New Amnesty - apply for 1 year non O

[MrKFC]

What I'm trying to do is get a 1 year non-O for retirement.

 

I have the $ in place and all the proof of residence documents they require.

 

Tried last week at Chiang Mai Immigration. They said that yes, my 'paperwork' was all OK but since the last visa expired Apr 25 I'd have to leave the country and return - obviously impossible at the moment - and the July 31 amnesty was not relevant. 

 

Was told that they were confident there would be no new amnesty and after August 1  I'd be subject to overstay penalties, but they'd be able to overlook the expiration date problem and get the non O going that day if I got 25,000 baht to them that afternoon. I said "thanks, but I'll wait a week"

 

So my plan now is to apply for a 30 day visa mid August, then - while there's more than 21 days remaining on that visa - apply for the 1 year non O.

 

Is that a sound plan?

 

Thanks

 

DS

Edited July 23, 2020 by MrKFC
forgot a detail

[jacko45k]

26 minutes ago, MrKFC said:

So my plan now is to apply for a 30 day visa mid August, then - while there's more than 21 days remaining on that visa - apply for the 1 year non O.

What 30 day Visa do you mean? The only 'Visa' you can apply for in Thailand is simply a conversion of a Tourist Visa or Visa Exempt Entry into a Non-Imm O entry, giving 90 days permission of stay and yes the ability to then apply for a 12 month extension based on marriage or retirement.

You have already told us you are dealing with an office quite prepared to extort you. The key for you is the ability to leave and re-enter Thailand and nobody knows yet when that might be even possible. Come September your options should look clearer, and I might look to an agent if there is no other avenue.... or pay the piper.

Edited July 24, 2020 by jacko45k

[ubonjoe]

You cannot apply for a one year non-o visa at immigration.

If you are on a visa exempt or tourist visa entry you can apply for a 90 day non immigrant visa entry (category O) visa and the during the last 30 day of the 90 days you can apply for a one year extension of stay based upon retirement.

What type of 30 day extension do you plan on applying for. If you entered visa exempt or on tourist visa did you already apply for the 30 day extension? If you did extend it there is no 30 day extension possible now.

 

 

[DrJack54]

OP, how did you last enter Thailand.

Meaning visa exempt or tourist visa or ME marriage etc.

With that entry have you applied for an extension already.

If you have (for example you entered visa exempt then subsequently obtained a 30 day extension) in that case pay immigration 25k. Money donated.

If you have not used your extension you could apply for one and during that period apply for a non O retirement. That gives you 90 days to apply for your annual extension retirement.

I have never used an agent. In these difficult nervous times, personally I would hand over the 25k in a blink.

 

OP the above link is to a guy that did you plan this week however at CW.

 

Edited July 24, 2020 by DrJack54

[MrKFC]

22 minutes ago, ubonjoe said:

You cannot apply for a one year non-o visa at immigration.

If you are on a visa exempt or tourist visa entry you can apply for a 90 day non immigrant visa entry (category O) visa and the during the last 30 day of the 90 days you can apply for a one year extension of stay based upon retirement.

What type of 30 day extension do you plan on applying for. If you entered visa exempt or on tourist visa did you already apply for the 30 day extension? If you did extend it there is no 30 day extension possible now.

 

 

Thanks for jumping in Joe!

 

I came on a US METV.

 

The last stamp was a land entry at Ranong, Feb 26, expired April 25, and have not applied for an extension. 

 

And what I'm after is the 90 day non immigrant visa entry (category O) visa which I'd then want to extend.

 

And the reason I'd start the process mid-August rather than waiting till near the end of the new amnesty is that I'm thinking they'll be operating under more 'normal' procedures and rules, no imminent deadlines, less pressure etc. 

 

DS

 

 

[MrKFC]

27 minutes ago, DrJack54 said:

 

If you have not used your extension you could apply for one and during that period apply for a non O retirement. That gives you 90 days to apply for your annual extension retirement.

 

OK - that's what I had in mind. Last stamp was a land entry, have not applied for an extension.

 

Back in April I intended to return to the US but as the Covid/political scene evolved, decided it's better to view that madhouse form a distance. 

 

And, just to be sure I understand, applying for that extension shouldn't be a problem with the new amnesty in place - that's what they're wanting anyone who wants to remain to do - right?

 

Thanks, much appreciated.

 

DS

Edited July 24, 2020 by MrKFC

[DrJack54]

6 minutes ago, MrKFC said:

And the reason I'd start the process mid-August rather than waiting till near the end of the new amnesty is that I'm thinking they'll be operating under more 'normal' procedures and rules, no imminent deadlines, less pressure

I understand your thinking. To each their own. If you have the requirements in place, money in bank etc, personally I would do it now. Perhaps I'm the nervous Nelly type but if I was here on amnesty only, I would love to see that 12 month permission of stay stamp in pp.

Good luck.

[Tanoshi]

A lot of offices won't allow you to apply for the Non O, or extensions whilst on the amnesty.

Your first course of action is to apply for a 30 day extension, so you have a 'valid' permission of stay', then within a week of being granted the 30 day extension, apply for the Non O as a prelude to applying for an extension based on retirement.

The Non O will give you permission of stay for a further 90 days.

Within the last 30 days of that 90 days, submit the application for a 1 year extension.

 

Personally if you have all the finances and documents already in place, I'd be applying for the 30 day extension ASAP.

[MrKFC]

3 minutes ago, DrJack54 said:

I understand your thinking. To each their own. If you have the requirements in place, money in bank etc, personally I would do it now. Perhaps I'm the nervous Nelly type but if I was here on amnesty only, I would love to see that 12 month permission of stay stamp in pp.

Good luck.

My thinking exactly. I've been in contact with an agent, it's a last resort. He's been helpful, knows I'm trying to do it on my own, no problem. My lady friend is a tailor, her business is down like everyone else, have the $ budgeted to help with the shop and her son's college, in his 3rd year at Phitsanhulok. Thanks for your help!!

DS

[bkkexplorer]

After having already used my 30d day and 60 day spouse extension and currently on amnesty, i was told by immigration that I cannot apply for any other visa. Do the same rules apply with this new extension grace period? Is there some type of visa I can apply with end goal being on a spouse visa without leaving the country? A few of you have given advise before and much appreciated. I'm still looking/ hoping for a way out.

[MrKFC]

1 hour ago, jacko45k said:

What 30 day Visa do you mean?

Here's another question, just occurred to me. 

 

A farang neighbor who's been here for 10+ years  walked by, told him what I'm doing.

 

He knows I've been working on the language, can read a little, speak clearly enough that Thais often think I'm way more fluent than I am. He asked whether I'd considered an ED visa.

 

I just checked into it a bit, found 2 different articles that said I have to apply from outside the country, but one also said that there's so few students these days the schools are willing/able to do what an agent typically does for the retirement visa, but for no fee, might not have to exit to get it done. 

 

I guess it's good for a year, requires less $ in the bank. 

 

Any thoughts on this? 

 

Thanks,

 

DS

 

[DrJack54]

4 minutes ago, bkkexplorer said:

A few of you have given advise before and much appreciated. I'm still looking/ hoping for a way out.

Thinking you will need an agent. 

The amnesty extension won't help.

If you see a report from someone who obtained what your after without obtaining an extension then you could relocate (yes pain in butt) and apply there.

Your immigration office?

[ubonjoe]

6 minutes ago, bkkexplorer said:

After having already used my 30d day and 60 day spouse extension and currently on amnesty, i was told by immigration that I cannot apply for any other visa.

The problem you have is that immigration does not recognize the "automatic extension" under the amnesty as a real extension of stay that would allow you to apply for a non immigrant visa (category O).

I just depends upon the office where you apply at. Some have a allowed the visa application while on the "automatic extension".

10 minutes ago, bkkexplorer said:

Do the same rules apply with this new extension grace period?

No changes to the actual rules since it is a extension of the original ministerial notice.

[bkkexplorer]

2 minutes ago, DrJack54 said:

Your immigration office?

I live in Bangkok. Not read which other offices will grant a visa in a case like mine.

 

 

[ubonjoe]

8 minutes ago, bkkexplorer said:

I live in Bangkok. Not read which other offices will grant a visa in a case like mine.

That would be Chaeng Watttana immigration. 

When did you try applying for it. If it was less than 15 days before the 31st that could be the reason.

You should try again after the 26th. I think they might be more flexible now.

Edit: Requirements are here for the visa application. http://bangkokimmigration.com/wp-content/uploads/2019/09/06-edit_NON-O.pdf

[holy cow cm]

Personally I would have paid the cash upfront to have things changed and move forward. Waiting in itself has too much stress involved with having nothing is ever certain.

[Disparate Dan]

3 hours ago, ubonjoe said:

You cannot apply for a one year non-o visa at immigration.

UJ, do you specifically mean for a one-year non-O "retirement"? Because this is not necessarily true for the marriage version - my local IO proposed for me to apply for a new visa before July 31 (a narrow window because my 400K won't be seasoned till July 27 which is now a holiday) and they would do it, no problem.

Now I am assuming (but will check with them) that I can do it next month when things are a little less hectic down there.

Edited July 24, 2020 by Disparate Dan

[DrJack54]

24 minutes ago, bkkexplorer said:

I live in Bangkok. Not read which other offices will grant a visa in a case like mine.

 

 

There is a link I posted #4 where a guy obtained what your after at CW immigration. He did not mention in his OP regarding need to have an extension in place to apply for the non O but he later clarified that he indeed obtain a 60 day extension to visit family and on that permission of stay obtained his non o and annual extension.

As ubonjoe suggested you could approach immigration after July 31. 

If you approach an agent they might suggest non o (retirement) easier path.

[bkkexplorer]

23 minutes ago, ubonjoe said:

That would be Chaeng Watttana immigration. 

When did you try applying for it. If it was less than 15 days before the 31st that could be the reason.

You should try again after the 26th. I think they might be more flexible now.

Edit: Requirements are here for the visa application. http://bangkokimmigration.com/wp-content/uploads/2019/09/06-edit_NON-O.pdf

Yes, CW. I applied end of June, more than 30 days before the last amnesty expiration. The reason given for not being able to apply was,.. I used up my 30 day and 60 day and was at the time on amnesty. It took me a while for account to reach the required funds. I have all documents as per the link ready, It will be pointless, stressful for the family and puts myself at risk if I have to do a trip out of country. I really hope I'm allowed to apply this time.

[ubonjoe]

9 minutes ago, Disparate Dan said:

UJ, do you specifically mean for a one-year non-O "retirement"? Because this is not necessarily true for the marriage version - my local IO proposed for me to apply for a new visa before July 31 (a narrow window because my 400K won't be seasoned till July 27 which is now a holiday) and they would do it, no problem.

Immigration only issues 90 day non immigrant visas.

They will issue one year extension of stay (it is not a visa) based upon marriage if you qualify for it.

[Disparate Dan]

4 minutes ago, ubonjoe said:

Immigration only issues 90 day non immigrant visas.

They will issue one year extension of stay (it is not a visa) based upon marriage if you qualify for it.

So the IO is wrong? My expiring 1-year multi comes from a consulate abroad and they say they can't do an extension to that, but said quite clearly (to my Thai-speaker family) they will do a new one-year. Gave me the usual details of what they need, all very amicable.

[I must say that my experience  of four visits recently was a very pleasant surprise given so many reports of bad stuff; they ere equally easy-going about TM30 registration]

[bkkexplorer]

10 minutes ago, DrJack54 said:

There is a link I posted #4 where a guy obtained what your after at CW immigration. He did not mention in his OP regarding need to have an extension in place to apply for the non O but he later clarified that he indeed obtain a 60 day extension to visit family and on that permission of stay obtained his non o and annual extension.

As ubonjoe suggested you could approach immigration after July 31. 

If you approach an agent they might suggest non o (retirement) easier path.

Thanks for the response, from what i read on the other thread, the guy did an extension while on a 'non amnesty' visa. This is the difference with my situation. I have previously done extensions without issue before I had my spouse 'O' visa lapse for work reasons a couple of years ago. The last time I came in the country was with visa exempt in Dec 2019.  I have since used up a 30 and 60 day extension which expired in mid April 2020.

 

I'm under 50 so retirement is not an option.

[Disparate Dan]

Or, I just thought, is "extension of stay" not the same as "extension of visa"? Perhaps if tht's the case we are on the same track and I apologise!

[Disparate Dan]

1 minute ago, Disparate Dan said:

They will issue one year extension of stay (it is not a visa) based upon marriage if you qualify for it.

Or, I just thought, is "extension of stay" not the same as "extension of visa"? Perhaps if tht's the case we are on the same track and I apologise!

[ubonjoe]

8 minutes ago, Disparate Dan said:

Or, I just thought, is "extension of stay" not the same as "extension of visa"?

Immigration does not extend visas. The TM7 form is titled "APPLICATION FOR EXTENSION OF TEMPORARY STAY IN THE KINGDOM" and the stamps for one say the same thing.

Calling it a extension of a visa is not correct and it gets very confusing when  people call them a visa. Many times I have to ask what a person actually has so I can answer the question.

[Disparate Dan]

Patience of a saint, Joe, thanks again. Of course my Thai wife and son translated the IO's words as "visa", which never helps clarification!

Plus the local IO office website says - in English: [at present] "there is no need to apply for a visa extension at Immigration Office for this period and will not be fined THB 500 per day for this case."

Edited July 24, 2020 by Disparate Dan

[jacko45k]

4 hours ago, MrKFC said:

Any thoughts on this? 

Personally not much experience with ED Visas. Nor much of a fan as they have been abused somewhat. A person does usually have to leave the country with paperwork from the school of choice to re-enter with the ED Visa. Then a permission of stay of I believe 90 days is given, and that can be extended in kingdom, but at a further cost.

In current times I hear of various Visas being available by using agents, but with amnesty it is not always required.

Edited July 24, 2020 by jacko45k

[Snackbar]

Very clear from the outset.
 

Amnesty is for overstay only, although you are breaking the law you won’t be prosecuted / fined B500.00 per day.

 

All other normal rules apply.

 

If you pay a bribe you are part of the problem.

 

[MrKFC]

1 hour ago, jacko45k said:

Nor much of a fan as they have been abused somewhat.

In current times I hear of various Visas being available by using agents, but with amnesty it is not always required.

Hey Jacko,

 

I read that people had been abusing the ED visa, but I actually am working on the language and thought I should at least consider it. The big roadblock on all of these is the usual exit/return path isn't available.

 

And even if there is an open border before Sept 26, a two week quarantine would make it more than a little difficult to get the papers filed with 21 days remaining on a 30 day visa, and that's likely to be required.

 

There's a legal firm in Bangkok where the honcho has been posting videos with their interpretation of what's happening, today he said that the wording of the new amnesty makes it sound as if Immigration will be deciding case by case whether to extend anything beyond Sept 26, thinking it's prudent to assume they're gonna be doing what they can to make things more difficult whenever possible. Hard to say why, other than that's what Immigration often seems to enjoy doing. Hope for the best, plan for the worst is what he's saying, and getting it done ASAP is probably a good idea. 

 

I have this idea that since I have deposited the 800K and I can prove a little additional income (minimal Social Security) residence paperwork is all in order, have good accident insurance, (no health ins) they wouldn't be as anxious to block my application once I have the extension. 

 

I'm trying to avoid paying the agent fee or the bribe because my income is pretty much budgeted to fill the gaps in my GF's income - she's a tailor and like everyone else, business is way down and doesn't seem likely to improve anytime soon. Her son's in his 3rd year of Engineering at Phitsanhulok U and that's been accounting for about 1/4 of my pension. 

 

 

 

Edited July 24, 2020 by MrKFC

[Peter Denis]

5 hours ago, bkkexplorer said:

Thanks for the response, from what i read on the other thread, the guy did an extension while on a 'non amnesty' visa. This is the difference with my situation. I have previously done extensions without issue before I had my spouse 'O' visa lapse for work reasons a couple of years ago. The last time I came in the country was with visa exempt in Dec 2019.  I have since used up a 30 and 60 day extension which expired in mid April 2020.

 

I'm under 50 so retirement is not an option.

In your case, having entered Visa Exempt and already used up both your 30-day extension as well as your 60-day extension (for reason of visiting your wife), your only hope is on finding an IO that is willing to accept your application for a 90-day Non Imm O Visa for reason of marriage, even though you are now on the Amnesty extension. 

In principle you have time till 25 September to apply (so enough time to meet the 2 month seasoning requirement of the funds on your personal thai bank-account). 

If CW is willing to do it for a 'brown envelope' I would go for that option, in case you don't find any more 'accomodating' IOs willing to accept your application while on the Amnesty extension. 

Please note that applying at a different IO than your present one, would require administratively relocating to that new province.  A rental contract of a place in that new province would be needed so that you can do your TM-30 (or TM-27) at that province IO.  It does not require physically relocating if you prefer staying at your present place, but you would need to be at the new place when IO does a House Visit during your 'under consideration' period.

Edited July 24, 2020 by Peter Denis