3 hours ago, Pedrogaz said:

Analysis is a massive weakness of Thai institutions. They revere academics for their titles not their skills or knowledge. The system here is the top man decides what he wants and then the policy follows what the top man says.....if Prayut decides that poverty is caused by the poor having too much money and massive taxation of poor people is in order, then that is what they will do, no matter every one else can see the stupidity of it. Deference is the major weakness off the East in general and Thailand is the worst of them all.

I agree. The Asian blind deference system only works reasonably well when the Top/Big Boss is actually skillful/knowledgeable. The Japanese and Koreans do ok. 

 

In Thailand, statistically, almost nobody is very clever. So, it is the blind leading the blind here. 

3 hours ago, onera1961 said:

Close all brothels fronting as bars and stop pimping your nation's daughters to old creepy sexpats for marriage to improve their economic situations. 

Did you know that Thai academics estimate that less than 10% of the sex trade in Thailand is attributable to foreigners? 

 

The other 90% is Thai-to-Thai prostitution. 

 

Did you know that? 

11 minutes ago, Fex Bluse said:

Did you know that Thai academics estimate that less than 10% of the sex trade in Thailand is attributable to foreigners? 

 

The other 90% is Thai-to-Thai prostitution. 

 

Did you know that? 

Excellent point.  Furthermore, not every westerner/Thai marriage or relationship has its origins in a bar...

3 hours ago, Fex Bluse said:

Did you know that Thai academics estimate that less than 10% of the sex trade in Thailand is attributable to foreigners? 

 

The other 90% is Thai-to-Thai prostitution. 

Same thing through out the World. No academic studies needed for that. It is common sense. What is needed is why old and young farangs come 10,000 miles to Thailand. I was referring to easy availability brothels fronting as bars where foreigners come for sex and old farangs come to seek young mate for marriage. How many farangs go to Moldovia to marry bar girls and settle there? I need this kind of study, instead of a stupid study that states the obvious. 

Under Prayuth's watch, the gap between rich and poor has widened enormously.  In 2016, a Credit Suisse survey showed Thailand was third in the league table of countries with the biggest wealth gap.

 

Their 2018 survey shows Thailand has jumped above India and Russia to take the top slot. Be interesting to see the next lot of figures.

 

Over to you, Big Chief Five Rivers.

Edited August 30, 20196 yr by Krataiboy

7 hours ago, RLAretired said:

Yes, indeed!    Good example. 

RLAretired I get so disgusted and annoyed at liberals.  They see everyone who has achieved success in life did not do it by their intelligence, hard work, investment, and of course they made no contribution to society for starting their businesses, employing people, and paying taxes.  THOSE 1% PEOPLE WERE ALL JUST LUCKY MEMBERS of the sperm club.  Heck, consider, anyone who is not living in the squalid conditions of Bangladesh, or Botswana is a member of the lucky sperm club.  A liberal believes that somehow if you have achieved substantial financial success somehow that person OWES it to others.  Of course that same liberal will look in the mirror and say they earned everything they have and would be appalled if you suggested confiscating what they have to redistribute to those poorer.  The strange part is that if you were a member of the "lucky gene pool" and it gave you the ability to kick a football, or throw a baseball and you are part of the 1% that is OK.  However if your grandfather came as an immigrant started a small jewelry store in Manhattan passed it on to two generations and you prosper with it, then somehow that "lucky" person is vile.  I can tell you this.  In the USA 25% of all new businesses fail in the first year and 80% fail within the first five years.  People take those risks for the potential rewards.  If you want the poor to really be poor, kill that entrepreneurial drive by engineering a social system that if you succeed the government confiscates the lions share of your earnings, but fail and you are on your own. That will stop those vile 1% people and certainly kill off any jobs in the process.   PS the attached two pictures are of those great social redistribution champions Bernie Sanders and Barack Obama and exactly how they "walk the walk"  PS they never invested $1 of their own money in any venture, never hired an employee or sold a product.  They just sold their BS to the liberals who actually believe in "equality" for all. 

Edited August 30, 20196 yr by Thomas J

34 minutes ago, Thomas J said:

 A liberal believes that somehow if you have achieved substantial financial success somehow that person OWES it to others.  Of course that same liberal will look in the mirror and say they earned everything they have and would be appalled if you suggested confiscating what they have to redistribute to those poorer.

 

Thank you, @Thomas J for taking your time to prepare those comments.  I certainly got value from reading.  And most interested to see those photos.

 

Now, to pull the topic back to "tackle national poverty", what could motivate a national leader to think that government could "tackle" that problem??  Sure, a government can take from some and give to others, whilst getting a generous cut for itself in the process.  However, that wouldn't "tackle" the problem, wouldn't stop the problem of "national poverty", merely move it around from one place to another for a time.  After a few years, the imbalances would reappear, and likely worse.  Might as well order analysis to tackle the problem of ocean tides. 

 

The reason I'm asking is because the current leader is a military man.  I've had the privelege of working around military officers (I was a civilian).  Whatever their other faults, military officers who make it to field grade (Major/Lieutenant Commander) and above are always very realistic in their thinking.  Not always correct.  Not always soft-spoken.  But always realistic about what can be done and what is impossible.  That order to prepare an analysis of national poverty suggests that the issuer of the order has lost touch with economic reality.  Either that, or has traded economic reality for political reality instead. 

 

I'm not seeking any political discussion here.  I'm asking, to be blunt, "What is he thinking?"  (And asking in a sincerely interested way, not at all ridicule.)

 

Thoughts, please.

 

Haha. "Ordering an analysis" is just to give the impression that he "cares" and that he is "doing something" - mere lip-service.

 

Won't come cheap though - will need a handsome budget for all the meetings, travel, catering, consultant's reports, etc. 

 

Anyway, would be interesting to see the resultant analysis, if it's ever produced and made public.

Why bother, the solution is on the way.  120 new APC's bought from the West. 

Bloody peasants! 

You forget she was surrounded by Prats and Morons and had nobody else to issue orders to !

Correct - and two of the prats and morons surrounding her where Prayuth and Prawit and other traitors undermining her and plotting against her.


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16 hours ago, Fex Bluse said:

I agree. The Asian blind deference system only works reasonably well when the Top/Big Boss is actually skillful/knowledgeable. The Japanese and Koreans do ok. 

 

In Thailand, statistically, almost nobody is very clever. So, it is the blind leading the blind here. 

Logically, the Labrador should be in control!

Anybody can see that successive Thai governments have put education as number one priority on top of the list. ( yes I am being sarcastic)

This country with a population of approx. 70 million employs 30.000 civil servants at the ministry of education - China with 1.4 billion people employs 1000 civil servants at the same ministry.

Thailand went through 22 ministers of education in 18 years pretending to reform education when most of them did not even last a year before handing each other the door .

Corruption is endemic at every level all the way down to school meals as recently brought to light.

 

Standard education is of incredibly poor quality and is tailored to keep the poor in their place so the elite can enjoy the inequality they have created and which has been widened over the last few years to 1% owning 67 % of wealth in this country.

Even higher education - only for those who can afford it - in this country is so lousy that all the rich send their kids abroad to get a proper education.

Let’s face it the corrupt elite has a grip on this country and they will not let go unless forced to.

 

Equality - in any country -had to be fought for it is never given freely by those in power.

But it takes real competent leaders and the political will to change and Thailand does not have both these components to achieve this in the near future with the biggest stumbling block being the corrupt civil service that sees itself superior to the countries underprivileged and poor while robbing the country blind.

 

 

 

 

 

 

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On 8/29/2019 at 9:51 PM, mok199 said:

Corrupt over supply of cival servants + their friends and family = national poverty.

 

17 hours ago, Fex Bluse said:

In Thailand, statistically, almost nobody is very clever. So, it is the blind leading the blind here. 

 

20 hours ago, Sakeopete said:

Educate them and stop stealing their money. 

 

21 hours ago, ChipButty said:

Say what you like we all know how it works here, nothing will change

 

This sums it up nicely.  

2 hours ago, Nowisee said:

This sums it up nicely.  

 

Very nice piece of work in your post above. 

 

Thank you, @Nowisee

13 hours ago, RLAretired said:

Now, to pull the topic back to "tackle national poverty", what could motivate a national leader to think that government could "tackle" that problem?? 

RLAretired,  Unfortunately most leaders in countries throughout the world have never worked one day in private industry and they view themselves as the wizard of oz behind the curtain that pulls levers and makes things work.  In truth, government only hampers economic prosperity by interfering with the normal market place.  Take electric cars as an example.  The governments policy of subsidizing them takes money away from reduced pollution, high mileage gas combustion cars and pushes billions into the production of electric vehicles that the marketplace deems are too expensive.  So government actions distorts what is the most efficient production of cars for what it deems are "socially" attractive.   If a government truly wanted to eliminate poverty it would implement policies that encouraged good behaviors and punish bad behaviors.  Some examples would be stop providing any subsidies such as true in the USA and Europe for child care credit to unwed mothers.  Like any subsidy it does not eliminate the problem, subsidies encourage it making the problem worse.  Children should  be "required" to attend schools and the schools should be held to standards that if they fail to meet the teachers would be fired.  The marketplace does that with companies.  If they produce a substandard product they go out of business.  Children who do not possess the acumen for advanced degrees should be mandated to go to trade schools where good jobs are available as an electrician, plumber, welder, boiler maker, etc.  Finally, government should stop "punishing" businesses for their success.  The first thing a successful business person wants to do if they are making a lot of money is to EXPAND  That means jobs for people and the reduction in poverty.  Liberals who want to TAX THE HELL out of those businesses are effectively curtailing the available money for those businesses to expand and killing the incentive for the business owner to risk their capital.  A simple example is the lottery.  When the jackpot is $500 million ticket sales go through the roof.  If the jackpot was only $1 million, ticket sales would be non existent.  The only path out of poverty for the vast majority of people is a good paying job. Common sense would have government encouraging successful companies rather than taxing them mercilessly. Taxes on business are ultimately paid by the customer anyway but they do rob business of the capital and incentive to expand hence killing jobs which is exactly what the average person needs to escape poverty.  Taking from those who produce to redistribute to those who don't is a prescription to forever have an underclass of people unable to find employment and escape poverty.  

23 hours ago, RichardColeman said:

Simple solution is make cars and pick ups cheaper, increase the minimum speed to 200 and sit back and let the poor population die off. Be quicker than fixing the problem the correct way

That plan is already in place.

Are we really  posting on this topic as though we believe he is serious about this. 

2 minutes ago, Thomas J said:

Taking from those who produce to redistribute to those who don't is a prescription to forever have an underclass of people unable to find employment and escape poverty.  

 

Thank you, again, for writing and posting.

So refreshing to see clear thinking in the tempest of emotions and logical fallacies here.

This applies to any country in any language. 

In a nation with massive wealth disparities, worst in the world the why is pretty obvious. Other nations like US the wealthy game the system but here the 1% just steal opportunity, wealth and even their labor outright. The legal system is so fraudulent itself it is a criminal enterprise. The education system wholly broken and any individual it produces that has the education and skills leaves. As a teacher of many gifted public school students I know. Many of my private school students stay because life is dreamy.

 

Are we aiding and abetting by living here? Are we enablers?

5 hours ago, Thomas J said:

RLAretired,  Unfortunately most leaders in countries throughout the world have never worked one day in private industry and they view themselves as the wizard of oz behind the curtain that pulls levers and makes things work.  In truth, government only hampers economic prosperity by interfering with the normal market place.  Take electric cars as an example.  The governments policy of subsidizing them takes money away from reduced pollution, high mileage gas combustion cars and pushes billions into the production of electric vehicles that the marketplace deems are too expensive.  So government actions distorts what is the most efficient production of cars for what it deems are "socially" attractive.   If a government truly wanted to eliminate poverty it would implement policies that encouraged good behaviors and punish bad behaviors.  Some examples would be stop providing any subsidies such as true in the USA and Europe for child care credit to unwed mothers.  Like any subsidy it does not eliminate the problem, subsidies encourage it making the problem worse.  Children should  be "required" to attend schools and the schools should be held to standards that if they fail to meet the teachers would be fired.  The marketplace does that with companies.  If they produce a substandard product they go out of business.  Children who do not possess the acumen for advanced degrees should be mandated to go to trade schools where good jobs are available as an electrician, plumber, welder, boiler maker, etc.  Finally, government should stop "punishing" businesses for their success.  The first thing a successful business person wants to do if they are making a lot of money is to EXPAND  That means jobs for people and the reduction in poverty.  Liberals who want to TAX THE HELL out of those businesses are effectively curtailing the available money for those businesses to expand and killing the incentive for the business owner to risk their capital.  A simple example is the lottery.  When the jackpot is $500 million ticket sales go through the roof.  If the jackpot was only $1 million, ticket sales would be non existent.  The only path out of poverty for the vast majority of people is a good paying job. Common sense would have government encouraging successful companies rather than taxing them mercilessly. Taxes on business are ultimately paid by the customer anyway but they do rob business of the capital and incentive to expand hence killing jobs which is exactly what the average person needs to escape poverty.  Taking from those who produce to redistribute to those who don't is a prescription to forever have an underclass of people unable to find employment and escape poverty.  

Good post

4 hours ago, Number 6 said:

In a nation with massive wealth disparities, worst in the world the why is pretty obvious. Other nations like US the wealthy game the system but here the 1% just steal opportunity, wealth and even their labor outright. The legal system is so fraudulent itself it is a criminal enterprise. The education system wholly broken and any individual it produces that has the education and skills leaves. As a teacher of many gifted public school students I know. Many of my private school students stay because life is dreamy.

 

Are we aiding and abetting by living here? Are we enablers?

At least in the US people can get out of proverty if they want to

What poverty? I don't think my brain has gotten so mushy yet due to age that I recall things that didn't happen; I'm pretty sure Mr. All Powerful here already got rid of poverty years ago and was rather vocal about doing so. Same for corruption. So what's the point ordering an analysis to tackle something that they so heroically got rid of shortly after taking over (because nobody else could do the job of course)?

 

Analysis is the first step to doing nothing imo.

Some excellent posts here.

 

A brave (or naive) PM to go jumping into this can of worms, risking upsetting the (well-entrenched) apple cart - remember PM: you can't close the box once it's opened - so why tamper with it like this.

Went to Chinatown Bangkok markets on Sunday. Never seen so many beggars/panhandlers on the streets ! Falling apart!

 

 

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