Britons would now vote to stay in EU, want second referendum: poll

[dick dasterdly]

1 minute ago, oilinki said:

Not fully, no. Difference of opinion is great as it gives us possibility to learn something new.

 

Constantly yelling slogans, which provide nothing new to the discussion, deserves similar kind of answer - this is the opposite what we 'socialists' and 'liberals' used to do for so long and I want to change the way we response to these predefined slogans/trolls. 

 

But yeah, I'll try to do my best not to go after the person, but to go after the idea. Would you do the same?

"But yeah, I'll try to do my best not to go after the person, but to go after the idea. Would you do the same?"

 

I've always tried very hard not to attack the poster, rather the post - but admittedly I've failed occasionally when a poster has been particularly offensive ☹️.

 

On the other hand, I'm pretty sure that I've rarely used offensive terms against remainers  - unlike those with a different pov.....

 

Edit - Incidentally, you obviously haven't picked up on the fact that I'm also a socialist and liberal....

Edited January 12, 2019 by dick dasterdly

[beautifulthailand99]

1 hour ago, SheungWan said:

For any visitor from outer space wondering why the Hard Brexiteers are having one of their ritual flurries going off at the deep end, it is for one reason only. It is precisely because of one of the most recent Parliamentary votes. The one removing Hard Brexit as the default Brexit exit in the event of no agreement between the UK and the EU. It is sending them totally bonkers at the thought that their final card bypassing Parliament has been pulled. Call an ambulance!

Their naivety is almost childlike - did the really think Parliament would gamble with the economic security of the UK - they should thank them for making adult evidence-based decisions rather than wilfully jumping off a cliff to see if the can fly.  Any street yobbery, if it should atise, which I don't think it will should be dealt with the full force of the law.  We're staying in now - the process has begun. Leave means Remain. 

 

https://www.standard.co.uk/news/uk/brexit-could-open-the-door-to-extremist-political-forces-in-the-uk-chris-grayling-warns-a4036986.html

 

Billionaire businessman Peter Hargreaves, who pumped more than £3 million into the exit campaign, told Reuters: "I have totally given up. I am totally in despair, I don't think Brexit will happen at all."

And hedge fund manager Crispin Odey, who donated more than £870,000 to pro-Leave groups, said: "My view is that it ain't going to happen. I just can't see how it happens with that configuration of Parliament."

[Guest]

3 minutes ago, dick dasterdly said:

"But yeah, I'll try to do my best not to go after the person, but to go after the idea. Would you do the same?"

 

I've always tried very hard not to attack the poster, rather the post - but admittedly I've failed occasionally when a poster has been particularly offensive ☹️.

 

On the other hand, I'm pretty sure that I've rarely used offensive terms against remainers  - unlike those with a different pov.....

We have all failed multiple times and will fail every now and then. After all we are who we are. I prefer us to be in this way. Not mean towards others, but offering a bit more challenges. Occasionally offering a bit of dirt to the discussions is a good thing. Too much of dirt, not so good anymore. 

 

Hi! It's nice to meet you DD.

[Patriot1066]

On 1/8/2019 at 1:21 PM, AlexRich said:

 

Another commentary from a member of the tin foil hat brigade. Fantasising about an EU break up ... it’s imminent, it’s just around the corner ... yet the EU get united and stronger whilst the UK tears itself apart ... soon to be Little England. And any mention of Soros is a red flag ...  ... only to be laughed at.

Well remainers seem to have to resort to insults like tin hats, gammon etc, and Little England is better than no England wishing the EU. Stick to facts the discussion will be easier.

 

Foreign billionaire such as Soros through his ‘open democracy’ charity just gave 500 million to the leave campaign, it should be illegal to accept such donations from foreign donors and Siri’s once brought the country to its knees so seems no friend of the English!

 

https://www.theguardian.com/business/2018/may/29/george-soros-drastic-action-needed-for-eurozone-to-survive

 

With Romania now holding the EU presidency it will be interesting to see forward momentum of the EU. I don’t mind staying in if it means wrecking it from the inside, forcing lower budgets  bans on running up future debt and actual accounts that match up why not a second referendum can happen for me we will win again. 

 

What can remain offer no changes? Like Ford moving factories out of the UK on EU development grants? Jaguar building factories in Slovakia with state aid we are not allowed to give? The list is endless we are just a piggy bank for the EU to break into.

 

https://www.telegraph.co.uk/politics/2019/01/10/eu-rules-left-slovakia-free-entice-jaguar-land-rover-uk-110m/

 

Isnt the EU our great friend taking our fishing and jobs yeas really great

[Patriot1066]

14 minutes ago, beautifulthailand99 said:

Their naivety is almost childlike - did the really think Parliament would gamble with the economic security of the UK - they should thank them for making adult evidence-based decisions rather than wilfully jumping off a cliff to see if the can fly.  Any street yobbery, if it should atise, which I don't think it will should be dealt with the full force of the law.  We're staying in now - the process has begun. Leave means Remain. 

 

https://www.standard.co.uk/news/uk/brexit-could-open-the-door-to-extremist-political-forces-in-the-uk-chris-grayling-warns-a4036986.html

 

Billionaire businessman Peter Hargreaves, who pumped more than £3 million into the exit campaign, told Reuters: "I have totally given up. I am totally in despair, I don't think Brexit will happen at all."

And hedge fund manager Crispin Odey, who donated more than £870,000 to pro-Leave groups, said: "My view is that it ain't going to happen. I just can't see how it happens with that configuration of Parliament."

Hehe we will be leaving leave always meant a ‘Hard Brexit’ if Corbyn wins his no confidence vote and there is a general election then May  will have the choice of dates. The executive (Cabinet) will be in charge, not parliament until Election Day which will need to be after the Brexit day due to time constraints or too many legal challenges. Labour are probably unlikely to win with Corbyn too much hate of his terrorist links to the IRA and Hamas.

 

Only option open is leave on Brexit day despite the remain MPs with their own interests in mind.

 

https://www.politico.eu/article/jeremy-corbyn-labour-local-elections-power-quest-off-course/

 

As to a second referendum, bring it on I know no one who voted leave that have changed their minds! We will win then you can ask for a third?

 

 

[Spidey]

19 hours ago, Chartist said:

 

Remain scum love saying people should retrain, up skill to compete in the market all sounds good unless your the poor sucker having to do it. 

 

3 hours ago, Loiner said:

No, its people like you giving the Brexiteers bad names. Hardly a post goes by without some kind of insult or name calling.

All because we don't agree with you and more of us voted to Leave.

 

1 hour ago, yogi100 said:

 

You are aware of the fact that you may not attack a poster, only his or her post.

 

1 hour ago, dick dasterdly said:

Please tell me you're joking!

 

As far as I can see very few brexiters or remainers report posts - even though the majority of insults come from remainers - but are deliberately 'general' against those supporting brexit....

Please show me a post where a remainer has called Brexiteers anything remotely as insulting as "scum"

[yogi100]

25 minutes ago, Spidey said:

 

 

An appeal to the mods would be an appeal made directly to them through the proper channels and not a general post that they probably won't not even see unless things become really heated. It's therefore best to resist the temptation to make such remarks in the first place.

34 minutes ago, Spidey said:

 

 

Snide personal remarks create animosity on any internet forum and sometimes can lead to personal confrontations and especially as few of us know one another should be avoided.

[Patriot1066]

On 1/8/2019 at 2:00 PM, yogi100 said:

 

I live in England and every Brexiteer I know is even more determined than ever to vote leave if there's another round. I assume those in your locality want to remain, is that the case? Or are you an ex pat in the LOS.

Everyone I know still wants to leave and we can quickly bring the country to a stop if we don’t . Certainally slowing traffic from Southern Ireland to the EU. ruining their dairy industry, Plus shutting London down is very easy and well discussed in internet groups. Brave Brexiteers recentkynshut most of the London river crossings, some were arrested unlike when environmentalist did the same thing. Unfair treatment?

 

I think the police and political class are getting ready for trouble as are reviewing the right to demonstrate, interestingly they didn’t do this over the EU demonstration or environmental but are over Brexit !! When Moggs children were abused by the leftist the police stood and watched, but once the remainers winge they act.

 

https://www.theguardian.com/law/2019/jan/10/cps-to-test-three-cases-of-alleged-harassment-after-soubry-abused-outside-parliament

 

I also firmly believe there will be further polarisation no matter what they do. 

Edited January 12, 2019 by Patriot1066

[Spidey]

47 minutes ago, AlexRich said:

Hitachi were going to develop a nuclear business in Wales ... but have decided not to?

Build of a new nuclear station at Wylva, Anglesey was due to start. Hitachi board has put it on hold. It was to replace the old Magnox reactors nearby, decommissioned in 2015.

[billd766]

1 hour ago, Spidey said:

Another charachteristic of Brexiteers. Can't take a joke.

Now that is rich, coming from you.

[Spidey]

1 minute ago, billd766 said:

Now that is rich, coming from you.

Can definitely take a joke, if it's funny. @nauseus has given several witty reposts to myself and others, which I have gladly acknowledged.

[Spidey]

1 hour ago, dick dasterdly said:

At last - some good news!

Loss of up to 9000 jobs locally. I don't think that the locals will agree with you, in fact I know they won't. Local politicians are already up in arms about it.

[anon676545345]

59 minutes ago, bomber said:

the FTSE 100 is less lower now than 31-12-1999,there will be plenty of large companies leaving if/when brexit arrives,JAL have started,yes some will be bluffing but some wont,therefore even if half do go it will be a major blow,perhaps you can tell us what major companies are planning to come after brexit as ive not read,heard,or seen anything.

 

What are you talking about you absolute buffoon what has the 31/12/1999 got to do with the price of eggs? It's higher than it was on the 23/06/2016 the date of the referendum anything prior to that has nothing to do with Brexit. My post was in reply to a remain idiot who stated the Stockmarket had crashed due to Brexit which it obviously hasn't. Using his logic Brexit must be a resounding success as the market went higher after the referendum.

[welovesundaysatspace]

22 minutes ago, Patriot1066 said:

(...) we can quickly bring the country to a stop if we don’t . Certainally slowing traffic from Southern Ireland to the EU. ruining their dairy industry, Plus shutting London down is very easy and well discussed in internet groups. Brave Brexiteers recentkynshut most of the London river crossings, (...)

Brexiteers showing their true colors. I’ve never had a doubt it’s just a bunch of far-right extremists trying to create havoc and anarchy to destroy our free democracies. Good it’s a minority that police will deal with. Time to clean up. 

[Spidey]

3 minutes ago, Chartist said:

What are you talking about you absolute buffoon

 

My post was in reply to a remain idiot

 

More Brexiteer personal insults. 555

Edited January 12, 2019 by Spidey

[anon676545345]

1 minute ago, welovesundaysatspace said:

Brexiteers showing their true colors. I’ve never had a doubt it’s just a bunch of far-right extremists trying to create havoc and anarchy to destroy our free democracies. Good it’s a minority that police will deal with. Time to clean up. 

 

If the result of the referendum isn't enacted then it shows we don't live in a democracy we live in a corporatocracy and continued participation in a system where you have no voice would be futile. The only option would be to take to the streets.

[anon676545345]

5 minutes ago, Spidey said:

 

More Brexiteer personal insults. 555

 

Its a simple fact remainers constantly try to manipulate facts but the numbers don't lie, there has been no Stockmarket crash since the Brexit vote and to claim otherwise is pure idiocy.

[Guest]

5 minutes ago, Chartist said:

 

What are you talking about you absolute buffoon what has the 31/12/1999 got to do with the price of eggs? It's higher than it was on the 23/06/2016 the date of the referendum anything prior to that has nothing to do with Brexit. My post was in reply to a remain idiot who stated the Stockmarket had crashed due to Brexit which it obviously hasn't. Using his logic Brexit must be a resounding success as the market went higher after the referendum.

Let's assume that UK based company value is 100. Let's assume it's listed in stock market, based in UK. Let's also assume that the stock market uses pound to compare stock values to real money.

 

All clear by now?

 

If the pound value drops 10% compared to the rest of the currencies, what happens to the real value of that 100 pound value of that company?

 

Even if the stock prices has been the same for the 100 pound valued company, is no longer 100 valued what pounds used to be anymore. Its value is only 90 pounds, when compared to the larger economic picture, even if it's value is showing 100 pounds in the local stock exchange. 

 

Confusing?

[Spidey]

1 minute ago, Chartist said:

 

Its a simple fact remainers constantly try to manipulate facts but the numbers don't lie, there has been no Stockmarket crash since the Brexit vote and to claim otherwise is pure idiocy.

Has the GBP crashed? Was this due to the Brexit vote?

[anon676545345]

3 minutes ago, oilinki said:

Let's assume that UK based company value is 100. Let's assume it's listed in stock market, based in UK. Let's also assume that the stock market uses pound to compare stock values to real money.

 

All clear by now?

 

If the pound value drops 10% compared to the rest of the currencies, what happens to the real value of that 100 pound value of that company?

 

Even if the stock prices has been the same for the 100 pound valued company, is no longer 100 valued what pounds used to be anymore. Its value is only 90 pounds, when compared to the larger economic picture, even if it's value is showing 100 pounds in the local stock exchange. 

 

Confusing?

 

Before the referendum £1 was equal to £1 after the referendum £1 was equal to £1 your analogy only works if a foreign investor bout UK stocks sold them then converted his investment back into his own currency. 

[anon676545345]

9 minutes ago, Spidey said:

Has the GBP crashed? Was this due to the Brexit vote?

 

GBP is down since Brexit so what I get a few less that when I go on holiday doesn't make a blind bit of difference to my day to day life in the UK. Plus it's caused an uptick in the UK's manufacturing PMI which incidentally is also higher than it was prior to the referendum, no need to thank us Brexiteers we're just glad to have helped boost the UK economy.

[welovesundaysatspace]

19 minutes ago, Chartist said:

 

If the result of the referendum isn't enacted then it shows we don't live in a democracy we live in a corporatocracy and continued participation in a system where you have no voice would be futile. The only option would be to take to the streets.

Another option would be to accept that the UK is a parliamentary representative democracy not a dictatorship by manipulated opinion polls. Of course, Brexiteer can resort to violence and riot; that has always been the preferred way of the enemies of our free democracies to harm us. In the end, any such hooligans and anarchists will be dealt with properly by the law enforcement authorities. 

[dick dasterdly]

55 minutes ago, Spidey said:

 

 

 

Please show me a post where a remainer has called Brexiteers anything remotely as insulting as "scum"

I'm inclined to agree with this comment.

 

Remainers are FAR more frequently insulting, but there is no excuse for calling those with a different opinion "scum".

[anon676545345]

4 minutes ago, welovesundaysatspace said:

Another option would be to accept that the UK is a parliamentary representative democracy not a dictatorship by manipulated opinion polls. Of course, Brexiteer can resort to violence and riot; that has always been the preferred way of the enemies of our free democracies to harm us. In the end, any such hooligans and anarchists will be dealt with properly by the law enforcement authorities. 

 

Haha yea good luck with that, we don't have enough police officers to cover their existing commitments, mass protests would shut the country down. You also seem confused by the term democracy it's a system of government by the whole population not by liberal elites, going against the will of the majority of the electorate to satisfy a few would be undemocratic, bordering on totalitarianism.

[evadgib]

3 hours ago, Spidey said:

I understand your sentiments but your post contains one glaring error: "<?> deemed fit to enhance this board" which it certainly wasn't.

The only glaring error is your deliberate omission of the "I" altering the quote to serve your purpose & spectacularly backfiring...again!

 

[welovesundaysatspace]

9 minutes ago, Chartist said:

 

Haha yea good luck with that, we don't have enough police officers to cover their existing commitments, mass protests would shut the country down.

Do those phantasies come from the same spin doctors who put the 350 on the bus and who told you you would get pink unicorns and castles in the sky for the price of a sandwich?

 

Quote

You also seem confused by the term democracy it's a system of government by the whole population not by liberal elites, going against the will of the majority of the electorate to satisfy a few would be undemocratic, bordering on totalitarianism.

Why don’t you have a look in the constitution. I’m pretty sure it doesn’t say anywhere that the U.K. is a system of government by manipualed opinion polls. Nor would anyone else agree that democracy is a system of government by manipulated opinion polls. That would be borderline banana state democracy. 

Edited January 12, 2019 by welovesundaysatspace

[beautifulthailand99]

1 hour ago, Patriot1066 said:

Everyone I know still wants to leave and we can quickly bring the country to a stop if we don’t . Certainally slowing traffic from Southern Ireland to the EU. ruining their dairy industry, Plus shutting London down is very easy and well discussed in internet groups. Brave Brexiteers recentkynshut most of the London river crossings, some were arrested unlike when environmentalist did the same thing. Unfair treatment?

 

I think the police and political class are getting ready for trouble as are reviewing the right to demonstrate, interestingly they didn’t do this over the EU demonstration or environmental but are over Brexit !! When Moggs children were abused by the leftist the police stood and watched, but once the remainers winge they act.

 

https://www.theguardian.com/law/2019/jan/10/cps-to-test-three-cases-of-alleged-harassment-after-soubry-abused-outside-parliament

 

I also firmly believe there will be further polarisation no matter what they do. 

Egging on social unrest from Chiang Mai very brave. It will soon blow over - George Orwell was right about the proles.

“So long as they (the Proles) continued to work and breed, their other activities were without importance. Left to themselves, like cattle turned loose upon the plains of Argentina, they had reverted to a style of life that appeared to be natural to them, a sort of ancestral pattern...Heavy physical work, the care of home and children, petty quarrels with neighbors, films, football, beer and above all, gambling filled up the horizon of their minds. To keep them in control was not difficult.”

[bristolboy]

1 hour ago, Patriot1066 said:

 

 

Foreign billionaire such as Soros through his ‘open democracy’ charity just gave 500 million to the leave campaign, it should be illegal to accept such donations from foreign donors and Siri’s once brought the country to its knees so seems no friend of the English!

 

https://www.theguardian.com/business/2018/may/29/george-soros-drastic-action-needed-for-eurozone-to-survive

 

 

500 million? You're at best mistaken, at worst lying. Which is it?

[evadgib]

3 hours ago, SheungWan said:

I think the Hard Brexiteers here carry on like an old, (sorry, new) Austin Princess, stuck in whinge, whinge, whinge gear coming right out the car showroom.

'Hard' is a label dished out by miffed 2016 silver medalists. Brexiters/leavers only ever wanted to leave; which more accurately explains how they view themselves. 

Edited January 12, 2019 by evadgib

[anon676545345]

13 minutes ago, welovesundaysatspace said:

Do those phantasies come from the same spin doctors who put the 350 on the bus and who told you you would get pink unicorns and castles in the sky for the price of a sandwich?

 

Why don’t you have a look in the constitution. I’m pretty sure it doesn’t say anywhere that the U.K. is a system of government by manipualed opinion polls. Nor would anyone else agree that democracy is a system of government by manipulated opinion polls. That would be borderline banana state democracy. 

 

Man your desperation makes me laugh, a referendum announced by the Prime Minister and ratified by parliament, a referendum that the Prime Minister promised to enact on the results, a referendum with the largest ever turn out in British history, and you deem it a manipulated opinion pole. Yes it was manipulated the remain campaigns project fear was full of lies like Osborne's threat of a punishment budget. But the majority of the British electorate were not phased and voted leave, now we wait for the results to be enacted as promised by not just one but two Prime Ministers.