Pompeo says U.S. trying to convince China 'to behave like a normal nation'

[pedro01]

So China should start bombing the Middle East?

[Morch]

10 minutes ago, pedro01 said:

So China should start bombing the Middle East?

 

There isn't a single country "bombing the Middle East". Other than in nonsense posts, that is. Some countries are bombing in other countries in the Middle East, yes. The Middle East in its entirety? No. 

[farcanell]

Chinas probably still annoyed that’s it’s not getting any royalties from gunpowder and silk tech, stolen from them by the west.

[spidermike007]

1 hour ago, Brunolem said:

On top of that, American companies were never forced to move their production to China.

It is their greedy shortsighted CEOs who considered that the deal (your know how against our slave workers) was good for them!

And by the way, most of these companies are still not complaining...it is the US government that is complaining against a deficit created by American companies, not by China!

 

But Trump doesn't understand that, on the contrary!

He imposes sanctions on multiple imports from China, while carefully avoiding to include Apple, one of the worst offenders!!!

Not only Apple produces in China, but it also carefully avoids to pay billions in taxes by stashing its profits in tax havens!

 

Finally, Trump and his henchmen have probably never heard of the concept of (not) losing face, which is fundamental in Chinese culture.

If he wants something from them, it has to look like they offered it, and certainly not that he got it by force and humiliation.

 

There is very little Trump understands about negotiations. He is a failure on so many levels. If it were not for his willingness to cripple small contractors, and steal money from investors, in addition to teaming up with Russian mobsters, he would not have seen much success in his life. To expect this crude, gruff, no class neophyte crime boss to negotiate a reasonable deal with China is beyond my imagination. 

 

 

[the guest]

7 hours ago, webfact said:

normal nation on commerce

 

Yes that's ripe from a country (USA) that does exactly the opposite. Its like the kettle calling the pot black, hypocrites !

[spidermike007]

1 hour ago, Morch said:

 

China's ways predate Trump's involvement in politics by many years. And it's not as if China's leadership is all that great either. Ask Winnie-the-Pooh.

 

Of course. China is a masterful at the game they play. That is part of the point here. Their intense level of skill is contrasted by Trump's intense level of naivety, surliness, hatred, and nastiness, and his intense lack of diplomacy, negotiating skill, vision, leadership, respect for other people or nations, character, or respect for our allies. 

 

Trump vs. Xi? Trump would go down in the first minute, of the first round. Same with Kim and same with Putin. So far, all of them have outplayed Trump, and made him look like the fool he is. He is an empty suit. All bluster. No substance. 

Edited November 1, 2018 by spidermike007

[poanoi]

6 hours ago, bristolboy said:

After the war the US got offered German rocket scientists the opportunity to work in the USA and with it the chance for some of them to escape war crimes prosecution. That may have been immoral, but it's hardly theft.

it may be immoral for chinese state to pay us citizens for classified info,

but its hardly theft

[bristolboy]

9 minutes ago, poanoi said:

it may be immoral for chinese state to pay us citizens for classified info,

but its hardly theft

But Chinese is paying thieves. So, at the least it's a party to the theft.

And much more probably it's organizing the thefts  as well. Whereas the US was occupying a conquered and occupied nation that had waged a war of aggression. Where's the thievery? Germany had no right to its military secrets.

Edited November 1, 2018 by bristolboy

[Morch]

28 minutes ago, spidermike007 said:

 

Of course. China is a masterful at the game they play. That is part of the point here. Their intense level of skill is contrasted by Trump's intense level of naivety, surliness, hatred, and nastiness, and his intense lack of diplomacy, negotiating skill, vision, leadership, respect for other people or nations, character, or respect for our allies. 

 

Trump vs. Xi? Trump would go down in the first minute, of the first round. Same with Kim and same with Putin. So far, all of them have outplayed Trump, and made him look like the fool he is. He is an empty suit. All bluster. No substance. 

 

Guess the context in which the post was made is totally lost on you. Seems like ranting is the only mode you're familiar with.

 

The post I replied to asserted China might reply it will change it's ways when the US changes it's president. The point made was that China's ways have nothing much to do with Trump.

[Brunolem]

33 minutes ago, spidermike007 said:

 

all of them have outplayed Trump, and made him look like the fool he is. He is an empty suit. All bluster. No substance. 

Actually, the suit is pretty much full...with all these burgers!

 

The problem is more that his brain appears to be located right under his tongue, with no selection process between his emotions and his talking.

 

In that respect, he is not alone these days anyway...

[poanoi]

19 minutes ago, bristolboy said:

But Chinese is paying thieves. So, at the least it's a party to the theft.

And much more probably it's organizing the thefts  as well. Whereas the US was occupying a conquered and occupied nation that had waged a war of aggression. Where's the thievery? Germany had no right to its military secrets.

winners rightful loot of the battlefield ?

why would us have 'rights' to secrets then ?

[bristolboy]

3 minutes ago, poanoi said:

winners rightful loot of the battlefield ?

why would us have 'rights' to secrets then ?

 Not about looting a battlefield. It's about occupying a nation defeated in war. War has some genuinely harsh consequences for the losers. You would have some kind of point in the case where the victor is the aggressor. Do you think that was case in WW2? Was Germany a victim of US aggression? Are you pining for something?

[poanoi]

1 hour ago, bristolboy said:

 Not about looting a battlefield. It's about occupying a nation defeated in war. War has some genuinely harsh consequences for the losers. You would have some kind of point in the case where the victor is the aggressor. Do you think that was case in WW2? Was Germany a victim of US aggression? Are you pining for something?

course its loot, been done as far back as the great genghis khan and undoubtedly before that, bringing back weapons smiths and siege engines builders etc

[wayned]

China is waiting for Trump to be a normal president before they will act like a "normal" nation.  it'll never happen.

[bristolboy]

12 minutes ago, poanoi said:

course its loot, been done as far back as the great genghis khan and undoubtedly before that, bringing back weapons smiths and siege engines builders etc

You can call it loot if you like. But international law wouldn't. Whereas taking from private citizens or state cultural treasures would be. But as a lawful occupying power of Germany, the USA did not commit theft.

And once again, you try to liken US actions against germany, the aggressor nation, to the conduct of aggressor nations. Not only are your tactics tranparent, but you keep on repeating them.

[Becker]

9 hours ago, smedly said:

hmmm, the world (as I predicted) is posturing for something big, I said on here several years ago that China and Russia would have a coming together and was laughed at....

Well, to be fair you were also a staunch junta supporter who predicted they would fix Thailand so your record isn't exactly stellar.

[smedly]

54 minutes ago, Becker said:

Well, to be fair you were also a staunch junta supporter who predicted they would fix Thailand so your record isn't exactly stellar.

wrong, I wasn't a junta basher and was willing to give them a chance - there is a massive difference, and their results are mixed I would have hoped for a lot more but they definitely were not as bad as the previous crew 

Edited November 1, 2018 by smedly

[Brunolem]

1 hour ago, poanoi said:

course its loot, been done as far back as the great genghis khan and undoubtedly before that, bringing back weapons smiths and siege engines builders etc

What really mattered was to get Wernher Von Braun who was the genius, and the latter willingly chose to defect and surrender to the Americans.

 

One couldn't call this looting...no more than Andrei Sakharov chosing to defect to the US.

 

Looting is what the Irakis did after invading Kuwait...

 

[Aj Mick]

16 hours ago, Damrongsak said:

Well, there was a war.  And the Germans were responsible for killing somewhere on the order of 6-17 million people. 

With the help of technology provided by Henry Ford. War is definitely good for business.

[Johnnyngai]

21 hours ago, spidermike007 said:

It is the way the Chinese government does business. Boeing signed a contract with them years ago, that turns over most of their technology to the Chinese within a specific period of time. It was do that, or not get the huge contract. You cannot just lecture a nation, and expect it to change. This coming from a nation led by one of the biggest goons of the past century. China is bending alot of rules. But, is this how you get them to change? Is this how you negotiate with them? Let us never forget. Trump is not much of a negotiator. He negotiated five companies out of business. He left behind billions of dollars in debt. Who paid for that debt? Not him. When it really comes down to it, Trump cannot negotiate his way out of a paper bag.

The various vendors in HCMC charged me three times as much as the locals.  

The vendors in Thailand only charge me 20 - 30% more.  

I went to HCMC for the first and last time.  

All western companies should leave China and start doing more business in Africa.    

[Johnnyngai]

21 hours ago, PremiumLane said:

So China can instigate coups in other countries, influence elections and media in other countries, start illegal wars, push economic policies that cripple countries, sell off other countries assets to US corporations etc. etc. etc.?

 

That is the normal behavior of the USA 

The mighty USA wants to have a monopoly in the above behavior.  

Push the cavemen back into their caves with the mighty USA made bulldozer.          

Edited November 2, 2018 by Johnnyngai

[Srikcir]

On 11/1/2018 at 5:43 AM, webfact said:

Pompeo says U.S. trying to convince China 'to behave like a normal nation'

In his maiden speech at the United Nations General Assembly in September 2017 - Trump said "as the leaders of your countries, will always and should always put your countries first" :

• every nation stands alone,
• cooperation is purely transactional
• alliances are held together by self-interest rather than shared values

https://www.vox.com/world/2017/9/19/16332770/trump-unga-speech-north-korea-iran

Given Trump's criteria for a sovereign nation's behavior, how can there be a "normal nation" behavior standard?

On the one hand Trump claims the US can behave however it wants for its own interests. But practically no other nation is allowed to behave in similar fashion in dealing with the US.

[Johnnyngai]

19 hours ago, farcanell said:

Chinas probably still annoyed that’s it’s not getting any royalties from gunpowder and silk tech, stolen from them by the west.

The Europeans paid China with glass marbles 800 years ago during the silk road days. 

[Johnnyngai]

18 hours ago, bristolboy said:

But Chinese is paying thieves. So, at the least it's a party to the theft.

And much more probably it's organizing the thefts  as well. Whereas the US was occupying a conquered and occupied nation that had waged a war of aggression. Where's the thievery? Germany had no right to its military secrets.

Trump said Americans first, and  Xi said Chinese first.  

International politic  =  every man for himself.   

You spy on me, and I spy on you.  

May the best spy win.  

[mauGR1]

11 hours ago, Aj Mick said:

On 11/1/2018 at 6:34 AM, Damrongsak said:

Well, there was a war.  And the Germans were responsible for killing somewhere on the order of 6-17 million people. 

With the help of technology provided by Henry Ford. War is definitely good for business.

It looks like a nice little can of worms, not sure it's a good idea trying to open it????

[farcanell]

1 hour ago, Johnnyngai said:

The Europeans paid China with glass marbles 800 years ago during the silk road days. 

And yet, China was producing glass beads more than a thousand years prior to 1218AD

[farcanell]

11 hours ago, Aj Mick said:

With the help of technology provided by Henry Ford. War is definitely good for business.

Yes... well... once again, it was the Chinese that came up with mass production and “production line” manufacturing, thousands of years ago.... for war weapons specifically.

 

Sorry mauGR1 ???????????? couldn’t help it.

[mauGR1]

6 minutes ago, farcanell said:

Yes... well... once again, it was the Chinese that came up with mass production and “production line” manufacturing, thousands of years ago.... for war weapons specifically.

 

Sorry mauGR1 ???????????? couldn’t help it.

Right, they were also having a central government and an organised society since (apparently) some 5000 years ago.

Still, the "white man" took it to a "higher" level.

[bristolboy]

3 hours ago, Johnnyngai said:

Trump said Americans first, and  Xi said Chinese first.  

International politic  =  every man for himself.   

You spy on me, and I spy on you.  

May the best spy win.  

not what my subthread with pianoi was about. which was the entirely irrlevant matter of whether the US was guilty of theft after WW2 because it coopted German rocket scientists.

[puck2]

On 11/1/2018 at 10:56 AM, Srikcir said:

No, they sought asylum ????

......... forced by the "circumstances".