Brexit on a knife edge as PM Johnson stakes all on 'Super Saturday' vote

[Chomper Higgot]

19 minutes ago, sanemax said:

Are you a working person in the Uk ?

How can I put this politely?

[Chomper Higgot]

25 minutes ago, cyril sneer said:

rats

 

11 minutes ago, nauseus said:

The majority of the house maggot remainers have actually been trailblazing ahead of Bojo for years.

Rats, Maggots.

 

What’s up with our Brexiteer brethren today, they normally take great personal offense when others start tossing derogatory remarks and name calling. 

[TopDeadSenter]

16 minutes ago, nauseus said:

Yes, I see that your sentiments are not shared by all:

But no surprise there.

Not to mention the "polite remainers" screaming scumbag and nazi traitor at poor 12 year old Rees Mogg jr as he walked home surrounded by a phalanx of police officers to stop the crazed mob tearing into him. Not very classy IMHO.

[fishtank]

Well done Bungle.

Yet another defeat. let the people decide.

[sanemax]

14 minutes ago, Chomper Higgot said:

How can I put this politely?

Just answer yes or no '

Are you a contributant  or  recipient of working peoples taxes ?

[Basil B]

 

30 minutes ago, nauseus said:

Yes, I see that your sentiments are not shared by all:

But no surprise there.

As I recall many MP's who oppose brexit have have been getting abuse from Brexiteers for a long time now including death threats, now a very angry gathering of people asking her to listen to them scares her.

 

As leader of the house under May she was responsible for controlling the agenda of parliament, she connived with May and the ERG to prevent parliament from debating alternative options including holding another referendum, instead she was party to operation "Wind Down The Clock".

 

Leadsom, welcome to the real world of your making.

 

Edited October 20, 2019 by Basil B

[Chomper Higgot]

23 minutes ago, sanemax said:

Just answer yes or no '

Are you a contributant  or  recipient of working peoples taxes ?

The tax I pay in the UK is considerably above the mean national wage, I have never received welfare.

 

How that changes any argument I have made is anybody’s guess.

[NanLaew]

13 hours ago, oldhippy said:

Sorry to read this about your parents.

But do you think the American / Thai systems do not make mistakes?

 

They all make mistakes but this is about the NHS and systemic failures and fraud due to mostly bad management and poor oversight. Before my parents passing, my sister was ramrodded out of employment by another NHS fiefdom. This was for being critical of a system where a high number of outpatients were being rushed through unnecessary health-screening just so the managers could claim more grants and recompense from central government. Bill padding or milking the cow for want of a better description. This was before whistle-blowers gained legal protections.

 

There are other NHS horror stories out there but it's the hype about it being repeatedly held up as a some totem of world class quality and integrity that sticks in my craw. Even Donald Trump wanted to buy it.

Edited October 20, 2019 by NanLaew

[DannyCarlton]

3 minutes ago, NanLaew said:

They all make mistakes but this is about the NHS and systemic failures and fraud due to mostly bad management and poor oversight. Before my parents passing, my sister was ramrodded out of employment by another NHS fiefdom. This was for being critical of a system where a high number of outpatients were being rushed through unnecessary health-screening just so the managers could claim more grants and recompense from central government. Bill padding or milking the cow for want of a better description. This was before whistle-blowers gained legal protections.

 

There are other NHS horror stories out there but it's the hype about it being repeatedly held up as a some totem of world class quality and integrity that sticks in my craw.

My wife, daughter and son in law all work in the NHS. They inform me that the demise in quality in the NHS is due to consistent underfunding by recent governments.

[NanLaew]

13 hours ago, oldhippy said:

in English please?

 

It's there on YouTube for all to see; go search. He did not say, "I am not going to send the letter."

[NanLaew]

10 minutes ago, DannyCarlton said:

My wife, daughter and son in law all work in the NHS. They inform me that the demise in quality in the NHS is due to consistent underfunding by recent governments.

And where does this claim of underfunding originate? From the management of the individual, badly managed, blatantly corrupt or horrendously inefficient trusts. There's no doubt that there are some shining stars in their firmament and the media makes much of them. However, the greater part is now a bloated, self-serving monolith that is far, far removed from what Nye Bevan envisaged. A world class enterprise needs world class management and in this I can agree with you, the revolving door on feckless and inept UK Health Ministers hasn't helped in this regard.

Edited October 20, 2019 by NanLaew

[DannyCarlton]

5 minutes ago, NanLaew said:

And where does this claim of underfunding originate? From the management of the individual, badly managed, blatantly corrupt or horrendously inefficient trusts. There's no doubt that there are some shining stars in their firmament and the media makes much of them. However, the greater part is now a bloated, self-serving monolith that is far, far removed from what Nye Bevan envisaged. A world class enterprise needs world class management and in this I can agree with you, the revolving door on feckless and inept UK Health Ministers hasn't helped in this regard.

The primary problem is underfunding. This claim originates from my family, nurses and doctors working i9n the NHS. I could give you a long list of government cost cutting initiatives that have directly led to the lowering of standards in the NHS but that's for another thread.

[NanLaew]

24 minutes ago, DannyCarlton said:

The primary problem is underfunding. This claim originates from my family, nurses and doctors working i9n the NHS. I could give you a long list of government cost cutting initiatives that have directly led to the lowering of standards in the NHS but that's for another thread.

No need for a long list; I agree that it all went south with Osborne's austerity budgets under the Tories coalition with the Lib Dems. Your family, like my sister, saw this from the front-end. Your family stresses the comparatively recent lack of funding whereas my sister, who's NHS career admittedly expired about 10 years ago, described it more as a spectacular waste of what funding was available. In hindsight, the fraud she witnessed could have been an altruistic but misguided effort to get badly needed funds but since there wasn't any notable investment in the department she supervised, it looked more like a local management boot-filling exercise, especially when she was told to shut up about it.

 

I am in agreement that it has been underfunded but just giving more money to inept or corrupt managers isn't going to help anyone in the long run.

 

I agree we took this thread off on a tangent but it's already past it's use-by date.

[tebee]

6 hours ago, sanemax said:

Just answer yes or no '

Are you a contributant  or  recipient of working peoples taxes ?

I just retired on the 2nd of September - does this somehow change the status of the value of my views?  

[nauseus]

7 hours ago, Chomper Higgot said:

 

Rats, Maggots.

 

What’s up with our Brexiteer brethren today, they normally take great personal offense when others start tossing derogatory remarks and name calling. 

Sadly, we have been led astray by years of abuse from rabiddy remainers.

[nauseus]

7 hours ago, Basil B said:

 

As I recall many MP's who oppose brexit have have been getting abuse from Brexiteers for a long time now including death threats, now a very angry gathering of people asking her to listen to them scares her.

 

As leader of the house under May she was responsible for controlling the agenda of parliament, she connived with May and the ERG to prevent parliament from debating alternative options including holding another referendum, instead she was party to operation "Wind Down The Clock".

 

Leadsom, welcome to the real world of your making.

 

Completely diverted from the point. Congratulations! 

[beautifulthailand99]

7 hours ago, nauseus said:

Yes, I see that your sentiments are not shared by all:

But no surprise there.

I was at that entrance I saw her and many others leaving with a huge police presence  - there were no missiles thrown just robust comments made - the anger that a Conservative government three and half years ago imposed on this country for opportunistic electoral advantage over UKIP and then subsequently two more conservative governments and 3 Tory PM's have foisted the undeliverable on the UK , trashing our money , threatening the breakup of the Union and causing the worse divisiveness in my lifetime and a police whose numbers these same Tories have reduced by 20,000 and slashed their pensions then is she surprised at the righteous anger. Lord Archer came out smiling and was unperturbed - I even quipped even you couldn't make this up to which he laughed and agreed. She should grow a pair or get out of politics. 

[beautifulthailand99]

7 hours ago, TopDeadSenter said:

Not to mention the "polite remainers" screaming scumbag and nazi traitor at poor 12 year old Rees Mogg jr as he walked home surrounded by a phalanx of police officers to stop the crazed mob tearing into him. Not very classy IMHO.

hmm he took his kid in and out if a public entrance when he could have used a ministerial car like many others did as commented  the police . Ken Clarke drove out himself in a modest red one smiling and to great cheers. He chose to walk out of that entrance with his son on purpose for the story he was clever enough to see would play out in the right wing press when ministerial cars were shuttling back and forth all the time. He is no slouch when it comes to propaganda and he used his son for that. Anyway with a million out on the streets a few may use intemperate language but no violence a credit to my countrymen and fellow Europeans who were there. And I can't speak highly enough of how wonderful the police were in every respect. When I came home I pointedly said to my wife I am proud to live in a democratic country, with a superb police force and with the freedom of speech and assembly.  Many engaged with the few Brexit Party folk out genially and with mutual respect even the rump UKIP nutters - the other more sinister knuckleheads who would have loved to have kicked off were the scary ones and unsurprisingly there favourite chant is for one Tommy Robinson and the police were out in force round those types. 

Edited October 20, 2019 by beautifulthailand99

[nauseus]

6 minutes ago, beautifulthailand99 said:

I was at that entrance I saw her and many others leaving with a huge police presence  - there were no missiles thrown just robust comments made - the anger that a Conservative government three and half years ago imposed on this country for opportunistic electoral advantage over UKIP and then subsequently two more conservative governments and 3 Tory PM's have foisted the undeliverable on the UK , trashing our money , threatening the breakup of the Union and causing the worse divisiveness in my lifetime and a police whose numbers these same Tories have reduced by 20,000 and slashed their pensions then is she surprised at the righteous anger. Lord Archer came out smiling and was unperturbed - I even quipped even you couldn't make this up to which he laughed and agreed. She should grow a pair or get out of politics. 

Her quote doesn't mention missiles.

 

A referendum on the EU was long, long overdue.

[DannyCarlton]

16 minutes ago, nauseus said:

Her quote doesn't mention missiles.

 

A referendum on the EU was long, long overdue.

But not due until after the government had negotiated the withdrawal agreement.

[tebee]

26 minutes ago, DannyCarlton said:

But not due until after the government had negotiated the withdrawal agreement.

Why are brexiters so happy to buy a pig in a poke.

 

They want the referendum result respecting without knowing what it means.

 

They wanted Boris deal passing yesterday without him having to show people what was in it .

 

buying the aforesaid pig is not normally a good investment.  

[BritManToo]

7 minutes ago, tebee said:

They want the referendum result respecting without knowing what it means.

I was hoping it meant war against Europe.

Or at the very least sinking the Spanish fishing fleet.

Edited October 20, 2019 by BritManToo

[473geo]

6 minutes ago, tebee said:

Why are brexiters so happy to buy a pig in a poke.

 

They want the referendum result respecting without knowing what it means.

 

They wanted Boris deal passing yesterday without him having to show people what was in it .

 

buying the aforesaid pig is not normally a good investment.  

Labour can't pass a deal, they have been constantly stalling the process, the only mitigation would be a second referendum where the vote to leave was overturned. Otherwise if Brexit happens, deal or no deal, Labour will be slated as contradicting the will of the people!

Joe public, clearly looking for an end to the uncertainty, where in reality Labour are more concerned with fighting for political survival!! Desperate times for a party whose only input has been disruption.

[SheungWan]

Sadly, we have been led astray by years of abuse from rabiddy remainers.

Especially the ones pointing out that there has been no vote for no-deal Brexit.

Sent from my SM-N935F using Thailand Forum - Thaivisa mobile app

[SheungWan]

Labour can't pass a deal, they have been constantly stalling the process, the only mitigation would be a second referendum where the vote to leave was overturned. Otherwise if Brexit happens, deal or no deal, Labour will be slated as contradicting the will of the people!
Joe public, clearly looking for an end to the uncertainty, where in reality Labour are more concerned with fighting for political survival!! Desperate times for a party whose only input has been disruption.

Self-appointed Brexiteer spokesmen for Joe Public and his wife Gertie.

Sent from my SM-N935F using Thailand Forum - Thaivisa mobile app

[SheungWan]

I was hoping it meant war against Europe.
Or at the very least sinking the Spanish fishing fleet.

But in the end the Hard Brexiteers haul might amount to a damp squib.

Sent from my SM-N935F using Thailand Forum - Thaivisa mobile app

[yodsak]

Tumultuous Tuesday vote

 

 

11 days to go.

Edited October 20, 2019 by yodsak

[nauseus]

6 hours ago, DannyCarlton said:

But not due until after the government had negotiated the withdrawal agreement.

Do you agree that the EU does not want the UK to leave it? 

[DannyCarlton]

1 minute ago, nauseus said:

Do you agree that the EU does not want the UK to leave it? 

Yes but I don't see how that has any bearing on my post.

 

BTW. 48% of Brits didn't want to leave it in 2016. I'll wager that that figure is well over 50% now. Don't believe me? Let's have a people's vote then.

[nauseus]

9 minutes ago, DannyCarlton said:

Yes but I don't see how that has any bearing on my post.

 

BTW. 48% of Brits didn't want to leave it in 2016. I'll wager that that figure is well over 50% now. Don't believe me? Let's have a people's vote then.

The government has negotiated the withdrawal agreement (again). This agreement is much the same as the last attempt. The latest attempt has not even got as far as a vote. It is this parliament which cannot agree with this proposed agreement, not the government. So we need a new government asap via a GE.