Regenerative Agriculture

[sbf]

Is anyone interested in this area? I had a look through the OP's for a few pages and did a search but did not bring anything up on the forum. As someone who has been around farming and especially organic production for many years, this seems to be an approach which has a lot of merit, and from the scientific evidence coming forwards it looks as if there may be an opportunity if this approach was widely adoption to mitigate some of the worst effects of increasing carbon dioxide levels whilst producing high quality food and other agricultural products in a profitable manner. 

There seems to be little work going on in Thailand either practically or academically at present, but I would love to stand corrected on this if anyone has any input.

 

For those not familiar with the basic principles of regenerative agriculture they are

 

little or no soil disturbance 

maximise plant diversity

maintaining living plant cover at all times

low artificial chemical pesticide and fertiliser inputs 

 

and integrate livestock if at all possible

 

Farms following all these principles are being measured as increasing organic matter levels in the soil up to 0.5% a year. Hence the interest from climate change researchers.  Drawing down carbon from the atmosphere and locking it into soils is a very cheap and effective way to reduce carbon dioxide levels. 

 

For those who wish to pursue this area further, there is already quite a lot of information available. Some is coming from academia in the form of scientific papers, others from practical farmers. Here is the list of some of the more accessible information starting with farmers and moving to the more academic research.

 

Good general introductions

 

Living Soil Film

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ntJouJhLM48

 

 

Soil Carbon Coalition

https://soilcarboncoalition.org/regenerative-secret-film/

 

 

Carbon Cowboys

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZGvVli0OTrQ

 

 

Some farmers applying these techniques

 

Gabe Brown - practical farmer with a very clear manner of describing the benefits of these principles on his farm   

 

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uUmIdq0D6-A

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QfTZ0rnowcc

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RkoCY4E0Fj4

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yvQGEtLtIpc

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9yPjoh9YJMk

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GxIyKfWf9kU

 

Book Dirt to Soil, One Families Journey into Regenerative Agriculture

 

 

Joel Salatin another articulate farmer from USA

 

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FsbDXQBuwPg

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4Z75A_JMBx4&t=69s

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jBZgANtcXm8&t=2721s

 

He has also authored several books but I have not read any yet

 

 

Charles Massey an Australian farmer and researcher, with a fairly recently published book on the subject

 

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Et8YKBivhaE

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6vQW8Tl_KLc

 

Book Call of the Reed Warbler

 

 

 

Savory Institute Alan Savory is a Zimbabwean farmer whose principles of rotational grazing are being followed by many of the regenerative farmers who have livestock  

 

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vpTHi7O66pI&t=2s

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xMjKcCfBtfI

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yVxLQtSqvbQ

 

Books Holistic Management

          Holistic Management : A New Framework

 

 

 

Dr Christine Jones This woman is my heroine, she has done some amazing research, and has some great presentations of this work on her website and in various youtube clips 

 

website https://www.amazingcarbon.com 

 

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=C3_w_Gp1mLM

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=K8_i1EzR5U8

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fW_5eLhKNTY

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2xZ7nfC7BQk&t=469s

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SYRpFqUlK78

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LuM2tnX-KJI

 

 

 

 

Jena University just to show that Europe while lagging in some ways is also doing some interesting research in the area

 

http://www.the-jena-experiment.de

 

https://www.youtube.com/watch?time_continue=5&v=j3SvG2nBCTM&feature=emb_logo

 

 

Rodale Institute this highly reputable and long established institute has been working on low chemical input, no-till, cover crop systems for a long time. We built one of their no-till roller crimpers a couple of years ago for use in our farming activities

 

Organic no-till 

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fkMB5meXMGg

 

 

Dr Ray Archuleta soil scientist extension officer from US who has been working in the field for many years

 

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Fwv-HJnGHMA

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9uMPuF5oCPA

 

 

Dr David Montgomery A geologist by training Dr Montgomery has a great take on the whole field. I highly recommend his books as well written and informative especially Growing a Revolution

 

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ej4nler3FiY

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6HwlqR1YnNk

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4-8mCXxsR3M

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FZ22IV2tDvs

 

Books Growing a Revolution

          The Hidden Half of Nature

          Dirt

 

 

 

Dr David Johnson This guy has done some really interesting research into the microbial benefits of compost, developed an interesting composting system. Being a microbiologist by training he has a very interesting take on things and produces the evidence to prove his points. We have built three of his style of compost heaps but the first will not mature for up to another 6 months. I am not quite sure on timing as his work in Arizona suggest 1 year as optimal, perhaps with the constant heat here in Thailand we can reduce this somewhat. Our first one is 6 months old. 

 

https://media.csuchico.edu/media/Soil+MicrobesA+Their+Powerful+Influence+in+Agroecosytems/0_ltz0ea1h

https://holisticmanagement.org/wp-content/uploads/2015/05/Quivira_Johnson1.pdf

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dmj611RfBgs

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MuW42tFC4Ss

https://www.youtube.com/watch?time_continue=164&v=18FVVYKU9gs&feature=emb_logo

 

 

 

 

Thailand - and finally a Thai twist on things, this is the only work I could find being done here. 

https://www.asean-agrifood.org/farmers-in-central-thailand-turn-to-alternative-crops-to-sustain-soil-health-after-harvest/

 

I would love to hear from others interested in this area. I hope that this OP sparks some discussion and maybe gives a few evenings of interest to some on the forum inclined to follow the links

 

[IsaanAussie]

Just now, sbf said:

We have built three of his style of compost heaps but the first will not mature for up to another 6 months. I am not quite sure on timing as his work in Arizona suggest 1 year as optimal, perhaps with the constant heat here in Thailand we can reduce this somewhat. Our first one is 6 months old

Love to talk to you about this. Our pig farm and rice crop residues coupled with EM biology and carbonised rice husk produced a constant supply of finished (immature) compost within 3 weeks start to finish. We have two three box compost systems. Some of my old posts circa 2010 might still be here? 

 

[farmerjo]

Hi sbf,

Glad to see you here again,hope things are well.

Will take a few days to get through the list but i as one have been modelling on this type of farming to an extent but in the tropics.

Another guy who has similar views and comes from about 50km's where i grew up.

https://www.no-till.com.au/

Can i asked how the roller crimper has been before i build mine.

Regards

[sbf]

Hi Isaan Aussie,

Have a read through the David Johnson's links if you have time. We also have tried some quick composting methods with daily turning and fair results in a matter of weeks. However what Dr Johnson found in his work was that leaving it completely undisturbed but with adequate aeration changed the balance of microorganisms with a lot less bacteria and much higher fungal levels. There was also a massive increase in the range of microorganisms between 9 and 12 months.  And if you have a chance read through to the results of his work on applications of the composted material. He is using it to spray on more as a soil inoculation at relatively low doses but with some impressive long term results.

[sbf]

Hi Farmerjo,

Thanks for your response. Yes with all that life throws at one sometimes I have not posted for quite a while, but still busy and active in the farming. 

 

Thanks for the added link, will have a read of that.

 

Roller Crimper good does the job well, although it depends a little on what you are rolling down of course. We are looking to sow a mixed cover crop and then roll down before direct seeding rice next June. Also ditto with the mixed cover crop before we start Sunn Hemp sowings in late August.

 

You probably know there is a detailed plan on the Rodale site, but just in case not here is the link

 

https://rodaleinstitute.org/wp-content/uploads/ROdale-Instutute-Roller-Crimper-Plans.pdf

 

We go ours made up with those drawings at the local "Technic" here. Can't recall exactly what we paid, think it was in the vicinity of 24,000. I remember looking at a couple of US websites at the time, and our local price to have it built was around the same price as they were being sold for in the US. They made a great job of it and the "Technic" were really happy to build something a little bit different with the students. Works well, although I would prefer to front mount it and then have a drill behind. We have not evolved tractor wise to that yet so it is two passes rather than one presently. 

[farmerjo]

Hi sbf,

Thanks for the reply,i have already priced the pipe at 9.000 but in a 6 metre length,i have also printed out the design so price seems reasonable in a finished product.(had the design printed for 12 months now)

Just need to work out a quick hitch method to the front of my rig and what i will grow to roll down.Rice weed plants in the early days we grew here would of been perfect,things starting to dry up now so will see what survives with the dew.

Video of 1st trial setting up the seeder without grain.

 

 

 

Edited December 10, 2019 by farmerjo

[IsaanAussie]

10 hours ago, sbf said:

Hi Isaan Aussie,

Have a read through the David Johnson's links if you have time. We also have tried some quick composting methods with daily turning and fair results in a matter of weeks. However what Dr Johnson found in his work was that leaving it completely undisturbed but with adequate aeration changed the balance of microorganisms with a lot less bacteria and much higher fungal levels. There was also a massive increase in the range of microorganisms between 9 and 12 months.  And if you have a chance read through to the results of his work on applications of the composted material. He is using it to spray on more as a soil inoculation at relatively low doses but with some impressive long term results.

I will read his work over the next few days. As a few initial thoughts:

My composting was done as part of a daily routine of cleaning the sty, bagging up to .75 cbm every 3 days. Stockpiling and running aeration systems are not on my horizon. I found storing for a while in this climate often left dried out piles which were very difficult to re-wet. 

I can control the fungal levels with the C:N ratio and the addition of biology if required although the inclusion of EM spraying in the turning produced a pretty good and consistent result. I made up an aerated compost tea brewer which works well and will get more use in the future. Best results when wormcastings and compost were used together. 

Now it is start again time, without the pigs. 

[farmerjo]

In our area with no livestock and usually a 4-5 month period of limited scattered rainfall i see the Yeoman theory as another alternative to getting regenerative farmland here underway in Thailand on non irrigated soils. 

http://yeomansplow.com.au/3-using-a-yeomans-plow/

[IsaanAussie]

Some toy box you are building up there FJ. 

[farmerjo]

16 minutes ago, IsaanAussie said:

Some toy box you are building up there FJ. 

I plug away with single shank ripper on the worst area's but same principle.

 

[farmerjo]

You hear many of these speakers talk about living soils for the microbes to survive.

Yet in a lot of dry land crop farming that has only a few scattered thunderstorms in the dry season here they still stay present in soils as long as they have dead roots to feed on.

So surely the main message is don't disturb your soil or if you do,keep it to a minimum.

Am i missing something or is this the basis to regenerative successful farming.

Edited December 18, 2019 by farmerjo

[ireckonso]

Many times in research papers words like "Regenerative xxx etc." are used to increase the chance of getting grant/study money when the real issue is a very simple concept such as the soil in thailand. It is just dead and devoid of anything useful for crop production hence the massive use of chemicals to produce a crop and then its not even a good yield per area grown. There is no organic material left because of years of abuse and outdated farming techniques. It is also heavily contaminated due to the overuse of chemicals to try and produce a crop. Rebuilding the soil and organisms required for high yield growth will take years without massive changes in the farming industry here, I dont like beating a dead horse but as I have said before vietnam is producing twice the yield of rice at half the cost, so they must be doing something right as in maybe listening and learning from foreign expertise. We learned in the us after the dust bowl disaster that soil quality is key to crop production.

[kickstart]

Looking at the Yeoman video they was very little soil disturbance ,but he was going down 18-20 inches ,

he was pulling two legs ,the tractor looked too be about 50hp ?,

Now, would 50 hp pull two legs here in Thailand to that depth ,during the dry season ,I did notice that it was old pasture he was working on ,say if cattle had been grazing it field the soil compaction would be higher than an arable field?  (cane fields excluded  in this example ).

I was taught that subsoiled should be done in the dry season ,you get a good shattering effect underground,so allowing the land to breath ,so increasing the microbes .

Subsoiling in the wet season you just make tram lines in the field with no effect ,was this video done after some rain ,hence the easy going.

IA made a point somewhere last week about practices working in other countries but not here in Thailand ,is this a cace .

Like FJ I am plugging away with my single tine ripper ,makes a good job ,you can see where you have been ,it leaves a ridge ,not quite minimum soil disturbance ,But I am certain under ground  it is making a good job.

One thing .out with the fag packet ,and see if I can design and fit   a disc in front  of the subsoiler leg seems to work well. 

[drtreelove]

52 minutes ago, farmerjo said:

You hear many of these speakers talk about living soils for the microbes to survive.

Yet in a lot of dry land crop farming that has only a few scattered thunderstorms in the dry season here they still stay present in soils as long as they have dead roots to feed on.

So surely the main message is don't disturb your soil or if you do,keep it to a minimum.

Am i missing something or is this the basis to regenerative successful farming.

Yes you are missing quite a bit regarding what "regenerative agriculture" is all about.  Dead roots to feed on is not enough for healthy soil biology. If that's what you have to work with, no budget for irrigation and soil building, then you really can't hope to regenerate the land you grow on. 

 

http://www.regenerativeagriculturedefinition.com/

[ireckonso]

Some of the most important ways for thailand to improve their ag industry would be to repeal the high import and tax duties on farm equipment !! My last trip home every tractor/implement where i am from was gps equipped, there was no waste of seed or overuse of chemicals, sensors on implements that could read the nutrient levels in the soil in real time so no chemical or spray was used unless needed on every seed or plant. Some will say thai farmers can not afford this, but billions and billions seem to be constantly handed out to farmers here and nothing ever changes it only gets worse, that money could buy a lot of equipment. And most important the monopolies on farming supplies here are way past ridiculous, there is so much technology out there now that we cant even look at here let alone purchase.

[IsaanAussie]

I watched a few youtube videos featuring a US farmer Gabe Brown. He detailed his years of regenerating his farm soils in Northern USA. There are things in common with here. For instance, he started without any soil aggregation, only a dusty SOM deplete soil that only allowed 1/2" of water percolation per hour. His growing season was only 3 months a year and when significant rains fell, little would be absorbed and most ran off taking the "topsoil" and any nutirents with it. Sounds familiar to me despite climatic differences. 

His no-till techniques were accompanying with complete diverse cover cropping. Those covers were chosen to supply the nutrient requirements of the soil and maximise the nitrogen, oxygen, hydrogen and carbon available for free from the atmosphere. The covers were rolled and left in place to cover the soil and he attempts to keep living roots in the ground for as long as possible so that fungal lattices could grow in and between the root masses of many of the covers. 

He uses no synthetic fertilisers and has built the nutrient levels in the soil past the best practice of organic farming in his area.

My point he used almost no tillage but relies on natural plant and microbial regeneration of the soil. His soil is aggregated, has SOM levels near double figures and allows for 9" of water absorption per hour.  

 

[kickstart]

14 hours ago, ireckonso said:

Some of the most important ways for thailand to improve their ag industry would be to repeal the high import and tax duties on farm equipment !! My last trip home every tractor/implement where i am from was gps equipped, there was no waste of seed or overuse of chemicals, sensors on implements that could read the nutrient levels in the soil in real time so no chemical or spray was used unless needed on every seed or plant. Some will say thai farmers can not afford this, but billions and billions seem to be constantly handed out to farmers here and nothing ever changes it only gets worse, that money could buy a lot of equipment. And most important the monopolies on farming supplies here are way past ridiculous, there is so much technology out there now that we cant even look at here let alone purchase.

How will you get a Thai farmer to change ,the wife's son in law a rice farmer ,him using GPS ,he can bealey use a smart phone ,let alone a GPS ,Somchie with his Ford 6600 with read outs ,I do not think so ,the read outs I  say would be in english ,most could not interpret the results .

You could say they could go on courses that would help them ,local extension works could help them ,the companies selling the equipment would be best showing the farmers how to use the equipment .

Ok the farmer has his results they tell him that is soil is shot of X ,his organic levels are low ,what will he do ,ask how much will is cost to put right ,local extension worker says plant  a green manuaer that will help ,rice farmers says can not afford the seed , no money to buy fuel for the Kwie Lec not enough rain ,no time the plant your green manure before I have to plant rice .

Something FJ said a while ago ,famers do not like changing they ways ,they are afraid it will not work and they will lose money ,he has a point 

Last month I posted some photos of a drone spraying a crop of rice ,made a good job he was using GPS ,to good effect if he had soil analysis results he could apply liquid fertilizers/mineral supplement ect    where it was needed ,as per you say.

Now this  guy was charging 100 baht/rie to spray this rice crop ,my wife said son in law charges 40 baht/rie with his knapsack  sprayer ,thinking  100 baht /rie to expensive .

I rest my case .

[ireckonso]

58 minutes ago, kickstart said:

How will you get a Thai farmer to change

You must be thai as you have no vision or hope for the younger generations that will someday take over. I have worked with many younger ag students in colleges that know what needs to be done and will do it as soon as all the non believers such as yourself are gone. Oh and by the way my garmin gps has english and thai.

Edited December 19, 2019 by ireckonso
addition

[IsaanAussie]

1 hour ago, ireckonso said:

I have worked with many younger ag students in colleges that know what needs to be done and will do it as soon as all the non believers such as yourself are gone.

We Australians have a saying, "I'm all ears like a bag of wheat!" Meaning I'm more than ready to hear the answer, so what have your efforts determined? What does have to be done?

[farmerjo]

6 hours ago, IsaanAussie said:

His no-till techniques were accompanying with complete diverse cover cropping

I'm interested in what's available.

Besides sunn hemp,maybe ubon stylo as a mix.

What others are out there in the market place in Thailand.

3 hours ago, kickstart said:

Ok the farmer has his results they tell him that is soil is shot of X ,his organic levels are low ,what will he do ,ask how much will is cost to put right ,local extension worker says plant  a green manuaer that will help ,rice farmers says can not afford the seed , no money to buy fuel for the Kwie Lec not enough rain ,no time the plant your green manure before I have to plant rice .

Especially on a year like this leading into the next.

With water limitations.

 

2 hours ago, ireckonso said:

You must be thai

????20 years probably qualifies KS as Thai by now.

But the message still is what happens here.

We can bang on about our home countries and how they do things,i'm probably the worst for it.

But it's a long way from the conditions here when doing a crop budget.

Even with subsidies,no average joe farmers here,young or old can make big changes to the way they farm without cost.

Be it putting food on the table to school fees or hired help. 

Edited December 19, 2019 by farmerjo

[farmerjo]

19 hours ago, drtreelove said:

Dead roots to feed on is not enough for healthy soil biology. If that's what you have to work with, no budget for irrigation and soil building, then you really can't hope to regenerate the land you grow on. 

No irrigation but will continue to armour the soil with residue and use gypum,lime dolomite.

The rest i can leave for now as i'm starting to see improvements in pest control and water intake into the soil without runoff.

18 hours ago, ireckonso said:

My last trip home every tractor/implement where i am from was gps equipped,

When i purchased mine a few years ago the only other buyers were corporations like sugar.

The problem here is the signal from the free satellites and the average farmer could not afford the next level up. 

[IsaanAussie]

Just now, farmerjo said:

I'm interested in what's available.

Besides sunn hemp,maybe ubon stylo as a mix.

What others are out there in the market place in Thailand.

Gabe Brown had a complete mix of up to 10's of different seeds in his covers. And at least several in his row crops. I'll have a squizz around and see if I can find the video again. 

[IsaanAussie]

Just now, farmerjo said:

every tractor/implement where i am from was gps equipped

To regenerate soil doesn't need implements GPS or plain stupid. It needs the missing soil and biological components and most of those are available FREE. 

We haven't got thousands of broad acres to plant and harvest with equipment that is high HP and 20 feet wide where every inch the combine misses or overlaps is important and extra minute expensive. We have mostly 5 or 6 rai blocks and DC 60's.

Regenerating soils and improving yields is not in my opinion technology dependant here. 

[ireckonso]

Okay lets start with this drought crapola, there is no drought only watershed mismanagement. The dams here were originally built for power generation not water storage. They are so silted in I doubt if any of them still have 50% of their design capacity left due to silting in from runoff for 40 years, I mean can you honestly tell me ubonrat dam and others one month is overflowing and the next month it is empty ??? I can guarantee if you took a boat out with a depth finder and did a depth survey you would find dredging is way overdue, How about those 50 year old canals with more holes in them than swiss cheese ? Large chunks of sidewall missing everywhere, no bottom. I doubt if 30% of the water released into them makes it to the final destination. Then I find it hard to believe with thailand next to the mekong and having a tropical climate there isnt an ocean of water to be had for agriculture if there were any proper well drilling equipment to be had here. In arizona us they grow water intensive crops year round in the desert for christs sake. next rant soon on the monopolies that only let you buy what they make alot of money on.

[farmerjo]

6 minutes ago, IsaanAussie said:

Gabe Brown had a complete mix of up to 10's of different seeds in his covers. And at least several in his row crops. I'll have a squizz around and see if I can find the video again. 

Thanks IA.

What's available in Thailand as cover crop potentials is what i'm interested in.

Is anybody currently selling a mix of seeds for this and what are they.

 

 

[ireckonso]

1 minute ago, IsaanAussie said:

We have mostly 5 or 6 rai blocks and DC 60's.

And thats why you will never have a successful ag industry here. You want to live in the past no skin off my butt, but dont just sit there and dream about it, that gets kind of old hearing the same ole sob story.

[ireckonso]

https://www.ubonforageseeds.com/en/seeds/

This guy seems to be about the only option unless you want to import something.

[IsaanAussie]

Just now, ireckonso said:

https://www.ubonforageseeds.com/en/seeds/

This guy seems to be about the only option unless you want to import something.

Michael's company sells forage seeds. They could form part of a regenerative cover. But legumes and others are also needed. 

[farmerjo]

3 minutes ago, ireckonso said:

https://www.ubonforageseeds.com/en/seeds/

This guy seems to be about the only option unless you want to import something.

That's why i asked about the ubon stylo,hopefully Michael might chime in.

Was looking for a tap root plant but it doesn't say in the glossary.

[IsaanAussie]

Just now, farmerjo said:

That's why i asked about the ubon stylo,hopefully Michael might chime in.

Was looking for a tap root plant but it doesn't say in the glossary.

Vitavar (spelling) or Kings grass. Can get it from the Ag ext places.