Thailand’s English proficiency is getting worse: study

[SmartyMarty]

Baffled by the fact Colombia is ranked better than Thailand. When I've travelled there no one, absolutely no one, speaks any english.....not on their planes, at the border, taxis, hotels, restaurants.....anywhere.

In my experience Thailand much better.

[THE REVERAND]

I have taught several thai people English and also Vietnamese with success. Firstly I show them an Oxford English Dictionary and tell them this is The English Bible . next I ask them for simple English examples i.e. trains ,buses, cars, motor bikes , dresses and clothing anything simple which can be projected from the Eye to the Brain to the Mouth. Next check the word with the Dictionary WRITE down this word and any other related Words  other described by the dictionary then check these words this can then give then 40 words they understand. Stage 2 read signs ,look at newspapers and books ,again use their dictionary. Stage 3 find these words in a sentence then see how they relate to other words again using the dictionary.   It takes time and The EYE ,BRAIN and MOUTH are The Beholders. Simplicity is the secret and I have only been to University 1 time (to play football) but have had many university lecturers ask me how I can teach them so easily.    

[marcusarelus]

2 minutes ago, THE REVERAND said:

I have taught several thai people English and also Vietnamese with success. Firstly I show them an Oxford English Dictionary and tell them this is The English Bible . next I ask them for simple English examples i.e. trains ,buses, cars, motor bikes , dresses and clothing anything simple which can be projected from the Eye to the Brain to the Mouth. Next check the word with the Dictionary WRITE down this word and any other related Words  other described by the dictionary then check these words this can then give then 40 words they understand. Stage 2 read signs ,look at newspapers and books ,again use their dictionary. Stage 3 find these words in a sentence then see how they relate to other words again using the dictionary.   It takes time and The EYE ,BRAIN and MOUTH are The Beholders. Simplicity is the secret and I have only been to University 1 time (to play football) but have had many university lecturers ask me how I can teach them so easily.    

Have you tried your method in a non air conditioned classroom with 50 Thai kids screaming, hitting one another, bleeding and picking lice from their hair? 

[attrayant]

13 minutes ago, marcusarelus said:

Firstly I show them an Oxford English Dictionary and tell them this is The English Bible .

 

Oh good; turn English instruction into a religion.  Is Noah Webster the devil in this scenario? 

 

I bet there is even a list of ten commandments.

[KiChakayan]

17 hours ago, janhkt said:

Stop dubbing movies and programmes, and subtitle them instead, so ppl get exposed to foreign languages. Worked out pretty well for scandinavian countries in terms of proficiency. Use France, Italy, Russia for opposite argument.

 

Nobody learns any language properly if they're not exposed to it from native speakers. 

Russia and France have another problem, they have the delusion that their language is "important" because of their "great" culture. Years back I was often told that French was the language of diplomacy whereas english is the language of business. With this sort of BS you don't motivate people to do the obvious right thing.

To some extent this could apply to Thailand, probably the most inward looking country in SEA.

[thequietman]

2 hours ago, Hanuman2547 said:

So in some ways, you are part of the problem as well by just telling them "Yes".

In a way, yes but I have a family to support and do not have the luxury of tenure and a job for life like the Thai members. I am renewed annually and so my voice carries no weight within this system.

It is broken and I can't fix it.

[pastprime]

11 hours ago, marcusarelus said:

Why is the exchange rate what it is.  Can't get off that easy.  What is the reason the baht has appreciated so much against the pound in the pasts decade? Baht up, GDP up, Jobs up and the economy doing great. 

Depends which paper you read,..economy down,exports down,tourism down jobs down

[MaxYakov]

1 hour ago, marcusarelus said:

Unless you taught Thais how to speak English first.  I know educated in Thailand people who speak perfect English.  They don't teach school though.  They are working in industry.  The future is teaching with computer games and that should take care of the problem. 

Yeah, right. Especially if it's Command & Conquer: Red Alert 2 with Kari Wuhrer (or maybe not):

 

 

Edited November 4, 2018 by MaxYakov

[thequietman]

3 hours ago, K950 said:

Here in Korat, I have a few friends that teach English. They all have said that you aren't allowed to fail the student even though they are failing.

I fail students but have been warned that this reflects badly on my end of year assessment. The fact that I just tally the scores and enter them into the system seems immaterial.

The student is lazy and doesn't do the work and I get punished. Amazing!

[terminatorchiangmai]

No need for English , they want everyone to learn Mandarin for the Chinese that aren't coming back anymore.

Other countries are not important for tourism.

[Puwa]

2 hours ago, THE REVERAND said:

I have taught several thai people English and also Vietnamese with success. Firstly I show them an Oxford English Dictionary and tell them this is The English Bible . next I ask them for simple English examples i.e. trains ,buses, cars, motor bikes , dresses and clothing anything simple which can be projected from the Eye to the Brain to the Mouth. Next check the word with the Dictionary WRITE down this word and any other related Words  other described by the dictionary then check these words this can then give then 40 words they understand. Stage 2 read signs ,look at newspapers and books ,again use their dictionary. Stage 3 find these words in a sentence then see how they relate to other words again using the dictionary.   It takes time and The EYE ,BRAIN and MOUTH are The Beholders. Simplicity is the secret and I have only been to University 1 time (to play football) but have had many university lecturers ask me how I can teach them so easily.    

Reverend is spelled with an "e."

[spidermike007]

12 hours ago, Lacessit said:

Thai is a language of vowels and tones. English is a language of combined consonants. Thais find English as difficult as falangs find Thai.

IMHO one of the factors in Thais learning English is face. They are reluctant to lose face by asking for help with words.

Their struggles at times can lead to quite comic situations. Like a Thai lady I was having a meal with who said she liked to eat bulls**t. Took me some time to work out she meant blue cheese.

 

Face is no doubt, the greatest form of weakness, a human can engage in. Many will say it is societal, cultural, etc. No matter. It is the absolute and complete lack of the ability to introspect, and look within for the source of any problem, shortcoming, conflict, or issue. It is the polar opposite of spirituality, and therefore an absolute scourge on Buddha, and all of the precepts he taught. By practicing face, you are denying your spiritual heritage. You are refusing to man up. To take responsibility for your actions. If a man or a woman cannot, and will not take responsibility for their actions, the problems they create, the mistakes they make, and the issues they involve themselves in, what are they? Are they still an adult? Are they a complete individual, if they allow themselves to be limited by such infinitely small social convention? 

 

Who cares what people think of you? For those of us with high self esteem, it just does not matter. Sure, close friends and family. But strangers on the street? Who gives a rat's butt about this? It means nothing what they think, nor what they say about you. They count for nothing. They are just people, and people you do not know, nor will ever see again. Face is rife with self doubt, and by subscribing to this weakness, and man or woman is made a far lesser person. For those of us with high self esteem, we know who we are. What others think, what society thinks, what a guy or gal thinks, means less than zero.

Real men or women, simply own a situation, and take responsibility for their errors or mistakes. Small men, social deviants, or emotional adolescents deflect, obfuscate, attempt to confuse, and do everything in their power to deny that they made a mistake, or that they are responsible in any way, or on any level. They make up narratives about fake news, or alternative facts. Anything to avoid looking within, for the source of the problem. Anything.

[Artisi]

1 hour ago, MaxYakov said:

Yeah, right. Especially if it's Command & Conquer: Red Alert 2 with Kari Wuhrer (or maybe not):

 

 

<deleted> was that all about? 

[ParadiseLost]

Thailand is reaping the rewards of endemic corruption, over decades.

 

Think about this, only the rich hi-so kids get access to the best education, including international universities. However, there is nothing to make these kids "special", other than their genes inherited from (rich) corrupt criminals, in many, if not most cases.

 

To make matters worse the Thai reverence and obsession with wealth means nobody will dare find fault or fail these kids at anything.

 

The results speak for themselves; Thailand as a whole will slide backwards as these pretenders take all the positions of power, thanks to Daddy's connections.

Edited November 4, 2018 by ParadiseLost

[dallen52]

GIGO.

Garbage In

Garbage Out.

 

They don't want to listen and learn.

It's a battle to get mobile phones turned off during training. 

 

The Tesl accreditation here is par for the course. 

 

I have my TAELLN 

Teaching adults English Language Literature and Numeracy acreds. 

Used during workplace training and assessment. 

Along with TAE quals and they leave for dead anything delivered here. 

 

I thought my thai learning was bad.

But at least I want to participate. 

[Jonnapat]

Anyone who watches football on tv will know that the panel who assess games before and after have no idea how to pronounce either the name of the club or individual players, despite the fact that they could learn by listening to the English commentary which is available. 

The  same individuals have been doing this job for many years yet never seem to learn so any Thais viewing, of which there are many simply repeat the mistakes. 

This is only one small example of the problem.

[Eligius]

2 hours ago, spidermike007 said:

 

Face is no doubt, the greatest form of weakness, a human can engage in. Many will say it is societal, cultural, etc. No matter. It is the absolute and complete lack of the ability to introspect, and look within for the source of any problem, shortcoming, conflict, or issue. It is the polar opposite of spirituality, and therefore an absolute scourge on Buddha, and all of the precepts he taught. By practicing face, you are denying your spiritual heritage. You are refusing to man up. To take responsibility for your actions. If a man or a woman cannot, and will not take responsibility for their actions, the problems they create, the mistakes they make, and the issues they involve themselves in, what are they? Are they still an adult? Are they a complete individual, if they allow themselves to be limited by such infinitely small social convention? 

 

Who cares what people think of you? For those of us with high self esteem, it just does not matter. Sure, close friends and family. But strangers on the street? Who gives a rat's butt about this? It means nothing what they think, nor what they say about you. They count for nothing. They are just people, and people you do not know, nor will ever see again. Face is rife with self doubt, and by subscribing to this weakness, and man or woman is made a far lesser person. For those of us with high self esteem, we know who we are. What others think, what society thinks, what a guy or gal thinks, means less than zero.

Real men or women, simply own a situation, and take responsibility for their errors or mistakes. Small men, social deviants, or emotional adolescents deflect, obfuscate, attempt to confuse, and do everything in their power to deny that they made a mistake, or that they are responsible in any way, or on any level. They make up narratives about fake news, or alternative facts. Anything to avoid looking within, for the source of the problem. Anything.

Brilliant statements, Spidermike007.

 

Yes, it is ironic that for a country that parades itself as a 'Buddhist nation' (and they are always banging on about it - and getting outraged if anyone dare even hint at disrespect for their religion), they completely ignore one of the key tenets of Buddhism: i.e. NON-self. That is to say, we should not be fixated on our ego ('face') - but rise beyond it to flow out in compassion and empathy and ego-detachment towards others. The Thais tend to do the opposite. Face, face, face is basically 'ego, ego, ego' - wanting to appear perfect and blameless to the outside world, when in fact there are numerous faults and failings that are not being addressed.

 

Thailand is in so many ways a schizoid society, a society full of 'reality control' (to quote Orwell) - where pretended image trumps truth every time.

 

And if you cannot even see the truth about yourself, you will never learn, never improve, never progress.

 

That is Thailand in the year 2018 in a nutshell (especially under autocratic military rule).

 

Edited November 4, 2018 by Eligius

[MaxYakov]

3 hours ago, Artisi said:

<deleted> was that all about? 

About 13 1/2 minutes, but IMHO the first 4 minutes are the best. ????

 

Does this statement by marcusarelus ring a bell?:

 

"The future is teaching with computer games and that should take care of the problem. "

 

Ref. my initial reply HERE

Edited November 4, 2018 by MaxYakov

[DM07]

bs, just the 3 past year when i was away they learned a lot of english,
before i had to converse in thai, there was no way around that,
but now almost everyone speak passable english

On what planet?

Sent from my RNE-L22 using Thailand Forum - Thaivisa mobile app

[marcusarelus]

5 hours ago, ParadiseLost said:

Thailand is reaping the rewards of endemic corruption, over decades.

 

Think about this, only the rich hi-so kids get access to the best education, including international universities. However, there is nothing to make these kids "special", other than their genes inherited from (rich) corrupt criminals, in many, if not most cases.

 

To make matters worse the Thai reverence and obsession with wealth means nobody will dare find fault or fail these kids at anything.

 

The results speak for themselves; Thailand as a whole will slide backwards as these pretenders take all the positions of power, thanks to Daddy's connections.

Anyone with a lick of sense will know that Thailand has been the same or worse for at least 200 years.  Given that can someone tell me why of all the countries in the immediate area why Thailand is 500% better off.  Burma and Vietnam and Laos and Cambodia are all sh**** countries.  Thailand sure is reaping the rewards and that is why it is doing so well in ASEAN.  https://www.focus-economics.com/countries/thailand

 

Quit the BS and get real.  I don't mind knocking Thai education but economically Thailand is doing better that the great majority of countries in the world.  Thailand is the 38 most competitive nation in the world out of 140 countries ranked in the 2018 edition of the Global Competitiveness Report published by the World Economic Forum. Competitiveness Rank in Thailand averaged 34.92 from 2007 until 2018, reaching an all time high of 40 in 2017 and a record low of 28 in 2008.

https://tradingeconomics.com/thailand/competitiveness-rank

 

There are three threads running now with a whole lot of people crying because Thai Immigration might make them go back to their 1st world countries.  If Thailand is so bad why do all those folks want to stay so much?

 

 

Edited November 4, 2018 by marcusarelus

[pastprime]

9 minutes ago, marcusarelus said:

Anyone with a lick of sense will know that Thailand has been the same or worse for at least 200 years.  Given that can someone tell me why of all the countries in the immediate area why Thailand is 500% better off.  Burma and Vietnam and Laos and Cambodia are all sh**** countries.  Thailand sure is reaping the rewards and that is why it is doing so well in ASEAN.  https://www.focus-economics.com/countries/thailand

 

Quit the BS and get real.  I don't mind knocking Thai education but economically Thailand is doing better that the great majority of countries in the world.  Thailand is the 38 most competitive nation in the world out of 140 countries ranked in the 2018 edition of the Global Competitiveness Report published by the World Economic Forum. Competitiveness Rank in Thailand averaged 34.92 from 2007 until 2018, reaching an all time high of 40 in 2017 and a record low of 28 in 2008.

https://tradingeconomics.com/thailand/competitiveness-rank

 

There are three threads running now with a whole lot of people crying because Thai Immigration might make them go back to their 1st world countries.  If Thailand is so bad why do all those folks want to stay so much?

 

 

Slave labour

[marcusarelus]

1 minute ago, pastprime said:

Slave labour

I suggest you get an English dictionary and look up the definition of slave as this thread is about English proficiency.  You might want to also look up wages at the Ford motor company in Thailand or Toyota motor Thailand or PTT of Thailand. 

 

The Thai economy is the world's 20th largest by GDP at PPP and the 27th largest by nominal GDP. It became a newly industrialised country and a major exporter in the 1990s. Manufacturing, agriculture, and tourism are leading sectors of the economy. The economy is heavily export-dependent, with exports accounting for more than two-thirds of gross domestic product (GDP). Thailand exports over US$105 billion worth of goods and services annually.

Substantial industries include electric appliances, components, computer components, and vehicles. Thailand's recovery from the 1997–1998 Asian financial crisis depended mainly on exports, among various other factors. As of 2012, the Thai automotive industry was the largest in Southeast Asia and the 9th largest in the world. The Thailand industry has an annual output of near 1.5 million vehicles, mostly commercial vehicles.

 

Maybe you should visit Thailand and ask some of the people shopping at the new Terminal 21 or signing up for new bank accounts this weekend at all the malls.  (The banks are out in force before new years. 

[Krataiboy]

With average wages around 13,770 baht a month, it is hard to imagine many Thais other than the hi-so variety being able to open shop at Terminal 21 or open new bank accounts.

 

Household debt across the nation has jumped to nearly 80 percent of GDP in the last decade, which seems to indicate that the working masses are using credit rather than cash to pay their way.

[marcusarelus]

2 hours ago, Krataiboy said:

With average wages around 13,770 baht a month, it is hard to imagine many Thais other than the hi-so variety being able to open shop at Terminal 21 or open new bank accounts.

 

Household debt across the nation has jumped to nearly 80 percent of GDP in the last decade, which seems to indicate that the working masses are using credit rather than cash to pay their way.

There is a reason people don't include links.  Mostly it's because they are not posting the truth.

[pastprime]

'Where do you see Thailand in the next 10 years'    Now thats a good thread

[marcusarelus]

26 minutes ago, pastprime said:

'Where do you see Thailand in the next 10 years'    Now thats a good thread

Thailand’s wealth market is estimated at around $300 billion, with a rapidly growing population of about 30,000 high net worth individuals, the BCG Global Wealth Report 2017 said.

 

BANGKOK/HONG KONG (Reuters) - Switzerland’s Julius Baer (BAER.S) is forming a joint venture with Siam Commercial Bank (SCB) (SCB.BK), the latest foreign bank looking to tap Thailand’s growing wealth.

 

The Swill will manage Thai banks and grow the wealth at a rate more rapid than currently possible. 

 

A good time to buy.  Thailand will eclipse Singapore (everybody knows why).  Have your kids start speaking Thai and maybe you can buy a football team too.  

 

[Fex Bluse]

24 minutes ago, marcusarelus said:

Thailand’s wealth market is estimated at around $300 billion, with a rapidly growing population of about 30,000 high net worth individuals, the BCG Global Wealth Report 2017 said.

 

BANGKOK/HONG KONG (Reuters) - Switzerland’s Julius Baer (BAER.S) is forming a joint venture with Siam Commercial Bank (SCB) (SCB.BK), the latest foreign bank looking to tap Thailand’s growing wealth.

 

The Swill will manage Thai banks and grow the wealth at a rate more rapid than currently possible. 

 

A good time to buy.  Thailand will eclipse Singapore (everybody knows why).  Have your kids start speaking Thai and maybe you can buy a football team too. 

http://knowledge.wharton.upenn.edu/article/can-thailand-escape-middle-income-trap/

 

It's obvious you think Thailand is doing well and has a bright future ahead. Many economists disagree, including some prominent Thai academics. 

 

How is Thailand to get out of the middle income trap it's been in arguably for a couple decades? 

 

Most everyone acknowledges that the country, unlike some others, such as China, lacks the human capital. If they start educating people properly TOMORROW, it will take 2 decades or more before they are ready to compete. 

 

 

[melvinmelvin]

4 hours ago, Krataiboy said:

With average wages around 13,770 baht a month, it is hard to imagine many Thais other than the hi-so variety being able to open shop at Terminal 21 or open new bank accounts.

 

Household debt across the nation has jumped to nearly 80 percent of GDP in the last decade, which seems to indicate that the working masses are using credit rather than cash to pay their way.

the low salary thais have bank accounts, by and large

 

[pastprime]

4 minutes ago, melvinmelvin said:

the low salary thais have bank accounts, by and large

 

That is so to obtain bank loans

[Fex Bluse]

52 minutes ago, marcusarelus said:

Thailand’s wealth market is estimated at around $300 billion, with a rapidly growing population of about 30,000 high net worth individuals, the BCG Global Wealth Report 2017 said.

 

BANGKOK/HONG KONG (Reuters) - Switzerland’s Julius Baer (BAER.S) is forming a joint venture with Siam Commercial Bank (SCB) (SCB.BK), the latest foreign bank looking to tap Thailand’s growing wealth.

 

The Swill will manage Thai banks and grow the wealth at a rate more rapid than currently possible. 

 

A good time to buy.  Thailand will eclipse Singapore (everybody knows why).  Have your kids start speaking Thai and maybe you can buy a football team too.  

I have to ask what makes you think Thailand's wealth market is rapidly growing. 

 

And, I ask because my wife is a wealth management exec at top 3 Thai Bank and she also wants to know. 

 

The wealth markets in Thailand are stagnant! Hardly any new entrants into the HNW or UHNW crowd. Your average wealth manager at a bank here has a client portfolio of about 300 or clients with an average of USD 100K or less with a VERY small number having millions or more. 

 

The HNW and UHNW clients invariably manage the bulk of their assets OUTSIDE THAILAND. Often, they will have TH accounts with a reasonable amount of money in them for children and wives, ect. 

 

We all see the adds on around Bangkok. They are selling credit cards and other stuff aimed at working class people. I attend the bank events with my wife, and they hardly have a handful of audience attending the wealth management product launches. The money in Thailand is concentrated into very few families' hands, and new entrants are very few. 

 

And, BCG, McKinsey and the other assorted Strategy firms publish reports that are, in part, aimed at generating interest in engagement work. Their numbers are often unreliable given their conflict of interest.

Edited November 4, 2018 by Fex Bluse