If denied entry, is the visa also canceled?

[Hal65]

I am considering taking a direct flight from Yangon to Chiang Mai airport with an ED visa, and maybe a tourist visa on future trips. We don't have much data on Chiang Mai airport immigration here so there is high uncertainty as to the chance of success.

 

• If the ED visa is canceled upon denial by the officer then it would be disasterous and probably not worth the risk compared to a longer but safer land border crossing.
• However if they just detain me, force me to buy a ticket, and I go back to Yangon with my ED visa in tact then it wouldn't be that big of an inconvenience as I could then use the land crossing fallback.

 

Which one is it? I assume the visa would be totally cancelled, otherwise the backup scenario I mention would probably be commonplace.

[ubonjoe]

Immigration do not cancel visas when a entry is denied. They do not have the authority to do it.

[Hal65]

9 minutes ago, ubonjoe said:

Immigration do not cancel visas when a entry is denied. They do not have the authority to do it.

Do you know if they take your belongings if/when they detain you?

 

If I'm in a cell for a day with my laptop and AIS 4G I'll be okay. WIthout that though, it would make rescheduling a route back into the country harder. And of course the detainment would be much worse as well.

[ubonjoe]

1 minute ago, Hal65 said:

Do you know if they take your belongings if/when they detain you?

 

No they do not.

[Hal65]

Forgot to also ask, do they stamp the reason for denial in the passport? Will that stamp make it hard to pass through on another attempt? I assume any officer who sees a denial will automatically look for reasons to deny entry again.

[emptypockets]

Yet another Hal topic. You are seriously considering working in the detention centre? 

[onera1961]

If denied entry you can always go back to your home country? Are you a stateless person? Are you running away from the ravages of war, violence, murder and political persecution?

Sent from my JKM-LX2 using Thailand Forum - Thaivisa mobile app
 

Edited August 31, 2019 by onera1961

[Max69xl]

On 8/30/2019 at 7:24 PM, ubonjoe said:

Immigration do not cancel visas when a entry is denied. They do not have the authority to do it.

How do you explain people getting denied entry and the red VOID stamp on top of the visa in the passport?

[DrJack54]

13 minutes ago, Max69xl said:

How do you explain people getting denied entry and the red VOID stamp on top of the visa in the passport?

Can you post where that has occurred. When denied entry somewhere like DM, they make remark reason for denied entry. Its always same reason...no sufficient funds. The visa remains valid.

The void stamp on a visa cannot be done at passport control. That happens at consulates where the issue visa and also stamp void. Been common in PP for some time and now Saigon doing it esp for ed visa.

Edited August 31, 2019 by DrJack54

[DrJack54]

23 hours ago, Hal65 said:

Forgot to also ask, do they stamp the reason for denial in the passport? Will that stamp make it hard to pass through on another attempt? I assume any officer who sees a denial will automatically look for reasons to deny entry again.

Assuming your denied entry at airport bkk your visa would still be valid. You would then enter at border crossing with your valid visa. 

[BritTim]

On 8/30/2019 at 7:12 PM, Hal65 said:

However if they just detain me, force me to buy a ticket, and I go back to Yangon with my ED visa in tact then it wouldn't be that big of an inconvenience as I could then use the land crossing fallback.

Assuming you need a visa to enter Myanmar, you would not be returned to Yangon. Depending on the airline you use to fly to Chiang Mai, you might have flexibility. The airline does not want the expense of removing you from Thailand without reimbursement. If you know your rights, you can probably convince the airline to fly you to a destination (perhaps Kuala Lumpur) where you will be admitted without a visa.

 

As @ubonjoe has told you, your visa (issued by Ministry of Foreign Affairs consular staff) will not be cancelled by Immigration (part of the Ministry of Interior).

[DrJack54]

5 minutes ago, BritTim said:

Assuming you need a visa to enter Myanmar, you would not be returned to Yangon. Depending on the airline you use to fly to Chiang Mai, you might have flexibility. The airline does not want the expense of removing you from Thailand without reimbursement. If you know your rights, you can probably convince the airline to fly you to a destination (perhaps Kuala Lumpur) where you will be admitted without a visa.

 

As @ubonjoe has told you, your visa (issued by Ministry of Foreign Affairs consular staff) will not be cancelled by Immigration (part of the Ministry of Interior).

That's a big call Tim. Not saying your wrong but most folk being denied entry are not in position to select where they wish to be flown to.

[BritTim]

1 hour ago, DrJack54 said:

That's a big call Tim. Not saying your wrong but most folk being denied entry are not in position to select where they wish to be flown to.

Most people denied entry have absolutely no idea of the rules governing inadmissible persons. They just do whatever they are told with no real attempt at negotiation. Actually, many have no real negotiating power because the airline can grab unused flight segments and use the proceeds to fly you where the airline likes. Also, it becomes tricky if you want to use a different airline because immigration, as well as the new airline, has to agree. It is important to realise:

• the airline that flies you to Thailand has responsibility for your removal, whether or not you are willing or able to pay (though the airline can and will try to get reimbursement, and the law might support them eventually);
• the airline staff want an easy life;
• as long as the airline removes you from Thailand within a reasonable period of time, immigration does not care where you go.

You often have more power than you realise to influence events.

[jacko45k]

11 hours ago, Max69xl said:

How do you explain people getting denied entry and the red VOID stamp on top of the visa in the passport?

I have heard of Embassies/Consulates stamping 'Void' on a Visa they have issued, and heard of Immigration Officers at border points refuse entry to people with valid visas , as they are empowered to do. But not doing both. In fact plenty of reports of people who were denied entry, who after being returned to point of origin, then using the same visa and managing to enter at a land crossing. 

Edited September 1, 2019 by jacko45k

[Hal65]

@jacko45k In what circumstances would someone even go back to an embassy to give them a chance to stamp void on a visa?

 

Seems the only reason you would do that... is if you actually wanted and applied for a different visa in which the VOID stamp would benefit you.

[essox essox]

On 8/30/2019 at 7:24 PM, ubonjoe said:

Immigration do not cancel visas when a entry is denied. They do not have the authority to do it.

SO WHO HAS??

[HampiK]

39 minutes ago, Hal65 said:

@jacko45k In what circumstances would someone even go back to an embassy to give them a chance to stamp void on a visa?

 

Seems the only reason you would do that... is if you actually wanted and applied for a different visa in which the VOID stamp would benefit you.

You not have to go back for the VOID stamp!

You become the void stamp, when the embassy/Consulate accepts your documents.. then they put a VISA sticker in your passport. THen a Senior or someone higher rank has to approve the visa sticker. If that not happens, then the Visa would be stamped VOID!

 

You could read many of this stories lately here.

[jacko45k]

40 minutes ago, Hal65 said:

@jacko45k In what circumstances would someone even go back to an embassy to give them a chance to stamp void on a visa?

 

Seems the only reason you would do that... is if you actually wanted and applied for a different visa in which the VOID stamp would benefit you.

The way I read it, the consulate in Phnon Phen were doing this, but stamping it void on issuance. Maybe to justify keeping the fee. 

[BritTim]

13 hours ago, jacko45k said:

The way I read it, the consulate in Phnon Phen were doing this, but stamping it void on issuance. Maybe to justify keeping the fee. 

Correct. In some countries, when applications for visas are denied, this has been standard practice for many years. An example is India where your application is not done directly at the Thai embassy, but through VFS Global that acts as an intermediary.