Follow the science....

[FarFlungFalang]

1 hour ago, Logosone said:

Wow so two doctors on the frontlines saying it makes sense to isolate the sick, but not so much to isolate the healthy, so basically what I've been saying for weeks. Nice to see American doctors catching up with German TVF contributors. Good stuff.

 

And two doctors saying that those losing out are non-Covid19 patients, again what I was saying weeks ago.

 

Why did you not make a video of my posts and do a thread about it? It's because I'm German, isn't it?

It can get a bit lonely swimming against the current so it's good to have some company on the journey.

[Lacessit]

3 minutes ago, Yinn said:

Thailand deaths per million .7,

infection 42 per million. 

Wear the mask.

Think Australia and Thailand will be ok soon. Two more weeks? Lucky.

 

Belgium 3,911 per million, death 597 per million. 

 

Europe/USA/SouthnAmerica/Indonesia will be problem 2+ month.

Italy lockdown long time already. Still about 500 die everyday.

 

I really do think there are other factors operating in Thailand, Yinn. Assuming government figures can be relied on, heat, the use of the wai instead of a handshake, spicy food, mass BCG immunization. None of us are out of the woods yet.

[teatime101]

45 minutes ago, 4MyEgo said:

somethings not right and the healthy should be back at work or out and about.

Social distancing has been highly effective in reducing the spread of the virus globally. The potential for a pandemic with very high mortality rates is massively increased if we allow people to mix. It could kill tens of millions worldwide. Not the rich, of course. They have the means to protect themselves and their families.

[CGW]

1 hour ago, cornishcarlos said:

What I do find interesting though, is a lot of people that dismiss anything other than the MSM angle, get very fired up and sometimes abusive to those that have an open mind.

Human "fallacy" systematic error in reasoning, people only hear what they want to hear!

 

I was hoping one of the positive outcomes from this "event" is that people would realise how corrupted the MSM has become! Then I read a post quoting Sky news! there is no hope for some! ???? 

 

Next we will have someone stating that the 5 million $$ a year the BBC receives from Bill Gates does not influence their left wing beliefs! ????

[chessman]

1 hour ago, cornishcarlos said:

What I do find interesting though, is a lot of people that dismiss anything other than the MSM angle, get very fired up and sometimes abusive to those that have an open mind..

They seem to lose their cool if you suggest anything outside what they have been told to believe !! I guess that's a side affect of brain washing ??

I think a lot of people have been brainwashed that the MSM angle is always wrong, even though they would never actually check themselves.

I would say the MSM is a lot more trustworthy than a lot of the fringe websites that some people tend to get their news from. Hey, they're much more likely to print their sources when using data, they usually have better access to the people making the news and will print retractions when they are found to make errors.

Someone like John Dickerson, he is a journalist and has had many top jobs for CBS news. That's MSM and I couldn't imagine someone smarter, fairer and more eloquent.

This MSM is also covering all the stories that you probably think they are ignoring. They are running stories about the economic problems and about the latest research with antibody tests that suggest a lower mortality rate. At the moment they are talking a lot about how things are going to open up and the best way to do that.

 

[Lacessit]

1 hour ago, mauGR1 said:

No, the data is saying that covid's dangers have been hyped, like every person of commons sense have realised a while ago.

And why the opinion of frontline doctors is not worth of your appreciation, pray tell.

Almost 200,000 deaths from COVID-19 is not worthy of your attention? Are you a descendant of Stalin?

Presumably you are not familiar with the aphorism opinions are like a##eholes, everybody has one.

For these two doctors, I could probably assemble half a dozen more with the opposite take on the situation.

[Yinn]

4 minutes ago, Lacessit said:

I really do think there are other factors operating in Thailand, Yinn. Assuming government figures can be relied on, heat, the use of the wai instead of a handshake, spicy food, mass BCG immunization. None of us are out of the woods yet.

Spicy food??? 55555 Lao kao?

[Lacessit]

Just now, Yinn said:

Spicy food??? 55555 Lao kao?

Don't know about Lao Kao. Spicy food kills bacteria, viruses are just the entree for anything bactericidal.

[FarFlungFalang]

4 minutes ago, Yinn said:

Spicy food??? 55555 Lao kao?

Homemade old fish sauce will keep anything away.One smell,gone!Maybe Durian as well!

[Logosone]

Thailand has not been testing the sick, healthy or dead to any great degree.

 

I certainly would not use Thailand as any kind of model on Covid19.

 

As for masks, evidence is very weak as to even a miniscule effect:

 

The government’s scientific advisory group for emergencies (Sage) met on Tuesday to review the evidence on wearing face masks. The Guardian understands that the group is split on the best policy to adopt because the evidence is so weak.

 

https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2020/apr/21/scientists-join-calls-for-uk-public-to-wear-homemade-face-masks-outdoors

[mauGR1]

9 minutes ago, Lacessit said:

Almost 200,000 deaths from COVID-19 is not worthy of your attention? Are you a descendant of Stalin?

Wow, and you are a scientist..Have you listened to the doctors ? Are you able to see the difference between death 'from covid' and death 'with covid' ? if not, you're wasting my time.

Thanks for the Stalin reference, but no thanks, how many die from flu every year ?

You say every opinion is like a a##hole, i say that every opinion is worth of some respect.

Now, the opinion of two doctors working on the frontline is worth a lot of respect to me.

Edited April 25, 2020 by mauGR1

[cornishcarlos]

7 minutes ago, Lacessit said:

For these two doctors, I could probably assemble half a dozen more with the opposite take on the situation.

 

Please post them up and let's discuss the pros and cons of both sides.. It's worth seeing all angles.. Please make them current though, not a few weeks old.. 

[chessman]

1 minute ago, mauGR1 said:

Now, the opinion of to doctors working on the frontline is worth a lot of respect to me.

I think frontline is pushing it. They seem to be working in a more rural area in a state (California) that is not one of the worst affected in the USA. I think what they said generally makes sense but I'm not sure they would be pushing for everything to be opening in New York.

 

[mauGR1]

2 minutes ago, chessman said:

I'm not sure they would be pushing for everything to be opening in New York.

 

You are probably right with this one, it's not a mystery that heavily polluted and densely populated areas are more affected by covid, and deserve another kind of attention.

Perhaps instead to blame everything on covid, it may be worth to look at the lifestyles of people who are more affected by the virus.

[sucit]

53 minutes ago, teatime101 said:

Social distancing has been highly effective in reducing the spread of the virus globally. The potential for a pandemic with very high mortality rates is massively increased if we allow people to mix. It could kill tens of millions worldwide. Not the rich, of course. They have the means to protect themselves and their families.

There is no scientific evidence whatsoever that social distancing works with covid19. I know you think you are right, but you are not. We do not know that yet. That is not to say it is not working, but we do not know yet. In fact it may be easier to peruse the data at this point and say it is not working, when considering countries who have very relaxed distancing measures in place. 

Edited April 25, 2020 by sucit

[Sujo]

36 minutes ago, mauGR1 said:

You are probably right with this one, it's not a mystery that heavily polluted and densely populated areas are more affected by covid, and deserve another kind of attention.

Perhaps instead to blame everything on covid, it may be worth to look at the lifestyles of people who are more affected by the virus.

Ye the lifestyle. If you ignore the lockdown you have more chance of getting it. Once you have it, roll the dice.

[chessman]

14 minutes ago, sucit said:

There is no scientific evidence whatsoever that social distancing works with covid19. I know you think you are right, but you are not. We do not know that yet. That is not to say it is not working, but we do not know yet.

you are technically right, but you must also think how that evidence would look. How would it be possible to prove it? The worst affected European countries were seeing increases of new cases of 20%+ before their social distancing measures. Now it is 2% or 3% (or less) per day. It seems the R0 number in countries with lock downs has been pushed under 1 now. It was clearly over 1 before the lockdowns.

Edited April 25, 2020 by chessman

[norfolkandchance]

2 hours ago, Logosone said:

Wow so two doctors on the frontlines saying it makes sense to isolate the sick, but not so much to isolate the healthy, so basically what I've been saying for weeks. Nice to see American doctors catching up with German TVF contributors. Good stuff.

 

And two doctors saying that those losing out are non-Covid19 patients, again what I was saying weeks ago.

 

Why did you not make a video of my posts and do a thread about it? It's because I'm German, isn't it?

I thought you where Austrian. 

[Lacessit]

50 minutes ago, mauGR1 said:

Wow, and you are a scientist..Have you listened to the doctors ? Are you able to see the difference between death 'from covid' and death 'with covid' ? if not, you're wasting my time.

Thanks for the Stalin reference, but no thanks, how many die from flu every year ?

You say every opinion is like a a##hole, i say that every opinion is worth of some respect.

Now, the opinion of two doctors working on the frontline is worth a lot of respect to me.

I wasted my time listening to these two doctors. How do you know they are working on the frontline? You only have their word for that.

The flu red herring keeps getting trotted out. I haven't had flu since my twenties, vaccination every year. Get back to me after they have found a vaccination for this pandemic, and stop wasting my time.

[mauGR1]

4 minutes ago, Sujo said:

Ye the lifestyle. If you ignore the lockdown you have more chance of getting it. Once you have it, roll the dice.

The lock down was useful at the beginning, when there was no data, now it seems clear that the virus is dangerous just for old people with pre-existing conditions.

Now, i'm 60 myself and a smoker too, but i would never be so selfish to lock down millions of young healthy people, children and families who need to work for a living, just to save my life, would you ?

[mauGR1]

5 minutes ago, Lacessit said:

Get back to me after they have found a vaccination for this pandemic, and stop wasting my time.

Never then. Welcome to my ignore list, mr. pleasant.

[Jingthing]

7 minutes ago, mauGR1 said:

The lock down was useful at the beginning, when there was no data, now it seems clear that the virus is dangerous just for old people with pre-existing conditions.

Now, i'm 60 myself and a smoker too, but i would never be so selfish to lock down millions of young healthy people, children and families who need to work for a living, just to save my life, would you ?

It's not only old people but you should quit smoking. 

https://www.washingtonpost.com/health/2020/04/24/strokes-coronavirus-young-patients/

 

 

Young and middle-aged people, barely sick with covid-19, are dying from strokes

Edited April 25, 2020 by Jingthing

[Lacessit]

56 minutes ago, cornishcarlos said:

 

Please post them up and let's discuss the pros and cons of both sides.. It's worth seeing all angles.. Please make them current though, not a few weeks old.. 

Please explain why I should post any more than I have. You have the data from Australia and the US, and Australia's Chief Medical Officer is diametrically opposed to the views expressed in the video.

Science always throws up different hypotheses. The real test is which one works, and the evidence is already there. If you don't understand that, I'm not going to waste my time anymore on a BS thread.

[mauGR1]

1 minute ago, Jingthing said:

It's not only old people but you should quit smoking. 

I quit everyday when i go to sleep ????

[Lacessit]

1 minute ago, mauGR1 said:

Never then. Welcome to my ignore list, mr. pleasant.

Thanks. I'll wear it as a badge of honor.

If I'm unpleasant, it's because I'm unable to suffer fools gladly.

[Logosone]

23 minutes ago, norfolkandchance said:

I thought you where Austrian. 

It's basically the same thing.

 

Austrians voted twice to join Germany. Only through a gun to their head were they prevented from achieving this lucky fate.

 

 

[CGW]

9 minutes ago, Lacessit said:

If I'm unpleasant, it's because I'm unable to suffer fools gladly.

Is that because you are superior - a "Scientist" wow - respect ????    

 

Waiting for tomorrows edition of "I am a scientist and know everything" sleep tight ???? 

[rumak]

58 minutes ago, mauGR1 said:

Perhaps instead to blame everything on covid, it may be worth to look at the lifestyles of people who are more affected by the virus.

the elderly (immune systems weaken with age).........  the obese (Obesity can weaken the body's immune system and reduce its ability to fight off infections, according to scientists.)

people with underlying medical conditions .... and   the junk food lifestyles

 

my personal opinion ( which some "experts" support).......  is that the western concern with sterile lifestyles does not allow the body to naturally build up resistance )

As i once stated, my gf grew up in a very rural and primitive environment,  exposed to all kinds

of  germs and I am sure not taught to wash her hands after getting the kwai in thru the mud.

Maybe that is why she is never sick........ and hardly even a sniffle.   Now that is immunity !

 

 

[mauGR1]

1 minute ago, rumak said:

my personal opinion ( which some "experts" support).......  is that the western concern with sterile lifestyles does not allow the body to naturally build up resistance )

True, i didn't take that into consideration, but i think you're spot on.

I am also quite suspicious of magnetic waves, and although there has never been a serious study, i believe that cancer rates have increased since the advent of mobile phones and especially smart phones.

[teatime101]

41 minutes ago, chessman said:

The worst affected European countries were seeing increases of new cases of 20%+ before their social distancing measures.

Yes. How else is it going to spread, other than through person to person contact? It's not in the water supply. It can't travel without a vector.

China (eventually) took social distancing to extremes and stopped the virus spreading in China. If they hadn't it could have been a disaster, given the density of some of their cities.

Edited April 25, 2020 by teatime101