Matt199 Posted June 7, 2020 Share Posted June 7, 2020 Hi guys, I need some help in understanding what are my options, given the current state of affairs. I want to avoid leaving the country, as it would mean in ideal scenario 28 days of quarantine (back in my home EU country and back in Thailand). I'm very worried about leaving my business here behind which is heavily reliant on me and my business partner. My situation is the following: Work permit extended recently and valid until May 2021 Non-B visa done in Penang last year and will expire beginning August 2020 As of June 2020 employing 6 Thais on Limited Company with 2 foreigners I understand that I will have to leave the country before my visa expires. The way I understand the situation is that I cannot apply for 1 year visa at Thai Immigration because I don't have 8 Thai employees. I would need to have 3 months worth of Social security paid for 8 Thai staff to apply. Is my understanding correct? What would you do in my scenario to either avoid having to leave the country, or minimize amount of days spent outside of Thailand? Thanks, Matt Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ubonjoe Posted June 8, 2020 Share Posted June 8, 2020 You need 4 Thai employees for your extension and if you have a foreign employee they 4 more would be needed for them to apply of one. Requirements are here. https://www.immigration.go.th/content/service_1 Border crossings should be open by time your non-b visa expires. When does your current 90 day entry end. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OneMoreFarang Posted June 8, 2020 Share Posted June 8, 2020 Hire some more Thais - at least on paper. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Matt199 Posted June 8, 2020 Author Share Posted June 8, 2020 Thanks @ubonjoe and @OneMoreFarang I don't have my passport with me, but the 90 day entry ended in sometime in June, to qualify me for the amnesty that allows me to stay until end of July. Even if I hire enough Thais to be able to apply for the visa, there won't be enough time since they require SSO for last 3 months. Which means that we will have to leave the country and apply for Non-B outside of Thailand. What is the difference in having a 1 year visa at Thai Immigration vs having a Non-B issued in a Thai consulate abroad? Is there a difference? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ubonjoe Posted June 8, 2020 Share Posted June 8, 2020 1 hour ago, Matt199 said: What is the difference in having a 1 year visa at Thai Immigration vs having a Non-B issued in a Thai consulate abroad? Is there a difference? The big difference is that you do not have to leave the country every not 90 days or leave the country every year to apply for a new visa. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Matt199 Posted June 8, 2020 Author Share Posted June 8, 2020 @ubonjoe Thanks; that's definitely good news. Are there any downsides to it? I heard that Immigration can pay you a visit any time and you are on their "radar" vs having Non-B from abroad. I understand this question goes beyond what's written officially of course, but I am curious about this aspect. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JackThompson Posted June 8, 2020 Share Posted June 8, 2020 (edited) The 4-Thai-employees per-foreigner is a labor-department rule, primarily. The rules are enforced differently by different labor-offices. Perhaps Immigration are double-enforcing this - I do see it is listed on the link above. The "published requirements" often differ greatly from what they actually want - though usually they want "published" plus more. I would suggest attempting to apply, and see what they demand. For immigration, in my experience, the issue is YOUR tax-forms, showing you paid Thai taxes, plus the DBD documents (originals) listing the business's board/owners/capital, plus pictures at your office, plus a document signed by a the company stating your salary, your proof of your social-security payments, and perhaps some others. I was recently put through this when attempting to get a Non-O based on marriage, using income from a Thai company for the financials, at Chiang Wattana. They now put these applicants through a similar/same document-process as a Non-B extension. They never mentioned a Thai/Foreign worker requirement - though perhaps they might in your case (or would have added it, if I came back with their first insane document list met). As far as "visits" - they could, of course, choose to come and see if you "really work there" - maybe someone else has expreience with this acutally happening. (Edit - I do recall a "came to visit" story from a friend in Jomtien - but not sure if labor or immigration made that visit). If you entered the country legally, you are in their system - though I know what you mean about "radar" scrutiny. Edited June 8, 2020 by JackThompson Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
timendres Posted June 8, 2020 Share Posted June 8, 2020 5 hours ago, OneMoreFarang said: Hire some more Thais - at least on paper. Indeed, motorcycle messengers and maids are not expensive. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Matt199 Posted June 8, 2020 Author Share Posted June 8, 2020 @JackThompson Thanks for sharing. Interestingly, we were able to apply with my business partner for 2 Work Permits last year having 1 employee only and it has been successful. This year, Work Permit has been extended for 1 year despite having only 6 employees. At least our lawyer seemed quite confident in getting us WP, but less confident in getting us Non-B Visa extensions stating the 8 employee requirement for 2 WP. If the case is that they can pay us a "visit", then I'd prefer to add 2 legitimate employees instead of "ghost" ones. I am wondering if anyone has been successful in obtaining Non-B extensions at Thai Immigration with less then 4 Thai employees per Work Permit? 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
blackcab Posted June 8, 2020 Share Posted June 8, 2020 If you both wish to obtain 1 year extension of stays from immigration, your limited company will also need to increase its share capital to 4 million baht (2 million baht per non-Thai employee). It's an easy process - talk to your accountant. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
blackcab Posted June 8, 2020 Share Posted June 8, 2020 If you both wish to obtain 1 year extension of stays from immigration, your limited company will also need to increase its share capital to 4 million baht (2 million baht per non-Thai employee). It's an easy process - talk to your accountant. 8 minutes ago, Matt199 said: I am wondering if anyone has been successful in obtaining Non-B extensions at Thai Immigration with less then 4 Thai employees per Work Permit? Not at Chaeng Wattana immigration in Bangkok. Non-B applications there have to be pretty much perfect. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Matt199 Posted June 8, 2020 Author Share Posted June 8, 2020 Thanks @blackcab Pretty much perfect, eh? Not great. About the capitalization, that's already been done at a time of incorporation, so no worries there. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
blackcab Posted June 8, 2020 Share Posted June 8, 2020 35 minutes ago, Matt199 said: Pretty much perfect, eh? Not great. To be fair to M Section (Business) at Chaeng Wattana, they are very straightforward. You can apply up to 45 days in advance and they will go through your application and tell you exactly what you need to supply if your application is not up to scratch. The nice thing is that when you appear the next time to get your documents re-checked, the criteria will be the same. If you have all the missing documents your application will be accepted. Non-B is definitely the most difficult extension to acquire. You will need original documents from the Social Fund, from the Revenue Department and from the Department of Business Development, as well as many other requirements. The thing is though, that a genuinely operating business would have all of these documents or they would be able to get them. My advice would be to apply as early as possible and expect to be asked for additional documents. Absolutely do not leave your application until the last minute or you will find it unmanageable. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Satcommlee Posted June 9, 2020 Share Posted June 9, 2020 Are either of the partners married to Thais? The requirements (at least in law) are relaxed to 2 employees for those married to a Thai but employee cannot include your wife. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ExpatDraco Posted June 9, 2020 Share Posted June 9, 2020 On 6/8/2020 at 1:32 PM, blackcab said: If you both wish to obtain 1 year extension of stays from immigration, your limited company will also need to increase its share capital to 4 million baht (2 million baht per non-Thai employee). It's an easy process - talk to your accountant. I have been wondering for some time now about the share capital. If you need 2 million share capital do you need to have that money in the bank somewhere or is it only on paper? Thanks in advance! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post blackcab Posted June 9, 2020 Popular Post Share Posted June 9, 2020 22 minutes ago, ExpatDraco said: I have been wondering for some time now about the share capital. If you need 2 million share capital do you need to have that money in the bank somewhere or is it only on paper? Thanks in advance! You will need to talk to immigration to see if they require the capital to be paid up. Then speak to your accountant about ways capital can be paid up. There are multiple ways this could happen. 2 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Matt199 Posted June 10, 2020 Author Share Posted June 10, 2020 17 hours ago, blackcab said: You will need to talk to immigration to see if they require the capital to be paid up. Then speak to your accountant about ways capital can be paid up. There are multiple ways this could happen. Can you share more? As much as I am focusing now on hiring new staff, this point might be an issue. I understood that capital has to be registered, not paid up. We have 4 mio THB registered capital, but money is taken out as a loan on which we pay interest. It seemed like a standard process to our accountant. We haven't had an issue getting Work Permits this way, but is this an issue when applying for Non-B extension at Thai Immigration in Bangkok? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
blackcab Posted June 10, 2020 Share Posted June 10, 2020 I'm sorry but I can't answer your question. The company I work for is not structured in this way so I have no direct experience that I can share. Easiest thing to do is to ask immigration. They are helpful and straight forward - it will just take a fair bit of waiting time. Please do share your answer here so that others can benefit in the future. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bwpage3 Posted June 10, 2020 Share Posted June 10, 2020 19 hours ago, ExpatDraco said: I have been wondering for some time now about the share capital. If you need 2 million share capital do you need to have that money in the bank somewhere or is it only on paper? Thanks in advance! It can be on paper only. Use a Thai lawyer, they can take care of it. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WebGuy Posted June 10, 2020 Share Posted June 10, 2020 On 6/9/2020 at 11:01 AM, Satcommlee said: Are either of the partners married to Thais? The requirements (at least in law) are relaxed to 2 employees for those married to a Thai but employee cannot include your wife. Thank you very much for this info. The company I work for has only four Thais employed so I was very afraid of not being able to obtain my WP if one of them gets fired. So I am a bit calmer now knowing that this measure was relieved to two Thais employed for the foreigners married with Thais. By the way, are there some additional benefits regarding this topic if the company is registered with BOI? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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