Chillies! How Hot Is Too Hot?

[DirkGently]

I have always enjoyed spicy food. A Ruby Murry in England to a Buddah's revenge here in Thailand, but is it dangerous? My better half tells me I will get stomach cancer from the chillis, just like a friend of a friend who once knew a guy that had a mate in the next village..............

The question is, is there any truth in it? I guess that in many ways the 'cleansing' effect it has on your bowels can only be a good thing, but she is so certain I started to look into it. However, she is alos certain that ghosts exist and demons exist and are scared away by her waving incense sticks.

Any links on the subject?

Any ideas?

Whilst I may scoff at somethings, cancer ain't one of them.

[junkofdavid2]

So easy to research on internet.

From Berkley.edu:

http://sulcus.berkeley.edu/mcb/165_001/pap...ripts/_642.html

It has been conjectured that irritant spicy foods may cause cancer. Even excessive ingestion of hot peppers has been suspected to be a risk factor due to injuries in the digestive systems. However, aside from the experimental studies that conduct the risk factors of capsaicin, a case-control study reveals that chili consumption is protective against stomach cancer. Furthermore, the overall frequency of gastric cancer in Mexico, where peppers are more heavily consumed than in any other countries, is in actuality relatively low. Also, the rate of stomach cancer in the United States have been declining despite increased consumption of chili peppers in the past decades (Surh et al. 1997). With this case-control study it seems unlikely that pepper consumption is linked to high risk for stomach cancer in humans. Numerous studies show the positive results of capsaicin. The depletion of substance P makes capsaicin a phenomenal analgesic. Its desensitization mechanism creates advantages for use in numbing painfully sore areas. Also, capsaicin's chemoprotective properties play a role in metabolism of the chemical carcinogens and inhibit DNA binding. It protects against free radicals suggested from the high content of resourceful vitamins. Although, the role of capsaicin suggests that it depletes substance P by destroying a subset of small diameter primary afferent fibers, the overall loss is not devastating. Regeneration of the nerve fibers replaces the subsequently degenerate one and therefore the overall result is a net gain of significant pain relief and protection of cancer and gastrointestinal damages.

[Jamie]

Peppers do not cause cancer. They are packed with vitamins and antioxidants. Stomach cancer is pretty rare but it is more prevalent in asian countries, namely Japan. It is most likely linked to the intake of high salt preserved foods.

[junkofdavid2]

Peppers do not cause cancer. They are packed with vitamins and antioxidants. Stomach cancer is pretty rare but it is more prevalent in asian countries, namely Japan. It is most likely linked to the intake of high salt preserved foods.

Or maybe linked to raw food?

In japan, they eat a lot of raw food like sushi.

In Thailand, chicken and pork are perennially undercooked and rare! Seared outside but still red and bloody inside!

(even in "reputable" restaurants!)

[DirkGently]

good work junkofdavid, i didn't bother with google as i was hoping for 'evidence' from long term Thai residents.

That all seems like good news for me though.

I'll have her do my tabasco and ground chilli sauce tonight then.

Thanks.

[junkofdavid2]

What does puzzle/concern me is that after a very spicy dinner, I "cleanse" myself very well the next day at the toilet BUT... my stool is a lot darker than usual.

Is that a sign of stomach bleeding?

(maybe the chilli burns small wounds or something?)

But the next day, stool color is back to normal...

[rak sa_ngop]

...and what does puzzle/concern ME is that after a very spicy dinner, I "cleanse" my lungs by coughing up some mucous fluid (and I do not smoke). Hopefully this 'sweating' of the lungs is a good cleansing side-effect of spicy food.

Edited April 15, 2007 by rak sa_ngop

[Jamie]

What does puzzle/concern me is that after a very spicy dinner, I "cleanse" myself very well the next day at the toilet BUT... my stool is a lot darker than usual.

Is that a sign of stomach bleeding?

(maybe the chilli burns small wounds or something?)

But the next day, stool color is back to normal...

Peppers do not cause ulcers. Capsaicin inhibits acid formation in the stomach.

[khunmarc]

In Thailand, chicken and pork are perennially undercooked and rare! Seared outside but still red and bloody inside!

(even in "reputable" restaurants!)

We must be eating in a different land of smile if anything they overcook everything

I never got rare meat in any food I ever ordered .

and as the street stalls go I always make sure they do cook again them sausages or whats not just in case but since I never tried the 'farang" type food in Thailand I wouldnt know how the steaks , pork chops and burgers look like and as eating chilies goes I must be terminally ill by now LOL aftery ears of spicy from all over the place (jamaica to thailand)

pls send chilies instead of flowers !!!!

[peterjackson]

Hey

I love having my food cooked with Habanero Peppers and the Red Savina variety in my salads.

I have never found them in LOS, but maybe next time I'm over, I'll look into the Tesco/Carrefour places.

I miss them when I am travelling and they do give me a 'cleansing' effect, not experienced with any other pepper/chile or sauce, for that matter.

Here's to more hot times.

Kind regards

Peter

[Boo]

When we moved to the UK my thai husband had a lot of blood in his stools & was sent to hospital for tests. The docs advised that he had polyps (sp?) & the amount of chilli he ate/eats (in excess of 15chillis in som tam for example without breaking a sweat) was irrritating the polyps. Polyps can then, if left, develop into cancer at a later stage.

As my husbands father died in his early 50's from undiagnosed & untreated stomach cancer hubby was advised to lay off the chillis in every meal so now mixes his usual unbearably spicy meals from 3 times a day to 1. The polyps were lassoed off & he has to have check up to make sure they haven't returned every 2 years. (a very unpeasant procedure & an incentive for him to keep the chilli to a minimum)

So the op's gf might not be that far off, if there is darker stools or blood in the stools then eating a lot of chilli would/could irriate an already damaged bowel & long term damage could cause greater problems over time.

Oh, he had also had this checked with a gp in thailand & was told he had worms (!) there was no examination or stool samples taken (as they did in the UK to rule out parasites etc) & was given a bunch of very expensive drugs which, needless to say, did nothing.

[Huw]

When we moved to the UK my thai husband had a lot of blood in his stools & was sent to hospital for tests. The docs advised that he had polyps (sp?) & the amount of chilli he ate/eats (in excess of 15chillis in som tam for example without breaking a sweat) was irrritating the polyps. Polyps can then, if left, develop into cancer at a later stage.

As my husbands father died in his early 50's from undiagnosed & untreated stomach cancer hubby was advised to lay off the chillis in every meal so now mixes his usual unbearably spicy meals from 3 times a day to 1. The polyps were lassoed off & he has to have check up to make sure they haven't returned every 2 years. (a very unpeasant procedure & an incentive for him to keep the chilli to a minimum)

So the op's gf might not be that far off, if there is darker stools or blood in the stools then eating a lot of chilli would/could irriate an already damaged bowel & long term damage could cause greater problems over time.

Oh, he had also had this checked with a gp in thailand & was told he had worms (!) there was no examination or stool samples taken (as they did in the UK to rule out parasites etc) & was given a bunch of very expensive drugs which, needless to say, did nothing.

A friend of the family who lived in Thailand during his 50's and 60's developed cancer of the colon and ultimately died from it last Xmas. His specialists told him to lay off the spicy food and indicated it had a role in the development of the cancer. Of course todays medical wisdom is tomorrows old wives tale but it does seem even the medics dont agree.

On the Mexican thing, I am sure I saw some research few years back which established a link between high consumption of chilli peppers and low IQ. Mexico was cited specifically as a problem in this regard, but the average IQ of Thai children between the ages of 7 and 12 is 87.8 (as measured last year in a study sponsored by the Ministry of ducation I believe). Most Western educators believe this is indicative of a problem with thre traditional methods of teaching in Thailand, but it seems possible there may also be a link to chillies (always assuming the original reporrt hasnt been debunked for being sloppy or politically incorrect of course).

On the expensive medicines thing, I frankly wouldnt be going to a Thai doctor for anything I regarded as serious. While I am sure there are good doctors in Thailand (and many are educated overseas), the above story is all too common and sloppiness is resulting in increased litigation (I note the Medical Association here tried to have the government exempt doctors from litigation, so it has them nicely rattled apparently). In my own experience, the arthritis I self-diagnosed a while back was diagnosed as tendonitis by one of right senior doctors at Rama 9 (educated in USA). He lost quite a lot of face when the radiologist confirmed I was right and he was wrong (to my own discomfort as well - I was frankly embarrassed for him and I would have loved it to be tendonitis). Ah well. TiT.

Edited April 16, 2007 by Huw

[Boo]

don't get me started on diagnosis in thailand, last trip over my husband visited his local dentist & was told, after no xrays & a 5 minute poke around in his gob, that he would need 3 teeth removed & would need to see the dentist weekly for several months. He didnm't pursue it out of fear of loosing his teeth & put it down to not visiting the dentist for over 30 years.

Fast forward to last month & we change dentists to an NHS one here in the UK, I force hubby to go & the guy takes xrays & does an exam & tells hubby that he needs one filling & has gum disease, floss twice daily & use a specialist mouth wash & his teeth will be fine. He does need a good cleaning but the whole thing including filling xrays & cleaning will run to about 50 pounds (3k baht!)

Again, had he listened to his own country man he would be minus several teeth & a lot of money!!! Amazing Thailand indeed.

[britmaveric]

Ulcers maybe, but Cancer I think not.

[sabaijai]

Peppers do not cause cancer. They are packed with vitamins and antioxidants. Stomach cancer is pretty rare but it is more prevalent in asian countries, namely Japan. It is most likely linked to the intake of high salt preserved foods.

Or maybe linked to raw food?

In japan, they eat a lot of raw food like sushi.

Studies suggest the over-ingestion of soy sauce and sodium-soaked preserved veggies, etc are the main culprit. Fresh soy (as in white tofu) is also toxic.

[think_too_mut]

Peppers do not cause cancer. They are packed with vitamins and antioxidants. Stomach cancer is pretty rare but it is more prevalent in asian countries, namely Japan. It is most likely linked to the intake of high salt preserved foods.

Or maybe linked to raw food?

In japan, they eat a lot of raw food like sushi.

Studies suggest the over-ingestion of soy sauce and sodium-soaked preserved veggies, etc are the main culprit. Fresh soy (as in white tofu) is also toxic.

In Japan milk or cheese are not commonly eaten.

For Japanese, the main source of calcium is tofu. Widely eaten by everyone everyday.

Japanese have the longest life expectancy on the planet.

So, where does it leave the above statement that white tofu is toxic?

Edited April 17, 2007 by think_too_mut

[sabaijai]

Peppers do not cause cancer. They are packed with vitamins and antioxidants. Stomach cancer is pretty rare but it is more prevalent in asian countries, namely Japan. It is most likely linked to the intake of high salt preserved foods.

Or maybe linked to raw food?

In japan, they eat a lot of raw food like sushi.

Studies suggest the over-ingestion of soy sauce and sodium-soaked preserved veggies, etc are the main culprit. Fresh soy (as in white tofu) is also toxic.

In Japan milk or cheese are not commonly eaten.

For Japanese, the main source of calcium is tofu. Widely eaten by everyone everyday.

Japanese have the longest life expectancy on the planet.

So, where does it leave the above statement that white tofu is toxic?

Soy toxicity

[think_too_mut]

Soy toxicity

Great. How does it explain Japanese longevity?

[sabaijai]

Soy toxicity

Great. How does it explain Japanese longevity?

1) There is probably no correlation. Longevity may be due to some factor other than soy ingestion.

2) from http://thyroid.about.com/od/bookssupportre...interview_2.htm

Q: We are told that the Japanese diet which includes soy is responsible for their longevity? How much soy do they actually eat?

A: Marketers of soy products would like us to believe that Asians have good health because they eat a "soy-based" diet. This simply is not true. In China the daily consumption of soy is about two teaspoons. In Japan it is about two ounces a day. In China they get most of their protein from pork. For the Japanese, it is from fish. In fact, the Japanese eat more eggs than they do soy. They eat more eggs than anyone in the world, followed closely by the Chinese. It is curious that the egg sellers didn't capitalize on this. They could have said, "Be healthy, eat like the Japanese, eat more eggs!"

Soy in Japan is used merely as a side dish or condiment, and the form of soy they consume makes a big difference. They mostly consume fermented soy products like tempeh, miso, and natto. The fermentation process alters soy in such a way that the natural toxins, antinutrients, and goitrogens are neutralized, and the isoflavones are made beneficial-- or at least, less harmful.

3) Fermented soy (including soy sauce, natto, tempeh, etc) is not toxic.

Further info on soy ingestion in Japan:

http://www.night-thunder.com/soy.html

http://www.soyonlineservice.co.nz/

Brain.com reports an ongoing study involving 3,734 elderly Japanese-Americanmen. That research has found that the men who ate the most tofu during mid-life had up to 2.4 times the risk of later developing Alzheimer's disease. Lead researcher Dr. Lon R. White said that men who ate tofu at least twice weekly showed brain aging about five years faster than those who seldom ate tofu. Soy has also been implicated in interference with the absorption of zinc, calcium, protein enzymes and amino acids