19 hours ago, neeray said:

First, he used it to rally a base after he descended like royalty down the escalator. "Mexico will pay for it". Where the hell did he get that idea from?

He got it from being a bigot all his life. The more he poked at that idea, the more his base cried "MAGA!" History will not look kindly at him or his blind followers/sycophants (but that's redundant, isn't it?).

21 hours ago, keemapoot said:

Trump has more to lose on this than the Dems. The Dems are waiting out Jan. 3, when the house changes hands. Trump proudly owns the shutdown and voters will place the blame on him in the end. He is the one who angrily ensconsed himself with just his iphone and twitter in the White house alone Christmas eve like Scrooge, and then just like the Grinch who stole Christmas, proceeded to break a child's heart by telling him Santa isn't real.

 

Bah Humbug!

LOL. The Dems have more to lose. The longer the shutdown keeps on, the more people will realise that they don't actually need most of the government.

Makes no difference if the Dems take over. He has the power of the pen and unless the Dems can get some GOP to vote with them for a 2/3rds majority, nothing they put to be signed will succeed.

If Trump gives in over this he's toast, as they will know that he is not prepared to stick it out in the future.

Trump actually has nothing to lose by sticking to it. He's not going to lose his base, and the other side already hate him. By constantly attacking him, the Dems have lost any chance of being able to negotiate in good faith.

2 hours ago, thaibeachlovers said:

LOL. The Dems have more to lose. The longer the shutdown keeps on, the more people will realise that they don't actually need most of the government.

Makes no difference if the Dems take over. He has the power of the pen and unless the Dems can get some GOP to vote with them for a 2/3rds majority, nothing they put to be signed will succeed.

If Trump gives in over this he's toast, as they will know that he is not prepared to stick it out in the future.

Trump actually has nothing to lose by sticking to it. He's not going to lose his base, and the other side already hate him. By constantly attacking him, the Dems have lost any chance of being able to negotiate in good faith.

Unfortunately true, except for your last sentence.

2 hours ago, thaibeachlovers said:

LOL. The Dems have more to lose. The longer the shutdown keeps on, the more people will realise that they don't actually need most of the government.

Makes no difference if the Dems take over. He has the power of the pen and unless the Dems can get some GOP to vote with them for a 2/3rds majority, nothing they put to be signed will succeed.

If Trump gives in over this he's toast, as they will know that he is not prepared to stick it out in the future.

Trump actually has nothing to lose by sticking to it. He's not going to lose his base, and the other side already hate him. By constantly attacking him, the Dems have lost any chance of being able to negotiate in good faith.

Every single thing that Trump does is to keep his base stoked and to keep them solidified in his block. Yes, that is the right strategy for him, because there is no other block of constituents that can be gathered by any other candidate in either party that is as sizable, and in the correct US states for the electoral college advantage. So, yes, for sure, his base gets solidified by moves like the shutdown, but he will lose a lot of fringe supporters not firmly in the base (like federal workers affected by the shutdown). So, perhaps we may see in the next election enough defectors from Trump's unsound decisions to erode this base (provided he makes it that far).

A troll post has been removed. 

Trump won the election with this being on of his key policies.

 

So there is obviously support for the wall.

 

The shutdown is caused by 2 sides - either of which can stop the shutdown any time. 

 

So of course, everyone blames the 'other side' because their myopia can't have it any other way.

Some troll posts have been removed. 

6 hours ago, pedro01 said:

Trump won the election with this being on of his key policies.

 

So there is obviously support for the wall.

 

The shutdown is caused by 2 sides - either of which can stop the shutdown any time. 

 

So of course, everyone blames the 'other side' because their myopia can't have it any other way.

trump said Mexico would pay for his wall.

 

Getting the USA tax payer to fund it was not the policy promise. 

6 hours ago, pedro01 said:

Trump won the election with this being on of his key policies.

 

So there is obviously support for the wall.

If anything, there was support for a walk paid by Mexico. I can’t remember Trump saying he would build a wall with 5bn USD taxpayer money. 

 

6 hours ago, pedro01 said:

The shutdown is caused by 2 sides - either of which can stop the shutdown any time. 

Trump live on TV said he would cause a shutdown. Then he agreed to something and later refused to respect the agreement. If anyone is causing the shutdown, it’s Trump. 

 

 

7 hours ago, pedro01 said:

The shutdown is caused by 2 sides - either of which can stop the shutdown any time.

Do you mean Trump and the Republican majority at the House? ????

11 hours ago, pedro01 said:

Trump won the election with this being on of his key policies.

 

So there is obviously support for the wall.

 

The shutdown is caused by 2 sides - either of which can stop the shutdown any time. 

 

So of course, everyone blames the 'other side' because their myopia can't have it any other way.

It's possible to win despite, not because. And even foxnews polls show more Americans against the wall than in favor of it.

19 hours ago, thaibeachlovers said:

The Dems have more to lose.

No. The three branches had come to an agreement and Trump was about to sign the bill when Fox News and Rush Limbaugh started broadcasting what a loser Trump was for caving in about the border wall. You DID see where Trump very publicly stated the shutdown was on him? The Dems are dealing from a position of strength and everyone knows it.

Edited December 27, 20187 yr by quandow
speling [sic]

13 hours ago, pedro01 said:

Trump won the election with this being on of his key policies.

 

So there is obviously support for the wall.

 

The shutdown is caused by 2 sides - either of which can stop the shutdown any time. 

 

So of course, everyone blames the 'other side' because their myopia can't have it any other way.

His election promise was that Mexico would pay for the wall , wouldn't cost US tax payers a single dime. Seems to me the Dems are helping him to keep that promise , right ?

IMHO, I doubt that anything will happen until next week when the Dems take over the house.  I suspect that Pelosi will introduce a bill that will include full protection to DACA immigrants with a path to eventual citizenship.  She will also increase the amount for Increased "Border Security" which will be further defined but not include any wording about finding a "wall".  McConnel will talk to Trump, he will refuse to sign it, and McConnel will not put it to the floor for a vote.  I then think that Pelosi will make minor changes to the bill, possibly increasing the amount for "border security" and this will happen over and over again until someone gives up, most likely the GOP.  He might end up with the full 5 billion, but the bill clearly state that it is to be used for  a defined list of what the money can be used for to improve "border security, but will also clearly state that the money can no not be used for construction of a new "wall".  During this whole fiasco 420000 feds will continue to work without paychecks and 350000 remain on furlough and will not be paid.  In addition, all of the private workers that have been "laid off" due to the government shutdown will continue to suffer!  Most of the private sector can apply for unemployment, less than their normal pay, but I do not think that the feds qualify.

A Police officer was shot and killed at a traffic stop Christmas Eve in central Calif. by an "illegal alien" The officer leaves behind a wife and 5 mos. baby, he himself was an immigrant from Fiji. He came to the US the legal way. I doubt this will make it to the headlines on TV. 

Edited December 28, 20187 yr by EVENKEEL

36 minutes ago, EVENKEEL said:

A Police officer was shot and killed at a traffic stop Christmas Eve in central Calif. by an "illegal alien" The officer leaves behind a wife and 5 mos. baby, he himself was an immigrant from Fiji. He came to the US the legal way. I doubt this will make it to the headlines on TV. 

It seems not to have made it to a source you can’t link to.

Edited December 28, 20187 yr by Chomper Higgot

1 hour ago, Chomper Higgot said:

It seems not to have made it to a source you can’t link to.

I can.

 

How about this source?

 

It took me less than 1 minute to find it on Google.

 

About 20,500,000 results (0.87 seconds) 

 

https://www.thestate.com/news/nation-world/national/article223610405.html

 

or this one

 

https://www.washingtonpost.com/national/authorities-launch-manhunt-after-killing-of-police-officer/2018/12/26/ba3116ea-096f-11e9-8942-0ef442e59094_story.html?noredirect=on&utm_term=.36a8b815d2aa

 

 

 

 

On 12/26/2018 at 7:55 AM, Brickbat said:

Trump is definitely a loose cannon and as the stock markets keep dropping , he will get the blame for that too, as he bragged about the rise being due to him. 

As for the wall being an election promise , as so many state, ARE WE FORGETTING THAT MEXICO WAS GOING TO PAY ? 

 

As for Santa, it’s time to wake up. The fat white man with flying reindeers bringing presents that Big Dept stores actually sell to parents, it’s a Xmas big business created. Bad enough we have to swear ( and why just the right hand! ) on a book that is full of contradictions and far fetched stories! So Trump does do some things right. 

You are right about the stock markets. Only silly people in politics claim a rise in prices was due to them (as individuals) Just as Trump told soldiers that Isis has been defeated since he came to power (by him). I remember Bush Jr saying the war in the middle east was over. It all comes back to bite you in the butt.

The stock market also knows that 25 billion dollars spent to build a wall is total dead money. Only 5 billion now but the total cost is astronomical for very little if any return.

Without doubt some of the republican lobbyist construction companies will pull in the profits if the wall build goes ahead. But the whole reasoning is a dud.

 Mexico was going to pay is a sad joke. Walls stop everyone is all too sad. The Israelis have a hard time patrolling a few hundred miles. Because walls are not impregnable, either over, under or around or through. But then, Trump did not study history.

Ummm. Sorry but I am confused. Why is this all about Trump? Other than the fact that the media is salivating at a good story to anger people for click bait? Last time I checked, Congress will override any presidential veto with a 2/3rds majority. So, here lies the problem... blame Congress? Or blame the divided citizens who put them in Congress? Or blame the media who divided the country? I seriously doubt the President has much to do with it.

29 minutes ago, scoutman360 said:

Ummm. Sorry but I am confused. Why is this all about Trump? Other than the fact that the media is salivating at a good story to anger people for click bait? Last time I checked, Congress will override any presidential veto with a 2/3rds majority. So, here lies the problem... blame Congress? Or blame the divided citizens who put them in Congress? Or blame the media who divided the country? I seriously doubt the President has much to do with it. 

Yeah, you are confused. That has been established.

 

 

Quote

 

How does Trump escape the trap he laid for himself?

Poll after poll shows that Americans hold President Trump and his Republican allies responsible for the shutdown, which is hardly surprising since Trump declared he’d be “proud” to shutter the government. In the most recent poll conducted by Reuters/Ipsos, 47 percent of Americans blame the president for the shutdown, compared to 33 percent who fault the Democrats. Moreover, according to NBC News, “just 35 percent of those surveyed in the Reuters/Ipsos poll said they backed including money for the wall in a congressional spending bill.

 

 

https://www.washingtonpost.com/opinions/2018/12/28/how-does-trump-escape-trap-he-laid-himself/

Edited December 28, 20187 yr by Jingthing