Tourist numbers well on track statistics show

[Dice Man]

On 10/25/2019 at 3:37 PM, Just Weird said:

So what statistics do you have to contradict the official figures?

The proven MK 1 eye ball  !!!

[Timwin]

When you deport long time, multiple visit per year tourists and other visitors for no good reason they will let it know in web forums and elsewhere in their home countries that Thailand is no longer a good place to go. That means even many of the first time tourists will also fly elsewhere, like to Vietnam or Malesia. On top of the very expensive Baht... 

[WillyPlatt]

My favourite eaterie on Pattaya Klang was 80 percent farang 4 years ago and is now 90 percent asian.

During low season if i did not get there by 11am i might not get a seat. I know the owners and it is well priced and good.

Visitor numbers is one thing, spending of those said visitors is another thing.

Meanwhile, the bars and restaurants of soi bukhawo are in real trouble.

 

[Yinn]

3 hours ago, xylophone said:

They also like to spit on the floors in restaurants,

Not see

3 hours ago, xylophone said:

 

put their feet on restaurant and cafe tables and cut their toenails at the same time, so that everyone gets showered with bits of toenails and dry skin – – yes I have seen all of that from the Chinese visitors.

Not see

3 hours ago, xylophone said:

 

You can add that I've also seen them pissing in the street and also defecating in the flower beds outside of a restaurant.

Not see

 

3 hours ago, xylophone said:

 

And the noise that they make when in large groups, taking over small cafes and allowing their children to play like it was a playground,

Agree 100%

3 hours ago, xylophone said:

 

as well as shouting above everybody else, is just monstrous. And on a number of occasions I have stood in front of unruly and ignorant tourists like this and shouted at them to stop/shut up........and the owners have thanked me for doing it.

You shout out at shout people?55555

 

 

3 hours ago, xylophone said:

 

And to go from bad to worse, a Chinese child had obviously wet itself whilst going around a Big C store with its parents, so they stopped by the nappy section to buy some new ones and changed him there and then, leaving the soiled one on the floor! Disgusting.

Agree

 

3 hours ago, xylophone said:

 

You say that they like to tour, so how about teaching them some manners before they do that.

We have sign for behavior. 90% are ok.

 

3 hours ago, xylophone said:

 

I have never seen a more disgusting group of people than those Chinese tourists whom I have witnessed coming to Phuket.

Fat old sex tourist with young sex worker or them? Up to the person.

[Yinn]

17 hours ago, spidermike007 said:

Yinn wrote:

 

They like to tour, love it. They tour all day. 

 

You not see it at your empty bar. I understand that. 

I not care.

I happy have bet is true. But think you have no money to pay. I will pay for your air ticket.

 

Pope is catholic? And???? 

 

Play at you for stupid? Hmmmm. Lazy to answer you again.

 

my reply:

 

Real high quality tourism. Wow. They each paid $13. Amazing what you can find, when you really come up with a plan, and then get the best minds to implement it. 

$13 x 500 perople = $6,500 for Friday 

 

average day about 300 = $3,900

 

expense less than 20,000 per day.

 

My friend going good. Winner.

You say your friend have no money. Maybe listen to you to much.

 

 

 

 

[CLS]

Bangkok is the city in the worls with most visitors.40 million they say.I really dont understands the numbers.

They count the birds too.

[joecoolfrog]

3 hours ago, Just Weird said:

Which way would you suggest that the correct numbers (which are not "dishonest") are interpreted, then?  Do you want to be subjected to an interview from TAT staff for every visitor to the country every time they pass through Immigration, including yourself?  

Well the figures obviously include a percentage of same day shoppers , 24 hour sex mongers and business people returning from overseas trips ,  not to mention the duplication of those who cross immigration more than once annually.

Is any attempt made to adjust the tourist numbers to reflect this , no , why not ?

One obviously cannot interview every tourist yet precise spending numbers are presented based on certain data and projected , exactly the same could be done to approximate true tourist figures.

My conclusion is that tourist numbers and income is massaged to look good , that is dishonest .What reason do you have  do to not agree , other than your natural inclination to defend ' Thainess ' ?

[xylophone]

1 hour ago, Yinn said:

5 hours ago, xylophone said:

They also like to spit on the floors in restaurants,

Not see

I and friends have seen many times and it has been posted on TVisa.

 

1 hour ago, Yinn said:

Quote

put their feet on restaurant and cafe tables and cut their toenails at the same time, so that everyone gets showered with bits of toenails and dry skin – – yes I have seen all of that from the Chinese visitors.

Not see

Well I and the restaurant staff did, and were disgusted, and when they told him to stop, he looked amazed that he was told to stop!!

 

1 hour ago, Yinn said:

Quote

You can add that I've also seen them pissing in the street and also defecating in the flower beds outside of a restaurant.

Not see

Also been seen and noted by others on the TVisa threads.

 

1 hour ago, Yinn said:

Quote

as well as shouting above everybody else, is just monstrous. And on a number of occasions I have stood in front of unruly and ignorant tourists like this and shouted at them to stop/shut up........and the owners have thanked me for doing it.

You shout out at shout people?55555

Damn right......on several occasions, as the groups were way too noisy and the Starbucks cafe was unbearable because of it. So I got up from my seat (on more than one occasion) walked over to them, stood right in front and shouted out, "Shut up you noisy bastards", and they quietened down.

 

The Starbucks staff thanked me so much because other people were complaining about the noise and leaving because of it, whereupon I sat back down to read my paper in peace.

 

 

1 hour ago, Yinn said:

Quote

You say that they like to tour, so how about teaching them some manners before they do that.

We have sign for behavior. 90% are ok.

From my experience that figure is way too high, as I have found a greater % that are rude and ignorant.........and don't get me started on the disgusting state that a young Chinese couple left my CHINESE girlfriends toilet in. So bad she couldn't go in to clean the feces and urine that were all over the place.

 

ALL THESE THINGS I HAVE SEEN.........just because you haven't doesn't mean that they don't/didn't happen! Disgusting people.

[Selatan]

1 hour ago, Yinn said:

$13 x 500 perople = $6,500 for Friday 

 

average day about 300 = $3,900

 

expense less than 20,000 per day.

 

My friend going good. Winner.

You say your friend have no money. Maybe listen to you to much.

 

 

 

 

It's good to hear that your friend is earning good money from tour groups from China. However, the number of free independent travellers (FIT) from China are on the rise and are now bigger than the tour groups. These travellers are younger, better educated, wealthier and have better language skills than those who travel in tour groups. Many of the tour group participants from China are lowly-educated country bumpkins from the smaller cities or from the countryside.

Attracting these independent travellers from China would require a different strategy. As they are more tech-savvy, a way to connect to them via the Chinese social network is probably needed.

Edited October 27, 2019 by Selatan

[Selatan]

3 minutes ago, Selatan said:

 

deleted

Edited October 27, 2019 by Selatan

[DUNROAMIN]

14 hours ago, dallen52 said:

What would be interesting to see is the actual length of stay per "Tourist".!!!

Then calculate the spend per tourist day here.

 

It's all well to say the Chinese tourists are way outnumbering any others, but takeaway certain factors, like.

 

C. Tourists book through home country agents. 

C. Tourists are escorted everywhere. 

C. Tourists have free entry to Thailand. No visa fees.

C. Tourists never return. 

C. Tourists buy up cheap condos and then rent to other country folks.

C. Tourists have massive discounts on the tour packages. 

C. Tourists usually have one free night to get out alone. 

C. Tourists normally do 5 or 7 days group tours.

C. Tourists go everywhere in chartered buses.

 

The recorded/reported revenue is only the up front spend.

The on the street spend is next to nothing. 

They would not come if not for the huge promotional discount they get.

 

You talk to any locals around Pattaya and they put them in the same category as the Indian tourists. 

 

One drink many straws.

One meal, several plates to share. 

And definitely no tips...

 

Don't forget their herded to any tourist shop that is owned by Chinese. Thailand would not see much money from these people, saw it Australia first hand, and not to mention from my experience they are very rude and pushy.

[dimitriv]

51 minutes ago, DUNROAMIN said:

Don't forget their herded to any tourist shop that is owned by Chinese. Thailand would not see much money from these people, saw it Australia first hand, and not to mention from my experience they are very rude and pushy.

 

This youtube video made by a Thai model about Chinese behaviour in lines and toilets has over 2 million views:

  

 

 

 

Edited October 27, 2019 by dimitriv

[BuckBee]

I have witnessed chinese women pissing in the streets on 2 occasions .

one was near chinese embassy at soi 3 ratchada with fortune town and central 2 minutes away and in clear sight with toilets on every floor .

They where in a group taking turns pissing on a side walk drainage cover during busy lunch hour lol .

 

Other occasion was outside MBK with old chinese lady squirting <deleted>/diarrhoea everywhere at a bus stop, was in a right mess no idea how that got resolved/cleaned up , was enough make you puke, not a thai in sight, they cleared off to make a new bus stop point lol

 

Just can't understand the logic when toilets are close to hand ????

 

I got caught once with bad guts in huay kwang late evening and rather <deleted> on the street I politely asked a street restaurant if could use the toilet and tipped them 50Bt for obliging

Sure you can get stuck but they seem do it even when decent toilets available ....

[Peterbilt]

6 hours ago, Selatan said:

It's good to hear that your friend is earning good money from tour groups from China. However, the number of free independent travellers (FIT) from China are on the rise and are now bigger than the tour groups. These travellers are younger, better educated, wealthier and have better language skills than those who travel in tour groups. Many of the tour group participants from China are lowly-educated country bumpkins from the smaller cities or from the countryside.

Attracting these independent travellers from China would require a different strategy. As they are more tech-savvy, a way to connect to them via the Chinese social network is probably needed.

Correct. And being VERY tech-savvy means that they use "social" media a lot, which in case of China means WeChat (the chinese copy of WhatsApp), QQ (the chinese copy of Twitter) and Ren Ren (the chinese copy of Facebook. Ren Ren is less important, since WeChat is taking over the role of Facebook).
So information is spread in a very short time. And information about a good "tourist attraction" travels around at the same speed as information about rip-offs, scams etc.
If any Thai thinks he/she can outsmart those next generation travellers from China, he/she should better think twice..........

[Peterbilt]

3 hours ago, dimitriv said:

 

  

 

 

<deleted>

Edited October 27, 2019 by Peterbilt

[nong38]

No mention of people from Antarctica notice, must be a mistake, check those figures and don't forget the penguins count treble on a Tuesday.

[Just Weird]

19 hours ago, joecoolfrog said:

My conclusion is that tourist numbers and income is massaged to look good , that is dishonest .What reason do you have  do to not agree , other than your natural inclination to defend ' Thainess ' ?

The reason I do not agree with you is that there is no suggestion from anyone, except mainly Thaivisa members who, in the most part have an anti-Thai agenda almost always backed-up by nothing empirical, that the figures are significantly inaccurate, just as you demonstrate. 

 

They're counting visitors to the country, the purpose of those visits is irrelevant to the numbers coming in!

 

[Saint Nick]

On 10/25/2019 at 4:41 PM, Yinn said:

Yes, correct. Tourism up again. Good news for Thailand, people around world love come thailand, the thai smile, thai food, good weather, shopping, tour,  love it. 

Up,up,up! 

 

But, lot of TVF members disagree. They have someone at the airport count. They know, sure. 

They never give there number. But down, down, down. 

Wow!

You are really special, aren't you?

Maybe some of us work in the tourism (or related) industry!

I do!

And I can tell you: the numbers haven't been up in years!

At least for the European, that is!

And mind you: numbers up means NOTHING, if the newly incoming masses are not leaving their money here!

Chinese groups don't!

Indian groups don't!

So please TAT (and Yinn): stop your senseless propaganda!

[Saint Nick]

On 10/26/2019 at 6:21 PM, Yinn said:

8 million Chinese come to Thailand. 

They like to tour, love it. They tour all day. 

 

You not see it at your empty bar. I understand that. 

I not care.

I happy have bet is true. But think you have no money to pay. I will pay for your air ticket.

 

Pope is catholic? And???? 

 

Play at you for stupid? Hmmmm. Lazy to answer you again. 

...and YOU are seriously asking other people, to show you, where they have their numbers from?

 

[Saint Nick]

I said it before: just take Patpong for an example!

When I came here for the first time (1997, I think) me and a friend went to the nightmarket.

You practically did not need to walk by yourself!

The masses moved you forward!

22 years later and you can take your friend by the hand and skip through the nightmarket -area...you would barely touch someone!

And "no"- the people who went to the nightmarket were not sexpats and sextourists.

They were couples and families and single travelers!

There are bars, that I frequented regularly in my 10+ years, living here!

You hardly see any customers in them anymore!

 

And that is just circumstantial evidence!

The numbers are DOWN!

 

[joecoolfrog]

2 hours ago, Just Weird said:

The reason I do not agree with you is that there is no suggestion from anyone, except mainly Thaivisa members who, in the most part have an anti-Thai agenda almost always backed-up by nothing empirical, that the figures are significantly inaccurate, just as you demonstrate. 

 

They're counting visitors to the country, the purpose of those visits is irrelevant to the numbers coming in!

 

I have no anti Thai agenda so your opening remarks are moot.

My gripe is actually with the projected tourist spend , so its not purely pedantic to wish actual tourist numbers rather than a generic visitors tab.

I suggest you do the maths , in all cases TAT project an annual percentage BAHT increase , this despite that currency being extremely strong for the last 12 months.

That is empirical and relates to a real time increase of 10-20% across the board , ridiculous and yes dishonest.

 

[Angry Dragon]

8 minutes ago, Saint Nick said:

I said it before: just take Patpong for an example!

When I came here for the first time (1997, I think) me and a friend went to the nightmarket.

You practically did not need to walk by yourself!

The masses moved you forward!

22 years later and you can take your friend by the hand and skip through the nightmarket -area...you would barely touch someone!

And "no"- the people who went to the nightmarket were not sexpats and sextourists.

They were couples and families and single travelers!

There are bars, that I frequented regularly in my 10+ years, living here!

You hardly see any customers in them anymore!

 

And that is just circumstantial evidence!

The numbers are DOWN!

 

good grief is that the best you can offer?

 

Thailand in 1997 is much different from Thailand today.  In 1997, patpong was probably considered a prime tourist go-to area.

 

Today it barely gets noticed.  Why?  Because the country has done much more to expand options for tourists.  If they want shopping, the patpong night market will be one of the last choices.  Look at all the various malls that have since been built - you will find all of your past nightmarket tourists there.

[Saint Nick]

1 hour ago, Angry Dragon said:

good grief is that the best you can offer?

 

Thailand in 1997 is much different from Thailand today.  In 1997, patpong was probably considered a prime tourist go-to area.

 

Today it barely gets noticed.  Why?  Because the country has done much more to expand options for tourists.  If they want shopping, the patpong night market will be one of the last choices.  Look at all the various malls that have since been built - you will find all of your past nightmarket tourists there.

In 1997 Patpong was as full of GoGo Bars, as it is now and it was famous as being a red light district!, with a night market inside!

So where are all the people gone, who frequented the beer- and GoGo Bars?

Are they also hanging around in the big shopping malls (who are also mainly empty, if you are being honest)!?

 

And mind you: it is an EXAMPLE!

One of many, where you can see the decline in numbers, if you are willing to see!

Or if you are able, because it seems your glasses are beyond rose- tinted!

[Yinn]

7 minutes ago, Saint Nick said:

In 1997 Patpong was as full of GoGo Bars, as it is now and it was famous as being a red light district!, with a night market inside!

So where are all the people gone, who frequented the beer- and GoGo Bars?

Maybe they find “love” already. And buy the house in the countryside with darling from the gogo?

 

How you know it empty now? You still go there right?

 

before (1997) have many lonely euro guy marry the sex worker. But nowadays (2019) most tourist to Thailand is from China. They not like to marry a sex worker. They think not good idea.

 

[Yinn]

4 hours ago, Just Weird said:

The reason I do not agree with you is that there is no suggestion from anyone, except mainly Thaivisa members who, in the most part have an anti-Thai agenda almost always backed-up by nothing empirical, that the figures are significantly inaccurate, just as you demonstrate. 

 

They're counting visitors to the country, the purpose of those visits is irrelevant to the numbers coming in!

 

They not believe you. They really believe themself.

waste your time explain it. Not want to listen. If they belief themself, up to them, I not care.

 

[Gweiloman]

15 minutes ago, Saint Nick said:

In 1997 Patpong was as full of GoGo Bars, as it is now and it was famous as being a red light district!, with a night market inside!

So where are all the people gone, who frequented the beer- and GoGo Bars?

Are they also hanging around in the big shopping malls (who are also mainly empty, if you are being honest)!?

 

And mind you: it is an EXAMPLE!

One of many, where you can see the decline in numbers, if you are willing to see!

Or if you are able, because it seems your glasses are beyond rose- tinted!

You claim to be in the tourist industry and you don’t realise that the tourists of today are different from 20 years ago. No wonder that your business is not faring well. 

[Angry Dragon]

19 minutes ago, Saint Nick said:

In 1997 Patpong was as full of GoGo Bars, as it is now and it was famous as being a red light district!, with a night market inside!

So where are all the people gone, who frequented the beer- and GoGo Bars?

Are they also hanging around in the big shopping malls (who are also mainly empty, if you are being honest)!?

 

And mind you: it is an EXAMPLE!

One of many, where you can see the decline in numbers, if you are willing to see!

Or if you are able, because it seems your glasses are beyond rose- tinted!

The people who frequented the beer and GoGo bars are still here, but probably not as plentiful.

The number of families coming to Thailand is much higher.  You could say that the TAT has done its job in cleaning up its act by trying to attract better quality tourists.  After living here for nearly 20 years, I'm pleased to see the likes of PatPong, Nana and Cowboy decline, even if it is in part being replaced by shopping (there are other things to do as well - waterparks, island tourism, hiking and biking tours have taken off over the past 20 years.

 

the shopping malls seem to be still doing well for the most part.  My rare visits to Paragon or CentralWorld show the place pretty packed.

 

I'm glad you admit your reference to Patpong was only an "Example" - anecdotal evidence such as this shows the value of a "bigger picture" view.

[Saint Nick]

29 minutes ago, Yinn said:

Maybe they find “love” already. And buy the house in the countryside with darling from the gogo?

 

How you know it empty now? You still go there right?

 

before (1997) have many lonely euro guy marry the sex worker. But nowadays (2019) most tourist to Thailand is from China. They not like to marry a sex worker. They think not good idea.

 

...and your point is...?

 

How do I know it is empty?

Again: tourism industry!

I have to go and visit places from time to time!

I also know people, who bars or restaurants in that area!

I even know some of the ladies, working there!

So you are telling me, your friend is the greatest evidence for Thailands continuous success in Tourism, because ONE of your friends has hundreds of Chineses - customers every day, but everybody else's first hand witness accounts, don't count for anything?

Got it!

 

And again: the most tourists from China don't bring the money!

Is that so hard to undersatand?

 

[Saint Nick]

30 minutes ago, Gweiloman said:

You claim to be in the tourist industry and you don’t realise that the tourists of today are different from 20 years ago. No wonder that your business is not faring well. 

And where are they, the many different tourists of today?

Because they are not in the hotels!

They are also not on the tour- buses or boats - except for the Chinese, who always come in groups!

Where are the Germans, the Scandies, the Austrians, the Dutch?

 

The only thing I realize, is that Thailand in the last 20 years, undertook a bunch of catastrophic mistakes, that drove the (mainly) European- tourists away!

 

[Saint Nick]

28 minutes ago, Angry Dragon said:

The people who frequented the beer and GoGo bars are still here, but probably not as plentiful.

The number of families coming to Thailand is much higher.  You could say that the TAT has done its job in cleaning up its act by trying to attract better quality tourists.  After living here for nearly 20 years, I'm pleased to see the likes of PatPong, Nana and Cowboy decline, even if it is in part being replaced by shopping (there are other things to do as well - waterparks, island tourism, hiking and biking tours have taken off over the past 20 years.

 

the shopping malls seem to be still doing well for the most part.  My rare visits to Paragon or CentralWorld show the place pretty packed.

 

I'm glad you admit your reference to Patpong was only an "Example" - anecdotal evidence such as this shows the value of a "bigger picture" view.

Oh great- so you are one of those who don't give a hoot for 1000's of workers on Patpong or Nana, as long as TAT did a "brilliant job" in attracting quality tourists!

Yeah...right!

That happened!

They cleaned up their act!

Yup...tooootally!

You mean like, getting rid of sunbeds and umbrellas (and the beach cleaning), so that the quality tourists don't have to  look at the low- lives, who block their view on the ocean!?