Netanyahu 'confident' U.S. will allow West Bank annexation in two months

[sanemax]

7 minutes ago, Mavideol said:

doesn't matter how quick they do it, coming 2021 the next administration will have to reverse Trump's (one more)  bad decision.... hope by then Netanyahu will be in jail

It will be too late by then .

[sanemax]

1 minute ago, Throatwobbler said:

I will quickly sum up every posts you have ever made. Blah blah blah Liberals. blah blah blah Liberals. That is the entire content of all your posts.

TBF, that was just one point in his post and he did make numerous other points 

[stevenl]

49 minutes ago, KhunFred said:

If your mother and grandmother were Jews, so are you. Why do you support those who want to DESTROY Jews??? 

We're talking Israel here, not Jews.

[simple1]

27 minutes ago, Baerboxer said:

<SNIP>part of the imagined Palestinian state that never existed!

I attended, as a non Jew, an all Jewish Private Grammar school in London for five years. Just my thoughts...

 

Your argument has been repeated ad nauseum. Personally I disagree, the claims are the land was given to the Jews by G_d, who commanded the Jews to  wipe out the previous occupants the Canaanites. Current researchers now claim the Canaanites 'moved' to Lebanon - did the Jews disobey G-d's commandment to commit genocide? Palestine was a recognised governed province for hundreds of years prior to 1948 and so on; the argument goes on endlessly. What is relevant to my mind is the Palestinians be able to work with the Israelis to gain independence, they've come close a few times, but now looks as though the dream is far, far away. One could say it's a great shame Palestinians opposing Hamas cruel rule aren't supported in any meaningful manner. 

 

 

[sanemax]

1 minute ago, simple1 said:

I attended, as a non Jew, an all Jewish Private Grammar school in London for five years. Just my thoughts...

 

 

Eh, if you were a non Jew attending a School, it could not have been an "All Jewish School" 

[sanemax]

8 minutes ago, stevenl said:

We're talking Israel here, not Jews.

We are talking about Palestinians that want to destroy a Jewish nation 

[metisdead]

An off topic deflection post about Myanmar has been removed. 

[Surelynot]

2 minutes ago, sanemax said:

We are talking about Palestinians that want to destroy a Jewish nation 

Only 75% of Israelis are Jews.....just out if interest.

[simple1]

2 minutes ago, sanemax said:

Eh, if you were a non Jew attending a School, it could not have been an "All Jewish School" 

Pedantic. To clarify, I was one of twelve non Jews attending a school with hundreds of those of the Judaic faith. School closed for Jewish holidays and so on.

[sanemax]

2 minutes ago, simple1 said:

Pedantic. To clarify, I was one of twelve non Jews attending a school with hundreds of those of the Judaic faith. School closed for Jewish holidays and so on.

Why did you attend that school ?

[sanemax]

5 minutes ago, Surelynot said:

Only 75% of Israelis are Jews.....just out if interest.

And Israel regards itself as a Jewish nation 

[simple1]

Just now, sanemax said:

Why did you attend that school ?

off topic so see if Mods will permit. Mother didn't want me to go to a government school. Guess she was correct, a number of friends from local schools ended up as criminals

[stevenl]

34 minutes ago, sanemax said:

We are talking about Palestinians that want to destroy a Jewish nation 

The Palestinians don't want to destroy Israel.

[sanemax]

1 minute ago, stevenl said:

The Palestinians don't want to destroy Israel.

Havent you read the Palestinian Charter written by Hamas who received 70 % of the Gaza vote  ?

The Palestinian Charter states it wants the whole of Israel to be a Palestinian land under Sharia law 

[Greenhill]

5 hours ago, TheDark said:

Netanyahu's plan to annex West Bank is similar to Putin's Annexation of Crimea and continuous war on East Ukraine. Horrific and illegal actions. 

 

It's time for the rest of the world to place very heavy sanctions against Israel. Ban their travel, stop trade with Israel and freeze Israel's and people of Israel assets around the world.

So, I haven't heard you advocate for the same sanctions against Russia but you equate the two?!   I wonder why that is?

 

Who are the 'people of Israel' whose assets you want to freeze around the world?

 

Maybe, just maybe, there's a bit of anti-semitism creeping in here????!!!

[metisdead]

A troll post and a reply has been removed.

[stevenl]

15 minutes ago, sanemax said:

Havent you read the Palestinian Charter written by Hamas who received 70 % of the Gaza vote  ?

The Palestinian Charter states it wants the whole of Israel to be a Palestinian land under Sharia law 

You're talking in the past, the charter was updated in 2017.

[Greenhill]

2 hours ago, thaibeachlovers said:

Of course Israel is an occupying power. Israel has only legal right to land granted by the UN in 1948. The UN has not expanded that.

Israel still occupies land it gained in 67 war, and most accept that as the de facto borders, though I wonder if the US would accept it if it had happened to them.

If it not for the US veto in the UN Israel would have been made pariah long ago, IMO.

But why doesn't your theory apply to the Palestinians, as well?     The Palestinians have NEVER accepted the land that was allocated to them by the UN in 1948 and they started the War of Independence against the newly-founded State of Israel.    The Palestinians have NEVER accepted Israel and have refused peace agreements several times.

 

In the interests of peace, Israel pulled out of all the Sinai, thereby securing a lasting peace agreement with Egypt.

 

By force, Israel pulled all it's settlers out of the Gaza Strip, on the promise of peace with the Palestinians.    This never happened, of course, because they are not interested in peace.     Gaza is run by a terrorist organization, Hamas, whose leaders live in mansions, whilst the people live in poverty.    The corruption there is astonishing.

 

As an aside, why haven't the Russians been made pariahs for 'occupying' Crimea and still fighting in Eastern Ukraine - hardly mentioned in today's biased world?    Why haven't the Chinese been made pariah's for their occupation of Tibet and their incarceration of 1 million Muslims (Uighurs) in China?

 

I wonder why it's the tiny State of Israel, which is always in the headlines but these other, much bigger, cases are hardly mentioned?

[Greenhill]

5 minutes ago, stevenl said:

You're talking in the past, the charter was updated in 2017.

Please provide a link or ANY proof that any updated charter by Hamas has in, any way, recognised the State of Israel's right to exist???!!!!

[Greenhill]

27 minutes ago, stevenl said:

The Palestinians don't want to destroy Israel.

Have you heard of any credible Palestinian peace plan????   On what basis are you making your comment?

[AussieBob18]

4 hours ago, simple1 said:

The vast majority of governments disagree. You made a number of claims. Tell me if a foreign power had occupied Northern Queensland and still did so today do you believe the Australian government would agree to unfair compromises in order to avoid conflict on our soil. if they did what would your opinion of them be?

Completely false analogy. There never was a country called Palestine.  It was a part of Jordan who lost it in the war. The war that some Arab nations started to remove Israel by force.  They lost the war and some lands.  You are completely fooled by the media provided information - try doing more research.  Try reading this reasonably balanced website : quote-

 

"Did the Arab governments help from a humanitarian point of view? Not particularly. The Palestinians have remained unpopular in large parts of the Arab world. When Egypt was in control of Gaza, from 1949 into 1967, Gaza Arabs were rarely allowed to travel into Egypt. After the first Gulf war in 1991, Kuwait expelled 250,000 Palestinians. Only Jordan allows Palestinians to become citizens. Elsewhere in the Arab world they are not permitted to become citizens. Even in Jordan, war broke out, suppressed by the Jordanian government. The Palestinian-Israeli conflict has been a superbly effective scapegoat and distraction for the Arab masses, who rank very poorly in the UN’s human development index in relation to the rest of the world."

 

https://ethicalfocus.org/the-israel-palestinian-conflict-each-sides-contrasting-narratives/

[AussieBob18]

3 hours ago, andersonat said:

 

Here's a bit more "flesh" to that sentence (from Wikipedia) -

"During the Six-Day War in 1967, Israel captured and occupied the formerly Jordanian-controlled West Bank, it's one million Palestinian population had now come under Israeli military occupation: Jordan, despite not continuing to be the actual sovereign, continued to pay salaries and pensions to civil servants and to provide services to endowments and educational affairs.

In 1974, the Arab League decided to recognize the PLO as the sole legitimate representative of the Palestinian people. The decision forced King Hussein to relinquish his claim to speak for the Palestinian people during peace negotiations and to recognize an independent Palestinian state that is independent of Jordan.

Jordan's disengagement from the West Bank, in which Jordan surrendered the claim to sovereignty over the West Bank, took place on 31 July 1988: Jordan renounced its claims to the West Bank, and recognized the PLO as "the sole legitimate representative of the Palestinian people." King Hussein announced the severance of all legal and administrative ties with the West Bank, and recognised the PLO's claim to the State of Palestine. In his speech to the nation held on that day he announced his decision and explained that this decision was made with the aim of helping the Palestinian people to establish their own independent state."

That is one way to read what happened - another more truthful way is to say that Jordan after losing land in the war, and not wanting it back, or the troubled people in it (Palestinians), 'proclaimed' land that was no longer theirs to belong to the PLO, and this was deliberately done to start the Palestine/Israel conflict.

[sanemax]

22 minutes ago, stevenl said:

You're talking in the past, the charter was updated in 2017.

https://www.middleeasteye.net/news/hamas-2017-document-full

 

"8. The following are considered null and void: the Balfour Declaration, the British Mandate Document, the UN Palestine Partition Resolution, and whatever resolutions and measures that derive from them or are similar to them. The establishment of “Israel” is entirely illegal and contravenes the inalienable rights of the Palestinian people and goes against their will and the will of the Ummah"

 

 

9. There shall be no recognition of the legitimacy of the Zionist entity. Whatever has befallen the land of Palestine in terms of occupation, settlement building, judaisation or changes to its features or falsification of facts is illegitimate. Rights never lapse

Edited April 27, 2020 by sanemax

[AussieBob18]

1 hour ago, Throatwobbler said:

I will quickly sum up every posts you have ever made. Blah blah blah Liberals. blah blah blah Liberals. That is the entire content of all your posts.

Ditto yourself and all the liberals. Trumpo bad bla bla bla. Trump bad bla bla bla.

[AussieBob18]

3 hours ago, thaibeachlovers said:

Of course Israel is an occupying power. Israel has only legal right to land granted by the UN in 1948. The UN has not expanded that.  Israel still occupies land it gained in 67 war, and most accept that as the de facto borders, though I wonder if the US would accept it if it had happened to them.

If it not for the US veto in the UN Israel would have been made pariah long ago, IMO.

Yes and No.  Jordan gave the land away when it was occupied by Isreal after the war - for its own protection - which reasons have proven to be very real.  

 

https://ethicalfocus.org/the-israel-palestinian-conflict-each-sides-contrasting-narratives/  Quote:

 

The Six-Day War in 1967 created a fundamental change for Israel. Because Israel conquered the territories of the West Bank and Gaza, these lands with their millions of Palestinians came under Israeli occupation. Then followed the much discussed Resolution 242. The UN stipulated that Israel should withdraw essentially to the 1967 borders, as part of an overall agreement and a recognition of Israel’s right to live in peace and security. The resolution acknowledges the Arab’s rights to these lands, and Israel’s right to peace and security. Israel expected to trade land for peace. In June 1967, Moshe Dayan said, “We are waiting for the Arabs’ phone call. They know where to find us.” The answer was given in Khartoum on September, 1967.

 

The major Arab states rejected the principles of Resolution 242, and announced their policy towards Israel—the three Nos: No recognition, no peace, no negotiations. Israel became the occupier of an angry and unhappy population. Living under occupation is terrible for the occupied. It is not a blessing for the occupier.

[AussieBob18]

All that is required for Israel to give up the occupied land is for the Arab Nations (and PLO) to accept the UN resolution that posters here are referring to to state that Israel is in the wrong.

 

https://ethicalfocus.org/the-israel-palestinian-conflict-each-sides-contrasting-narratives/

 

"The major Arab states rejected the principles of Resolution 242 (UN), and announced their policy towards Israel—the three Nos: No recognition, no peace, no negotiations."

 

Israel wants peace and to be accepted in the pre-1967 war boundaries - the Arab Nations do not and will not accept that.  They want Israel and all Jews removed.  

[AussieBob18]

24 minutes ago, Greenhill said:

Please provide a link or ANY proof that any updated charter by Hamas has in, any way, recognised the State of Israel's right to exist???!!!!

mate - some posters here have literally know idea what they are talking about - clearly.

To claim that Hamas or Hezbollah or PLO or any bordering Arab Nation has formally accepted the existence of Isreal - is ridiculous and proof of their ignorance about what has been and is still happening. 

I dont blame them - that is what they are 'told' by the media - same about Trump - distortions and half-truths and outright lies.

 

[Greenhill]

2 hours ago, johno49 said:

Is it any wonder Palestinians want to fight, The allies gave their land to Israel after the war and after almost stealing in the 67 war, what the Palestineans have had to call home in the westbank the Jews want it all, if the USA give them the go ahead on this there is less justice in this world than we all thought which was very little to begin with, it is shameful and disgusting, my mother and grandmother were jews but i hang my head in shame over this appalling situation

I can see of no reason why you should hang your head in shame, even if you are Jewish?!    You MAY have noticed in Israel that Netanyahu does not command a decisive majority in the country - 3 General Elections, almost tied, in the past year!!

 

Israel is a sovereign state and it's citizens ,(approx 75%) are Jewish.    You don't have to agree with the Israeli Government but you shouldn't be shy of being Jewish.   Jews have nothing to be ashamed about.

 

What you say about 'the allies giving Palestinian land to Israel', is simply not true.    The Palestinians never accepted that partition.    Please provide ANY proof that the Palestinians want peace.    They have never even recognised the State of Israel with whom they (Syria, Jordan, Egypt), went to war with in 1948, (actually, Palestinians weren't even mentioned then), which was certainly on less land than they have now.

 

Again, I've never heard you complaining or being embarrassed about Russia's invasion and 'occupation' of Crimea or the Chinese 'occupation' of Tibet or their incarceration of the Uighurs (Muslims) in China?!

 

I keep wondering why it's ONLY Israel on people's minds all the time?

 

Has anybody taken a look at the size of Israel in the Middle East?   It's a sliver but they can't be allowed to live in peace, even on that sliver of land.    Seems like a real shame or maybe other forces are at play?

[stevenl]

33 minutes ago, Greenhill said:

Please provide a link or ANY proof that any updated charter by Hamas has in, any way, recognised the State of Israel's right to exist???!!!!

 

18 minutes ago, sanemax said:

https://www.middleeasteye.net/news/hamas-2017-document-full

 

"8. The following are considered null and void: the Balfour Declaration, the British Mandate Document, the UN Palestine Partition Resolution, and whatever resolutions and measures that derive from them or are similar to them. The establishment of “Israel” is entirely illegal and contravenes the inalienable rights of the Palestinian people and goes against their will and the will of the Ummah"

 

 

9. There shall be no recognition of the legitimacy of the Zionist entity. Whatever has befallen the land of Palestine in terms of occupation, settlement building, judaisation or changes to its features or falsification of facts is illegitimate. Rights never lapse

The claim was Palestinians want a Islamic Sharia state. Not true.

[Greenhill]

6 minutes ago, AussieBob18 said:

All that is required for Israel to give up the occupied land is for the Arab Nations (and PLO) to accept the UN resolution that posters here are referring to to state that Israel is in the wrong.

 

https://ethicalfocus.org/the-israel-palestinian-conflict-each-sides-contrasting-narratives/

 

"The major Arab states rejected the principles of Resolution 242 (UN), and announced their policy towards Israel—the three Nos: No recognition, no peace, no negotiations."

 

Israel wants peace and to be accepted in the pre-1967 war boundaries - the Arab Nations do not and will not accept that.  They want Israel and all Jews removed.  

And Israel has proved that, by giving-up the whole of the Sinai desert & returning it to Egypt, in return for recognition & a peace agreement which has lasted for over 25 years and is still respected by both sides.

 

For the hope of peace with the people of Gaza, Israel withdrew ALL it's settlers from Gaza, many by force but of course, the Gazan's had no intention of making peace with Israel.

 

The so-called Palestinians have made NO effort for any peace with Israel, only destroying every attempt e.g. Oslo Accords etc.