Florida records 9,300 new coronavirus cases, blows past New York

[heybruce]

1 hour ago, innosiem said:

can you provide evidence that it is not ?

providing there are no lock downs etc. to prevent it.........oh wait, too late for that????‍♂️

You want to risk hundreds of thousands of lives on the unproven conjecture that herd immunity for Covid 19 might work?

[Anton9]

5 minutes ago, heybruce said:

You want to risk hundreds of thousands of lives on the unproven conjecture that herd immunity for Covid 19 might work?

 

And you want to destroy people's lives and economy(which will results in way more deaths) to save mostly old people with a short life expetancy?

You should check how many millions of people die of hunger every year.

[steelepulse]

1 hour ago, Chomper Higgot said:

Please provide a link to where you obtained the ‘graph’ you have posted.

 

 

The US is currently facing a death toll of 1000 deaths per day, refer link below:

 

 

https://abcnews.go.com/US/coronavirus-updates-hundreds-texas-bar-owners-pledge-defiance/story?id=71982262

None other then the cdc itself.  Do you think I would post facts without getting it from the source?  

 

 

https://www.cdc.gov/nchs/nvss/vsrr/covid_weekly/index.htm

[steelepulse]

19 minutes ago, heybruce said:

You want to risk hundreds of thousands of lives on the unproven conjecture that herd immunity for Covid 19 might work?

Here'a few more deaths to think about while you are trying to scare people without facts to back anything up.

 

"CANCER deaths caused by the indirect effects of Covid-19 on the NHS will outstrip the number predicted to die from the virus, experts have warned."

https://www.express.co.uk/news/uk/1268059/cancer-deaths-coronavirus-nhs

 

"U.N. warns economic downturn could kill hundreds of thousands of children in 2020"

https://www.reuters.com/article/us-health-coronavirus-children-un/u-n-warns-economic-downturn-could-kill-hundreds-of-thousands-of-children-in-2020-idUSKBN21Y2X7

 

75,000 deaths of despair

https://www.cbsnews.com/news/coronavirus-deaths-suicides-drugs-alcohol-pandemic-75000/

 

Unicef says 1.2 million children under 5 years old will die in 6 months due to this.

 

https://www.unicef.org/press-releases/covid-19-devastates-already-fragile-health-systems-over-6000-additional-children.

 

Edited July 27, 2020 by steelepulse

[Chomper Higgot]

7 minutes ago, steelepulse said:

None other then the cdc itself.  Do you think I would post facts without getting it from the source?  

 

 

https://www.cdc.gov/nchs/nvss/vsrr/covid_weekly/index.htm

From the attendant technical notes:

 

"It is important to note that it can take several weeks for death records to be submitted to National Center for Health Statistics (NCHS), processed, coded, and tabulated. Therefore, the data shown on this page may be incomplete, and will likely not include all deaths that occurred during a given time period, especially for the more recent time periods."

 

There is also this rather troubling development? 

 

https://www.cbsnews.com/news/coronavirus-data-cdc-hospitals-trump-administration/

 

 

Edited July 27, 2020 by Chomper Higgot

[heybruce]

5 minutes ago, Anton9 said:

 

And you want to destroy people's lives and economy(which will results in way more deaths) to save mostly old people with a short life expetancy?

You should check how many millions of people die of hunger every year.

How will letting Covid 19 spread across the US prevent millions of people from dying of hunger every year?

 

How many people die of hunger in the US?

 

Many of those dying were, prior to contracting the disease, employed and productive.  Estimates are that the people who died of Covid 19 would have lived an average of 11 more years if they hadn't contracted the disease.

 

"... the years of life lost (YLLs) for the average Briton or Italian who passed away was probably around 11, meaning that few of covid-19’s victims would have died soon otherwise."  https://www.economist.com/graphic-detail/2020/05/02/would-most-covid-19-victims-have-died-soon-without-the-virus

 

However I will admit to a certain "selfish" bias; my mother is 86, in good health, but might not survive the virus.  I'm in no hurry for her to die, even if some think that would be good for the economy.

 

 

[steelepulse]

5 minutes ago, Chomper Higgot said:

From the attendant technical notes:

 

"It is important to note that it can take several weeks for death records to be submitted to National Center for Health Statistics (NCHS), processed, coded, and tabulated. Therefore, the data shown on this page may be incomplete, and will likely not include all deaths that occurred during a given time period, especially for the more recent time periods."

 

Yes correct.  And the point is?  Look at the shape of the graph.  Which way has it been heading for the last few months.  Feel free to keep drawing at straws though.  

[heybruce]

 

10 minutes ago, steelepulse said:

Here'a few more deaths to think about while you are trying to scare people without facts to back anything up.

 

"CANCER deaths caused by the indirect effects of Covid-19 on the NHS will outstrip the number predicted to die from the virus, experts have warned."

https://www.express.co.uk/news/uk/1268059/cancer-deaths-coronavirus-nhs

 

"U.N. warns economic downturn could kill hundreds of thousands of children in 2020"

https://www.reuters.com/article/us-health-coronavirus-children-un/u-n-warns-economic-downturn-could-kill-hundreds-of-thousands-of-children-in-2020-idUSKBN21Y2X7

 

75,000 deaths of despair

https://www.cbsnews.com/news/coronavirus-deaths-suicides-drugs-alcohol-pandemic-75000/

 

Unicef says 1.2 million children under 5 years old will die in 6 months due to this.

 

https://www.unicef.org/press-releases/covid-19-devastates-already-fragile-health-systems-over-6000-additional-children.

 

Cancer deaths in the US and school meal programs in the poorer parts of the world will not be affected by how the US responds to Covid 19. 

 

The projections of "deaths of despair" are speculative, and significantly lower than the deaths from Covid 19.  Besides, aren't people who are pushed over the edge by Covid 19 in pretty bad shape already?  Why are you unconcerned about seniors and people with pre-existing health conditions being at risk from the virus, but concerned about unstable people?

Edited July 27, 2020 by heybruce

[Chomper Higgot]

Just now, steelepulse said:

Yes correct.  And the point is?  Look at the shape of the graph.  Which way has it been heading for the last few months.  Feel free to keep drawing at straws though.  

The point is the graph is reporting data from over a week ago and the technical notes tell us that data is not complete. 

 

Meanwhile infection rates are climbing across the nation. 

 

It's not the shape of the graph looking backwards that matters, it is where is it headed.

 

The last five days, not shown on the graph you posted, the death rate has consistently  been over 1000 per day.

[DavisH]

2 hours ago, Chomper Higgot said:

The Coronavirus pandemic is far from over and many nations and hundreds of millions of people have taken measures to reduce the spread of the infections.

 

Your comparisons make no sense.

Yeah, they year is only half over. The problem is, that for some countries, the rate of increase in the spread of infection is overcoming their capacity to treat patients - look at India, Brazil...once the ICU beds are all used up, the sick will be turned away. There are only so many ventilators to go around. This is going to get much worse over the next 6 months to a year - and that is IF a viable vaccine is developed. 

[tribalfusion001]

1 minute ago, DavisH said:

Yeah, they year is only half over. The problem is, that for some countries, the rate of increase in the spread of infection is overcoming their capacity to treat patients - look at India, Brazil...once the ICU beds are all used up, the sick will be turned away. There are only so many ventilators to go around. This is going to get much worse over the next 6 months to a year - and that is IF a viable vaccine is developed. 

Those countries need to depopulate anyway, plenty of countries need to have smaller populations.

[kingstonkid]

More and more are going to be found to have the virus and the more testing they do the higher the number. A better indicator is ICU hospital and deaths.v so far they are low

 

[earlinclaifornia]

2 hours ago, paddypower said:

I'm interested in further discussion of the OP, because events in Florida have followed a similar trajectory as in the UK. Both refused to recognise that long after the alarm bells rang - there needed to be clear guidelines, with proper enforcement measures, to restrict large gatherings of the public. we saw it with the UK allowing the hobnobs to have their Chelteham party, Europe has international football; and Florida Gov. DeSantis allowed Spring Break, amongst his continuing idiocracy. Both UK and Florida (and other Republican governed States) have refused requiring mandatory mask, mostly. Also, there is a shortage of testing and timely reporting - not to mention that townships in Florida and the UK are reporting a shortage of ICU beds. Obama, despite his faults, left a hard copy legacy and a trained international organization to handle such an epidemic. It got trashed due to one man's ego. I don't believe that this virus happened because Planet Earth got p/o'd with us - mankind has elected mostly incompetent governments to take care of us; certainly in the West, we and thsoe we elect have become lazy, soft, weak.

Will we learn from this? I am trying, but I'm not sure enough others will.

Florida has failed to do the needed contact tracing to deal effectively. https://miami.cbslocal.com/2020/07/06/florida-health-authorities-often-fail-to-do-contact-tracing/

[candide]

55 minutes ago, kingstonkid said:

More and more are going to be found to have the virus and the more testing they do the higher the number. A better indicator is ICU hospital and deaths.v so far they are low

 

That's why it's useful to know the percentage of positive tests.

[Jonnapat]

It seems quite obvious that Desantis is as idiotic as Trump.

Surely the non action from this Republican governer will be ample reason to flip this state come November. 

[jybkk]

Quote

Globally the death count is the same as the flu

I limited the comparison to the US on purpose, because the current global numbers are extremely unreliable: the 646K death from the flu is an estimation based on statistical analysis, because many countries do not have a proper reporting system or simply do not test for the flu. The current number of Covid deaths we have is not comparable because it's purely based on reported data. You're comparing 2 numbers that are completely different.

For a reliable comparison, you need to pick a country or region where you can be quite confident about the reporting numbers. If you do so, you'll see the same gap.

 

Quote

people are being counted as covid death simply because they test positive (guidance from CDC) regardless of what actually kills them

So you're talking about Global numbers and then now it's about guidance from the CDC? Are you implying the whole world is following the US CDC guidance to count their Covid deaths?

Also, that's not true anyway. Here's the actual guidance from CDC: https://www.cdc.gov/nchs/covid19/coding-and-reporting.htm
Nowhere do they say that a death should be counted as Covid death simply because they test positive. They actually insist on the importance of accurately state the Underlying Cause of Death in order to ensure accuracy in the reporting.

 

Quote

not to mention the financial incentive to hospitals to diagnose them with covid

Do you have any proof of that? Is there a 'cash bonus' system for Covid death in the US? I can tell you that in most of Europe the healthcare system has nothing in place that could give an incentive to diagnose with any specific disease.

 

Quote

in the UK 95% of "covid deaths" have pre-existing underlying conditions

Guess how many people who die from the regular flu also have pre-existing conditions? How is that different then? Also, are you suggesting that it's ok for these people to die because they were sick anyway?

 

Quote

then we have people being shot 7 times, but "died from covid"
Man who tried suicide by cop to avoid COVID-19 death succumbs to virus

There are many people who survived multiple gunshot wounds. It's indeed possible that the coroner estimated that he would have had good chance of survival from his injuries if he didn't have the virus. Note that death certificates can list several causes of death...

Anyway, that's called cherry picking. It proves nothing about this supposed 'conspiracy to inflate numbers'. There's actually some more serious reason to believe that if there's number fudging happening, it's to hide deaths. In Florida for example.

 

Quote

and thousands more people reported as "covid deaths" who were never tested
New York City adds 3,700 to death toll of coronavirus without ever having tested them

Remark how they made a very public announcement about this number and where it came from how they made it very clear it was an estimation based on mortality statistics? Is this the behaviour of an administration trying to secretly pump numbers? 
No, what they did here is nothing ominous, it's exactly the same statistical analysis that allows us to estimate the number of flu deaths per year despite not all of them having been tested (see first point). Right now they're pretty much the only place that have published this sort of estimation. Feel free to remove 3700 from the total tally if that makes you feel better. But I can tell you that in a year or maybe less, you'll see statistician come back with mortality noticeably higher than the current numbers.

 

 

 

Edited July 27, 2020 by jybkk

[GeniusFarang]

Are people really this dumb? 
 

Florida’s cases blow past New York because they are testing more than New York.

 

Meanwhile, New York has 5x more deaths than Florida. Big difference. Funny how the media was reporting deaths to scare the idiots but now they only report “cases” because deaths have plummeted. So they need another ruse to keep the sheep in line and scared of their shadows over a .04% flu.  

Edited July 27, 2020 by GeniusFarang

[Tug]

1 hour ago, GeniusFarang said:

Are people really this dumb? 
 

Florida’s cases blow past New York because they are testing more than New York.

 

Meanwhile, New York has 5x more deaths than Florida. Big difference. Funny how the media was reporting deaths to scare the idiots but now they only report “cases” because deaths have plummeted. So they need another ruse to keep the sheep in line and scared of their shadows over a .04% flu.  

Ok mr genius why do they need to keep the sheep in line?to what end?whos to gain?and don’t tell me it’s to get rid of trump he’s done a fine job on that all by himself 

[heybruce]

3 hours ago, GeniusFarang said:

Are people really this dumb? 
 

Florida’s cases blow past New York because they are testing more than New York.

 

Meanwhile, New York has 5x more deaths than Florida. Big difference. Funny how the media was reporting deaths to scare the idiots but now they only report “cases” because deaths have plummeted. So they need another ruse to keep the sheep in line and scared of their shadows over a .04% flu.  

Uh, Genius, did you check your facts before you posted?

 

New York and Florida are doing about the same number of daily tests, but Florida's positive rate is in the high teens as opposed to New York's positive rate of around 2%.  https://coronavirus.jhu.edu/testing/individual-states/florida

[nattaya09]

Are the Independent labs funneling test data to the Fla Dept of Health still reporting 100% of their tests as positive or have they gotten a handle on that yet?

[steelepulse]

8 hours ago, GeniusFarang said:

Are people really this dumb? 
 

Florida’s cases blow past New York because they are testing more than New York.

 

Meanwhile, New York has 5x more deaths than Florida. Big difference. Funny how the media was reporting deaths to scare the idiots but now they only report “cases” because deaths have plummeted. So they need another ruse to keep the sheep in line and scared of their shadows over a .04% flu.  

Here's something I came across which is showing facts, hot hype and scare mongering.

 

I live in Florida, which media outlets have described as a hotspot and a disaster in terms of the virus.

New York wasn't a disaster, they say. New York was a case of wise leadership.

So forget about having a rational discussion with people like this.

Here's the real situation:

The recent spike in "cases" in Florida -- hundreds of thousands of them -- is already past its peak, and it wasn't even close to another New York, which the Twitterverse predicted. 

There have been 341,670 "cases" among Florida residents under age 65. Of those, 11,496 have required hospitalization. And finally, 982 deaths.

So even in a state we've been urged to panic about, for the under-65 population the effects wouldn't even be noticeable if we weren't tracking them obsessively. Nobody would know anything was even happening.

Here's another item: the other day news outlets everywhere reported 77 deaths in Florida. Not reported was that only 10 of those deaths occurred on that day. The rest were added retroactively, going all the way back to June 14.

[simple1]

19 minutes ago, steelepulse said:

Here's something I came across which is showing facts, hot hype and scare mongering.

 

I live in Florida, which media outlets have described as a hotspot and a disaster in terms of the virus.

New York wasn't a disaster, they say. New York was a case of wise leadership.

So forget about having a rational discussion with people like this.

Here's the real situation:

The recent spike in "cases" in Florida -- hundreds of thousands of them -- is already past its peak, and it wasn't even close to another New York, which the Twitterverse predicted. 

There have been 341,670 "cases" among Florida residents under age 65. Of those, 11,496 have required hospitalization. And finally, 982 deaths.

So even in a state we've been urged to panic about, for the under-65 population the effects wouldn't even be noticeable if we weren't tracking them obsessively. Nobody would know anything was even happening.

Here's another item: the other day news outlets everywhere reported 77 deaths in Florida. Not reported was that only 10 of those deaths occurred on that day. The rest were added retroactively, going all the way back to June 14.

I Understand misinformation regards Covid is contrary to forum rules, so I assume you have perhaps misunderstood reporting on Covid in Florida or out of date data. From a Tampa based media outlet dated 27 July...

 

Florida’s Department of Health reported 9,344 infections and 78 fatalities. The overall caseload is 423,855 since March 1, and the number of deaths tied to the virus is 5,972.

 

https://www.tampabay.com/news/health/2020/07/26/florida-reports-9344-coronavirus-infections-sunday-78-deaths/

[steelepulse]

13 minutes ago, simple1 said:

I Understand misinformation regards Covid is contrary to forum rules, so I assume you have perhaps misunderstood reporting on Covid in Florida or out of date data. From a Tampa based media outlet dated 27 July...

 

Florida’s Department of Health reported 9,344 infections and 78 fatalities. The overall caseload is 423,855 since March 1, and the number of deaths tied to the virus is 5,972.

 

https://www.tampabay.com/news/health/2020/07/26/florida-reports-9344-coronavirus-infections-sunday-78-deaths/

I think you missed the "under 65 years of age"  Nice try though.

[paddypower]

39 minutes ago, steelepulse said:

I think you missed the "under 65 years of age"  Nice try though.

my reaction to your post(s) is ''sad''. It's like you've stuck your head in the Florida sand. there is a virus. It kills. new research shows that even if you survive, there are risks that your major organs suffer permanent damage. I don't see this pigheadness in any other nationality, except the US. Your country has sold its soul to money a long time ago - get used to the fact that you haven't been ''free'' since forever.

[steelepulse]

14 minutes ago, paddypower said:

my reaction to your post(s) is ''sad''. It's like you've stuck your head in the Florida sand. there is a virus. It kills. new research shows that even if you survive, there are risks that your major organs suffer permanent damage. I don't see this pigheadness in any other nationality, except the US. Your country has sold its soul to money a long time ago - get used to the fact that you haven't been ''free'' since forever.

My reaction to people who don't educate themselves as to the actual numbers and facts is "sad".  However, I realize the majority of people do not actually delve into the subject and just start parroting the narrative that is being spun.  That is "sad".

 

 

 

 

[paddypower]

45 minutes ago, steelepulse said:

My reaction to people who don't educate themselves as to the actual numbers and facts is "sad".  However, I realize the majority of people do not actually delve into the subject and just start parroting the narrative that is being spun.  That is "sad".

 

 

 

 

that is a lazy basis for your response. I am not arguing about any numbers which are reported out of FL. Please save me the time, by please presenting a proper rebuttal against the following facts:                     

1. there is a virus.

2. It kills.

3. new research shows that even if you survive, there are risks that your major organs suffer permanent damage. 

 

thanks in advance!

[simple1]

5 hours ago, steelepulse said:

I think you missed the "under 65 years of age"  Nice try though.

 

Yes, my error, I missed your qualifying statement. I have re-read your post and don't 'get' your commentary or indeed others who go on about the ages of the dead from Covid - what are you trying to say, the medical profession shouldn't report a rapid increase in deaths of the elderly and bring it to the attention of the media / authorities. To date this calendar year, deaths from Covid have far exceeded those from the flu (usual virus comparison made), both in the US and worldwide for countries who record the data. Some have preferred to fast track opening economies, ignored professional advice, which quite possibly will end their political life at the next election due to the disastrous outcomes. 

 

 

[mr mr]

On 7/27/2020 at 4:40 PM, tribalfusion001 said:

Those countries need to depopulate anyway, plenty of countries need to have smaller populations.

as you can see by the reactions to your comment most people are not ready for real change on this planet.