Chiang Mai splutters: But "Curtain of Water" protects tourists as polluted city continues among world's worst

[Yorkshire Tea]

8 minutes ago, Fore Man said:

I'd advise you to switch to the AirVisual app...its a lot more accurate.

 

It doesn't show me a listing for the SK Hospital, but it does show San Khampaeng as reading 161 at the current time (1500 on Friday).

177 AQI in my garden, San Kamphaeng, just now 15.03hr.  aqicn.org shows 191 & falling.  It was much higher earlier.  

[Forza2002]

I found a reading on AirVisual closer to my house, still not great...lol...

 

[Yorkshire Tea]

2 hours ago, Forza2002 said:

I found a reading on AirVisual closer to my house, still not great...lol...

 

Saraphi & San Kamphaeng are often the worst for air quality around Chiang Mai on both these AQI websites, & my personal pm2.5 readings agree with them.

[Odysseus123]

It's funny tho'...

 

Like watching the Benny Hill Show acted by weather presenters..

 

In short, the place is a polluted nightmare.

[UbonThani]

On 2/19/2020 at 2:34 PM, Lungstib said:

You cant add a million cars, thousands of houses, hundreds of condo's and shopping venues in 30 years

Small compared to big would cities. The burn offs need to stop.

[Grumpy John]

I am further South in Phitsanulok province bordering Phetchabun it's been smokey for months, not nice at all.  It can't be any worse in Chang Mai........

[Fore Man]

56 minutes ago, UbonThani said:

Small compared to big would cities. The burn offs need to stop.

Absolutely dead on assessment.  I’ve been here 16 years and the countryside was pristine back then. Yes, I could understand a localized smog layer lying over the city because of its bowl-like location, hemmed in by the mountains.  A good example in comparison are the Los Angeles basin and nearby Las Vegas, both of which are cloaked in a highly visible haze that is quite vivid at a standoff distance.  Outside of these cities, the air is clean and you can see for miles and miles.  Conversely in Chiang Mai the entire region is blanketed by toxic miasma that there is simply no escape from.  You can’t avoid it and no matter where you go it’s always there, forcing we humans to seek shelter inside our dwellings running air purifiers almost 24/7.  
 

After surviving...the only way to put it...the intense three-month smog we were subjected to in 2019...punctuated by several days of near 500 total AQI days, only then being rudely surprised by unhealthy air for several added months later in the year, it’s time to call our living experience in northern Thailand a failure.  Because that’s exactly what is in our minds.  This is no way to live a life in retirement when my wife and I badly want to be outdoors enjoying our recreational, fitness and sporting pursuits.   My fellow readers, what has befallen us is nothing less than a grand scale criminal act...epic criminality on the part of those who refuse to stop burning and epic malfeasance on the part of an apathetic, decrepit, money-grubbing government.  A self-serving aristocracy that seems to care not a whit about its hapless constituents and has the authority to turn this tragedy around but still will do nothing.
 

The Lord and Buddha willing, we will be at long last saying ‘Sawasdee, Chiang Mai and Thailand too” next week when we make our carefully-planned escape from this wasteland.  The city we are relocating to enjoys a daily total AQI ranging from 5 to 30. It lies in a modern nation that will not tolerate dirty air.  I hope with all my heart that your plight will be remedied but I honestly don’t hold out much hope for it either.
 

God bless you all and take care. 

Edited February 28, 2020 by Fore Man
eliminated unintended double use of one word

[JimmyJ]

2 hours ago, Fore Man said:

Absolutely dead on assessment.  I’ve been here 16 years and the countryside was pristine back then. Yes, I could understand a localized smog layer lying over the city because of its bowl-like location, hemmed in by the mountains.  A good example in comparison are the Los Angeles basin and nearby Las Vegas, both of which are cloaked in a highly visible haze that is quite vivid at a standoff distance.  Outside of these cities, the air is clean and you can see for miles and miles.  Conversely in Chiang Mai the entire region is blanketed by toxic miasma that there is simply no escape from.  You can’t avoid it and no matter where you go it’s always there, forcing we humans to seek shelter inside our dwellings running air purifiers almost 24/7.  
 

After surviving...the only way to put it...the intense three-month smog we were subjected to in 2019...punctuated by several days of near 500 total AQI days, only then being rudely surprised by unhealthy air for several added months later in the year, it’s time to call our living experience in northern Thailand a failure.  Because that’s exactly what is in our minds.  This is no way to live a life in retirement when my wife and I badly want to be outdoors enjoying our recreational, fitness and sporting pursuits.   My fellow readers, what has befallen us is nothing less than a grand scale criminal act...epic criminality on the part of those who refuse to stop burning and epic malfeasance on the part of an apathetic, decrepit, money-grubbing government.  A self-serving aristocracy that seems to care not a whit about its hapless constituents and has the authority to turn this tragedy around but still will do nothing.
 

The Lord and Buddha willing, we will be at long last saying ‘Sawasdee, Chiang Mai and Thailand too” next week when we make our carefully-planned escape from this wasteland.  The city we are relocating to enjoys a daily total AQI ranging from 5 to 30. It lies in a modern nation that will not tolerate dirty air.  I hope with all my heart that your plight will be remedied but I honestly don’t hold out much hope for it either.
 

God bless you all and take care. 

Why don't you want to name the city you are moving to?

[terminatorchiangmai]

Curtain of water? Like always this was maybe one day.

Now al fountains are of again and the moat water is dark green from algae.

Not that it makes any difference.

[Fore Man]

Some interesting observations made at the Airport Plaza in Chiang Mai just now.  With an outside total AQI index of 195 as reported by my AirVisual app, and its PM 2.5 portion of 143, I checked the PM 2.5 level inside a mall restaurant using my Xiaomi handheld tester and was chagrined to see that the PM 2.5 content had only diminished 32 points to 111. Definitely unhealthy. 

 

No restaurants are fitted with closing doors or if they are, their doors are kept open to appear inviting to customers. The PM 2.5 level I measured inside our restaurant is only a few points lower than in the mall hallways outside. 
 

Many folks seem to believe they are relatively safe in an enclosed shopping mall or public building. Not so. Lesson learned starting a year ago: protect your heart and lungs by wearing a proper N95 respirator mask. In fact, the only safe haven we have found is inside the Bangkok - Chiang Mai Hospital, with PM 2.5 readings indoors in the 30s when the outside levels were in the 150s.  This newer facility was designed to much more stringent standards and incorporated double door ingress/egress and HEPA filtration in its HVAC system. 
 

Good luck and protect yourself and those you care about. 

 

 

 

 

[VocalNeal]

Apparently smoking and poor diet are more of a hazard to health than pollution.

[Yorkshire Tea]

6 minutes ago, Fore Man said:

 

 

Many folks seem to believe they are relatively safe in an enclosed shopping mall or public building. Not so. Lesson learned starting a year ago: protect your heart and lungs by wearing a proper N95 respirator mask.
 

I thought this was common knowledge, especially on TV forum.  Inside home without purifier isn't much better than outside.

[JimmyJ]

Since the discussion has turned to interior conditions, perhaps someone can help me with a brain teaser I'm trying to figure out.

 

In the hotel I am staying in currently, periodically the PM 2.5 in the room is much worse than outside.

 

No smoking hotel.

I"m very sensitive to tobacco stench and smell none.

 

There is a kitchen and breakfast served on the ground floor but I'm on the

4th and don't smell any cooking odors.

 

AC filters are clean.

 

One floor above mine used for storage (perhaps some staff living there- no guests).

 

This am was getting PM 2.5 readings in the 40's which a few times spiked very briefly into the 100's, then back to 40's.

 

I'm at one end of the hall overlooking the street.

Sometimes there are cars or a bus idling in front.

But the times I've put the SNDWAY on the window ledge the reading goes down.

Not sure if I've ever pkaced it on the ledge when a bus idling there - will try this and see.

I never hear a sound from outside so I think it's double paned glass.

 

This AM at some point a maid was cleaning a room at the other end of the hall with the room door open.

 

I smelled nothing in my room but perhaps she's spraying an air freshener or a cleaning spray.

But I'd be surprised if the spray particles make it down the hall into my room and persist in the air causing a higher reading than outside.

 

I exited the hotel and took a reading there and it was about 15 to 20.

 

At other times the room readings are like outside - after 3 months in CM, in bed here (Da Nang) one night I checked and saw something I thought I would never see anything close to - it read between 0 and 2.

 

Any theories on what's causing the periodic much higher room readings?

 

 

 

 

 

Edited February 29, 2020 by JimmyJ

[Fore Man]

2 minutes ago, JimmyJ said:

Since the discussion has turned to interior conditions, perhaps someone can help me with a brain teaser I'm trying to figure out.

 

In the hotel I am stsying in currently, periodically the PM 2.5 in the room is much worse than outside.

 

No smoking hotel.

I"m very sensitive to tobacco stench and smell none.

 

There is a kitchen and breakfast served on the ground floor but I'm on the

4th and don't smell any cooking odors.

 

AC filters are clean.

 

This am was getting PM 2.5 readings in the 40's which a few times spiked very briefly into the 200's, then back to 40's.

 

I'm at one end of the hall overlooking the street.

Sometimes there are cars or a bus idling in front.

But the times I've put the SNDWAY on the window ledge the reading goes down.

 

This am at some point a maid was cleaning a room at the other end of the hall with the room door open.

 

I smelled nothing in my room but perhaps she's spraying an air freshener or a cleaning spray.

But I'd be surprised if the spray particles make it down the hall into my room and persist in the air causing a higher reading than outside.

 

I exited the hotel and took a reading there and it was about 15 - 20.

 

At other times the room readings are like outside - after 3 months in CM, in bed one night I checked and saw something I thought I would never see anything close to - it read between 0 and 2 (I'm in Da Nang).

 

Any theories on what's causing the periodic much higher room readings?

 

 

 

 

 

Might be vagaries in the HVAC. Central or Room/window unit?  ...could be the reason. If not, there is air leaking into your room.  We found that PM2.5 can leach into a room through the smallest openings around door jambs and window casings. If so, you can use painter’s tape to seal off the windows and place a rolled towel under the bottom of the door. These aren’t foolproof but better than doing nothing.  Keep other interior doors closed as well.

[JimmyJ]

4 minutes ago, Fore Man said:

Might be vagaries in the HVAC. Central or Room/window unit?  ...could be the reason. If not, there is air leaking into your room.  We found that PM2.5 can leach into a room through the smallest openings around door jambs and window casings. If so, you can use painter’s tape to seal off the windows and place a rolled towel under the bottom of the door. These aren’t foolproof but better than doing nothing.  Keep other interior doors closed as well.

Except this is happening when outside the PM2.5 is lower.

So it would seem something indoors is causing it.

 

Room ac unit. I checked and the filters are clean.

 

 

Edited February 29, 2020 by JimmyJ

[Fore Man]

1 minute ago, JimmyJ said:

Except this is happening when outside the PM2.5 is lower.

So it would seem something indoors is causing it.

 

Room ac unit. I checked and the filters are clean.

 

 

Yes, agree. Contaminating air is entering the room.  I recall staying in certain hotels where restaurant kitchen odors wafted into my room early in the morning, when it’s staff lit up the stoves in preparation for breakfast service. But if you don’t detect such smells, it might originate elsewhere in the building. 

[baansgr]

On 2/19/2020 at 12:03 PM, canthai55 said:

And what - pray tell - is your solution for the air pollution which comes into Thailand from other countries ?

Invasion ? A stern "Don't do that ! "

Most air pollution is invasive from neighboring countries.

There is no simple answer ...

Well Thailand could start to impound every vehicle that bellows out black smoke, which much be in the millions...could stop all that crop burning stuff also, maybe then the invasive pollution wouldn't be noticed so much

Edited February 29, 2020 by baansgr

[Yorkshire Tea]

4 hours ago, JimmyJ said:

Except this is happening when outside the PM2.5 is lower.

So it would seem something indoors is causing it.

 

Room ac unit. I checked and the filters are clean.

 

 

I have pm2.5 sensor on my desk, in my "study".  When my wife is doing a stir fry or a roast is in the oven, the readings go through the roof!  like 200-300.  And that's through my door, hallway & kitchen door, with good extractor fan above the cooker.

[wotsdermatter]

On 2/18/2020 at 11:32 PM, Tracyb said:

I just laughed so hard that I peed my pants.

Was that your little contribution to help resolve the problem?  A bit close to home wasn't it?

'nuf sed.