Alternative to Transferwise for Monthly transfers-new visa regs

[Genericnic]

2 hours ago, skatewash said:

Thank you for the link to the other thread. 

Did you know that you can link directly to a specific comment in that thread?  It's fairly easy to do.  Just go to the comment you want to link to and right-click on the timestamp for the post (upper left corner of the post, for example:  "Posted 37 minutes ago.")  Select "Copy link address" or similar to get a link directly to that comment.  Past the link into your new post.  After a few moments you will see "You're link has been automatically embedded. Display as a link instead."  If you click on "Display as a link instead" it will make a link directly to the comment of interest.  Instead, if you accept the link being embedded it will make the link to the entire thread and then someone will have to find the comment you are referencing.  In other words, you want to display as a link rather than have the link automatically embedded which is the default behavior.  When someone clicks on your direct link they will go straight to the comment you are referencing, not just the thread.

In this case, not a big deal because comment #12 was on the first page of the thread, but if you were linking to a huge multi-page thread it would be a real benefit to link directly to the comment rather than to the entire thread.

Thanks skatewash. Was not aware of how to do it. Information filed for future reference.

 

David

[ToddinChonburi]

I have not had any problems with transfers from bank in the United States to Bangkok bank using transferwise. Always coded FTT

[OJAS]

5 hours ago, thetefldon said:

Thanks for that and info in PM. So 20 GBP a pop from First Direct who say it is free and a charge in Thailand by BB to receive it. Compare to a fee of around 14 GBP from Transferwise, a slightly better rate and no charge in Thailand.

 

A no brainer cost wise BUT peace of mind wise perhaps not.

 

Really appreciate the helpful comments on this thread.

You might like to consider making monthly transfers from your FD to Bangkok Bank accounts via the latter's London branch? Unlike its New York counterpart this facility doesn't appear to be going away any time soon.

 

Doesn't come cheap, though, at £20 a pop at the London end + 0.25% at the Bangkok end if the GBP-to-THB conversion is done in Bangkok rather than London. Alternatively it is possible to have the conversion done pre-transfer in London, but don't be fooled by the sole £15 charge: the exchange rate used by the London branch is much worse than the corresponding TT rate used at the Bangkok end, and the difference would more than offset the £5 + 0.25% saving, I understand.

 

In any case, according to a report which I distinctly recall on here from @Kalasin Jo the coveted FTT coding is only guaranteed for GBP-to-THB conversions performed in Bangkok: those performed in London, I gather, risk being assigned a non-international coding.

 

I myself have now reverted to the London branch/Bangkok GBP-to-THB conversion method for my monthly 65k+ transfers after 18 months of using TransferWise in view of the coding issue uncertainties which the recent monthly income changes have thrown up. Unfortunately, you will, however, need to jump through some hoops before you can start using the London branch service.

 

Further info, in case you are interested, is contained in this link:-

 

https://www.bangkokbank.com/en/Personal/Other-Services/Transfers/Transferring-Into-Thailand/Transfer-money-from-UK-to-Thailand-via-London-Branch

 

 

Edited March 9, 2019 by OJAS

[Fairynuff]

It would seem that with all the confusion over transfers, when they need to start from, how they’re coded and the apparent lack of the promised leniency up to now, that quite likely there will be a lot of people losing their extension.

[jacko45k]

13 hours ago, ToddinChonburi said:

I have not had any problems with transfers from bank in the United States to Bangkok bank using transferwise. Always coded FTT

That might be a more useful statement if you told us how many you had done, presumably more than two. In my case, from the UK, 2/3 have shown up as FTT.

[wgdanson]

18 hours ago, jimn said:

I am not doubting you because I dont know and I am not Swedish. I would say however that this seems most unusual. In every case from transfering from the UK it is always cheaper to send ££££ and for the money to be transferred into baht using the Thai banks TT exchange rate. The same goes with using a credit card abroad, never choose to let the originating bank do the exchange, it is always poor. Are you 100% sure what you state is true, as I say I am not doubting your belief but I will be very surprised if this is the case.

 

18 hours ago, Proboscis said:

The only reason Transferwise is in business is because of the awful foreign exchange rates given by the British banks

Then why do they operate in USA, Aus and most other countries please?

[thetefldon]

13 hours ago, OJAS said:

You might like to consider making monthly transfers from your FD to Bangkok Bank accounts via the latter's London branch? Unlike its New York counterpart this facility doesn't appear to be going away any time soon.

 

Doesn't come cheap, though, at £20 a pop at the London end + 0.25% at the Bangkok end if the GBP-to-THB conversion is done in Bangkok rather than London. Alternatively it is possible to have the conversion done pre-transfer in London, but don't be fooled by the sole £15 charge: the exchange rate used by the London branch is much worse than the corresponding TT rate used at the Bangkok end, and the difference would more than offset the £5 + 0.25% saving, I understand.

 

In any case, according to a report which I distinctly recall on here from @Kalasin Jo the coveted FTT coding is only guaranteed for GBP-to-THB conversions performed in Bangkok: those performed in London, I gather, risk being assigned a non-international coding.

 

I myself have now reverted to the London branch/Bangkok GBP-to-THB conversion method for my monthly 65k+ transfers after 18 months of using TransferWise in view of the coding issue uncertainties which the recent monthly income changes have thrown up. Unfortunately, you will, however, need to jump through some hoops before you can start using the London branch service.

 

Further info, in case you are interested, is contained in this link:-

 

https://www.bangkokbank.com/en/Personal/Other-Services/Transfers/Transferring-Into-Thailand/Transfer-money-from-UK-to-Thailand-via-London-Branch

 

 

Thanks, yes have used them in the past. I looked again recently, NOW there seems to be a new registration form to complete, that needs to be registered in London, if I am reading it correctly? Requires proof of address etc. I don't have a UK address anymore so is there a workaround?

[Henryford]

18 hours ago, scubascuba3 said:

18 hours ago, jacko45k said:

Don't sweat it. You may at the time be able to persuade them  if you can show them paperwork tying the withdrawal from your home account to the arrival in your Thailand account. Depends on your office... 
I just had a friend get lucky in that respect in Jomtiem, persuading an IO that despite not having as much as 65,000 every month, the average was more than that for the year. 
 
Else you need to get 800,000 in there 2 (or is it 3) months before .

Technically all Transferwise transfers are domestic, it just depends if Immigration do a bit of investigation and decide all are deemed as domestic

I don't see how TW can be deemed as "domestic" when they only transfer money INTO Thailand. How can it be anything else but international. Also my PDF receipt clearly shows a conversion from GBP to Thai baht. So it MUST be international. Despite this though i understand that Immigration might/will not accept it.

[trd]

I don't see how TW can be deemed as "domestic" when they only transfer money INTO Thailand. How can it be anything else but international. Also my PDF receipt clearly shows a conversion from GBP to Thai baht. So it MUST be international. Despite this though i understand that Immigration might/will not accept it.

Transferwise don't transfer money into Thailand.

[ThaiBunny]

2 minutes ago, Henryford said:

I don't see how TW can be deemed as "domestic" when they only transfer money INTO Thailand.

I've assumed since the changes that Immigration are simply substituting a certificate/letter from a Thai bank in place of an Embassy letter.  Except in unusual circumstances the chances that they will want to examine the details of the underlying bank book would be next to never.  They're outsourcing the verification to the bank OR the embassy, whichever will do it for them and they don't basically care which that is

[Tanoshi]

55 minutes ago, trd said:

57 minutes ago, Henryford said:

I don't see how TW can be deemed as "domestic" when they only transfer money INTO Thailand. How can it be anything else but international. Also my PDF receipt clearly shows a conversion from GBP to Thai baht. So it MUST be international. Despite this though i understand that Immigration might/will not accept it.

Transferwise don't transfer money into Thailand.

Neither do banks or any other financial institutions.

 

Pony express, postman Pat and carrier pigeons are now extinct, this is the age of electronic transfers, a debit and credit facility from one account to another. What do you think FTT stand for!

[trd]

Neither do banks or any other financial institutions.
 
Pony express, postman Pat and carrier pigeons are now extinct, this is the age of electronic transfers, a debit and credit facility from one account to another. What do you think FTT stand for!

I'm well aware that cash isn't transferred by carrier pigeon. Transferwise does not do a swift transfer from another country to Thailand like banks do. They take the money out of your bank and they instruct their local office in Thailand to do a domestic transfer to your account. The business model relies on transferring money back and forth between local offices based on favorable exchange rates. How do you think they can offer the mid market rate to you? They have a sum of money on which they draw to make domestic transfers. A swift transfer is different. That money is electronically transferred from one country to another and exchanged to the local currency.

[Tanoshi]

1 hour ago, ThaiBunny said:

I've assumed since the changes that Immigration are simply substituting a certificate/letter from a Thai bank in place of an Embassy letter.  Except in unusual circumstances the chances that they will want to examine the details of the underlying bank book would be next to never.  They're outsourcing the verification to the bank OR the embassy, whichever will do it for them and they don't basically care which that is

Unlike an Embassy letter which states a figure of income, the bank letter simply confirms your account.

It's only your passbook/statements that detail amounts of income for Immigration to check.

[Henryford]

1 hour ago, trd said:

Transferwise don't transfer money into Thailand. 

So you think they can fund thai bank accounts like mine and thousands of others without ever funding them from abroad ?

[trd]

So you think they can fund thai bank accounts like mine and thousands of others without ever funding them from abroad ?

Of course they are funded from abroad. How would they have the money locally to transfer to your account otherwise?

[Henryford]

Just now, trd said:

Of course they are funded from abroad. How would they have the money locally to transfer to your account otherwise? 

But you just said TW don't transfer money into Thailand, make up your mind.

 

1 hour ago, trd said:

1 hour ago, Henryford said:

I don't see how TW can be deemed as "domestic" when they only transfer money INTO Thailand. How can it be anything else but international. Also my PDF receipt clearly shows a conversion from GBP to Thai baht. So it MUST be international. Despite this though i understand that Immigration might/will not accept it.

Transferwise don't transfer money into Thailand.

 

[trd]

 

If transferwise transfers money to their local office in Thailand as a source of funding that will be a foreign transfer which will appear on their statement. When their office sends Thai baht to your local account that will be a domestic transfer and will appear on your statement. I can't make it clearer than that.

 

[skatewash]

3 minutes ago, Henryford said:

So you think they can fund thai bank accounts like mine and thousands of others without ever funding them from abroad ?

Of course it's an international transfer.  To believe otherwise is absurd.  Money that belongs to you in one country has been transferred to another country where you continue to own it.  The transaction is an international transfer.  How it gets tagged by individual banks that participate in the transaction is the issue.  And no one would really care about that if we didn't have to demonstrate to Thai Immigration's satisfaction that the funds were transferred internationally.  If people believe TW transfers aren't international then why do they believe that SWIFT transfers are?  It's rather a silly argument in my opinion.

[trd]

Of course it's an international transfer.  To believe otherwise is absurd.  Money that belongs to you in one country has been transferred to another country where you continue to own it.  The transaction is an international transfer.  How it gets tagged by individual banks that participate in the transaction is the issue.  And no one would really care about that if we didn't have to demonstrate to Thai Immigration's satisfaction that the funds were transferred internationally.  If people believe TW transfers aren't international then why do they believe that SWIFT transfers are?  It's rather a silly argument in my opinion.

It's not an international transfer if the Thai baht is coming from transferwise local Thai office is it?

[Tanoshi]

16 minutes ago, trd said:

I'm well aware that cash isn't transferred by carrier pigeon. Transferwise does not do a swift transfer from another country to Thailand like banks do. They take the money out of your bank and they instruct their local office in Thailand to do a domestic transfer to your account. The business model relies on transferring money back and forth between local offices based on favorable exchange rates. How do you think they can offer the mid market rate to you? They have a sum of money on which they draw to make domestic transfers. A swift transfer is different. That money is electronically transferred from one country to another and exchanged to the local currency.

 

So your point being what exactly about Transferwise.

That it's not guaranteed to be coded as an FTT transaction?

[trd]

So your point being what exactly about Transferwise.
That it's not guaranteed to be coded as an FTT transaction?

Exactly!

[ThaiBunny]

My understanding of how TW works is that they maintain bank accounts in multiple countries from which they disperse funds to banks within that country.  They also add to the funds they have in any one country when/if someone seeks a transfer.  However they may decide to pool a number of transfers from (say) the US received within a few hours into a single large transfer so as to get a better exchange rate.  In Thailand they have accounts with (it is rumoured) two or three banks and transfer from those banks to the specific bank the transferor has requested.  It may be the same bank, it may not.  To assume that you "own" the money while it is being transferred between your account in one country to your account in a different country defies the practices of modern commerce.  At best the money is in their name, held in trust for you

[Henryford]

3 minutes ago, trd said:

5 minutes ago, skatewash said:

Of course it's an international transfer.  To believe otherwise is absurd.  Money that belongs to you in one country has been transferred to another country where you continue to own it.  The transaction is an international transfer.  How it gets tagged by individual banks that participate in the transaction is the issue.  And no one would really care about that if we didn't have to demonstrate to Thai Immigration's satisfaction that the funds were transferred internationally.  If people believe TW transfers aren't international then why do they believe that SWIFT transfers are?  It's rather a silly argument in my opinion.

It's not an international transfer if the Thai baht is coming from transferwise local Thai office is it?

I would maintain it is an international transfer but it just doesn't happen at the same time. But of course what i think is immaterial if Immigration don't agree.

[trd]

I would maintain it is an international transfer but it just doesn't happen at the same time. But of course what i think is immaterial if Immigration don't agree.

Why do you think TW can guarantee the exact Baht amount that will appear in your account? You can't do that with a swift transfer because the exchange rate can fluctuate in the period the transfer is being executed Also when I receive money into my account from TW there is no transfer/commission fee because it's a local domestic transfer in Baht. There is no exchange rate conversion.

 

[trd]

https://transferwise.com/help/article/1779442/basic-information/how-does-it-work-a-video-guide

[skatewash]

15 minutes ago, skatewash said:

Of course it's an international transfer.  To believe otherwise is absurd.  Money that belongs to you in one country has been transferred to another country where you continue to own it.  The transaction is an international transfer.  How it gets tagged by individual banks that participate in the transaction is the issue.  And no one would really care about that if we didn't have to demonstrate to Thai Immigration's satisfaction that the funds were transferred internationally.  If people believe TW transfers aren't international then why do they believe that SWIFT transfers are?  It's rather a silly argument in my opinion.

 

11 minutes ago, Tanoshi said:

So your point being what exactly about Transferwise.

That it's not guaranteed to be coded as an FTT transaction?

 

Of course, it's not guaranteed to be coded as an FTT transaction, that's why there's a problem.  My what a long journey through "it's not an international transfer"-land we've been on only to get back to the starting line.  ???? 
 

 

Edited March 10, 2019 by skatewash

[trd]

 
Of course, it's not guaranteed to be coded as an FTT transaction, that's why there's a problem.  My what a long journey through "it's not an international transfer"-land we've been on only to get back to the starting line.  [emoji6] 
 
 

I bought some oranges yesterday that came from Malaysia but I didn't buy them from Malaysia. I bought them from Lotus. Get it?

[Tanoshi]

1 minute ago, trd said:

1 minute ago, Tanoshi said:

So your point being what exactly about Transferwise.
That it's not guaranteed to be coded as an FTT transaction?

Exactly!

Neither is a bank using a SWIFT code.

All foreign bank to bank transactions to Thailand go through the Head office of the bank, then they transfer it 'locally' to your branch. These can be coded as 'domestic' or 'local' payments in your passbook, depending on your bank.

 

The problem of transactions not being coded 100% as from overseas is not confined to just Transferwise, it's also an issue with the Thai banking method of recording the source of the transfer.

 

There are other international transfer system at work as well, such as when a Pension is paid directly into your Thai account.

[trd]

Neither is a bank using a SWIFT code.
All foreign bank to bank transactions to Thailand go through the Head office of the bank, then they transfer it 'locally' to your branch. These can be coded as 'domestic' or 'local' payments in your passbook, depending on your bank.
 
The problem of transactions not being coded 100% as from overseas is not confined to just Transferwise, it's also an issue with the Thai banking method of recording the source of the transfer.
 
There are other international transfer system at work as well, such as when a Pension is paid directly into your Thai account.

Of course they transfer it locally. They don't load the cash onto crates and put it on a cargo ship and deliver it to you. You are missing the point.

[skatewash]

3 minutes ago, trd said:

7 minutes ago, skatewash said:

 
Of course, it's not guaranteed to be coded as an FTT transaction, that's why there's a problem.  My what a long journey through "it's not an international transfer"-land we've been on only to get back to the starting line.   
 
 

I bought some oranges yesterday that came from Malaysia but I didn't buy them from Malaysia. I bought them from Lotus. Get it?

I don't know from oranges.  The point you seem to be missing (repeatedly) is that an international transfer done through TW via an intermediary bank (partner bank in Thailand: TMB, BBL, or Kasikorn) is the same sort of international transfer that occurs when done through SWIFT via an intermediary bank in Thailand.  The transaction initiated in one country has the effect of money being credited and debited so that it passes into another country and ends up in the destination account.  It's a transaction that occurs in several legs. In the case of TW or SWIFT there is enough information in the transaction that reaches each bank for them to correctly identify it as an international transfer.  In the case of a SWIFT transfer the banks seem capable of marking the transaction correctly.  That doesn't seem to be the case for TW.

It seems you are arguing that a SWIFT transfer made from a bank in the US to SCB in Thailand that flows through an intermediary bank (BBL) should not be marked as an international transfer because the money from BBL is sent domestically to SCB on the final leg.  Often those sort of transactions are marked as international because the source of the money being transferred is from outside the country.  That marking continues to attach to the transaction on each leg of the journey.