Am I still married?

[SenorJorge]

34 minutes ago, Gracas said:

This is just a business expense for many girls, Just like paying electricity and water for other businesses.

She's supposedly a good girl.. Not on the prowl, etc.  I just thought it was amusing.  I am going back to look for jobs at the factory.  Wait, I need an expensive day at the salon first..

[Tagged]

51 minutes ago, Dogmatix said:

A good acid test for a relationship is to imagine that either of you is so unfortunate as to be disfigured and crippled in a car accident.  Would she stay with you, take care of you and try her best to support you both? Would you do the same for your erstwhile pretty Asian trophy wife, if it happened to her?  Two negatives.  Ah, I thought so.  Then move on. 

 

31 minutes ago, BritManToo said:

Not that good a test, if you've got the money they'd still bang you if you looked like Frankenstein's monster.

 

Have to give Britman right here. If you disabled, the mare control she got over you and the money. If she´s there just for the money, and you disabled, the better for her, as long you do not cost her to much work for little money. 

[SenorJorge]

Also.. She is tall, leggy, long haired.  Perfect face and smile.  Model appearance.  Ten out of ten.  There will be more victims.  I don't think I have to worry that she won't get a divorce eventually.  She should be able to twelve months after I break contact.  As others have said, I'm just glad to be out of there at this stage in the game.  It could have been way worse.

[CharlieH]

You said " But she won't be getting any money from me.  If she won't divorce me in thailand then I will just never go back and remain "married" to her until I die.  I have no family or close friends and it really doesn't matter. "

 

So, why are you bothering at all, just get on with your life and forget all about her ! Move on.

[SenorJorge]

2 minutes ago, CharlieH said:

You said " But she won't be getting any money from me.  If she won't divorce me in thailand then I will just never go back and remain "married" to her until I die.  I have no family or close friends and it really doesn't matter. "

 

So, why are you bothering at all, just get on with your life and forget all about her ! Move on.

That's where I am pretty much at with this Charlie.  There's nothing I can do about my status without risk to myself in thailand.  So the best thing to do is just act as though the marriage never occurred to the best of my ability.  As the previous poster said, at least I'm alive.

[Just Weird]

19 hours ago, Small Joke said:

I am reasonably certain, you can initiate a divorce in your citizenship country, regardless of where you got married.

I can't speak to the US family court system, but in Australia, you can do it all yourself, online, so long as both parties agree to the divorce (asset divisions, if any, are handled separately, later).

You'll need your marriage certificate or certified copy. Proof of your Citizenship, and affidavit proof your wife as been served the divorce papers, she dosnt need to consent, just you need proof of service.

 

This is generic advice, the family court website in your country/state can give you more guidance YMMV and being Thailand, who knows what crap you'll be dealing with legally at this end, try to minimize her involvement in the proceedings.

 

Avoid as far as possible Thai legal entanglements, they may well  oblige you to remain in Thailand against your will, for years as the case drags on, impoverishing you utterly, plus it's an immigration nightmare! Monthly reports and passport confiscated. 

 

Don't start any proceedings from within Thailand! Go home and sort it out.

Nonsense, as far as divorce in Thailand is concerned, from beginning to end.

 

"Avoid as far as possible Thai legal entanglements, they may well  oblige you to remain in Thailand against your will, for years as the case drags on, impoverishing you utterly, plus it's an immigration nightmare! Monthly reports and passport confiscated". 

What are you talking about?

[Just Weird]

19 hours ago, SenorJorge said:

19 hours ago, Small Joke said:

Avoid as far as possible Thai legal entanglements, they may well  oblige you to remain in Thailand against your will, for years as the case drags on, impoverishing you utterly, plus it's an immigration nightmare! Monthly reports and passport confiscated. 

 

This is the exact kind of nightmare I am trying to avoid.  She and her family have never been on the "up and up" with me.  She's heisted thousands from me since the outset of our relationship.  They aren't getting ANY MORE money from me - the whole marriage was a sham from the start.  I know, my fault for getting involved.  I was outsmarted.  But this is precisely why I won't go back to Thailand.

 

Unfortunately, in order for me to divorce her from my state in America, she needs to have been at least a previous 6-month resident of the state.  She's never been here before.  Never set foot in America.  So I'd be perjuring myself if I tried to divorce her by publication, which is the only way to divorce with one spouse in absentia, or even if both spouses sign.

 

I don't really feel any strong desire to live in Thailand again.  I just want my name cleared from this horrendous marriage.  Thank you

"Avoid as far as possible Thai legal entanglements, they may well  oblige you to remain in Thailand against your will, for years as the case drags on, impoverishing you utterly, plus it's an immigration nightmare! Monthly reports and passport confiscated". 

That paragraph you quoted from Small Joke is nonsense, ignore it.

 

But you are still married until you sign the divorce papers.

 

 

[wisperone]

Well look at it this way. You were her temporary meal ticket. Sooner or later she will target another equally stupid farang to be her next meal ticket target. When the time comes, she will have to ask you for a divorce so she can get on with her scamming. I would just wait it out. Don't worry, there is a endless que of people just like you with plans to go to paradise full of the same naivete.

[SenorJorge]

3 minutes ago, Just Weird said:

"Avoid as far as possible Thai legal entanglements, they may well  oblige you to remain in Thailand against your will, for years as the case drags on, impoverishing you utterly, plus it's an immigration nightmare! Monthly reports and passport confiscated". 

That paragraph you quoted from Small Joke is nonsense, ignore it.

 

But you are still married until you sign the divorce papers.

 

 

She can divorce on her own for abandonment after twelve months.  I don't have to sign a thing in that case.

[expatfromwyoming]

20 hours ago, SenorJorge said:

Inform me, what am I deluded about?  If you're going to offer criticism, which I am not sure I need right now, I have been beaten up enough about this, at least make the criticism constructive.  Thanks.

self inflected and unworthy of sympathy. Walk in every door with your eyes open and brain engaged

[Just Weird]

5 hours ago, SOTIRIOS said:

...buddy...reading between the lines...doesn't seem like you have learned your lesson...

 

...she did not get everything she wanted out of you...

 

...has marked you as 'weak'....and seems to think she can lure you back for more punishment with the Facebook posts...

 

...sad to say...she may be right...why are you still friends with her...and following her...???

 

...then you state...'needs to have resided in The States 6 months' in order to divorce her...

 

...!@#$%^&*(...makes you sound like 'a glutton for punishment'...

 

...am quite sure there are way to annul the marriage without coming back here...

 

...do some research first...

 

..avoid engaging lawyers...but seek out free advice on their web sites...

 

...you may have some friends here who can get some info for you too...and even sign necessary annulment papers so that you will never have to come here again...

 

...after 2 years apart...she cannot contest it, I believe...

 

...change your contact details and cut off all connections with her...

 

...somehow I doubt that you will...

 

...good luck....

OP, lesson 1 (after the marriage thing), DO NOT TAKE ANY LEGAL ADVICE FROM SOTIRIOS!

[Just Weird]

4 hours ago, Stevemercer said:

Unless I'm missing something, I would have thought you had to register your Thai marriage in the US before you are 'legally' married in the states. Until/if you do, there would be no need to say anything officially.

 

Unless you are in a hurry to marry again, you should wait until she contacts you for a divorce.

 

If you want a divorce from her, you will have to negotiate a 'settlement' fee with her before she'll agree to a divorce on mutual grounds under Thai law. Of course you will have to fly to Thailand to do it.

 

It depends who cracks first (in terms of wanting a divorce) - you or her. In any case your non-Thai assets are safe from her whatever happens (assuming you do not register your marriage under US law).

"If you want a divorce from her, you will have to negotiate a 'settlement' fee with her before she'll agree to a divorce on mutual grounds under Thai law..". 

Garbage.  Thai law does not stipulate that!

[Pique Dard]

i  don't how to tell you this, but maybe you should accept the situation as it is, ie wait/ take it easy until things settle down, don't rush for the divorce....! this is your second marriage, maybe you  were too quick to marry again after the first marriage and now you suffer consequences

[SenorJorge]

He's right about one thing though.  She thought I could be used to extract more baht and possibly even a visa (giving her access to even more rich farang in farangland.. They'd be on her like flies to honey here, she's hot and they know nothing about thai women..) after I departed.  When I shut her down and told her I don't trust her, she won't get any money or visa from me, etc, that's when she started saying she hated me.  Esan girls.  I'm lovin it!  As the previous poster said, I'm bullet proof to these girls and their games after this.

[SenorJorge]

1 minute ago, Pique Dard said:

i  don't how to tell you this, but maybe you should accept the situation as it is, ie wait/ take it easy until things settle down, don't rush for the divorce....! this is your second marriage, maybe you  were too quick to marry again after the first marriage and now you suffer consequences

Guilty on all charges.  Waiting it out really is my only option.  Two law firms in thailand have already told me I either need to appear in court at a final hearing or wait for her to file after a year for abandonment or three years for leaving the marital home.  

[Just Weird]

8 minutes ago, SenorJorge said:

Guilty on all charges.  Waiting it out really is my only option.  Two law firms in thailand have already told me I either need to appear in court at a final hearing or wait for her to file after a year for abandonment or three years for leaving the marital home.  

"How can I check to see if I am still married over in Thailand?  Will I have to hire a law firm to do this?" 

Why not ask the two law firms that you've already consulted and whose advice you are clearly taking?  In fact, bearing this in mind, what was the point of your OP?

[elliss]

20 hours ago, SenorJorge said:

I came here asking for answers to specific regulatory and legal questions.  I know many aren't lawyers, but you have experience with this kind of thing.

 

 Correct ,  many farlangs , have experience of losing it all, in paradise .

    Nothing new under the Sun , in Los .

    Welcome to the club ..

 

 

Edited July 10, 2019 by elliss

[SenorJorge]

5 minutes ago, Just Weird said:

"How can I check to see if I am still married over in Thailand?  Will I have to hire a law firm to do this?" 

Why not ask the two law firms that you've already consulted and whose advice you are clearly taking?  In fact, bearing this in mind, what was the point of your OP?

They want me to start paying them now.  They won't keep talking to me for free.  Maybe to get that answer I will contact a third.  I was mostly just fishing for personal experiences with farangs here and people that farangs know and divorce with these kinds of girls.  This can be a very valuable resource for that kind of experience-based information.  The law firms never offer that sort of insight.

[elliss]

3 minutes ago, SenorJorge said:

They want me to start paying them now.  They won't keep talking to me for free.  Maybe to get that answer I will contact a third.  I was mostly just fishing for personal experiences with farangs here and people that farangs know and divorce with these kinds of girls.  This can be a very valuable resource for that kind of experience-based information.  The law firms never offer that sort of insight.

 

 Exsuse me , did your check if your wife was married , before you married her ?.

 

[SenorJorge]

Just now, elliss said:

 

 Exsuse me , did your check if your wife was married , before you married her ?.

 

I didn't.  I assumed that the amphur wouldn't be able to marry her if she was already married according to Thai records at the office?  Possibly more foolishness on my part?

[Just Weird]

8 minutes ago, SenorJorge said:

They want me to start paying them now.  They won't keep talking to me for free.  Maybe to get that answer I will contact a third.  I was mostly just fishing for personal experiences with farangs here and people that farangs know and divorce with these kinds of girls.  This can be a very valuable resource for that kind of experience-based information.  The law firms never offer that sort of insight.

"They want me to start paying them now.  They won't keep talking to me for free". 

Of course, same as any lawyer anywhere.

 

"I was mostly just fishing for personal experiences with farangs here and people that farangs know and divorce with these kinds of girls". 

The "type of girl" makes no difference to the legal procedure for divorce!

Fishing for advice from anonymous, unqualified Thaivisa posters is not the way to go, all you'll mostly get is speculation and uncorroborated, Thai-bashing horror stories.

 

I was separated from my wife for 10 tears here and even though I was in a new relationship and had two more daughters she refused to agree to an amphur divorce.  I wasn't prepared to do it in court so I had to remain married to her while I had a new family until she decided the time was right for her.  Then we both had to go to the Amphur, with witnesses for both of us, to get the papers signed and the divorce certificate issued.

[Just Weird]

18 minutes ago, elliss said:

Exsuse me , did your check if your wife was married , before you married her ?.

The amphur would have told him that!  You can't just get married willy-nilly as many times as you want, even in Thailand, they do have records.

[Dogmatix]

4 hours ago, SenorJorge said:

I appreciate the concern.  What is wrong with me won't kill me but it makes life not worth living.  Health definitely takes top priority over all else.  My worrying about all this doesn't help matters and as others have stated I need to let this simmer out and die in the land of frowns.  She will find a new one, get him drunk, get him to pay for her divorce and freedom to marry affidavit.. Not my problem anymore.  Thanks to those who helped me stop beating myself up over this for so long.  I'm two times a sucker marrying se Asian girls.  Finally learned my lesson.  Never again.

 

Actually Thai citizens (and foreign permanent residents) don't need a freedom to marry affidavit to get married in Thailand. That is only needed for foreigners on temporary visas. As far as I can recall from getting married to a Thai citizen when I was a permanent resident, the official just asked each of us to confirm verbally that we were not married (I was pointed asked to confirm I was not married in my home country) and we must have both signed something to that effect.  There was no search of any government database to check that neither party was married in Thailand, as far as I know and I am not sure that the information about marital status is maintained in the Thai smart ID cards. 

 

There is no crime of bigamy in Thailand - only a relatively minor penalty for lying to a government official. I am not sure if things have changed but I recall seeing cases reported in the newspapers of men being accused of serial bigamy and being married to different women in different provinces.  The complaints were all brought about by wives finding out from others that their husbands were married to someone else, rather than through detection by the authorities. Of course, most Thais don't even bother to register their marriages and many people have multiple marriage ceremonies with the monks without disclosing they have already been through the same thing before. 

 

What I am saying is that it might be possible for her to marry another foreigner in Thailand, assuming she needs to do this to get a visa to go overseas, without bothering to divorce you.  It would certainly be possible for her to get married in a neighbouring country such as Malaysia.  I think she would only need the same sort of affirmation of freedom to marry from the Thai embassy, which like the foreign embassies in Thailand, would not try to check whether the information was true or not.  It is also quite possible that she was already married to someone else when she married the OP.

Edited July 10, 2019 by Dogmatix

[HampiK]

So the OP is using 2 Lawyers for free (not want pay them Money) and now try with a third Lawyer in the hope he helps for free...

 

Sorry to say, but if you were showing the same behavior to your gf or later wife, maybe you were the bad person and not your wife.

The Problem with Stories like that is as always, we only hear your side... I not tell you are lying but many times people only tell the part which they think are important or are looking good for them.

[SenorJorge]

3 minutes ago, HampiK said:

So the OP is using 2 Lawyers for free (not want pay them Money) and now try with a third Lawyer in the hope he helps for free...

 

Sorry to say, but if you were showing the same behavior to your gf or later wife, maybe you were the bad person and not your wife.

The Problem with Stories like that is as always, we only hear your side... I not tell you are lying but many times people only tell the part which they think are important or are looking good for them.

I just don't want to pay for casual conversation if they're not going to provide any actual legal services.  No one has offered a divorce from the USA so I haven't used them.  Most law firms in america offer free consultations.  Most in Thailand offer a few free phone conversations or emails but then they want you to pay for them to represent you.  I don't really need to be represented now.  When I got divorced the first time I had to talk to three or maybe it was four law firms, I can't remember, before I found the one I decided to use.  I'm not doing anything wrong by talking to multiple firms.  Anyway, yeah totally man, I got married, gave the girl everything, caught her talking to other men, lying many times (even about her phone/birth date/history), she took lots of money, sold all of my jewelry I gave her, mistreated me when I couldn't get out of bed.  Ok I'm the bad one.  I'm not going to get into this, because its a separate issue, but some people just aren't willing to admit that the scathing majority of Thai girls around Jomtien looking for foreign love are flat-out crooks.  I was one of them.  I thought surely the bad girls are centered around the tourist trade and you can sift through lots of good ones who work in the malls and factories around Pattaya.  I wouldn't date any woman who lived within a 2 hour drive-time radius of Pattaya City (or Bangkok, Or Phuket, etc) for that matter.  Forget marriage, I don't trust them enough to date them after this.  Again, its my fault for not being more careful.  I'm not blaming any other people.  I'm the idiot in this situation.  She won, really. 

[SteveK]

The problem of being married in Thailand will only become an issue if you find a new lady, which you want to marry. In the meantime, Thai laws have a reason for divorce of the spouse fleeing and not being contactable - it's just as likely that she may want to marry again also. My advice would be to ignore your marriage and forget about it. If it becomes an issue in the future THEN state your case and do whatever you need to do to have it annulled, if she has not already done so. Chill, drink a beer and think about how lucky you were to escape such a disgusting situation in it's early days rather than letting it drag on.

 

Don't go chasing a divorce so hard unless you need to be divorced! She sounds like a real scumbag, do what you can to improve your life without her, there are nasty people around the world and if we all let them get to us, then they would be the winners. You are the winner in this scenario.

Edited July 10, 2019 by SteveK

[Dogmatix]

As I see that the OP has no intention of moving back to Thailand and has no close friends or family that know about his marriage, he can probably just forget about this unfortunate lapse of judgment on his part and put it down to experience. Even if he changes his mind in future and decides to remarry outside Thailand, it is highly unlikely that married status in Thailand will ever be discovered.

 

He would not be the first person to do this.  With America's history of immigration there were countless males who came to the land of the free alone, promising to send for their families as soon as they got established, only to find a new love in the new country and marry her without troubling with the formalities of divorcing the wife in the old country.  One of my former gfs, an American, told me that her grandfather did this and he and his new wife and family one day got a surprise knock on the door which turned out to be his old wife and family who had raised the money to come over from the South of Italy to look for him after he had stopped writing for some years.  No criminal action was taken and an amicable solution was agreed whereby both families lived close by. 

Edited July 10, 2019 by Dogmatix

[CanadaSam]

Senor, I believe you're going about this all wrong.

 

Divorces can almost never be handled between spouses without some sh*t hitting the fan.

 

Get somebody in Thailand, somebody trustworthy, even a farang to talk to her, and see what she wants.

 

You don't even know that yet!

 

It may be less than what you dread, or if it is, then your "mediator" could clue HER into the fact that you are considering taking legal action and more, to resolve the issue.

 

Basic idea is to get somebody, anybody, involved, who gets you the actual facts, and clues her into the fact that you're not alone anymore, and she better be willing to settle the issue.

 

Before that, don't step into the Kingdom.

 

My two cents.

[Isaanbiker]

OP, I feel sorry for you as it sounds like a lot of buffalo shi+e you had to go through so far.

 

  Just take it easy, and please use your brain for the next steps. Play friendly, but fair and make it clear that you want a divorce.

 

Do not let her know how urgent it is for you. So more pressure you put on her, so much more bs you'll get.

 

  She could have plenty of witnesses that you've beaten her up, and she could create a situation where they'd arrest you and look into all these allegations, some of them can be very nasty.

 

  The problem is that foreigners here seem to be already much lower than a cockroach in many Thai peoples' eyes. And we're losing respect from day to day, just read the news. And it's not going to get better. 

 

  If you can end it by paying a little amount of money, please do it.

  You could make a contract she has to sign, and if I were you, I would not even go to the Amphur personally. I'd take a lawyer and let him/her do that for me. 

 

  Please don't get me wrong, but she'll use the marriage to get as much money out of it as possible. But that's only working when you stop to check her Facebook and other stuff. Get over it! 

 

  There are quite a lot of people who marry on paper, only that they can live here, so please think about your situation.

 

  You've only lived with her for one month? If she's trying to make any problems, please be one step ahead of her. She could make anything up, and the cops would arrest you. That's how they deal with it.

 

 Try to have some witnesses and record all the negative stuff coming from her; it might come in handy when you need it. Considering that you do not live with her should make divorce very easy.

 

  But please have your weapons ready when she, for example, all in sudden lets you know that she's pregnant. Just see it as it is, anything could happen, but you're the one who can steer it into the right direction.

 

  Just don't write anything contrary to her, act like all is okay and try to make her understand that your marriage was a big mistake.

 

  If she's okay with a not so big sum, then it's still better than fighting for a long time. But you've already done the first step, to understand that your marriage was a huge mistake.

 

  There'll be many traps, don't fall into one. And as you already said, do not get married again, there'll be too many good looking ladies in the future who're single, and the same could happen again.

 

Just say no, there's no need to buy a whole cow if you only want some milk. Best of luck! 

 

  

 

  

 

  

 

  

[SteveK]

You are married in Thailand. You said that you will never marry again and you don't want to go back to Thailand. Forget about it, see your friends and have a few beers. She can't touch you.