idiot although she was mentally fit and normal. One day she dejectedly started calling for her mother, when a Mrs Botha walked over to her to console her. She was just telling the child that she would soon see her mother again, when she was brusquely interrupted by one of the nurses who told her not to interfere with the child as she was a nuisance. Quote from Stemme uit die Verlede ("Voices from the Past") - a collection of sworn statements by women who were detained in the concentration camps during the Second Boer War (1899-1902). Image source

3 minutes ago, Bluespunk said:

Your Red Cross figure is not true. 

 

Read and learn. 

 

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Criticism_of_Holocaust_denial#International_Committee_of_the_Red_Cross

 

 

Of course not!

 

But this sort of thing relies on the regurgitators knowing little or nothing about history.

 

Then,when the regurgitators spout off about Irving or Buchanan..etc and are questioned they fall back on the increasingly popular meme of"We are being persecuted for expressing our opinion!"

 

Curiously enough,they learned this tactic from the American Christian right which spends most of the time (fallaciously) claiming that they are being persecuted whilst raking in the millions.

2 minutes ago, Esso49 said:

She was in a concentration camp for goodness sake. malnourishment was typical. she died from hunger . Stop trying to justify the death of children in these circumstances was anything other than inhuman treatment. Same as suffered by the Jews.

 

Extract for documents are  "Emily Hobhouse tells the story of the young Lizzie van Zyl who died in the Bloemfontein concentration camp: She was a frail, weak little child in desperate need of good care. Yet, because her mother was one of the "undesirables" due to the fact that her father neither surrendered nor betrayed his people, Lizzie was placed on the lowest rations and so perished with hunger that, after a month in the camp, she was transferred to the new small hospital. Here she was treated harshly. The English disposed doctor and his nurses did not understand her language and, as she could not speak English, labeled her an idiot although she was mentally fit and normal. One day she dejectedly started calling for her mother, when a Mrs Botha walked over to her to console her. She was just telling the child that she would soon see her mother again, when she was brusquely interrupted by one of the nurses who told her not to interfere with the child as she was a nuisance. Quote from Stemme uit die Verlede ("Voices from the Past") - a collection of sworn statements by women who were detained in the concentration camps during the Second Boer War (1899-1902). Image source

Off- topic, needs to be removed

Just a pic of a tiran from the past and so many get agitated. A fact is and will always be, it will continue. Nowadays so called leaders, in any form, may it be your boss or company, are doing war. there are so many more power and money lusted people, there are about millions of hitlers. I do believe there are groups going for world domination.

Mostly they are super rich. They dont start wars like in old times, but just pinching everywhere. Why aids, ebola started in Africa, H1N1 in Asia? 

Their pics are also everywhere, only you dont know yet. Or some you know but you dont care. Like a Castro, Mao, Lenin,Stalin, Spanish kings, UK kings, France, German, Japanese Russian emperors, Korean, Menyamar, Egyptian, Syrian and even religious organizations, like the catholic church> Hitler just become more famous than all the other ones. (sarcastic meant) 

Would it be ok , if the pic was replaced by a pic of the pope? A "christian" who leads a company, burning, torturing people and now in modern time with his gang raping young children?!!

Every now and then, a complete disturbed human is rising and try to take total control. Now you have a man in the US saying "America first" ... meaning every one else can die. If you are in the elite of rich Americans, he meant so, not the other Americans, whatever American means. 

It is in mankind and will NEVER go. Unless......"we are the borg, we will assimilate you, resistance is futile" I love that sentence from the movie, a possibility for a new race in future, no more mankind, just one collective mind and others to obey to go beyond, explore and conquer the universe. 

 

"Just one collective mind and others to obey.."

 

Yup..tomorrow belongs to me..but it begs the question-why would choose to unleash the collective human mind on the rest of the universe?

29 minutes ago, Esso49 said:

And such a subject should not be taken lightly irrespective of victimsms race, religion or colour  but to put things into perspective, and apologies for going off topic, the picture below was taken in 1899 at Bloemfontain concentration camp. That is as horrific as those refered to by yourself after the liberation in 1945, a mere 46 years apart. Nothing ever is learned from history other than history will indeed repeat itself.

 

"The Hitler" isnt around anymore, he is replaced by many hitlers around now.

13 hours ago, Bluespunk said:

It matters when people try to minimise what happened. 

 

Have to wonder at their reasons for doing so. 

 

The Holocaust deniers and those who would try to deny the extent of what happened must be challenged. 

 

To debate about 4 or 6 Million is no denying, it is healthy discussion. NOBODY knows the real numbers and if it is accuracy you are looking for then we need to stop giving the extremists on both sides any attention. And to be clear ... Calling somebody a denier because they question the numbers is being an extremist.  

 

As if it was only 4 million is would somehow be less a horrific event. And to be clear, it is insulting that some people think this is the worst think that came from the war when in fact 50 to 80 Million people lost their lives in the war (3% of the world population).  So, while 6 Million Jews died from persecution, lets not forget about the other 70-Million people whose lives also mattered.

1 minute ago, JohnThailandJohn said:

 

To debate about 4 or 6 Million is no denying, it is healthy discussion. NOBODY knows the real numbers and if it is accuracy you are looking for then we need to stop giving the extremists on both sides any attention. And to be clear ... Calling somebody a denier because they question the numbers is being an extremist.  

 

As if it was only 4 million is would somehow be less a horrific event. And to be clear, it is insulting that some people think this is the worst think that came from the war when in fact 50 to 80 Million people lost their lives in the war (3% of the world population).  So, while 6 Million Jews died from persecution, lets not forget about the other 70-Million people whose lives also mattered.

Did I call someone a Holocaust denier? If so that was in error. Which post was it?

 

I have taken issue with those attempting to undermine the truth of the Holocaust. 

 

No doubt there. 

 

Such views must be contradicted. 

9 minutes ago, Bluespunk said:

Did I call someone a Holocaust denier? If so that was in error. Which post was it?

 

I have taken issue with those attempting to undermine the truth of the Holocaust. 

 

No doubt there. 

 

Such views must be contradicted. 

 

It just seems you are a bit obsessed with the Jews that died when in fact others were targeted for extermination including in particular the disabled, ethnic Poles and other Slavs, Soviet citizens, Soviet prisoners of war, political opponents, gay men and Jehovah's Witnesses, resulting in up to 17 million deaths overall of the 50 to 80 Million totals who died as a result of the war.

10 minutes ago, JohnThailandJohn said:

As if it was only 4 million is would somehow be less a horrific event. And to be clear, it is insulting that some people think this is the worst think that came from the war when in fact 50 to 80 Million people lost their lives in the war (3% of the world population).  So, while 6 Million Jews died from persecution, lets not forget about the other 70-Million people whose lives also mattered.

Although many other people did indeed die during the course of  the war , what sets the Jewish deaths apart is that it was one group of people systematically trying to make another group of people extinct by killing them all .

  It wasnt about territory or Politics , it was about complete annihilation of one group of people

Just now, JohnThailandJohn said:

 

It just seems you are a bit obsessed with the Jews that died when in fact others were targeted for extermination including in particular the disabled, ethnic Poles and other Slavs, Soviet citizens, Soviet prisoners of war, political opponents, gay men and Jehovah's Witnesses, resulting in up to 17 million deaths overall of the 50 to 80 Million totals who died as a result of the war.

I’m not obsessed with anything and if you bother to read the thread I do mention the non Jewish millions murdered by the nazis during ww2. 

 

Most of my posts have been aimed at those attempting to minimise the extent of Jewish deaths during the Holocaust. 

 

If someone attempts to spread myths about the deaths of any other victims of the nazi genocidal behaviour I will of course counter such “views”. 

 

Any closer to finding that post where where I called someone a Holocaust denier?

 
Why should they care about the history of Europe?

Here is a hint: Mr. Hitler was especially active during WORLD War 2!
Rings a bell, no!?

Sent from my RNE-L22 using Thailand Forum - Thaivisa mobile app

19 minutes ago, DM07 said:

Here is a hint: Mr. Hitler was especially active during WORLD War 2!
Rings a bell, no!?

Sent from my RNE-L22 using Thailand Forum - Thaivisa mobile app
 

 

Do you think they've ever heard of it?

HITLER and his nazis did not only kill 6 millions of jews, but also 20 millions russians, millions of polish, millions of french, and of course scores of english and americans, and for dessert, yes, also 8 million germans, and the cherry on the very top - 2 million german woman aged between 8 and 80 years old were raped by angry russian soldjers when they finally took over germany.

some thai people see that war as something that happaned only to farang and by farang.

hope they won't have to learn the hard way what khun hitler really means.

A post using ALL CAPS has been removed.

 

Some off topic posts and the replies have been removed. 

 

 

Well, considering that almost the whole world was against him (them), he/they did pretty good.

On 10/5/2018 at 4:54 AM, RandolphGB said:

Hitler was a monster who started a war that killed millions of people

 

How do you know this?  The Americans was very eager to get inteligent people from Germany to their country for the development and manufactoring of the A-bomb. What did they do with this? How many people got killed by these bombs?

35 minutes ago, Vacuum said:

 

How do you know this?  The Americans was very eager to get inteligent people from Germany to their country for the development and manufactoring of the A-bomb. What did they do with this? How many people got killed by these bombs?

Which actually saved a lot of allied lives. Those who perished via the bomb did so because of the  unprovoked aggression by their rulers on others..

6 minutes ago, transam said:

Which actually saved a lot of allied lives.

 

And their lives would be worth more than innocent citizens (old ladies, old men, children)?

4 minutes ago, Vacuum said:

 

And their lives would be worth more than innocent citizens (old ladies, old men, children)?

If Hitler had one more year what do you think would have been up front of V2 rockets that were falling on London..?

7 minutes ago, transam said:

If Hitler had one more year what do you think would have been up front of V2 rockets that were falling on London..?

 

Not sure, but, I think having Germans as neighbours instead of you know what would be better.

4 hours ago, Vacuum said:

 

Do you think they've ever heard of it?

You asked, why they should care!

And I answered that one!

Its rather certain if Hitler had won Citizens of other Nations would have to remain there.Unless needed.


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On 10/5/2018 at 11:54 AM, Vacuum said:

 

As always, the history is written by the 'winners'.

Am I misunderstanding what you said or are you an Nazi sympathizer?

2 hours ago, Vacuum said:

 

Not sure, but, I think having Germans as neighbours instead of you know what would be better.

Instead of "you know what"?

 

I don't.

 

Please elaborate.

Personally I don't give a toss about all the outrage every time an 'incident' like this occurs? What are we going to do- remove his image from every history books as well?

 

Bad taste- yes. Worth getting in a froth about- no.

 

Why should the Thai Gov't stop it? it's none of their business.

Edited October 7, 20187 yr by Psimbo