5 Months and 800,000 baht

[ubonjoe]

8 minutes ago, lovelg10 said:

Ah, the mysterious 'form'. Would someone be kind enough to attach a copy of said form, as all of the usual Thai Immigration form sources seem to be devoid.

Not exactly a form. It is just a copy of a the page of the police order stating the requirements for the money in the bank with a line on the bottom of it with space for the date they want you to return.

[DrJack54]

38 minutes ago, lovelg10 said:

Ah, the mysterious 'form'. Would someone be kind enough to attach a copy of said form, as all of the usual Thai Immigration form sources seem to be devoid.

There is no form. The 3 month show bankbook is a made up rule being done by couple of offices i.e Jomtien.

With a note of date 3 months from extension granted.

Edited January 10, 2020 by DrJack54

[yodsak]

23 minutes ago, lovelg10 said:

Ah, the mysterious 'form'. Would someone be kind enough to attach a copy of said form, as all of the usual Thai Immigration form sources seem to be devoid.

[lovelg10]

2 minutes ago, yodsak said:

Thanks - seems some IO's are pro-actively dealing with it. I assume this was given to you at extension approval time?

[Max69xl]

On 1/9/2020 at 10:29 AM, WorriedNoodle said:

You are going to need it longer than 5 months, more like 5 1/2 - 6 months as many extenders go to extend a month or so before expiry (hardly anyone leaves it to last day) and the money has to be in bank 2 months before date of application until 3 months after the extension date.

It's still only 2+3 months where you need the 800k if you every year apply for the 1 year extension 30 days before expiration date. 

[Lacessit]

I haven't heard of any verification requirement in Chiang Mai. I'm not sure how any system could operate if the expat leaves Thailand, and is absent when the 90 day report falls due. That becomes a reset.

My best guess is the IO checks the bank statement at the next extension, and refuses it if the statement shows the balance has fallen to less than 800K/400K in the relevant time frames.

[Max69xl]

1 minute ago, lovelg10 said:

Thanks - seems some IO's are pro-actively dealing with it. I assume this was given to you at extension approval time?

You get the paper when you pick up the passport the day after applying for the 1 year extension. Then you show up 90 days later for the so called "90 days check". That's how it works at Jomtien Immigration. 

[DrJack54]

3 minutes ago, Max69xl said:

You get the paper when you pick up the passport the day after applying for the 1 year extension. Then you show up 90 days later for the so called "90 days check". That's how it works at Jomtien Immigration. 

And what if you don't show up?

[Max69xl]

3 minutes ago, Lacessit said:

I haven't heard of any verification requirement in Chiang Mai. I'm not sure how any system could operate if the expat leaves Thailand, and is absent when the 90 day report falls due. That becomes a reset.

My best guess is the IO checks the bank statement at the next extension, and refuses it if the statement shows the balance has fallen to less than 800K/400K in the relevant time frames.

If you leave the country before the 90 days check you have to go there when coming back. It's not up to you when doing the check. The requirement comes from Thai Immigration and you have to sign the paper. It's better to ask immigration what to do when applying for the extension. 

[Max69xl]

1 minute ago, DrJack54 said:

And what if you don't show up?

I don't actually know,I haven't heard anything here at TV. You also have to sign the paper telling you when to come back. If you're smart you tell the officer you're leaving before the check and what to do. 

[DrJack54]

3 minutes ago, Max69xl said:

If you leave the country before the 90 days check you have to go there when coming back. It's not up to you when doing the check. The requirement comes from Thai Immigration and you have to sign the paper. It's better to ask immigration what to do when applying for the extension. 

If "The requirement comes from Thai immigration..." Why don't all the imm offices require the "check" and not just a few? 

[Max69xl]

35 minutes ago, ubonjoe said:

Not exactly a form. It is just a copy of a the page of the police order stating the requirements for the money in the bank with a line on the bottom of it with space for the date they want you to return.

Not only a line at the bottom with space for the date. 

It's signed by the applicant and is supposed to be signed by the highest ranked officer at Desk 8. 

[Jingthing]

For those of us that do have the formal order to come back for a bank book examination after 90 days, there is the grey area of what might happen if you don't.

 

It seems to me its very possible that in at least some cases immigration would visit such expats and that certainly wouldn't be pleasant if their bank book is under.

 

But of course some non reporters will simply not be in Thailand at the time.

 

Personally if I was going to be out of Thailand at the report time I would make an effort to approach the retirement desk and inform them of that situation. 

 

In cases where the applicant is under after 90 days and decides not to report to avoid expected bad consequences, then, what to do?

 

That's not really clear either. As said they could visit you and that would be horrible or you could choose to exit Thailand voluntarily at that time. 

Edited January 10, 2020 by Jingthing

[Jingthing]

4 minutes ago, Max69xl said:

Not only a line at the bottom with space for the date. 

It's signed by the applicant and is supposed to be signed by the highest ranked officer at Desk 8. 

Indeed. There is no doubt about it to those of us that received that. This is a REQUIREMENT. 

[DrJack54]

That "form" looks like a set of requirements that someone has tacked on little statement at the bottom. To present bankbook on....

I realize many imm offices have different rules, but this....really. 

[Just Weird]

4 hours ago, Sumarianson said:

...agents are rubbing their hands with the interest they sre making on the loan of 800K for 5 months and 400K for 9 months.

Which agents are lending hundreds of thousands of baht to complete strangers for months on end?!

[Peter Denis]

For all of the checks being done by IO when applying for an extension of stay of a Non Imm O Visa, I can imagine WHY they do it (not that I always agree with HOW they do it).

But for this 90-day after extension bank-book check now required by Jomtien I can really not think of any reason that makes sense to do it.  Sure, if you use the money-in-bank method it's a requirement that you should not dip under 800K during the first 3 months of your extension.  But they are already checking the 2 month before / 3 month at start of previous extension 800K minimum when applying for your extension of stay.  So why require people to come back after 3 months, when it will also be checked at next extension?  In order to catch you 9 months earlier in case you don't comply, could be the explanation.  But what good would that do?  It's a massive waste of time/effort both from IO as from the retiree who has to re-visit the IO for this check.

I surely hope this bad example of overzealousness will not spread to other IOs.

My IO is +70 km (approx 1,5 hour) from where I live, and since I do my 90-day reports and TM30s on-line I only have to visit them once a year, but imposing this bank-book check - or God forbid quarterly checks of the balance on your bank-book - would be a horrendous exercise in ridiculous bureaucracy.

[Lacessit]

13 minutes ago, Just Weird said:

Which agents are lending hundreds of thousands of baht to complete strangers for months on end?!

Possibly the ones who employ beefy Thais as collection agents.

[Just Weird]

4 minutes ago, Lacessit said:

Possibly the ones who employ beefy Thais as collection agents.

i.e. none of them as no agents would lend on the basis originally suggested by Sumarianson.

[jacko45k]

7 hours ago, lovelg10 said:

jacko45k - Was more done than just showing them your bankbook (filled out a form, copy of bankbook needed)? Was there any notation made to any document (passport, your extension file, etc.)?  Was the timing linked to your 90 day visit in any way?

They want the usual passport copies too, but no notations being made. The timing is not related to your regular 90 day reporting..... 

They were giving out slips of paper telling you when to return, but recently that is lapsing. I asked and was given a date, a Saturday!

Edited January 10, 2020 by jacko45k

[Max69xl]

7 hours ago, Lacessit said:

I haven't heard of any verification requirement in Chiang Mai. I'm not sure how any system could operate if the expat leaves Thailand, and is absent when the 90 day report falls due. That becomes a reset.

My best guess is the IO checks the bank statement at the next extension, and refuses it if the statement shows the balance has fallen to less than 800K/400K in the relevant time frames.

The 90 days report has nothing to do with the "90 days money check".

The problem as I see it,is that you have to sign the paper with the date for the "90 days money check".

 

[DrJack54]

26 minutes ago, Max69xl said:

The 90 days report has nothing to do with the "90 days money check".

The problem as I see it,is that you have to sign the paper with the date for the "90 days money check".

 

So question remains. Why do Jomtien require this rogue requirement

Edited January 10, 2020 by DrJack54

[jacko45k]

6 hours ago, DrJack54 said:

So question remains. Why do Jomtien require this rogue requirement

For the same reason  they require 300 baht for a residence certificate, or the same reason some rogue offices want a map for a retirement extensions, or some insist on seeing a TM30 to do a 90 day report, or see company paperwork to prove your residence, or want you to put long pants on. Or the same reason some charge to transfer stamps. They are little fiefdoms often making rules up (and ignoring them) as they go along. That said, I would rather deal with Jomtien than many other locations!

[tgeezer]

8 hours ago, DrJack54 said:

So question remains. Why do Jomtien require this rogue requirement

To discover whether, people who are not officially qualified to extend for retirement, are prepared to pay to remain in Thailand?  

Edit: I make that a question now because it seems a cynical thing to state.  However I am sure that there are people who know for sure whether this is a reasonable assessment of the situation.   

Edited January 11, 2020 by tgeezer

[DrJack54]

2 minutes ago, tgeezer said:

To discover whether, people who are not officially qualified to extend for retirement, are prepared to pay to remain in Thailand.  

Please translate.

[DrJack54]

1 hour ago, jacko45k said:

For the same reason  they require 300 baht for a residence certificate, or the same reason some rogue offices want a map for a retirement extensions, or some insist on seeing a TM30 to do a 90 day report, or see company paperwork to prove your residence, or want you to put long pants on. Or the same reason some charge to transfer stamps. They are little fiefdoms often making rules up (and ignoring them) as they go along. That said, I would rather deal with Jomtien than many other locations!

Personally I don't do any of what you mention above, apart from map, when dealing with CW.

It would seem a 3 hour round tip to imm and back does not apply to most folk at Jomtien.

Anyway will be very interesting to see what happens to someone if they have dipped below the 800k and are foolish enough to turn up with bankbook at Jomtien.

[condobrit001]

I renewed my retirement extension at CW several months ago, with no mention of any need to verify my bank balance at a later date. Also did my 90 day report on-line a few days ago. Don't know how you would prove funds when reporting on-line anyway. Also, if you spend many months overseas each year with 90 day clock resets, you would never need to contact immigration anyway, especially when doing TM30's on-line. Can't understand the problem!!

[tgeezer]

9 minutes ago, DrJack54 said:

Please translate.

Do you really need an explanation?

In reference to your last post, I also report to CW with minimal fuss.  

I would be blissfully ignorant of all the woes some people have at Immigration if the Thai Language forum was more active.  However the stories do provide some insight into Thai culture and Western naivety and I post for the sake of discussion.  

 

If someone was told to report with their bank book at Jomtien and didn’t meet the balance condition I think that unless he had his extension cancelled, we should never know what happened.

 

[tgeezer]

13 minutes ago, condobrit001 said:

I renewed my retirement extension at CW several months ago, with no mention of any need to verify my bank balance at a later date. Also did my 90 day report on-line a few days ago. Don't know how you would prove funds when reporting on-line anyway. Also, if you spend many months overseas each year with 90 day clock resets, you would never need to contact immigration anyway, especially when doing TM30's on-line. Can't understand the problem!!

The 90 day in-country report is not the report we are speculating upon. CW does not require a Bank balance report 90 days after extending,  Jomtien apparently does in some cases.

[DrJack54]

5 minutes ago, tgeezer said:

Do you really need an explanation?

In reference to your last post, I also report to CW with minimal fuss.  

I would be blissfully ignorant of all the woes some people have at Immigration if the Thai Language forum was more active.  However the stories do provide some insight into Thai culture and Western naivety and I post for the sake of discussion.  

 

If someone was told to report with their bank book at Jomtien and didn’t meet the balance condition I think that unless he had his extension cancelled, we should never know what happened.

 

I can sort of understand your last paragraph. I think we would know. So far there have been zero reports of consequence of not meeting the "3 month bb requirement" or not attending imm office at all. 

Some people even in this thread suggest the permission of stay would be void and you would be given 7 days to leave. 

Thinking that guess comes from the standard 7 day to exit after rejection for request for extension etc.

The interesting thing is that other imm offices are not in sync with Jomtien. I can only guess that Jomtien assume that if someone cannot meet the 3 month condition then they simple will not attend imm and exit Thailand prior to permission of stay expires. In that case to continue living in Los they would need to start over with a new non o