Bangkok Pride Festival V Pattaya Gay Festival

[PoliticallyCorrect]

I read on another forum that the Pattaya Gay Festival street party on Wednesday February 21st raised 874000 Baht. Someone had commented that this was 45% more than the Bangkok Pride Festival raised in the whole of last year. I don't know if that figure is accurate but if it is then it's a sad indictment of Bangkok's efforts.

I know that my dear friends in Pattaya are all aware of what is happening vis-à-vis the fund raising efforts of the PGF, they know when and where the functions are and how much is raised. Consequently they all go to support the functions.

In years gone by Bangkok was quite good at disseminating information about its events but last year getting information about the Pride Festival was like getting blood out of a stone. These days there is no sense of community in Bangkok. It was only by chance that I knew anything was happening because I was strolling in Lumpini Park on the day when they had their Pride in the park party.

What is the matter with Bangkok Pride Festival? I am sure they try their best but honestly, the committee is utterly hopeless. Why can't it do as well as Pattaya?

[wowpow]

I think that the question is "What is the purpose of a Gay Festival?" Pride? I wonder if the news shots seen around the worlds of gay parades with everyone in wierd outfits, drag, leather, degrees of nudity, sequins and feathers does much to warm the hetero community to gays. Still a parade of men in suits would be boring. It seems that there may be many reasons for such. I think that currently Bangkok organisers are very new and did provide a super parade and some amusing side events. This brought together many of the gay organisations of Bangkok and was a fun party and nothing wrong with that. They do not see their main purpose to fund raise.

Pattaya authorities have, sadly, not permitted a parade for the last two years and the future looks unlikely. The great thing about the Pattaya Festival is the brilliant Madam Jim of Boyz Boyz Boyz. The committee decided to go the fund raising route with a series of events throughout the year and Madam Jim can extract blood from a stone without hurting it. What makes it possible is the large resident gay community and lots of snowbirds and holidaymakers. I believe that the big fundraising events are the monthy dinners and streetparties plus the amazing individual generosity of locals and visitors.

Madam Jim in a rainbow frock

[Jingthing]

Maybe its about pride for drag queens. And Madame Jim, the local queen of the drag queens. Can someone please explain to me why this character is worshipped so much locally? Is it because he is so rich and local expats have internalized Thai culture so much that rich and flashy is translated as the ultimate good? I wonder what these "pride" festivals do to bring forward full gay civil rights in Thailand for Thais and expats, for example marriage rights. Wouldn't it be nice if farang expats could marry their Thai boyfriends under Thai law the same as their hetero brothers? Ever hear one of those "Pride" parades mention anything concrete like that?

Edited February 25, 2007 by Jingthing

[jdinasia]

Bangkok and Pattaya are ummmmmmm very different places.

If you couldn't get info on last year's festival in BKK ... then you never looked at the website or signed up for their emails <in fact I got one from them today! for 2007's 1st meeting>

Times are changing in BKK and the days of 'hookers on parade' = gay pride are over (and only 8 years late!) The Thai folks are getting more and more involved and it is moving along nicely!

Edited February 28, 2007 by jdinasia

[mjthai007]

Bangkok and Pattaya are ummmmmmm very different places.

If you couldn't get info on last year's festival in BKK ... then you never looked at the website or signed up for their emails <in fact I got one from them today! for 2007's 1st meeting>

Times are changing in BKK and the days of 'hookers on parade' = gay pride are over (and only 8 years late!) The Thai folks are getting more and more involved and it is moving along nicely!

I've recently been informed by a co worker (who by the way is gay), that there seems to be quite a bit of 'creative accounting' going on at the gay charity Bangkok Gay Pride!

My co worker tells me that he has requested, on a number of times, financial statements for the monies given to no avail! He has also been told that 'people who ask too many questions (in Thailand) sometimes vanish without trace!'

I quote;

Over 600,000 baht was raised via, sponsor fee, donations, fund raisers and other various events. The expenses for running pride, park and parade was a little over 400,000 baht, and so far over 200,000 baht has been donated to charity. The final selection for charity donation will be voted on at the next meeting.

Forgive me if this is the norm, but when the comitee members spend money on lavish dinners etc.(All, may I add being spent at comitee members, friends, restaurants and bars) I feel utterly disgusted with some of the other creatures I have to share this planet with!

Call me old fashioned but is there some sense of morality left in this world?

By the way, we can't blame this on Thais! it is greedy farangs!!

I apologise for this rant, but I am more than annoyed!!! And I hope that at least next year these THIEVING BAS#ARDS won't get away with it!!!

[jdinasia]

I have a friend of a friend of a .... that said ...... etc

Please work on getting your facts straight! First ... lavish dinners? dream on!

Second ... the farang? Pride is being run by Thai people more than farang now

[mjthai007]

Sir, I apologise for using a link in my letter about charities not using the money for which it is given, but this was the only source of information that was available, plus I didn't realise it was an offence!

One question though, is why was it moved to the gay forum? I am a straight man, and the issues affect everyone who gave money, gay or straight!

Again, I apologise!

[Ijustwannateach]

As a point of information regarding your query, Mjthai007, this is not your thread. It was already in the gay subforum. This thread's initial topic is a comparison of the Bangkok Gay Festival to the Pattaya Gay Festival.

Your thread ("Questionable Gay Charity??) was moved to this forum because it is a gay-related topic, and this is where most of the gay-related topics go, even when straight posters wish to post on them.

"Steven"

[PeaceBlondie]

Sir, I apologise for using a link in my letter about charities not using the money for which it is given, but this was the only source of information that was available, plus I didn't realise it was an offence!

One question though, is why was it moved to the gay forum? I am a straight man, and the issues affect everyone who gave money, gay or straight!

Again, I apologise!

mjthai007, welcome to all of ThaiVisa. If you want, you can start a topic about Thai charities in general, and post that in the "General Topics" forum.

[mjthai007]

I have a friend of a friend of a .... that said ...... etc

Please work on getting your facts straight! First ... lavish dinners? dream on!

Second ... the farang? Pride is being run by Thai people more than farang now

Sir, you mention the word 'facts', the only fact I can see is that,and I quote from the website:

Over 600,000 baht was raised via, sponsor fee, donations, fund raisers and other various events. The expenses for running pride, park and parade was a little over 400,000 baht, and so far over 200,000 baht has been donated to charity.

I would be very obliged if you could help me (and others!) getting my 'facts' straight! and I will pay for dinner!

[jojo11]

I have a friend of a friend of a .... that said ...... etc

Please work on getting your facts straight! First ... lavish dinners? dream on!

Second ... the farang? Pride is being run by Thai people more than farang now

I agree with you about getting the facts straight! But, where can we begin to get facts from!

I don't understand 'Pride is being run by 'Thai people' more than farang now! Farang aren't people or the farang that 'were' running it weren't people?

Maybe jdinasia can tell us more, I quote "If you couldn't get info on last year's festival in BKK ... then you never looked at the website or signed up for their emails <in fact I got one from them today! for 2007's 1st meeting>

If I was a member of the last comitee I would want to clear this up! Or maybe not if I was hiding something!

[jdinasia]

I have a friend of a friend of a .... that said ...... etc

Please work on getting your facts straight! First ... lavish dinners? dream on!

Second ... the farang? Pride is being run by Thai people more than farang now

Sir, you mention the word 'facts', the only fact I can see is that,and I quote from the website:

Over 600,000 baht was raised via, sponsor fee, donations, fund raisers and other various events. The expenses for running pride, park and parade was a little over 400,000 baht, and so far over 200,000 baht has been donated to charity.

I would be very obliged if you could help me (and others!) getting my 'facts' straight! and I will pay for dinner!

simple ... Pride IS the charity to whom people gave money ..... amazingly they ran in the black and donated some out to further charoties/ngo's/agencies etc Probably it is in their by-laws that they do this, but you are deluded if you think they needed to. They could have kept the cash and used it for volunteer appreciation ... or next year's advertising budget .... or just about anything! ... so you have no "facts" about lavish dinners or anything else! Just an over-inflated sense of what YOU think should be done and the way it should be done! Pride was not established to be a means of donating money to other agencies ... the fact that they DO donate should be lauded!

[jdinasia]

I have a friend of a friend of a .... that said ...... etc

Please work on getting your facts straight! First ... lavish dinners? dream on!

Second ... the farang? Pride is being run by Thai people more than farang now

I agree with you about getting the facts straight! But, where can we begin to get facts from!

I don't understand 'Pride is being run by 'Thai people' more than farang now! Farang aren't people or the farang that 'were' running it weren't people?

Maybe jdinasia can tell us more, I quote "If you couldn't get info on last year's festival in BKK ... then you never looked at the website or signed up for their emails <in fact I got one from them today! for 2007's 1st meeting>

If I was a member of the last comitee I would want to clear this up! Or maybe not if I was hiding something!

Farang were not running it ... sorry if the word 'people' confuses you!

If you have questions please feel free to contact the people involved in last year's Pride and ask! <I was not involved, and am not close with any of the people I know that were involved.> Congrats though on a total of 2 posts and both aimed at me though!

[mike18]

i love this Gay Festival ...

good news,, thank you

[PrideFestival]

There have been a number of requests on this forum for information about the operations and finances of the Bangkok Pride Festival Organization (PFO) for 2006.

As PFO is a community based organization, it is accountable to the community at large. While the Pride Committee is comprised of volunteers who contribute their own time and energy for the objectives of PFO, it welcomes both criticisms and praises when due. However, there seemed to be some confusion and misunderstanding here that warrants clarification.

During the discussions on this forum, comparisons have been made between PFO and Pattaya Gay Festival. There are some similarities between the two organizations but there are also major differences between the two. The main difference is that for the last two years, Pattaya authorities have not permitted a parade. As a result, the Pattaya Gay Festival committee decided to go the fund raising route with a series of events throughout the year. The Pattaya Gay Festival's current mission statement reads, "We are in Pattaya Thailand because we love here and have great fun, but along the way, we like to help many others." (This is from their web site.)

On the other hand, the focus of PFO is the yearly Gay Pride Parade and related activities. Fundraising for charities is a secondary objective of PFO. This was last stated in our August 31, 2006 press release, 'Bangkok Together 2006' Strives to 'Unite Community' with annual Pride Festival. The entire press release will soon be included on our 2007 web site, which you can locate in Google or other search engine by searching on the following phrase: "Bangkok Pride Festival"

The main body of the press release gives the major objectives of the PFO but does not mention fundraising for charities at all. However, a note at the bottom of the page describes the organization that runs the Pride Festival and includes mention in the last sentence of raising money for needy Thai charities.

Here are the objectives of PFO as stated in the body of the press release:

Bangkok Together 2006 strives to engender a sense of community amongst the GLBT population in Thailand, and to empower everyone with a stronger sense of pride. The festival has launched an integrated marketing campaign to reach out to the Thai GLBT community using such headlines as (English translations) "Join Hands, Join Hearts in Pride," "United in Community for Pride," and "Experience Friendship and Creativity with Pride."

Here's the section from the bottom of the press release describing the PFO:

About Pride Festival Organization (PFO): The Pride Festival activities in Bangkok are organized by a committee of volunteers who have been selected by the community. PFO operates as a not-for-profit entity to produce entertainment, education and informational events to promote a positive image of the gay, lesbian, bisexual and transgender community in Thailand, and to raise money for needy Thai charities, particularly those serving the GLBT community.

As you can see from the above, there are currently major differences in the objectives between Pride in Pattaya and Pride in Bangkok. These differences account for the differences between the two organizations in both the way they operate and in the way they receive and disburse money. Thus, it is difficult to make comparisons between the financial performance of the two organizations to determine which is more "efficient". For Pattaya, their main objective is raising money for charities. For Bangkok, our main objective is raising money for the Pride parade and related events such as Pride in the Park. Thus, one cannot look at our financial statements to determine a ratio between our expenses (for the parade, etc.) and our contributions to charities. It's like comparing "apples to oranges".

There are of course valid ways of measuring our performance. One is to look at our expenditures. Another concern raised in this forum was in regards to our expenditures for meals for our volunteers during planning sessions. One poster even went so far as to call our meals "lavish dinners".

Our discussion on whether to cover meals (at cost) for our over 20 volunteers centered around the fact that our committee members come from a very diverse financial backgrounds. Also, with the amount of preparations required for PFO, the committee has spent a lot of time together, usually after work. Thus, we decided that we should cover the meals (at cost) for our meetings so as to encourage the broadest range of people from the gay community to participate in the planning of Pride Festival 2006. The meals were approximately 60 baht (at cost) per person. (Please note that at the restaurants that served the committee, an average non-alcoholic beverage would have cost over 60 baht.) There was a comment on this forum that meals could be obtained for less but we felt that we needed a suitable environment for our planning sessions. And we genuinely believed that spending 60 baht a meal per person was a reasonably prudent amount. Additionally, on the 4th and 5th of November for the Pride in the Park and Parade, water was also catered for the volunteers and marching band, totaling over 100 persons, also at wholesale cost.

The restaurants mentioned by the posters were active volunteers on the PFO Committee, and also donated cash as sponsors. There was really no need for any of them to turn around and try to profit from all the efforts at PFO.

As our financial information will show when it is put on our website, a significant part of the expenses went to outreach for the broad GLBT community and funding for an official float during the Parade. The Committee struggled over several meetings before deciding to go ahead with the float. The rationale of the float was to achieve our primary objectives. It was important that the Parade not be merely a number of commercial floats but actually had one to set the right tone and spirit of Pride Festival -- to raise a stronger sense of pride within the GLBT community. There were questions that an official float costing about 60,000 baht was excessive. The committee actually reviewed three proposals, costing 110,000, 90,000 and 60,000. We selected not just the least cost proposal but also the one that seemed to achieve our primary objectives the best.

A significant impact on our financial statements is that the Pride 2006 Committee recommended that Pride Festival be registered as a Non-Profit Organization or Foundation. Under the law, we are required to have over 200,000 baht for that purpose. Thus, we are holding 200,000 baht in our bank account for that purpose. The major reason for our wanting to be registered is that this would permit us to add mainstream sponsors such as airlines, global beverage brands, automobiles, etc. Also, as a foundation, we would have complete financial accountability that the Revenue Department, in addition to the GLBT community at large, can audit.

There was criticism on this forum that PFO is not "open" about its finances. That is actually not the case. A meeting was held for sponsors and direct donors and detailed financial information for 2006 was passed out. In addition, following past practices, two of our sponsors but non-committee members, O Ho Restaurant and Om Yim Lodge, did an independent audit of our finances at our request and found no problems. Any other sponsors and direct donors may also do an audit.

In addition, we will be including detailed financial information on our 2007 web site. Unfortunately, we are behind schedule in bringing the 2007 web site on line because of the delay in finding a new volunteer webmaster. On March 5, a new volunteer webmaster joined us and one of his top priorities will be to put the financial information on the web site.

There was a question on this forum about our current web site having only the date of this year's Pride Parade and an ad for a webmaster and no 2006 information. The problem is that one of our sponsors, who had donated website hosting, did not renew for 2007 and we had to move temporarily to a free web hosting company, which cannot support for free the amount of traffic we have.

The PFO Committee is well aware of the need to improve both the website and communications in general. We are adding volunteers to improve on both fronts for 2007.

While financial achievement is one measure of the PFO performance, I would like to summarize how 2006 has progressed towards our stated primary objectives of bringing awareness and pride to the community.

In the 2006 parade, we had over 20 floats, including for the first time in many years, several from NGO's, lesbian groups, and a contingent from Japan.

This year, we had sponsorships and donations from over 30 businesses, including many Thai GLBT businesses, as well as several women's clubs and mainstream brands that have never participated in Pride in the past. We have also received support from 30 NGO's and media partners. And our Annual General Meeting was hosted by Human Rights Commission of Thailand. The Rainbow Health Fair in the park included both local and international NGO's as well as relevant ministries in the government. Our sporting events enjoyed record numbers of participants, including GLBT teams from Beijing and Hong Kong, as well as local mainstream teams competing together.

As our outreach program, we have distributed tens of thousands of brochures, post cards and posters, in not only GLBT businesses but also mainstream shopping malls and outlets.

We held two well-attended media conferences, and as a result, we were covered by a couple of TV programs, and over 30 print articles on Thai, English, and even Japanese mainstream newspapers, magazines and websites, in addition to the extensive support by GLBT media. One very promising development for future fundraising included one TV story and several print articles about the opportunity for mainstream brands to advertise targeting the GLBT market segment – a relatively new marketing concept for Thai businesses.

We believe the 2006 achievements are merely small but positive inroads towards our objectives, with a great deal more work to be done in building a positive image, mutual respect and acceptance of GLBT community by its own members as well as by the general public in Thailand.

I've read carefully all the posts on this forum about Bangkok Pride. I think I've addressed here all the concerns and suggestions contained in those posts. For ongoing comments and suggestions throughout the year, we will have a feedback feature on our 2007 web site for you to communicate with us directly. Also, I hope the information I have given here will encourage some of you to join the committee and to help us plan for a bigger and better Pride Festival 2007.

Tony King

Pride Festival Committee

[jdinasia]

nice work Tony! keep it up!

[bibendum]

Board members will be pleased to learn that the Pride Festival website is now live.

There is little detail at the moment but it is expected the accounts and a lot more will be posted soon.

Well done Tibor.

[endure]

Board members will be pleased to learn that the Pride Festival website is now live.

There is little detail at the moment but it is expected the accounts and a lot more will be posted soon.

Well done Tibor.

A URL would be helpful...

[Boxer]

Board members will be pleased to learn that the Pride Festival website is now live.

There is little detail at the moment but it is expected the accounts and a lot more will be posted soon.

Well done Tibor.

A URL would be helpful...

http://www.pridefestival.org

Edited April 15, 2007 by Boxer