Aussie Suffer Heart Attack In Immigration Jail

[george]

Envoy held over child porn

Robert Scoble after being charged.

BANGKOK: -- Former Australian diplomat Robert Scoble, facing child pornography charges, has had a mild heart attack since his imprisonment in a Bangkok immigration centre, but says he is enjoying the detention because he is able to help his fellow detainees.

Mr Scoble said he had taken his mind off his problem by helping his many cellmates write letters, phone their families and understand their legal predicaments.

"I am totally innocent and that gives you a lot of serenity," he said last Friday night.

Mr Scoble's lawyer, Ratpratan Tulatorn, claims Australian authorities pressured the Thai Attorney-General after the Thai authorities had decided not to pursue the charges.

The Australian Government cancelled his passport after the investigation, forcing Mr Scoble, who would otherwise be free on bail, into the immigration detention.

"They have to win this one because they have no luck in finding the real pedophiles," Mr Scoble told The Australian.

Mr Scoble, 55, was formally charged on Friday with possessing obscene material for trade.

The charges followed an Australian Federal Police request to Thai authorities to investigate Mr Scoble, who has lived in Thailand on and off for 27 years and has most recently operated a gay travel agency.

Authorities raided his home in March and claim to have found hundreds of CDs, videos and still photographs of men having sex with pre-pubescent and pubescent boys.

Mr Scoble and his business partner, American John Charles Goss, pleaded not guilty and were ordered to appear for trial on August 17.

--The Australian 2004-06-13

[Bluecat]

If he is indeed guilty.

Som nam na,...

[whattodo]

If he is indeed guilty.

Som nam na,...

Nice one Bluecat

[possom]

if he is a kiddie f****r , i hope hes choking with no assistance !!!!!!!

[whattodo]

I dont want to go down the line NO SMOKE WITHOUT FIRE but if the Australian Goverment/Athourites have suffice evidence then i rest my case .

F****** NONCE , no deportation i say its an easy route out. Let people like this suffer in Thai custody indefinatley .

[PvtDick]

If I recall correctly, there were no allegations that he "diddled" anyone. They just found some kiddie porn in his house. Surely there should be a milder form of ###### for pedophiles who don't actually act on it?

[PvtDick]

That should be "milder form of h-e-double-hockey-sticks". I can't believe this forum is so puritanical that I have to resort to such a puerile saying.

[DaveYo]

Another new twist here. This person had CD's in his own personal possession. How does his business partner get involved in all of this??? Also, I thought in some other threads that having KP in your own personal possession was not a crime here. Hmmmm, I have a feeling fellas, I was right all along when I said even mere possession is illegal.

However this case is strange indeed. The Aussie Police asked the Thai authorities to investigate, not arrest. Obviously he had no convictions in his past according to this article. So why is the Aussie Police picking on those without convictions and picking on them just on mere suspicions??????????? There has to be more to this than what I have read here.

Also what is more interesting in this case the Thai authorities did not want to arrest this dude, so Australia cancels his passport thus forcing the Thai authorities to pick him up because he now has no valid passport. How's that for some crazy Aussie Government???

Daveyo

[Wisdom]

He knows and God know what is happening ?

If your are guilty pls stand up , admit it and ask for pardon.

This is the way of life and you never can escape it.

Hope you are well and happy inprison and look after for others

who need help from you.,

Do good and you got goodness in return.

Dont forget Law are equal and god are great and police dont simply arrest

the innocent .

God love you ,Buddha enlighten you.

Try to learn again the nature of wisdom and never too late to be innocent.

[PvtDick]

Dont forget Law are equal and god are great and police dont simply arrest the innocent.

What planet are you living on???

[mtnthai]

Well, I have never been one to condone pedophilia or any other such reprehensible behaviors. And, if you do the crime, do the time. And, if he did, it needs to be “hard” time, if you catch my drift.

BUT there are two other “wise sayings” that I try to live by and I would hope are applied to me and anyone else for that matter should the need arise:

INNOCENT UNTIL PROVEN GUILTY and QUESTION AUTHORITY.

How many innocents are doing time? Estimates on the “fair and equitable” USA penal system say about 17% of those currently incarcerated are innocent and wrongly accused. How many times have governments been WRONG, dead wrong? Everyday. Look at the world situation, as it exists right now.

We do not have the luxury of picking and choosing who is condemned by the press and innuendo, the system must apply to all concerned and all must be granted the time and means to plead their case, without prejudice or presumptive judgments, regardless of the severity or distastefulness of the crime in question. Other wise, society as a whole is doomed.

Everyone is so quick to judge in these forums where they are not seen and just heard. And, all of this judgment is based on nothing but a news article, pure hearsay.

So now you can go ahead and berate me if you will, accuse me of being soft and aligned with these people solely because I uphold their implicit rights, be my guest. Put the other foot in your mouth now.

[mtnthai]

What planet are you living on???

Ur-anus?

Texas-ville?

Yeah, that's it, Texas-ville.

[Wisdom]

Well, I have never been one to condone pedophilia or any other such reprehensible behaviors. And, if you do the crime, do the time. And, if he did, it needs to be “hard” time, if you catch my drift.

BUT there are two other “wise sayings” that I try to live by and I would hope are applied to me and anyone else for that matter should the need arise:

INNOCENT UNTIL PROVEN GUILTY and QUESTION AUTHORITY.

How many innocents are doing time? Estimates on the “fair and equitable” USA penal system say about 17% of those currently incarcerated are innocent and wrongly accused. How many times have governments been WRONG, dead wrong? Everyday. Look at the world situation, as it exists right now.

We do not have the luxury of picking and choosing who is condemned by the press and innuendo, the system must apply to all concerned and all must be granted the time and means to plead their case, without prejudice or presumptive judgments, regardless of the severity or distastefulness of the crime in question. Other wise, society as a whole is doomed.

Everyone is so quick to judge in these forums where they are not seen and just heard. And, all of this judgment is based on nothing but a news article, pure hearsay.

So now you can go ahead and berate me if you will, accuse me of being soft and aligned with these people solely because I uphold their implicit rights, be my guest. Put the other foot in your mouth now.

INNOCENT UNTIL PROVEN GUILTY and QUESTION AUTHORITY

Some peoples guilty and escape becomes no guilty and innocent.

some innocent simply innocent but become guilty ?

can you say that this man is no guilty ? Whose know ?

Evidence can be rewritten and erased with the smart guy legal adviser.

Dont look at one side of the moon and the other side is still brighter ???

[stumonster]

I wonder If his arrest had anything to do with the recent arrival back in australia of the IT man?

[penzman]

1-has had a mild heart attack

,2- but says he is ENJOYING ??? the detention because he is able to help his fellow detainees.

1- Guilt slowly catching up to him? Hang on for the next one ....

2- What a load of C-r-a-p! The good samaritan thing, been done...

Something wrong here or somewhere else if he was being investigated. I bet he comes out of IT legless

[dplast]

You play with fire and you get burnt -

what else needs to be said

[tuky]

I wonder If his arrest had anything to do with the recent arrival back in australia of the IT man?

Related link American, Aussie Arrested For Child Trafficing.

[mtnthai]

Well, I have never been one to condone pedophilia or any other such reprehensible behaviors. And, if you do the crime, do the time. And, if he did, it needs to be “hard” time, if you catch my drift.

BUT there are two other “wise sayings” that I try to live by and I would hope are applied to me and anyone else for that matter should the need arise:

INNOCENT UNTIL PROVEN GUILTY and QUESTION AUTHORITY.

How many innocents are doing time? Estimates on the “fair and equitable” USA penal system say about 17% of those currently incarcerated are innocent and wrongly accused. How many times have governments been WRONG, dead wrong? Everyday. Look at the world situation, as it exists right now.

We do not have the luxury of picking and choosing who is condemned by the press and innuendo, the system must apply to all concerned and all must be granted the time and means to plead their case, without prejudice or presumptive judgments, regardless of the severity or distastefulness of the crime in question. Other wise, society as a whole is doomed.

Everyone is so quick to judge in these forums where they are not seen and just heard. And, all of this judgment is based on nothing but a news article, pure hearsay.

So now you can go ahead and berate me if you will, accuse me of being soft and aligned with these people solely because I uphold their implicit rights, be my guest. Put the other foot in your mouth now.

INNOCENT UNTIL PROVEN GUILTY and QUESTION AUTHORITY

Some peoples guilty and escape becomes no guilty and innocent.

some innocent simply innocent but become guilty ?

can you say that this man is no guilty ? Whose know ?

Evidence can be rewritten and erased with the smart guy legal adviser.

Dont look at one side of the moon and the other side is still brighter ???

Well, I really have very little to go on here because your English language skills are confusing the daylights (self-censorship there) out of me, but I will take a stab at it.

So, what you are trying to say is that anyone accused of this crime (or one similar in magnitude) whether guilty or not, should be assumed guilty, judged by no one and made to suffer the full brunt of the law simply because society frowns on this sort of behavior or he may get off? Why not go over to Silom Soi 4 and just start to extra-judicially whack those folks because they are suspected of leading an alternative lifestyle that most people find offensive? After all, “those kinds of people” seem to have a propensity to commit unlawful and distasteful acts, too.

It all sounds absurd and ludicrous doesn’t it? About as ludicrous as your response to my post I think. (Just my opinion.)

If you were to have read my submission and understood it fully you will know that the only issue I have brought up is that NO MATTER WHAT THIS MAN MAY HAVE OR MAY NOT HAVE DONE, and REGARDLESS OF THE NATURE OF THE ALLEGED CRIME, for society on the whole it is not wise to prejudge him. (This is what is going on here.) He should be afforded all the courtesy that the law provides and then a judgment should be made. He should then be made to suffer the full weight of the penalties assigned that crime if found guilty. THEN and only then drag him through the streets of Dodge, string him up and hang his butt in the town square for all to see and scorn. Othewise the punisment has served no purpose.

The system must also do its best to make certain that the proceedings are held in such a manner that there is no question of impropriety or tampering. We must fall back on the system and all of its checks and balances. The wheels of justice can turn rather slowly at times but that can be a good thing, too. (I know, what planet am I from? No need to ask. Planet Hippie, I guess.)

The nature of this alleged crime is grave. And, to disregard any signs that would point to such an occurrence would be irresponsible. It needs to be investigated, fully. Just wait before you hang this person. To pre-judge and convict him in the press or a forum like this is as big a disservice to the public good as the crime itself.

Society must always take the chance that justice will slip and some will make it through the system unscathed, that happens from time to time. But I ask you, which is worse? People getting off and going free, or people being wrongly accused and their lives irrevocably destroyed? And who is it that will make that judgment, you? All because we want to find someone guilty? The only purpose I can see that that would serve is to remove our own guilt and shame that we wrongly associated with someone else’s crime and our/societies inability to have prevented it.

OK, now you can start to bash me again. But firs, this time PLEASSSSSSE read what I have written and digest it before hurling your words about.

[sonnyjc1]

As you say innocent until proven guilty. Sounds to me like the Aussie Gov't wants to mess with this guy for some reason. But all that porn was there by accident unless it was planted. Something here not being said. Woder what it is

[john b good]

mtnthai wrote.............

"Society must always take the chance that justice will slip and some will make it through the system unscathed, that happens from time to time. But I ask you, which is worse? People getting off and going free, or people being wrongly accused and their lives irrevocably destroyed? And who is it that will make that judgment, you? All because we want to find someone guilty? The only purpose I can see that that would serve is to remove our own guilt and shame that we wrongly associated with someone else’s crime and our/societies inability to have prevented it."

You are 100% on here.

There have been quite a number of cases (around the world) where after the "fact" i.e. the imposition of the "chair, gas chamber, (or whatever method was employed) or a very lengthy incarceration" where a person has later been found to be not guilty.

It is far better that ten guilty persons escape punishment than for one innocent persons life to be extinguished, or that he/she spends 20 +/- years in a prison.

[Up2U]

As you say innocent until proven guilty. Sounds to me like the Aussie Gov't wants to mess with this guy for some reason. But all that porn was there by accident unless it was planted. Something here not being said. Woder what it is

Innocent until proven guilty usually is the right way to go.

But all the kiddie porn found in his apartment was made to be sold to the likes of this guy (at the very least, assuming he was not involved in the production). And thus kids have been molested, abused and otherwise interfered with - again at the very least.

To me even possession of this muck is a serious offence. Creating or perticipating in a market for these goods is almost at the level of producing these goods. And should carry much the same severe penalties.

Regrettably laws are never tightened up, but only made more lax by the 'don't punish, rehabilitate' brigade. That don't work in this type of crime.

[tess79]

Ma muang thai tham mai kan ja???..... tham hai kon thai sia kon ....som nam na ...

[Dutchy]

BUT there are two other “wise sayings” that I try to live by and I would hope are applied to me and anyone else for that matter should the need arise:

INNOCENT UNTIL PROVEN GUILTY and QUESTION AUTHORITY.

How many innocents are doing time? Estimates on the “fair and equitable” USA penal system say about 17% of those currently incarcerated are innocent and wrongly accused.

Hitler has never been in court but I would not consider him innocent...I guess 'innocent until proven guilty' is not always valid; why are some people granted bail and some not for instance? The verdict is not there at that time but there appears to be some wild guesses about the chances on a guilty verdict and chances of skipping bail..

[Martin]

To Up2U. Agreed. The "Don't punish, rehabilitate" brigade need reminding that the general view of society is "While we are punishing, we should rehabilitate"

And doesn't it generally happen that the rehabilitation doesn't get done, because it is much more expensive to do than the punishing is?.

Also it is very hard to recruit 'rehabilitators'----to be capable of 'rehabilitation work' requires a personality that doesn't find it easy to associate with those who have been attracted to 'punishment work'.

Society often 'wills the ends, but grants not the means'.

[jltheart]

Hmm Let me see. You like little babys for sex. I hope you fuc___k die. Die in prison, Die in you cell. Die now. If I was there a heart attack would be your least problem.

[Emuu]

Die in prison, Die in you cell. Die now. If I was there a heart attack would be your least problem.

It never ceases to amaze me that in the midst of rational debate will come the always present voice of irrational, emotional hatred and violence. No wonder this world struggles to maintain equilibrium.

In the face of this type of rantings, it remains more than ever a responsibility for the sane to require innocence be the default and the guilty verdict be the responsibility of those with a clear head and sound evidence.

To invoke otherwise invites the same condemnation on our own heads.

[medicinebox]

Wonder if this guy has anything to do with the guy that allegedly shopped ######?

They say he was in possesion of material. Not a mere charge as someone said, but if its true, then possesion is one step away from participation. This is helping the atrocity spread.

Paedophiles are destroying lives even if they are "merely" buying CD's

Drug users are destroying lives, even if they are "merely" using drugs.

These highly illegal participants will be brought to justice.

But what happens when a country buys off a 3rd world country. Children working in sweat shops, accidents, and deaths, cheap labour. This all goes unchallenged because it is not done by a "mere individual". Or huge coporates dumping toxic waste in 3rd world countries. They are just as guilty as the aforementioned, but what happens to them. Scott Free comes to mind!

Mad world.

[mtnthai]

BUT there are two other “wise sayings” that I try to live by and I would hope are applied to me and anyone else for that matter should the need arise:

INNOCENT UNTIL PROVEN GUILTY and QUESTION AUTHORITY.

How many innocents are doing time? Estimates on the “fair and equitable” USA penal system say about 17% of those currently incarcerated are innocent and wrongly accused.

Hitler has never been in court but I would not consider him innocent...I guess 'innocent until proven guilty' is not always valid; why are some people granted bail and some not for instance? The verdict is not there at that time but there appears to be some wild guesses about the chances on a guilty verdict and chances of skipping bail..

In no manner shape or form does my reference to INNOCENT UNTIL PROVEN GUILTY state or infer that this man should not go to court. Further, there is (at least appears to be for now) no body of evidence on this alleged crime in the magnitude that we find relative to Hitler and his cronies. (No smoking ovens if I may coin a dis-tasteful phrase.) I think you are comparing a firecracker with nuclear fission. Not even on the same planet this analogy of yours.

And as far as your second comment goes about bail, etc, INNOCENT UNTIL PROVEN GUILTY does not state or imply that someone should not be incarcerated without bail until such time as they are INNOCENT UNTIL PROVEN GUILTY. Which is why I said in my earlier post that an allegation of this magnitude should and must be investigated and followed up on to its conclusion. Not to do so is in itself a disservice to the law and the society that it is meant to protect. JUST DON"T PREJUGE BASED ON THE SEVERITY OF THE ALLEGATION.

Read and digest before you write should be the 3rd wise saying, chai-mai?

And to

jltheartHmm Let me see. You like little babys for sex. I hope you fuc___k die. Die in prison, Die in you cell. Die now. If I was there a heart attack would be your least problem. -

I say this.

Suppose tomorrow you get picked up by the local police for whatever reason, let's say you do not have your passport on you and you LOOK like someone they are searching for. They through your oh-so-self-righteous-angry butt into Suan Plu lock-up while they are trying to determine if you are the guy they are looking for. Then some other detainee, who thinks like you do, decides to whack this alleged pedophile and kills him.

Now, you were asleep at the time in the corner of the same cell and had nothing to do with it, BUT somone sees your very angry posting here at the forum and you are then given the same lack of due process of which you speak, based solely on this angry posting. After all, you say you would seel retribution if you were in the same cell with him.

Hmmmmm, seems you did murder the alleged pedophile and now we have to put you against the wall and pull the trigger. Oh that's right, they don't shoot you anymore in the Kingdom, they use more humane penalties. Is this an unfair or bad comparrison?

[abbas]

BUT there are two other ?wise sayings? that I try to live by and I would hope are applied to me and anyone else for that matter should the need arise:

INNOCENT UNTIL PROVEN GUILTY and QUESTION AUTHORITY.

WEll i think the best wise saying is

GUILTY UNTIL PROVEN INNOCENT

that pice of S**T should be hanged

thank you reading this lil post have nothing else to say.

takecare uall.

[CMguy]

A person should be considered "Innocent unless proven guilty". The statement "Innocent until proven guilty" implies the finding of guilt as inevitable.

This should be a fundamental right for anyone in any country, anything else and the police can act as judge, jury, and executioner.

Maybe I stand alone on this but I don't trust anyone's judgement that much.

That said investigate the alleged crime and act accordingly.