Just think! If only Spain had controlled Gibraltar from 1939 to 1945.

2 hours ago, Sydebolle said:

On the other hand, look at it from the positive side. The more those EU morons bark and whine the more united the UK will be; they never liked (nor needed) to take instructions from some non-elected self-profiling neurotics - anywhere!  

The UK has never been so dis-united as it is now. Thankfully the old nag is reaching the end of the road; soon it will be put out of its misery, to the benefit of all. 

10 hours ago, Samui Bodoh said:

"...Recalling how EU policy on Gibraltar had so far largely favoured Britain, which joined the bloc before Spain, a senior EU official told Reuters recently: "Now the table has turned."

 

"The Union position ... was the British position ... But with Brexit, the Union position is now the Spanish position. We will always take the side of a member against a non-member," the official said..."

 

This is the proverbial 'Brave New World' for the UK; in a short time, you will no longer have the wholehearted backing of the world's largest economic area behind you as you negotiate, but rather against you when dealing with the EU.

 

It can be a sad, scary feeling after all these years, but the simple fact is now when the UK is in a dispute with someone, and that moment arrives when you look over your shoulder to be reassured that you've got your mates at your back, there ain't going to be anyone there.

 

The UK needs to make a few... adjustments in its world view and the UK's place within it.

 

Sigh...

 

It was all so unnecessary...

 

PS I would also point out that all those 'superior trade deals' that the pro-Brexit people talked about are going to occur with the same limitations; simply put, the UK has weakened itself greatly just before trying to to negotiate a better economic future. How do you think that will go? I will hope for the best, but expect something less...

 

 

I have news for you  -- the UK has never felt that it had the EU at its back, not unless the EU happened to have a knife in its hand at the time.

11 hours ago, Samui Bodoh said:

It can be a sad, scary feeling after all these years, but the simple fact is now when the UK is in a dispute with someone, and that moment arrives when you look over your shoulder to be reassured that you've got your mates at your back, there ain't going to be anyone there

Oh well.

 

Been there.

 

Done that.

 

Got the Tee shirt.

Edited February 2, 20197 yr by JAG

4 hours ago, zydeco said:

Just think! If only Spain had controlled Gibraltar from 1939 to 1945.

Absolutely!

 

Great fun, these "what if" looks at history.

 

Just think, the Mediterranian really would have been Mussolini's "Mare Nostra",

Malta would have fallen. The Axis could have taken Egypt and the Middle Eastern oil fields, Germany would not have needed to invade Russia.

 

Germany would control the whole of Europe, with France, Italy and Spain doing what they were told.

 

Golly, in that case, there would have been no need to invent the EU!

????

 

 

 

 

Edited February 2, 20197 yr by JAG

19 minutes ago, JAG said:

Oh well.

 

Been there.

 

Done that.

 

Got the Tee shirt.

Agreed, but on previous occasions our leaders were up to it.

1 minute ago, evadgib said:

Agreed, but on previous occasions our leaders were up to it.

It's not the leaders that get the job done.

 

Remember Cadiz? QE1 was having a bit of strife with the Spaniards so she sent Frank Drake, a privateer down there. Sorted.

 

Remember the Falklands? Maggie was having a problem with a bit of Argie Bargie. She sent the lads down there. Sorted.

 

We don't need anyone's help to sort our problems out. We just send the lads in.

10 hours ago, sungod said:

I note they are both classed as Spanish autonomous cities, not colonies.

muchas gracias amigo

10 hours ago, sungod said:

I note they are both classed as Spanish autonomous cities, not colonies.

That's because Spain doesn't want them, but owns them already... ???? 

Gibraltar, on the other hand, as a colony, needs to be freed by Spain. ????

 

Imagine, Germany called French Polynesia, New Caledonia, or Reunion colonies... Start of WW3! ????

Edited February 2, 20197 yr by StayinThailand2much

7 minutes ago, StayinThailand2much said:

That's because Spain doesn't want them, but owns them already... ???? 

Gibraltar, on the other hand, as a colony, needs to be freed by Spain. ????

 

Imagine, Germany called French Polynesia, New Caledonia, or Reunion colonies... Start of WW3! ????

Gibraltar only needs to be freed by Spain, if you happen to be Spanish, perhaps?

 

The people of Gibraltar are not interested in being freed from the UK.

 

1 hour ago, JAG said:

(...)

Germany would control the whole of Europe, with France, Italy and Spain doing what they were told.

 

Golly, in that case, there would have been no need to invent the EU!

????

And Britain would be out all the same... ????

41 minutes ago, Spidey said:

It's not the leaders that get the job done.

 

Remember Cadiz? QE1 was having a bit of strife with the Spaniards so she sent Frank Drake, a privateer down there. Sorted.

 

Remember the Falklands? Maggie was having a problem with a bit of Argie Bargie. She sent the lads down there. Sorted.

 

We don't need anyone's help to sort our problems out. We just send the lads in.

It's the leaders that have to make the decisions for military action. Without them then nothing happens.

 

A bit like Brexit now - we have a weak "leader" - so not much happens.

3 minutes ago, nauseus said:

Gibraltar only needs to be freed by Spain, if you happen to be Spanish, perhaps?

 

The people of Gibraltar are not interested in being freed from the UK.

 

Ah, but you forget, this is a pronouncement by the EU.

 

What has the opinion of the people affected have to do with it?

 

Please do try to keep up!

 

????

 

 

11 minutes ago, nauseus said:

Gibraltar only needs to be freed by Spain, if you happen to be Spanish, perhaps?

 

The people of Gibraltar are not interested in being freed from the UK.

 

It was an ironic remark, in regards to Spain's: "Gibraltar = Britain's colony", but "Ceuta, Melilla = 'Spanish autonomous cities'"...

 

Looking how Spain is run, people in Gibraltar are lucky to be on 'the right side' of the border.

Edited February 2, 20197 yr by StayinThailand2much

1 hour ago, Mavideol said:

muchas gracias amigo

Nor will the Falklands ever be known as Las Malvinas.

52 minutes ago, JAG said:

Ah, but you forget, this is a pronouncement by the EU.

 

What has the opinion of the people affected have to do with it?

 

Please do try to keep up!

 

????

 

 

Brexit?

13 hours ago, Samui Bodoh said:

"...Recalling how EU policy on Gibraltar had so far largely favoured Britain, which joined the bloc before Spain, a senior EU official told Reuters recently: "Now the table has turned."

 

"The Union position ... was the British position ... But with Brexit, the Union position is now the Spanish position. We will always take the side of a member against a non-member," the official said..."

 

This is the proverbial 'Brave New World' for the UK; in a short time, you will no longer have the wholehearted backing of the world's largest economic area behind you as you negotiate, but rather against you when dealing with the EU.

 

It can be a sad, scary feeling after all these years, but the simple fact is now when the UK is in a dispute with someone, and that moment arrives when you look over your shoulder to be reassured that you've got your mates at your back, there ain't going to be anyone there.

 

The UK needs to make a few... adjustments in its world view and the UK's place within it.

 

Sigh...

 

It was all so unnecessary...

 

PS I would also point out that all those 'superior trade deals' that the pro-Brexit people talked about are going to occur with the same limitations; simply put, the UK has weakened itself greatly just before trying to to negotiate a better economic future. How do you think that will go? I will hope for the best, but expect something less...

 

 

Yeah, but blue passports, bendy bananas and chlorinated chickens will make it all worth it...

8 hours ago, Spidey said:

Nope. British Overseas Territory.

col·o·ny

Dictionary result for colony

 

1. 1.

   a country or area under the full or partial political control of another country, typically a distant one, and occupied by settlers from that country.

14 hours ago, evadgib said:

UK can and will return the compliment via the Basques/Catalans in Spain & minorities in other member states if this disgraceful posturing continues post 29 March.

At least until the Scots have themselves away from the UK, (rightly) sick as everyone else is becoming of the horror show that is Westminster.

It isn't only Brexit but the UK itself at stake. And still we are told that somehow it will be alright on the night. For Christ's sake...

The EU  just keeps shooting itself in the foot. The people of Gibraltar wish to remain with the UK. They have said so twice in referendums that voted massively in favour of remaining with the UK. The treaty of Utrecht was clear in its statement of perpetuity.  There  should be no doubt and no discussion.

 

What we see now, is the true duplicity and dishonesty of the EU members particularly the poorer parasitic members like Spain and Belgium. There was never any  support of the  only legitimate position of keeping Gibraltar with the UK: What existed was lip service with backstabbing as soon as the UK was out of the room. Now we see the EU for what it is. How civilized countries like the Netherlands, Denmark etc. remain in what has become a new Franco/German economic bully cartel is puzzling. 

 

9 hours ago, geriatrickid said:

The EU  just keeps shooting itself in the foot. The people of Gibraltar wish to remain with the UK. They have said so twice in referendums that voted massively in favour of remaining with the UK. The treaty of Utrecht was clear in its statement of perpetuity.  There  should be no doubt and no discussion.

 

What we see now, is the true duplicity and dishonesty of the EU members particularly the poorer parasitic members like Spain and Belgium. There was never any  support of the  only legitimate position of keeping Gibraltar with the UK: What existed was lip service with backstabbing as soon as the UK was out of the room. Now we see the EU for what it is. How civilized countries like the Netherlands, Denmark etc. remain in what has become a new Franco/German economic bully cartel is puzzling. 

 

Belgium, The Netherlands and Denmark are, effectively, economically entirely dependent on Germany. I have heard a couple of Dutch friends of my mine bemoan the fact that they are "an economic colony" (since we are on the subject!).

 

Tell Spain where to stick its colonic irritation.

Its just a bit of name calling. Throw one back.

 

'The EU are like modern day Nazis, engulfing Europe with their demands.'

 

I feel better already.

 

 

27 minutes ago, JAG said:

Belgium, The Netherlands and Denmark are, effectively, economically entirely dependent on Germany. I have heard a couple of Dutch friends of my mine bemoan the fact that they are "an economic colony" (since we are on the subject!).

 

It is true that the economy of the smaller neighbors is largely dependent on the economy of Germany. But they all benefit from it.

So what do your Dutch friends actually bemoan? Is it that like some Brexiteers they want to be more 'sovereign' (but also significantly poorer)?

5 minutes ago, whatsupdoc said:

It is true that the economy of the smaller neighbors is largely dependent on the economy of Germany. But they all benefit from it.

So what do your Dutch friends actually bemoan? Is it that like some Brexiteers they want to be more 'sovereign' (but also significantly poorer)?

It's like a flea complaining about being dependent on a dog, only going where that dog goes, and having to put up with all the other fleas and ticks living on that dog - coming over here from some poorer dog, taking my dog's hard earned blood!  The flea is always free to exit the dog and make its own way in life, but will it really be any better off as a fleeing free flea?

On 2/2/2019 at 11:02 AM, Bluespunk said:

Why? That’s what it is. 

 

No it isn't.

 

 

13 hours ago, geriatrickid said:

The EU  just keeps shooting itself in the foot. The people of Gibraltar wish to remain with the UK. They have said so twice in referendums that voted massively in favour of remaining with the UK. The treaty of Utrecht was clear in its statement of perpetuity.  There  should be no doubt and no discussion.

 

What we see now, is the true duplicity and dishonesty of the EU members particularly the poorer parasitic members like Spain and Belgium. There was never any  support of the  only legitimate position of keeping Gibraltar with the UK: What existed was lip service with backstabbing as soon as the UK was out of the room. Now we see the EU for what it is. How civilized countries like the Netherlands, Denmark etc. remain in what has become a new Franco/German economic bully cartel is puzzling. 

 

 

Yet the same EU supported the Catalans and defied the Spanish courts and lawful requests to extradite the former Catalan parliament leader who defied the courts.

 

The EU - politically correct rather than worried about democracy, justice, laws etc

6 hours ago, whatsupdoc said:

It is true that the economy of the smaller neighbors is largely dependent on the economy of Germany. But they all benefit from it.

So what do your Dutch friends actually bemoan? Is it that like some Brexiteers they want to be more 'sovereign' (but also significantly poorer)?

I don't know, they made the comment quite some time ago, when I was working with them, I  am not in touch with them, and I presume anyway that they are in Holland and I am here now, so I can't really ask them. The fact remains that they said it, and they were part of a (well educated) group of professional people, working in an organisation which drew it's members from a number of European countries. They (the Dutch) all seemed to be like minded on the matter. I therefore assume that it was a view that was reasonably widely held.

Edited February 3, 20197 yr by JAG

3 hours ago, Baerboxer said:

 

No it isn't.

 

 

Yes it is and up to 2002 was classified as such, until the Blairite govt got all touchy feely about the word.

But, what about the monkeys??