Not feeling welcome

[sanemax]

8 minutes ago, beautifulthailand99 said:

If I was very rich and not married to a Thai why would I ever come here more than once. That said if it's 5 star hotels , limos and private planes everywhere it would probably be somewhat different. 

But you're not, stop dreaming 

[BestB]

4 minutes ago, dimitriv said:

 

But is it right to change the rules for people already living in Thailand for a long time?  

 

Some people are staying for a long time, have a family, there life here. And than suddenly they change the rules making it difficult to stay.

 

Also considering that in other countries they will give you a passport after some years, or at least a permanent residence.

 

Would it be right to send someone home after 20, 30 years, if he cannot prove that he has enough money to stay?  Living together with someone you are married to is a basic human right.

 

 

 

 

Who is to say what is right or wrong. Your insurance policies and coverage changes, your subscriptions change. Times changing so are the regulations.

 

They are not forcing anyone out, but expect people to comply with new regulations, If unable, there are still ways with "donations" and agents, but if can not even afford that, than clearly can no longer afford just to get by

 

Not saying is right or wrong, but it is what it is. Just like prices increase over time irrespective if we like it or agree with it, it just changes

[SteveK]

I have to agree though, if I was a multi-millionaire in dollars, I would not be holidaying in Thailand.

[BestB]

6 minutes ago, dimitriv said:

 

In all countries in the world you will get a passport or permanent residency allowing you to stay when you are married. So nothing to worry about after that.

 

Thailand is really the exception here.

 

 

Yes i agree with you there, it is easier, however in all countries spouse provides  guarantee  to cover all medical and needs to provide evidence have means to cover until citizenship is granted,

 

In Thailand, when married, you are also allowed to stay on marriage visa with much less requirements, only 400 000 baht needed and no requirement for insurance either. 

 

How much does it cost to apply for spouse visa and the process in other countries?

 

In Thailand, you can also apply for citizenship and perm residency if married but need to provide all the docs and all the rest, and it is not cheap either

[sanemax]

Its quite clear that Westerners are no longer wanted in Thailand .

From the way many behave , thats quite understandable .

50 + year old Westerners driving around town in the afternoon on a moped with last nights conquest sitting behind , still in her make up, short skirt and high heels and going off for a pad thai  .

  Quite embarrassing for all concerned 

[richard_smith237]

[Deleted] 

 

Agreed - If married, options are easier for many. 

 

 

 

 

[dimitriv]

33 minutes ago, richard_smith237 said:

 

What rules have they changed?

 

Verification of income letter from Embassy - it was the Embassies (3) who stopped this.

Seasoning of funds (800k Retirement) - this has always been the case

If no seasoned funds, proof of income from overseas (>65k baht per month?) - has this changed?

 

Insurance for Type O retirement Visa application - this is new and can be a show stopper for some who cannot get insurance or have pre-existing conditions, although, there is surely a simply way around this? 

 

 

 

 

 

 

The insurance is a new requirement. The possibility that there is maybe a way around this is for me not so important. The knowledge that maybe tomorrow there will be something else without possibility to escape is what matters.

 

Let's talk about morals. Or lack of it.

 

Would it be right to send someone home after 20, 30 years, if he cannot prove that he has enough money to stay?  Living together with someone you are married to is a basic human right.

 

Would it be right to send someone home if he doesn't have 400k in the bank? After he lived here for 20 or 30 years, is married, and has children? 

 

It is a violation of human rights.

 

 

 

 

 

[dimitriv]

33 minutes ago, BestB said:

They are not forcing anyone out, but expect people to comply with new regulations

 

That is the same ????

 

 

[beautifulthailand99]

28 minutes ago, sanemax said:

Its quite clear that Westerners are no longer wanted in Thailand .

From the way many behave , thats quite understandable .

50 + year old Westerners driving around town in the afternoon on a moped with last nights conquest sitting behind , still in her make up, short skirt and high heels and going off for a pad thai  .

  Quite embarrassing for all concerned 

They are just living the dream....and greetings away from the Brexit threads. ????????

 

[BestB]

2 minutes ago, dimitriv said:

 

That is the same ????

 

 

No it is not. Just because you do not like new requirements, it does not mean they are forcing you out.

[CNXexpat]

You feel not welcome? Yes, Thailand is not very interested in expats. They want you as a tourist, spending money (the more the better) and leave after 2 or 3 weeks. For expats they make it so uncomfortable as possible (90 days report, report when you come back from another province, only get a one year visa, can not own land, can not work a bit, can not own your own business, etc), but if you can deal with it, you have a good life. 

 

Some people wrote, that the health insurance is a negative point too, but in my eyes everybody should have a health insurance, same as a travel insurance for tourists, especially in a 2nd world country with so dangerous roads like Thailand. 

 

If I would be super rich, I wouldn´t live in Thailand. Vacation yes, for sure, because here is a lot I like. But I am unfortunately not super rich. I have enough money for a very good life without work in Thailand, when I relocated in the age of 55, but not enough to have a so good life without work in Germany. If my wife wouldn´t be Thai, perhaps I would live in Vietnam or South America. 

[uhuh]

48 minutes ago, BestB said:

 

Some places in SE Asia are easier but they have not had an influx yet and have not experience the burned of unpaid medical bills.

Thailand has made many billions of Baht fleecing foreigners for medical fees.

 

Mostly private hospitals (look at Bangkok Hospitals' stock price during the last 2 decades)  but also clinics and government hospitals,  especially Vachira Phuket (the one which crying aloud about foreigners not paying,  and which in reality makes good money from foreigners in their private arm).

 

The private sector charges much more than countries like France, Holland  or Germany (if you have to pay out of pocket there).

I just had to pay outpatient medicine 9000 Baht which in Western Europe would have cost half (due to unforeseen circumstances it had to be bought in the hospital), and useless physical therapy 2500 baht per session (3 times the price in Europe).

 

From these many billions,  deduct a couple of millions for those who didn't pay. 

 

The insurance scam is a scam just as SteveK pointed out. 

 

 

[Kadilo]

48 minutes ago, sanemax said:

Its quite clear that Westerners are no longer wanted in Thailand .

From the way many behave , thats quite understandable .

50 + year old Westerners driving around town in the afternoon on a moped with last nights conquest sitting behind , still in her make up, short skirt and high heels and going off for a pad thai  .

  Quite embarrassing for all concerned 

But living with  your Mum at 50 is really cool 

[BestB]

1 minute ago, uhuh said:

Thailand has made many billions of Baht fleecing foreigners for medical fees.

 

Mostly private hospitals (look at Bangkok Hospitals' stock price during the last 2 decades)  but also clinics and government hospitals,  especially Vachira Phuket (the one which crying aloud about foreigners not paying,  and which in reality makes good money from foreigners in their private arm).

 

The private sector charges much more than countries like France, Holland  or Germany (if you have to pay out of pocket there).

I just had to pay outpatient medicine 9000 Baht which in Western Europe would have cost half (due to unforeseen circumstances it had to be bought in the hospital), and useless physical therapy 2500 baht per session (3 times the price in Europe).

 

From these many billions,  deduct a couple of millions for those who didn't pay. 

 

The insurance scam is a scam just as SteveK pointed out. 

 

 

The reason why you paid less in EU is because your government subsidize it because you have paid taxes, in Thailand you have not worked to pay taxes, so you pay full price

 

How is insurance a scam?

[Psimbo]

51 minutes ago, sanemax said:

Its quite clear that Westerners are no longer wanted in Thailand .

From the way many behave , thats quite understandable .

50 + year old Westerners driving around town in the afternoon on a moped with last nights conquest sitting behind , still in her make up, short skirt and high heels and going off for a pad thai  .

  Quite embarrassing for all concerned 

Nothing to do with 'Westerners'- the majority they target are Burmese, Laotians and Cambodians along with other Asiatic and African nations. 'Westerners' form a very small part of the overall picture but like to big up their own self-importance on here. 

 

'Westerners' who break the law would not be welcome in most countries around the world.

 

'Good guys in' works for me- I have been here a number of years and have never felt 'not wanted' , nor have I had any issues with Immigration.

 

For the record I do not have a motorbike so plead the fifth on the 3rd paragraph.

[sirineou]

 

1 hour ago, dimitriv said:

 

In all countries in the world you will get a passport or permanent residency allowing you to stay when you are married. So nothing to worry about after that.

 

Thailand is really the exception here.

 

 

If I understand this correctly, you can get permanents residency if you :

"

Thai Permanent Residency

  -You must have had a Thai non-immigrant visa for at least three years prior to the submission of your application. Holders of multiple NON-Immigrant visas can not apply. You must have 3 consecutive yearly extensions in order to qualify.

  -You must be a holder of a non-immigrant visa at the time of submitting your application.

  -You must be able to meet one of these categories to apply for PR status in Thailand:

Investment category (minimum 3 – 10 Mil. Baht investment in Thailand)

Working/ Business category

Support a family or Humanity Reasons category: In this category, you must have a relationship with a Thai citizen or an alien who already posses a residence permit as a husband or wife; father or mother; or a guardian of a Thai child under 20 years of age.

Expert / academic category

Other categories as determined by Thai Immigration"  

You can apply for Thai citizenship after holding a permanent resident status   for 10 years. 

https://www.thaiembassy.com/thailand/thai-permanent-residency.php 

 

 

[dimitriv]

43 minutes ago, sirineou said:

 

If I understand this correctly, you can get permanents residency if you :

"

 

That list is not complete. There is a language test, there are quota, extremely high fees and some other things.

 

[sirineou]

11 minutes ago, dimitriv said:

 

That list is not complete. There is a language test, there are quota, extremely high fees and some other things.

 

Thank you for that

I am not familiar with the process or interested, but the statement that you can't get permanent residency in Thailand is not correct.

I know I have read thread of posters wo have.

[Jingthing]

2 hours ago, sanemax said:

Its quite clear that Westerners are no longer wanted in Thailand .

From the way many behave , thats quite understandable .

50 + year old Westerners driving around town in the afternoon on a moped with last nights conquest sitting behind , still in her make up, short skirt and high heels and going off for a pad thai  .

  Quite embarrassing for all concerned 

Yeah. Pad Thai. Embarrassing! 

[BestB]

38 minutes ago, dimitriv said:

 

That list is not complete. There is a language test, there are quota, extremely high fees and some other things.

 

Married and working can skip and go directly for citizenship where none of the above is needed.

 

But even if not working, not much different than any other country, not too sure why you think it should be cheaper and easier here than anywhere else

[uhuh]

1 hour ago, BestB said:

The reason why you paid less in EU is because your government subsidize it because you have paid taxes, in Thailand you have not worked to pay taxes, so you pay full price

 

How is insurance a scam?

I explicitly said prices are much higher here than they are in Western Europe "if you have to pay out of pocket there" (normally nobody has to pay out of pocket there,  but it does happen - foreigners without insurance,  people who have only private insurance for reimbursement later, people whith high deductibles, many reasons).

 

The actual prices most Europeans pay are much lower. 

 

Example: Pantoprazol in Germany bought without insurance, 11,78 Euro

Bought with insurance 5 Euro (these are the "subsidized" prices - actually,  they are not subsidized, they are paid for by social health insurance, not by taxes; fees for social health insurance are typically several hundreds EUR per month)

Pantoprazol as just paid to an upcountry private Thai Hospital: 2436 baht - more than 6 times the German "free market" price

 

Crestor in Germany without insurance: 82,09 euro,  with insurance 8,20 euro

Crestor as just paid in the same upcountry Thai Hospital 4760 baht

 

Plavix in Germany without insurance 39,95 euro,  with insurance 5 euro

Plavix  as just paid in the same upcountry Thai Hospital 3542 baht

 

BTW German pharmaceutical prices are expensive by international standards,  that's why i chose Germany as a comparison

 

 

Insurance is a scam as explained by SteveK: high premiums, forced contraction,  no value whatsoever because the insured sums are ridiculously low and everybody needs an additionally  "real" insurance (with coverage of millions of baht)

 

 

[uhuh]

4 minutes ago, BestB said:

 

 

But even if not working, not much different than any other country, not too sure why you think it should be cheaper and easier here than anywhere else

Very much different from Switzerland (very easy - never seen Thai ladies with Swiss passport?), Norway,  Germany,  to name a few.

[nakluapattaya]

Lol rules getting enforced, laws getting stricter. Sad for those wanting to stay long term. But its pretty normal, Thailand is not so desperate anymore to just want to let anyone in.

 

Personally i hate it, i wanna stay forever on tourist visas. But it makes sense. In my country u can only stay for 3 months as a tourist. Other long term options are either being married to a citizen or work. Kinda the same like Thailand tho, but my country also accept refugees. In my country most people dont like immigrants. So i think Thailand is still very tolerant. As most westerners are just drunk old guys coming for the rentgirls, or smelly backpackers.

[uhuh]

1 minute ago, nakluapattaya said:

In my country most people dont like immigrants. So i think Thailand is still very tolerant. 

Do you think Thais like immigrants???

[uhuh]

2 minutes ago, nakluapattaya said:

 As most westerners are just drunk old guys coming for the rentgirls, or smelly backpackers.

Thank you for the compliments. 

I guess you are talking about yourself. 

 

[nakluapattaya]

1 minute ago, uhuh said:

Do you think Thais like immigrants???

Depends on which Thai. Some dont think anything, some like immigrants, some dont. Generally i think they have a bad attitude towards Khmr, and Burmese, and Chinese. They also think we westerners are dirty, rude, and degenerate.

[nakluapattaya]

3 minutes ago, uhuh said:

Thank you for the compliments. 

I guess you are talking about yourself. 

Yeah "most" about you? or "most" about myself? Did u even read the full sentence? Why did u got emotional?

Did u feel spoken to?

[uhuh]

1 hour ago, Psimbo said:

I have been here a number of years and have never felt 'not wanted' , nor have I had any issues with Immigration.

I have been here a number of years and feel more and more not wanted. 

By officials and by ordinary people.

 

I don't have issues with immigration, but always filling out new forms and trips to CW every second month is not my idea of fun.

But if you like these things,  good for you

[uhuh]

4 minutes ago, nakluapattaya said:

Yeah "most" about you? or "most" about myself? Did u even read the full sentence? Why did u got emotional?

Did u feel spoken to?

I just figured you must be taking about yourself. Whomelse?

[nakluapattaya]

1 minute ago, uhuh said:

I just figured you must be taking about yourself. Whomelse?

I think i typed "most westerners" didnt include myself yet. The fact that u had to respond in such obvious sarcastic way, makes me suspect you in falling in one of those categories. I suspect the first one. The old drunk with prostitutes.