Natural cooling ideas.

[moose7117]

There is a Australian member who designed and built his own house up in deepest darkest Ubon, i have been inside that house and he did use a lot of ideas from Australia.

it has a "veranda" all the way round and a lot of open space, this promotes air flow and when i was there the inside of house was noticeably cooler than outside.

Good luck with it and please post pics.

 

Moose

[kuma]

6 hours ago, whaleboneman said:

Got any snakes under there?

sometimeswoodworker

Snakes galore here, wife has mentioned it often...will need some safeguards in place. Actually a poor young fellow got bit coming home from school and succumbed, just about a minth ago, about 1600m from here

Cheers

[kuma]

4 hours ago, verticalift said:

I had the inside walls of my home lined with Q-Con blocks to insulate the house. I also extended the roof overhangs out 1 meter from the outside walls to keep the sun from hitting the walls mid-day. Final step was lots of air-flow. Recognize what the prevailing winds are where you live. Get rid of small windows and install either much larger windows or bi-fold doors, opening up the house as best you can to maximize the air flow inside your house.

Cheers for that, i am using qconn for the walls, getting large windows on every wall for airflow and will use awnings for sun reflection when required.

[kuma]

9 minutes ago, moose7117 said:

There is a Australian member who designed and built his own house up in deepest darkest Ubon, i have been inside that house and he did use a lot of ideas from Australia.

it has a "veranda" all the way round and a lot of open space, this promotes air flow and when i was there the inside of house was noticeably cooler than outside.

Good luck with it and please post pics.

 

Moose

Now looking at a november start and yes will post as we progress. Wrap around Veranda is also in the plan, but i will pick away at that myself after house complete. This place is a 7/24 outside type of place (from canada so grew up with the max house model,having a few months where outside was not practicle), so minimal house to keep comfortable and most time outside...cheers

[kuma]

4 hours ago, spidermike007 said:

The roof is absolutely critical. From everything I have read, you would be better off investing in roofing materials that provide insulation. There is a new generation of roofing tile, that provides a level of R22 minimum. It reflects alot of heat. In addition you can use fiber insulation in the attic, and exhaust fans both in the house, near the ceiling, and in the attic. Expect huge difference in temps. 

 

The money you are spending by raising the house is substantial. 

 

 

Hey thanks for the info. Yes the price includes metal roof w r18 fibre insulation underneath...i am leaning to gettung metal with insulation attached (as in photos) and adding r40 fibre under that. Includes venting as well, but yes maybe will put a few vent fans to help draw that heat out.

Thanks for the comprehensive reply!

Edit...you think the cost to lift is $$?. The ground is wet here so pillars need to be sunk deep to maintain the structure. All other builds in the area are doing same...that are raised. You are right i could save money even if i left it at level....but it seems lift is the way to go.

Thanks for the great input

Edited October 5, 2020 by kuma

[CGW]

On 10/4/2020 at 1:14 PM, rumak said:

Keeping sun off the roof /  walls as much as possible is IMO  the first consideration.  Once the walls heat up.... its an oven

Once the floors in the house get above 30° you know its hot, roof and walls are easy to deal with the floor not so, only happens in the heat of the summer - thankfully!

[CGW]

44 minutes ago, KarenBravo said:

Alignment. My house faces NE. The prevailing winds here are NE and SW. Always have a breeze inside the house helped by lots of windows.

I struggle with this statement based on my 40+ years in the tropics!

 

The winds here do not blow very often, the slight breeze is blocked out if you have insect screens on your windows, in the middle of summer opening windows up when its 40° outside just equalises the temperature, if the house is hotter than 40° all well and good!

 

Even a human body at rest produces waste heat as part of its basic life processes. This heat has to go somewhere, otherwise the body would overheat. If the outside temperature equals your body temperature, your body is unable to dispose of its excess heat without overheating. (Actually, so long as humidity remains reasonably low, your body can employ evaporative cooling, which is how we survive on hot days without air conditioning. But excessive sweating is not exactly fun. And in 100% relative humidity, 32-33 degrees Centigrade can be deadly to an otherwise healthy human being. )

 

We feel most comfortable in temperatures where the body's natural ability to dissipate heat without heroic measures (like sweating) equals the amount of waste heat our body produces at rest, so those who want to "get used' to the heat, enjoy 

 

[kuma]

23 hours ago, kuma said:

BK Steve. Excellent teply in a great thread fir me, just was looking for this topic and there it us brand new and up frint. Thanks to OP.

I am just gwtting a house built. I asked for a 1m crawl space underneath, with no wall around....thinking it will allow considerable airflow under the house and help a lot with coolibg and dehumidification.

The bulider has a surcharge to do so as pillars need to be strong enough to support house with out soil underneath to help.

My question to the forum, does anyone have experience raising their hone and keeping it open...does it assist with cooling and dehumidification or should expect the same outcone?

Cheers in advance for on topix replies.

 

 I know OP has a condo but topic is cooling so sorry if flipping to house feels like hijackng, lol. But still on topic re cooling, imo

 

Edit...BK another great point. I need minimal air con here after 17 years of acclimating. Typically an hour or so at bedtime then again when waking up depending on tge season...but this area is almost as cool as it gets around here. These days i find the aircon in the bedroom blows too cool and was thinking of having it in the main room situated such that it blows into the bedroom and use fans to help push that cool air in, sounds like you make that work, so thanks for the input! 

[MadMuhammad]

25 minutes ago, CGW said:

I struggle with this statement based on my 40+ years in the tropics!

 

The winds here do not blow very often, the slight breeze is blocked out if you have insect screens on your windows, in the middle of summer opening windows up when its 40° outside just equalises the temperature, if the house is hotter than 40° all well and good!

 

Even a human body at rest produces waste heat as part of its basic life processes. This heat has to go somewhere, otherwise the body would overheat. If the outside temperature equals your body temperature, your body is unable to dispose of its excess heat without overheating. (Actually, so long as humidity remains reasonably low, your body can employ evaporative cooling, which is how we survive on hot days without air conditioning. But excessive sweating is not exactly fun. And in 100% relative humidity, 32-33 degrees Centigrade can be deadly to an otherwise healthy human being. )

 

We feel most comfortable in temperatures where the body's natural ability to dissipate heat without heroic measures (like sweating) equals the amount of waste heat our body produces at rest, so those who want to "get used' to the heat, enjoy 

 

I’ve always ‘run hot’. Even as a kid I used to emit visible steam on cold days exerting myself at school. My internal temperature doesn’t allow me to equalise my temperature very well at all and I sweat excessively. No ‘getting used’ to the temps for me sadly 

[KarenBravo]

36 minutes ago, CGW said:

I struggle with this statement based on my 40+ years in the tropics!

 

The winds here do not blow very often, the slight breeze is blocked out if you have insect screens on your windows, in the middle of summer opening windows up when its 40° outside just equalises the temperature, if the house is hotter than 40° all well and good!

 

Even a human body at rest produces waste heat as part of its basic life processes. This heat has to go somewhere, otherwise the body would overheat. If the outside temperature equals your body temperature, your body is unable to dispose of its excess heat without overheating. (Actually, so long as humidity remains reasonably low, your body can employ evaporative cooling, which is how we survive on hot days without air conditioning. But excessive sweating is not exactly fun. And in 100% relative humidity, 32-33 degrees Centigrade can be deadly to an otherwise healthy human being. )

 

We feel most comfortable in temperatures where the body's natural ability to dissipate heat without heroic measures (like sweating) equals the amount of waste heat our body produces at rest, so those who want to "get used' to the heat, enjoy 

 

I think that experience and common sense indicates that houses that have a through breeze are cooler than houses with no breeze. That is based on my 40+ years in the tropics.

[CGW]

13 minutes ago, KarenBravo said:

I think that experience and common sense indicates that houses that have a through breeze are cooler than houses with no breeze. That is based on my 40+ years in the tropics.

A 40° through breeze (when there is one!) that is then able to ignore insect screens, sure ???? 

So much for experience! 

[Nakdontree]

I've been quite happy with my simple "active" cooling system used both in BKK condos as well as in small houses in the NE of Thailand. It consists of one or several low-noise fans installed in a way that they push air into the room(s) at night, usually between 7 p.m. and 7 a.m., in front of or better behind any type of mosquito screen.
During the day I keep the doors and windows closed. In addition, in hot season I use a standard Hitari fan at low revs inside the room I stay, just to keep the air moving a bit.
Obviously, this only works in buildings with sufficient ceiling insulation, and windows and walls that are protected from direct sunlight throughout the day.

[KarenBravo]

19 minutes ago, CGW said:

A 40° through breeze (when there is one!) that is then able to ignore insect screens, sure ???? 

So much for experience! 

We don't get those temperatures here. Most places don't get those temperatures.

I KNOW my house is cooler with a breeze. The thermometer doesn't lie.

There is no need to be insulting. I stand by my experience that breezes cool a house.

Edited October 5, 2020 by KarenBravo

[CGW]

4 minutes ago, KarenBravo said:

There is no need to be insulting. I stand by my experience that breezes cool a house.

I apoligise if you consider my response to be insulting, i thought with your sarcasm that you would not expect a polite reply.

Off course a breeze can cool a house, certainly below 35° after that no, you obviously don't live in the North or NE if you don't get 40° weather in the summer.

First of all you need a breeze, then the air needs to be able to flow to remove heat, if you have these weather conditions where you are - good 

They are rare days up here in the summer, in the "winter" we have days like this, but it makes little difference as cool anyway, the house cools down at night and tetains the cool during the day anyway, opening windows just equalises the heat with the outside.

[spidermike007]

1 hour ago, kuma said:

Hey thanks for the info. Yes the price includes metal roof w r18 fibre insulation underneath...i am leaning to gettung metal with insulation attached (as in photos) and adding r40 fibre under that. Includes venting as well, but yes maybe will put a few vent fans to help draw that heat out.

Thanks for the comprehensive reply!

Edit...you think the cost to lift is $$?. The ground is wet here so pillars need to be sunk deep to maintain the structure. All other builds in the area are doing same...that are raised. You are right i could save money even if i left it at level....but it seems lift is the way to go.

Thanks for the great input

If you are in an area prone to flooding, I would put it on stilts. I will be building soon, and will be doing 5 meter stilts! But, it is a scenic area, and I want the house to be high, to take advantage of the views. 

[johng]

A breeze will make you feel cooler because of the evaporation of sweat from the skin, same as having a fan blowing...but as the relative humidity rises this effect is less and less effective.

The actual air temperature should be the same unless  the air temperature "outside" is already lower than inside the house.

Edited October 5, 2020 by johng

[KarenBravo]

18 minutes ago, CGW said:

I apoligise if you consider my response to be insulting, i thought with your sarcasm that you would not expect a polite reply.

Off course a breeze can cool a house, certainly below 35° after that no, you obviously don't live in the North or NE if you don't get 40° weather in the summer.

First of all you need a breeze, then the air needs to be able to flow to remove heat, if you have these weather conditions where you are - good 

They are rare days up here in the summer, in the "winter" we have days like this, but it makes little difference as cool anyway, the house cools down at night and tetains the cool during the day anyway, opening windows just equalises the heat with the outside.

I live near the sea and there is nearly always a breeze. Even when it is 37 degrees outside, my house is always two to three degrees cooler (checked with thermometer). Usually, the hottest it ever gets here is 35 degrees with anything above that very rare.

Even if you do live in the NE, the temperature of 40 degrees is only for two, or three months of the year. For the remainder of the year (9 to 10 months), the points I have made and put into practice will cool the house and lower your electricity bill. For those hot months, only an AC will work.

It's no accident that houses all around the world in the tropics have the same features. Maybe because they are effective?

Edited October 5, 2020 by KarenBravo

[sandyf]

On 10/4/2020 at 1:14 PM, rumak said:

There's ALWAYS gonna be a few guys that tell you their house is cool as a cucumber without A/C.

 

There are ways, with some or a lot of effort/money  that a house here can be kept cooler .(a bit !)

A friend built adobe style with double walls and other features.   A year later added air conditioners.

 

Keeping sun off the roof /  walls as much as possible is IMO  the first consideration.  Once the walls heat up.... its an oven

 

 

You can never stop ambient equalisation so if the ambient is acceptable good ventilation would be required and then the main focus would be to prevent any rise above ambient from direct radiation from the sun. Natural shading from trees or shrubs can be the most effective but failing that screens can be erected.. The same applies to the roof, the weakest link for direct heat, insulation and roofspace ventilation helps a lot. I should imagine one of the hidden benefits of solar power is a reduction of direct sun on the roof but never heard it mentioned.

I had my house built with cavity walls which is quite effective but not something you can just do. The inner wall remains cool during the time the aircon is off keeping the internal temperature below ambient during the day.

[rumak]

2 hours ago, CGW said:

I struggle with this statement based on my 40+ years in the tropics!

 

The winds here do not blow very often, the slight breeze is blocked out if you have insect screens on your windows, in the middle of summer opening windows up when its 40° outside just equalises the temperature, if the house is hotter than 40° all well and good!

I  struggle with it too,  but did not care to try to dispute it.   To me the strangest things is when people open the windows when its even mid 30's outside .  Who wants that blowing through the house ?

As soon as it starts to heat up outside I close windows and doors and keep the cooler air inside for as

long as I can tolerate with the use of fans .  

And CM area also can only hope to have  a slight breeze,  if that.

 

AHAH !  i just scrolled up to see your last post to mr. B .    I will go back to read and enjoy his previous reply to you  lol       i often refer to "experience"  on this forum as the great teacher ; I usually am a fast learner .   So i am once again assured that my "did not care to try to dispute it"  remark was the right choice .  ( and having my house in the mid 30's range is not my idea of comfort) .  

Edited October 5, 2020 by rumak

[Yellowtail]

I think it fair to say if you have a nice sea-breeze opening the windows it is nice.

 

It is also worth noting that people living up-country also have to worry about the cold for a month or two a year...

[rumak]

51 minutes ago, spidermike007 said:

If you are in an area prone to flooding, I would put it on stilts. I will be building soon, and will be doing 5 meter stilts! But, it is a scenic area, and I want the house to be high, to take advantage of the views. 

I am in and out of my house around 30 times a day .    Now a 5 meter step up and down 30 x a day

would certainly make me stronger.   or kill me

[kuma]

1 hour ago, KarenBravo said:

I think that experience and common sense indicates that houses that have a through breeze are cooler than houses with no breeze. That is based on my 40+ years in the tropics.

I agree, the condo i have is blessed with a very persistent and strong cross breeze, which combined with  being blocked from moat direct sun makes it very cool. If it were not for the street noise, we could often sleep with just fans.

Hoping to create a similar effect with this house...for me the less time in air the better....but i am from the upper north so i still do need a blast at least once a day.

[rumak]

xx  mai pen rai

Edited October 5, 2020 by rumak

[kuma]

1 hour ago, spidermike007 said:

If you are in an area prone to flooding, I would put it on stilts. I will be building soon, and will be doing 5 meter stilts! But, it is a scenic area, and I want the house to be high, to take advantage of the views. 

Yes good move, here we also have a view and lifting it would maimize that, but we get it at ground level as well so need to trade off cost and also then having to always take the steps up...1m ok, 3+ might pose issues in later years, if they come!

Cheers, enjoy your build

[spidermike007]

9 minutes ago, rumak said:

I am in and out of my house around 30 times a day .    Now a 5 meter step up and down 30 x a day

would certainly make me stronger.   or kill me

I used to live in a house on a steep hill. It was 78 steps to the first floor of the house. And 122 steps to my roof deck. Great exercise. And fun. 

[rumak]

Just now, spidermike007 said:

I used to live in a house on a steep hill. It was 78 steps to the first floor of the house. And 122 steps to my roof deck. Great exercise. And fun. 

I used to live on a steep hill and would run down every evening and bonk me a few stunners.

 

Now if I'm up to it,  i just casually walk down and try to find another old farang to talk to

about our ailments.

 

????????????

[scubascuba3]

1 hour ago, spidermike007 said:

If you are in an area prone to flooding, I would put it on stilts. I will be building soon, and will be doing 5 meter stilts! But, it is a scenic area, and I want the house to be high, to take advantage of the views. 

I've always been a fan of the stilt idea, I'll never understand why people build on flood plains and don't use stilts

[CGW]

1 hour ago, KarenBravo said:

For those hot months, only an AC will work.

It's no accident that houses all around the world in the tropics have the same features. Maybe because they are effective?

Pretty much what I said (or meant) in my first post, dependant on how a chap choose to read it ???? 

Effective rules! 

[CGW]

52 minutes ago, rumak said:

As soon as it starts to heat up outside I close windows and doors and keep the cooler air inside for as

In all seriousness! once the hot weather arrives - so does the pollution, another reason for closing up the house and keeping the heat and pollution out ???? 

[kuma]

5 minutes ago, CGW said:

In all seriousness! once the hot weather arrives - so does the pollution, another reason for closing up the house and keeping the heat and pollution out ???? 

I find it was the opposite here, seems this area suffered most from pollution coming from north asia in the winter months, coolest time here, but that sure changed this year due to the shut down of economic activity...the air here is the clearest its ever been or so it feels. Can see landscape features that were not visible before due to the haze. One positive, it seems, of this time  ...