Johnson faces perilous Brexit ratification after deal vote blocked

By Kylie MacLellan and William James

 

Britain's Prime Minister Boris Johnson speaks ahead of a vote on his renegotiated Brexit deal, on what has been dubbed "Super Saturday", in the House of Commons in London, Britain October 19, 2019. ©UK Parliament/Jessica Taylor/Handout via REUTERS

 

LONDON (Reuters) - Prime Minister Boris Johnson faces a potentially perilous ratification of his Brexit divorce deal in the British parliament after the speaker refused to allow a vote on it on Monday.

 

With just 10 days left until the United Kingdom is due to leave the European Union on Oct. 31, the divorce is again in disarray as Britain's politicians argue over whether to leave with a deal, exit without a deal or hold another referendum.

 

The government is trying to force through the legislation needed for Britain to leave the bloc in the shortest time possible, drawing cries from opposition lawmakers that Johnson was trying to bully and rush lawmakers into passing the bill.

 

Earlier, House of Commons speaker John Bercow said a vote should not be allowed on Monday as the same issue had been discussed on Saturday when opponents turned Johnson's big Brexit day into a humiliation.

 

British Prime Minister Boris Johnson was prevented from holding another vote on his Brexit deal on Monday, giving his opponents more time to thwart his plans. David Doyle reports.

 

"In summary, today's motion is in substance the same as Saturday's motion and the House (of Commons) has decided the matter. Today's circumstances are in substance the same as Saturday's circumstances," Bercow told parliament.

 

"My ruling is therefore that the motion will not be debated today as it would be repetitive and disorderly to do so," Bercow said, provoking the ire of Brexit supporting lawmakers who said they had been refused a chance to vote on Johnson's deal.

 

Bercow said the government could still secure ratification for the Brexit deal by Oct. 31 if it had the numbers in parliament. Johnson was disappointed by the decision, a spokesman said.

 

But the speaker's decision means that the government will have to try to push on with the legislation needed for ratification, a process opponents are plotting to wreck with amendments that would destroy Johnson's deal.

 

Jacob Rees-Mogg, the leader of the House of Commons, said the government wanted the lower house of parliament to finish voting on the bill on Thursday, before it heads to the upper house, which also has to approve it before the Brexit deadline.

 

"Trying to ram through legislation of this complexity, significance and long lasting consequences in just 3 days is an abomination of scrutiny and democracy," said Nicola Sturgeon, the leader of the Scottish National Party.

 

Sterling <GBP=D3> traded at around $1.30, unaffected by the speaker's move.

 

AMBUSH

Johnson was ambushed in parliament on Saturday by opponents who demanded a change to the sequencing of the ratification of the deal, exposing the prime minister to a law which forced him to request a delay until Jan. 31.

 

He sent the note to the European Union unsigned - and added another signed letter arguing against what he said was a deeply corrosive delay.

Brexit Secretary Steve Barclay said European Council President Donald Tusk had accepted the delay request as valid and was considering it.

 

The European Union, which has grappled with the Brexit crisis since Britons voted 52%-48% to leave in a 2016 referendum, decided on Sunday to play for time rather than rush to decide on Johnson's request for a delay.

 

From the bloc's point of view, extension options range from just an additional month until the end of November to half a year or longer.

 

The government insists Britain will leave the EU on Oct. 31. Parliament will vote in the second reading on legislation known as the Withdrawal Agreement Bill on Tuesday, after which amendments can be proposed to it.

 

Johnson's ministers said they were confident they had the numbers to push a deal through parliament, though there was concern that amendments could wreck Johnson's deal.

 

CRITICISM

The opposition Labour Party is planning changes to the legislation needed for Brexit that would make the deal unacceptable to swathes of Johnson's own party -- including a proposal for another referendum.

 

Bercow's decision provoked criticism from Brexit supporters.

 

"It is becoming remarkable how often you please one lot and not the other lot," Bernard Jenkin, a pro-Brexit Conservative Party lawmaker, told parliament.

 

Bercow dismissed such criticism, saying his decision was honourable and based on a long-standing convention in the House of Commons.

 

"He is grumbling now because he doesn't like the judgement," Bercow said of Jenkin. "If the government have got the numbers, the government can have their way."

 

The Withdrawal Agreement Bill enshrines the Brexit deal, known as the Withdrawal Agreement in British law and must be passed before the treaty is considered to be ratified.

 

Previous bills to implement major European treaties have taken between 10 and 40 sitting days to get through parliament, according to the Institute of Government.

 

A spokesman for Johnson said that if the legislation strayed too far from the deal then its ratification would be placed in question.

 

(Additional reporting by Gabriela Baczynska in Brussels and Elizabeth Piper in London; Writing by Guy Faulconbridge; Editing by Toby Chopr, Jon Boyle, William Maclean)

 

-- © Copyright Reuters 2019-10-22

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Boris  has failed miserably, next. 

25 minutes ago, pegman said:

Boris  has failed miserably, next. 

He promised to be out by 31st October.

It's only 22nd ........ no failure yet, as far as I can see.

Bercow is a disgrace. Not even attempting to hide his bias any more. Not to mention the secret meetings to plot with Sassoli.

 

By comparison this makes Thailand look like a stable, functioning Democracy. A national embarrassment .

Bercow is a disgrace. Not even attempting to hide his bias any more. Not to mention the secret meetings to plot with Sassoli.
 
By comparison this makes Thailand look like a stable, functioning Democracy. A national embarrassment .

Bercow an excellent Speaker. Well at least for anybody following the actual reason for stopping Boris trying yet again to bounce Parliament.

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He promised to be out by 31st October.
It's only 22nd ........ no failure yet, as far as I can see.

Myopic analysis.

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42 minutes ago, BritManToo said:

He promised to be out by 31st October.

It's only 22nd ........ no failure yet, as far as I can see.

Boris promised....5555555

19 minutes ago, SheungWan said:

Bercow an excellent Speaker. Well at least for anybody following the actual reason for stopping Boris trying yet again to bounce Parliament.

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He is an excellent speaker for Remainers because he is completely biased towards Remain.

 

Of course you like him. If all you care about is Remaining at all costs and you don't give a toss about convention, the constitution, Democracy, bullying of subordinates and the integrity of the House of Commons then he's perfect ????.

October 31 Brexit because EU not delay any more

 

 

So Boris says, “Then I will huff and I will puff and I will blow your house down! ????

9 minutes ago, JonnyF said:

He is an excellent speaker for Remainers because he is completely biased towards Remain.

 

Of course you like him. If all you care about is Remaining at all costs and you don't give a toss about convention, the constitution, Democracy, bullying of subordinates and the integrity of the House of Commons then he's perfect ????.

Like unlawfully proroguing Parliament.

38 minutes ago, SheungWan said:

Bercow an excellent Speaker.

 

Yeah for the remainers

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

38 minutes ago, SheungWan said:

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

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15 minutes ago, ICELANDMAN said:

October 31 Brexit because EU not delay any more

 

9 minutes ago, Chomper Higgot said:

Like unlawfully proroguing Parliament.

To comply with the democratic vote in 2016

Don,t know why every ones getting so upset,it only wants 1 country  out the 27 to veto the extension and we,'re out.

5 minutes ago, kingdong said:

To comply with the democratic vote in 2016

And then Parliament was reopened to comply with the law.

The remainers still can't grasp what is happening. OK, so they managed(through a highly compromised speaker) to frustrate the result of the 2016 referendum, but the public are furious and growing ever more angry each time the speaker and remainers thwart their will. They can not put off a general election for ever, and having seen the poll results Labour are in for a severe hiding, and Boris is soaring. The result of all the shenanigans is that the Brexit we get will end up being much harder than if they only played fair and got this compromise Boris deal done and dusted. 

 The damage to democracy thanks to the remainer behaviour is IMHO insurmountable and huge changes will take place after the next election to ensure such anti democratic displays can not occur again. They only have themselves to blame. See you at the ballot box!

45 minutes ago, SheungWan said:

Bercow an excellent Speaker. Well at least for anybody following the actual reason for stopping Boris trying yet again to bounce Parliament.

Sent from my SM-N935F using Thailand Forum - Thaivisa mobile app
 

He told May the exact same thing, he is not making the rules up, he is referring to Erskin May

Quote

Erskine May’s treatise on the law, privileges, proceedings and usage of Parliament (25th edition, 2019), online and free to use.

https://erskinemay.parliament.uk/

 

Yesterday I took the time to watch this video in which Keir Starmer presents lots of valid points.

Boris deal is bad, he tries to hide the details and he tries to rush it through parliament.

How can any politician support a PM with such bad intentions and a record of telling anything but the truth?

 

 

3 minutes ago, TopDeadSenter said:

The remainers still can't grasp what is happening. OK, so they managed(through a highly compromised speaker) to frustrate the result of the 2016 referendum, but the public are furious and growing ever more angry each time the speaker and remainers thwart their will. They can not put off a general election for ever, and having seen the poll results Labour are in for a severe hiding, and Boris is soaring. The result of all the shenanigans is that the Brexit we get will end up being much harder than if they only played fair and got this compromise Boris deal done and dusted. 

 The damage to democracy thanks to the remainer behaviour is IMHO insurmountable and huge changes will take place after the next election to ensure such anti democratic displays can not occur again. They only have themselves to blame. See you at the ballot box!

The remainers Brexiteers still can't grasp what is happening...

 

 

its karma, maggie got the whole ipcc started,

now you reap what you sow, karma is inheritable

7 minutes ago, TopDeadSenter said:

The remainers still can't grasp what is happening. OK, so they managed(through a highly compromised speaker) to frustrate the result of the 2016 referendum, but the public are furious and growing ever more angry each time the speaker and remainers thwart their will. They can not put off a general election for ever, and having seen the poll results Labour are in for a severe hiding, and Boris is soaring. The result of all the shenanigans is that the Brexit we get will end up being much harder than if they only played fair and got this compromise Boris deal done and dusted. 

 The damage to democracy thanks to the remainer behaviour is IMHO insurmountable and huge changes will take place after the next election to ensure such anti democratic displays can not occur again. They only have themselves to blame. See you at the ballot box!

Lots of leavers talk about that referendum and democracy.

But recently it seems very little is written about the advantages of Brexit.

Where are the advantages? Should a government follow through with anything after lots of facts come out and show that the original decision was flawed and bad for the country?

 

Just doing something now because 52% thought 3 years ago they like that idea does not make sense! 

Now people know a lot more details. Let them decide if they want to stay in the EU or if they like Boris Great Deal.

If his deal is so wonderful then you should have no doubt that the majority will support it.

35 minutes ago, Chomper Higgot said:

Like unlawfully proroguing Parliament.

555 classic whataboutism.

 

The courts ruling against the government on political, nonjusticiable matters against Brexit is yet another example of the establishment being completely biased towards Remain. Another embarrassment that Remainers have brought on the country. I'd be keeping quiet about that if I was you.

4 minutes ago, JonnyF said:

555 classic whataboutism.

 

The courts ruling against the government on political, nonjusticiable matters against Brexit is yet another example of the establishment being completely biased towards Remain. Another embarrassment that Remainers have brought on the country. I'd be keeping quiet about that if I was you.

 

Maybe it's not a bias but have they concluded that Brexit is a big mistake and has no benefits?

 

Has the UK already better trade deals? So far it looks bad.

 

 

18 minutes ago, TopDeadSenter said:

The remainers still can't grasp what is happening. OK, so they managed(through a highly compromised speaker) to frustrate the result of the 2016 referendum, but the public are furious and growing ever more angry each time the speaker and remainers thwart their will. They can not put off a general election for ever, and having seen the poll results Labour are in for a severe hiding, and Boris is soaring. The result of all the shenanigans is that the Brexit we get will end up being much harder than if they only played fair and got this compromise Boris deal done and dusted. 

 The damage to democracy thanks to the remainer behaviour is IMHO insurmountable and huge changes will take place after the next election to ensure such anti democratic displays can not occur again. They only have themselves to blame. See you at the ballot box!

1. Your claim of the means by which Remain supporters have managed to frustrate Brexit is flawed: Firstly you have no evidence of the speaker being compromised and secondly you ignore court victories and legitimately votes in Parliament. Hundreds of thousands of Remain supporters peacefully protesting in the capital played a part too.

 

2. I guess you are furious, I see no evidence of ‘the public being furious’. You are perhaps extrapolating, your own emotions.

 

3. The General Election is not being ‘put off for ever’, it’s not even being ‘put off’. The next election is due (under the governing law) in 2022.

 

4. Your assertion that ‘Labour are in for a severe hiding’ is yet to be proven, while your claim ‘Boris is soaring’ is measured against the fact that Boris is continually losing. You are perhaps ignoring some uncomfortable realities.

 

5. Where was your interest in ‘playing fair’ when Boris was unlawfully proroguing Parliament and you thought you were winning?

 

6. Your claimed ‘Damage to democracy’ is, by your own addition your own opinion, and as we see you are wrong on so many things.

 

Now what were you saying about people not being able to grasp what is happening?

 

 

 

36 minutes ago, Basil B said:

He told May the exact same thing, he is not making the rules up, he is referring to Erskin May

 

Yes he's always consistent. He consistently abides with the conventions if that supports Remain. And he consistently breaks conventions if that supports Remain ????. He secretly meets with Sassoli (EU Parliament President) to plot strategies to Remain, and he drives around with "Barlucks To Brexit" stickers on his car.

 

This is the guy who is supposed to be impartial and the "referee" of the house of commons. It's like a boxing referee putting a fighter in a headlock while the other fighter punches him. It's absolutely laughable, and makes a mockery of the system.

 

Obviously Remainers love him as he shares their values of trampling all over Democracy and the constitution to try to get what they want. Of course, all they are doing is delaying the inevitable and hardening the resolve of Leavers but they haven't worked that out yet.

Edited October 22, 20196 yr by JonnyF

2 minutes ago, dimitriv said:

 

Maybe it's not a bias but have they concluded that Brexit is a big mistake and has no benefits?

 

Has the UK already better trade deals? So far it looks bad.

 

 

Are you suggesting it is OK to for unelected judges to overturn the political decisions of a democratically elected Government?

11 minutes ago, JonnyF said:

Are you suggesting it is OK to for unelected judges to overturn the political decisions of a democratically elected Government?

 

If that government breaks the laws...  Yes, for sure.  Everybody has to follow the law.

 

But what about the trade deals ?  We talked about that before. And you expected a lot. But till now it looks very sad. Nothing worth talking about. Even before Brexit takes place it is already a failure. 

 

 

Edited October 22, 20196 yr by dimitriv

50 minutes ago, TopDeadSenter said:

The remainers still can't grasp what is happening. OK, so they managed(through a highly compromised speaker) to frustrate the result of the 2016 referendum, but the public are furious and growing ever more angry each time the speaker and remainers thwart their will. They can not put off a general election for ever, and having seen the poll results Labour are in for a severe hiding, and Boris is soaring. The result of all the shenanigans is that the Brexit we get will end up being much harder than if they only played fair and got this compromise Boris deal done and dusted. 

 The damage to democracy thanks to the remainer behaviour is IMHO insurmountable and huge changes will take place after the next election to ensure such anti democratic displays can not occur again. They only have themselves to blame. See you at the ballot box!

Ok, see you there. 

9 minutes ago, JonnyF said:

Yes he's always consistent. He consistently abides with the conventions if that supports Remain. And he consistently breaks conventions if that supports Remain ????. He secretly meets with Sassoli (EU Parliament President) to plot strategies to Remain, and he drives around with "Barlucks To Brexit" stickers on his car.

 

This is the guy who is supposed to be impartial and the "referee" of the house of commons. It's like a boxing referee putting a fighter in a headlock while the other fighter punches him. It's absolutely laughable, and makes a mockery of the system.

 

Obviously Remainers love him as he shares their values of trampling all over Democracy and the constitution to try to get what they want. Of course, all they are doing is delaying the inevitable and hardening the resolve of Leavers but they haven't worked that out yet.

What really upsets you Brexiteers he is as speaker preventing the Government from "railroading"  parliament, Yes, he has views but please show where he has ignored Erskine May...