EC accuses activist, critic of libel

By The Nation

 

 

The Election Commission (EC) has sued political activist Nuttaa Mahuttana and political critic Sirote Klampaiboon for allegedly libeling the agency.

 

Sirote on Friday posted on Facebook that he had received a summons demanding that he and Nuttaa report to the police on Thursday, April 11.

 

The complaint against the duo was filed by the EC’s legal chief Nawat Boonsri, accusing them of co-defaming the agency.

 

Sirote said it is the first time he has been summoned by the police and he wrote that he is perplexed how he had defamed the EC.

 

“I’m confident when I spoke of the EC ... I always insisted that most of the criticisms against the agency were about the inefficiency in the operational level,” he said. 

 

“It’s never about the commissioners and never about accusing them of committing fraud.”

 

Nuttaa posted on Facebook that the charge may have stemmed from the special news programme on election day which the duo co-hosted.

 

“This is the fifth summons I've got. And I have another suspect here - Sirote. So, this means that this stemmed from us doing our duty as media on election day,” Nuttaa wrote. “I’m confident I have never been libelous. All I did was inform the people about the rules and regulations of the vote.”

 

Both said they would report to the police as requested.

 

Source: http://www.nationmultimedia.com/detail/breakingnews/30367218

 

-- © Copyright The Nation 2019-04-05

I also see seven people have been arrested for sharing or forwarding the petition link to dissolve/fire the EC. But apparently, under the junta constitution, you’re allowed to petition in this manner. ‘It’s your right’. Guess they’ll have to arrest the 840k people who signed it. Unless of course it’s legal to sign it just not share it.

 

Make it up as you go along. See how far you can push the envelope.

 

I can’t even imagine how frustrated Thais who want change in this country are feeling right now. 

Incredible how an agency whose reputation can (at best) be described as mud can just file charges against people for reporting about clear and obvious faults in their management.

Whatever happens, the election results are meaningless now anyways, the whole thing was a complete fiasco, and an expensive, futile one at that.

Edited April 5, 20197 yr by z42

Everyone getting into the act of using the law to silence disagreement. Its gone crazy.

How much more are the Thais willing to take ....??

Ah, abuse the law to try and shut down legitimate criticism. Instead of trying to abuse the law, maybe next time they could actually do their job and ensure a free and fair election is being held, without granting one side of the divide an unfair advantage and abusing the law to abolish a party on no legal basis whatsoever. 

 

I guess the above might prompt even more legal action right ? The facts of the piss poor job the EC has been doing are piling up in the meantime. But hey let's sue people for telling the truth. 

The way they abused Thai laws right now is like robbing people in the daylight.  

4 hours ago, Eligius said:

How much more are the Thais willing to take ....??

If you have ever been to a Thai junior and mid level school you would understand how the process of indoctrination works.

I am not being critical here, just mentioning how the love of the King, the country, the family and "Thainess" is impregnated.

Lesser but also important is not making waves, not becoming angry, not going against traditional Thai structures.

If you do, you lose "face" and are seen to be anti Thai.

The children also understand at an early stage that envelopes are a part of life. They see parents giving them to teachers and officials at all levels.

 

But the terrible influence of computers and social media is having an effect. At a basic level Thais are not happy. But.

They are ruled by a huge military and police force. 

It is not simple. You are fortunate to be a westerner, but you cannot live here and express the same freedoms you enjoy in your own country.

I bite my tongue mostly and comply, it is easier to live here if you do. Smile a lot. lol

 

7 hours ago, Eligius said:

How much more are the Thais willing to take ....??

I think just about the only thing that would get them to streets would be shutting down the internet. Otherwise they'll just vent here like we all do, no action.

I think just about the only thing that would get them to streets would be shutting down the internet. Otherwise they'll just vent here like we all do, no action.

If there was no Facebook.. all the lovely workers at family mart or 7/11 may have to actually work...

 

Can’t count the times a guy was playing a game on his phone when I wander in at 3 am.

 

WITH boxes all around, signifying they got their daily shipment, but maybe the morning-morning shift handles stocking. Maybe I’m ignorant of Thai work division.

 

Sent from my iPhone using Thailand Forum - Thaivisa mobile app

2 hours ago, FarangDoingHisThing69 said:

If there was no Facebook.. all the lovely workers at family mart or 7/11 may have to actually work...

 

Can’t count the times a guy was playing a game on his phone when I wander in at 3 am.

 

WITH boxes all around, signifying they got their daily shipment, but maybe the morning-morning shift handles stocking. Maybe I’m ignorant of Thai work division.

 

Sent from my iPhone using Thailand Forum - Thaivisa mobile app

Buhu.

4 hours ago, FarangDoingHisThing69 said:

Can’t count the times a guy was playing a game on his phone when I wander in at 3 am.

 

He should be expecting you?

 

 

12 hours ago, rkidlad said:

I also see seven people have been arrested for sharing or forwarding the petition link to dissolve/fire the EC. But apparently, under the junta constitution, you’re allowed to petition in this manner. ‘It’s your right’. Guess they’ll have to arrest the 840k people who signed it. Unless of course it’s legal to sign it just not share it.

 

Make it up as you go along. See how far you can push the envelope.

 

I can’t even imagine how frustrated Thais who want change in this country are feeling right now. 

Yes, all 5 or 6 of them. I agree with much of what you post, but I think it's a mistake to think that many Thais want change and want it for the right reasons. 

 

Of the small number who want change, a considerable motivation is selfish. They only want their own clan in so they can benefit. 

 

They are all the same culturally and aspire to be alike and have uniform values. That is why Asian societies usually change so slowly. The young not so different from old, rich not so different from poor. 

4 minutes ago, Fex Bluse said:

Yes, all 5 or 6 of them. I agree with much of what you post, but I think it's a mistake to think that many Thais want change and want it for the right reasons. 

 

Of the small number who want change, a considerable motivation is selfish. They only want their own clan in so they can benefit. 

 

They are all the same culturally and aspire to be alike and have uniform values. That is why Asian societies usually change so slowly. The young not so different from old, rich not so different from poor. 

Doesn't the Future Forward vote imply that you are underestimating the desire for change?

4 minutes ago, madmitch said:

Doesn't the Future Forward vote imply that you are underestimating the desire for change?

No. What I'm saying is that the "change" they are after is not important, not fundamental, not values-based change. 

 

They want a new team/tribe/clan in power. Their hopes are not motivated by wanting to see Thailand become a fairer, merit-based society with high civic participation and civic duty. 

 

Thais will continue to find corruption OK as long as they individually benefit. 

 

Thais will continue to think exploiting power and "might is right" is OK. 

 

Thais will continue to beleive that unquestioningly obeying whoever is their "Pee" or "better" is the right thing to do. 

 

Thais will continue to be xenophobic and closed off as much as possible to foreigners. 

 

They will be the same people culturally irrespective of whichever latest face and clan is in power. We've seen this story dozens of times throughout Thai history. 

12 hours ago, Eligius said:

How much more are the Thais willing to take ....??

If the Thai's just let this happen....again....I hold very little hope. I am hanging on to one last teeny weeny little bit of hope that SOMETHING will trigger them out of the mass apathy. If not, we are looking at decades of military rule. Its depressing. Where is the anger? Where is the indignation? Its there....but has the population been neutered to such an extent that a beating is taken by simply lying down?

47 minutes ago, madmitch said:

Doesn't the Future Forward vote imply that you are underestimating the desire for change?

Sorry. Quick follow-up.

 

I think mistake we Westerners repeatedly make with Asians is to think their values and motivations align with ours.

 

We want to beleive that because Thanathorn speaks our language, says things we understand, that he and his party and his supporters are somehow like us. 

 

The reality is that his supporters would be FULL of middle class and wealthy Thais who, for example, despise westerners just because their skin is white. I see no benefit in cheering any of them on. 

4 minutes ago, Fex Bluse said:

Sorry. Quick follow-up.

 

I think mistake we Westerners repeatedly make with Asians is to think their values and motivations align with ours.

 

We want to beleive that because Thanathorn speaks our language, says things we understand, that he and his party and his supporters are somehow like us. 

 

The reality is that his supporters would be FULL of middle class and wealthy Thais who, for example, despise westerners just because their skin is white. I see no benefit in cheering any of them on. 

I think I would prefer to take my chances with a party supported by middle class, possibly foreign educated Thais than I would another few decades of the like of Prayuth and Apirat. I dont buy your take on it. I think the majority of Thai's are  indifferent to us....a lot see the benefit of Western ideas and tech. Parents realise that the majority innovation comes from the west and want their kids to be part of it and understand it.....I dont think I would say the same for the Junta....would you?

23 minutes ago, 248900_1469958220 said:

I think I would prefer to take my chances with a party supported by middle class, possibly foreign educated Thais than I would another few decades of the like of Prayuth and Apirat. I dont buy your take on it. I think the majority of Thai's are  indifferent to us....a lot see the benefit of Western ideas and tech. Parents realise that the majority innovation comes from the west and want their kids to be part of it and understand it.....I dont think I would say the same for the Junta....would you?

I don't know..

 

Some of my dealings with the Thai upper middle class were problematic to say the very least.

 

They were the first to screech "if you don't like it here-go home."They were also the perfect purveyors of ultra nationalism.I always thought that their attachment to the West was minimal and they were the perfect engine for miltaristic conservatism.

 

A progressive middle class is exactly what Thailand (and Myanmar,Cambodia,and Laos) lacks.

 

However Mr Thanathorn-and others- may prove me wrong...

Edited April 6, 20197 yr by Odysseus123

1 hour ago, 248900_1469958220 said:

If the Thai's just let this happen....again....I hold very little hope. I am hanging on to one last teeny weeny little bit of hope that SOMETHING will trigger them out of the mass apathy. If not, we are looking at decades of military rule. Its depressing. Where is the anger? Where is the indignation? Its there....but has the population been neutered to such an extent that a beating is taken by simply lying down?

 

I have given up all hope of the Thais doing anything.

 

I know this sounds silly but in answer to your question about “where is the anger” I remain completely convinced that their anger gets channeled into their driving.

Can we do the same with TV. I know someone has said nasty things on TV. 

 

Someone needs to grow some knackers! If you picked politics as a profession, class 101 was about 'letting the water slide off the ducks back'.

 

Sad.

15 hours ago, snoop1130 said:

All I did was inform the people about the rules and regulations of the vote.”

In the eyes of the Junta that amounts to deformation/libel !!

1 hour ago, 248900_1469958220 said:

I think I would prefer to take my chances with a party supported by middle class, possibly foreign educated Thais than I would another few decades of the like of Prayuth and Apirat. I dont buy your take on it. I think the majority of Thai's are  indifferent to us....a lot see the benefit of Western ideas and tech. Parents realise that the majority innovation comes from the west and want their kids to be part of it and understand it.....I dont think I would say the same for the Junta....would you?

The middle class and wealthy Thais, even those educated and who have lived in western countries are THE WORST in my experience. 

 

They are the most xenophobic. 

 

I have spent more than 20 years working with and employing these Thais.

 

Like I said, it's a common mistake and shows a fundamental western misunderstanding of Asians, and especially Asians from regressive countries like Thailand. 

 

In most western countries, the more educated and traveled a person is, the more worldly and open minded he/she is. In Thailand and much of Asia, it's exactly the opposite. 

 

Just my opinion. Respect yours as well. 

11 hours ago, sjaak327 said:

Ah, abuse the law to try and shut down legitimate criticism. Instead of trying to abuse the law, maybe next time they could actually do their job and ensure a free and fair election is being held, without granting one side of the divide an unfair advantage and abusing the law to abolish a party on no legal basis whatsoever. 

 

I guess the above might prompt even more legal action right ? The facts of the piss poor job the EC has been doing are piling up in the meantime. But hey let's sue people for telling the truth. 

 

There are two big differences in Thai defamation/libel laws than those of most Western democracies. One is it's a criminal as well as civil offense, and the other being telling the truth isn't a defense. 

 

I know UK law, in which another defense is making something known for the public good; or repeating something that is already in the public domain. I don't know if these would be valid defenses or even taken into consideration under Thai law. Somehow I doubt it.

 

As they say, this ain't Kansas Toto!

11 minutes ago, Fex Bluse said:

The middle class and wealthy Thais, even those educated and who have lived in western countries are THE WORST in my experience. 

 

They are the most xenophobic. 

 

I have spent more than 20 years working with and employing these Thais.

 

Like I said, it's a common mistake and shows a fundamental western misunderstanding of Asians, and especially Asians from regressive countries like Thailand. 

 

In most western countries, the more educated and traveled a person is, the more worldly and open minded he/she is. In Thailand and much of Asia, it's exactly the opposite. 

 

Just my opinion. Respect yours as well. 

Sadly, my own experience tends to back up what you say, Fex Bluse. The most disgraceful of all Thais (because they have no ideological excuse) are those who have got their Ph.D.s from the West and then come back to Thailand and lord it over the serfs. Disgusting. Supporting oppression, repression and all the rest (which I will not mention) after all the benefits of Western liberal democracy and freedom of thought and expression - it makes my blood boil. I have had some of these Ph.D. Thais say to me: 'Well, if you don't like it here - go back to your own country'. This is the most intellectually and morally bankrupt argument any human being can ever advance towards a foreigner who GENUINELY feels compassion and sympathy with the native underdogs and the under-trodden, and wants to see Thai society progress and advance - for the many, not just the tiny few.

 

I've even seen well-educated Red Shirts cheering and applauding junta ministers when the latter come to give a speech - even laughing at the junta's jokes.

 

Without a moral backbone and physical courage - the country will remain enmeshed in the Middle Ages for decades. It's as simple as that.

 

2 hours ago, Fex Bluse said:

Sorry. Quick follow-up.

 

I think mistake we Westerners repeatedly make with Asians is to think their values and motivations align with ours.

 

We want to beleive that because Thanathorn speaks our language, says things we understand, that he and his party and his supporters are somehow like us. 

 

The reality is that his supporters would be FULL of middle class and wealthy Thais who, for example, despise westerners just because their skin is white. I see no benefit in cheering any of them on. 

 

I think your second sentence is spot on! We Westerners apply our values and motivations and also use our constructs in trying to understand things in Asia. My Hong Kong friends used to laugh at this and say that Westerners just can't grasp that it's fundamentally different and that by applying our constructs we distort and misunderstand.

 

Many Asian, IME, do a better job of understanding the West and it's culture and norms. And quite frankly, they don't particularly like it and certainly don't consider it superior as Westerners often think it is.

Thailand has historically always hedged its bets in this region. Its courted both the U.S and China etc. I think though that now obviously  the shift is toward China. I think the Junta likes the idea of an internet that is as controlled by government as much as China's is. I think it like's China's 'social credit' system....I think its modelling itself on this. Thailand in a few years could well be a place where many of us may not want to be, regardless of tightening visa regs. 

 

Again, I hold a little bit of hope...its not a lot though. 

 

Remember when Thaksin proposed a second city be built? Rumour had it that it was to be out in NakhonNayok somewhere. One drunken night a mate and I decided to ride out and try and find the bones of it ,that we had heard about.  We never did.....imagine what this place would have been like if they had done that....One wonders what this place would be like now if the 2007 coup had never happened? I am not a fan of his but.....

3 hours ago, Baerboxer said:

 

There are two big differences in Thai defamation/libel laws than those of most Western democracies. One is it's a criminal as well as civil offense, and the other being telling the truth isn't a defense. 

 

I know UK law, in which another defense is making something known for the public good; or repeating something that is already in the public domain. I don't know if these would be valid defenses or even taken into consideration under Thai law. Somehow I doubt it.

 

As they say, this ain't Kansas Toto!

I am well aware of the idiotic Thai laws. TIme for a change. Justice has nothing to do with prosecuting people that are merely stating facts. If they get offended by people addressing their <deleted> up, maybe instead of crying foul, take a hard look at oneself and get their shit in order. After all, they are wasting tax payer money, and the tax payer is not getting what it paid for, not even close. If Thailand ever wants to get rid of the third world label, this kind of shit needs to go. 

3 hours ago, Baerboxer said:

 

I think your second sentence is spot on! We Westerners apply our values and motivations and also use our constructs in trying to understand things in Asia. My Hong Kong friends used to laugh at this and say that Westerners just can't grasp that it's fundamentally different and that by applying our constructs we distort and misunderstand.

 

Many Asian, IME, do a better job of understanding the West and it's culture and norms. And quite frankly, they don't particularly like it and certainly don't consider it superior as Westerners often think it is.

Well I certainly wouldn't classify Western culture as being superior. However Hong Kong is much more akin to the west than Thailand ever could hope to be. This is not about culture as such, but the sheer incompetence in every day business one can see in Thailand, but not in Hong Kong or the west. That incompetence has nothing to do with culture, but a sheer lack of education and business ethics. 

 

At the end of the day, the differences aren't all that big as you seem to claim. In fact, I would say they are almost identical, the biggest different is the ridiculous concept of face. And apart from culture, or norms, the concept of saving face IS ridiculous and it is being used as an excuse for many things. It is seriously holding this country back, and is perfectly visible in every day life. 

 

I as a westerner are very familiar with this concept, and adapt to it perfectly. It means, I expect vastly less service and quality as compared to the west, and in almost all fields this is simply the truth. From restaurant staff, to hotel clerks, from 7-11 staff to the guys in even the classiest clothing store. They simply don't get the concept of service, and any mistake is shoved under the carpet, because god forbid one would lose face!

 

The laugh isn't on us I believe. 

7 hours ago, Hayduke said:

He should be expecting you?

I remember in 2006 on my first holiday, prior to facebook taking Thailand over, going to Homemart and the clerk visibly cheering up as a customer walked in. Never going to happen now. Social media has made people addicted and apathetic. Even with all the "outrage", if they don't go out onto the streets, it's worth zero. IRL FTW.

Edited April 6, 20197 yr by DrTuner