Fence.

[Neeranam]

Thinking of building a fence myself. 

At the moment got a 5 foot thin wall. 

I want to use Shera wood or another brand that looks like wood, smart wood I think. 

 

Any ideas as to how to join the support to the wall? As in the photo. 

Maybe better to put into the ground. 

 

 

[vogie]

What is your wall constructed of, is it a concrete frame with blocks cemented in the frame?

[VocalNeal]

Depends a lot on how thick the existing wall is. Simplest is to just drill holes in the wall and use plastic expansion plugs.  How much of the square post sits behind the wall below the top depends on the height of the extra bit you want to add. If you add say 60cm of Shera wood you need 40cm of square tubing bolted to the back face of the wall, for a total on 1m.

If the wall is really thin we will have to have a rethink.

Edited December 19, 2020 by VocalNeal

[Neeranam]

The wall is very thin, will take a photo tomorrow. I don't think there is a frame. 

[Neeranam]

Even thinner than I thought, about 3 inches. 

[sometimewoodworker]

8 hours ago, Neeranam said:

The wall is very thin, will take a photo tomorrow. I don't think there is a frame. 

It looks as if you have a frame (the blocks aren’t strong enough without one). The blocks infill between uprights and there looks to be a capping beam on top. 
 

First test try pushing against the top. If there is no movement then drill a couple of test holes into the top beam, if it looks as if they will take plugs easily then you can use the wall as a support. Your local metal shop will be able to make some custom U shaped brackets with an upright welded to the centre of the U.

 

But if the wall is not stable enough then long supports into the ground will be needed, they can also get fixed to the wall for additional support.

Edited December 19, 2020 by sometimewoodworker

[VocalNeal]

For the most part you can fix the steel tubes to the concrete pipe wall supports.  Also drill some test holes to see if the wall blocks are solid or hollow. 

 

I am assuming the extra height is for privacy. 

[Neeranam]

8 hours ago, sometimewoodworker said:

It looks as if you have a frame (the blocks aren’t strong enough without one). The blocks infill between uprights and there looks to be a capping beam on top. 
 

First test try pushing against the top. If there is no movement then drill a couple of test holes into the top beam, if it looks as if they will take plugs easily then you can use the wall as a support. Your local metal shop will be able to make some custom U shaped brackets with an upright welded to the centre of the U.

 

But if the wall is not stable enough then long supports into the ground will be needed, they can also get fixed to the wall for additional support.

I'm thinking 9/10 foot wooden poles 3x3 " might be cheaper, stuck in the ground(with cement) and attached to wall somehow. 

[Neeranam]

7 hours ago, VocalNeal said:

For the most part you can fix the steel tubes to the concrete pipe wall supports.  Also drill some test holes to see if the wall blocks are solid or hollow. 

 

I am assuming the extra height is for privacy. 

Yes, mostly for privacy. 

If using shera/smartboard, would you put the nice side on the inside or outside? 

 

[vogie]

12 minutes ago, Neeranam said:

Yes, mostly for privacy. 

If using shera/smartboard, would you put the nice side on the inside or outside? 

 

The wall is quite thin at the top but it gradually gets thicker to the bottom, have you tried drilling a few test holes. On the photo you've shown are those rounded concrete stanchions supporting the wall, if so maybe use them for supporting the fence, I would be very reluctant to use wood over here.

Pretty side in does it for me everytime.

 

Edited December 20, 2020 by vogie

[VocalNeal]

49 minutes ago, Neeranam said:

I'm thinking 9/10 foot wooden poles 3x3 " might be cheaper, stuck in the ground(with cement) and attached to wall somehow. 

 

I believe you will find that 1 1/2 x 3/4 steel tubing will be cheaper. If you find the right steel shop they will cut them to length for you. 

Edited December 20, 2020 by VocalNeal

[worgeordie]

55 minutes ago, Neeranam said:

I'm thinking 9/10 foot wooden poles 3x3 " might be cheaper, stuck in the ground(with cement) and attached to wall somehow. 

The termites will like them, use iron

regards Worgeordie

[VocalNeal]

59 minutes ago, Neeranam said:

would you put the nice side on the inside or outside? 

 

Depend from which side you will instal it? From your picture, either way. 

 

Edited December 20, 2020 by VocalNeal

[sometimewoodworker]

2 hours ago, VocalNeal said:

 

I believe you will find that 1 1/2 x 3/4 steel tubing will be cheaper. If you find the right steel shop they will cut them to length for you. 

Every steel shop will cut for a small fee or free, places like Global House, DoHome, Thai Watsadu probably will not

[sometimewoodworker]

3 hours ago, Neeranam said:

I'm thinking 9/10 foot wooden poles 3x3 " might be cheaper, stuck in the ground(with cement) and attached to wall somehow. 

Use steel not wood, and long Carriage  bolts are cheap as chips but use a cross strap under the head or they will pull through.

[VocalNeal]

56 minutes ago, sometimewoodworker said:

Every steel shop will cut for a small fee or free, places like Global House, DoHome, Thai Watsadu probably will not

 

..and at least one place in Bangkok, on Rama 4. ????

[Neeranam]

4 hours ago, sometimewoodworker said:

Use steel not wood, and long Carriage  bolts are cheap as chips but use a cross strap under the head or they will pull through.

I understand the first part re. steel but I'll have to google Carriage bolts and cross straps under the head! 

[sometimewoodworker]

7 hours ago, Neeranam said:

I understand the first part re. steel but I'll have to google Carriage bolts and cross straps under the head! 

Take a look at how old English houses have stopped the walls from bowing out for the principal, they use custom forged rods with a thread on each end often with a cross strap/washer under the nut and heat to expand them, you don’t need to do that as carriage bolts are cheap here and you don’t need a 5metre span.

[Yellowtail]

Steel is the way to go, preferably galvanized . Hat-channel much easier to work with and is much less prone to rust than is tubing.

 

A decent job should look okay from either side. I would put the nicest side out around the front of the house, and the nicest side in around the back. 

[Neeranam]

Had a "chang" round giving a quote. he said the wall was strong enough but to leave a gap between the wood for the wind to get through.

One side of my garden is 10m. He quoted 6,000 baht which I think it high. he said that would be for his team of 3 to work on it. If it is only one day, isn't that a bit high? We are in the city but still in Isarn. I would have to buy the sera/smart wood and steel. 

Gt another guy coming tomorrow. 

[Neeranam]

I would love to do it myself but the time it would take makes it not practical in the money I would lose from not working my normal job.

[sometimewoodworker]

2 hours ago, Neeranam said:

Had a "chang" round giving a quote. he said the wall was strong enough but to leave a gap between the wood for the wind to get through.

One side of my garden is 10m. He quoted 6,000 baht which I think it high. he said that would be for his team of 3 to work on it. If it is only one day, isn't that a bit high? We are in the city but still in Isarn. I would have to buy the sera/smart wood and steel. 

Gt another guy coming tomorrow. 

If that price is high or not very much depends on the design of your fence and fixing methods. As that seems to be not apparent  there’s no way to say if it’s sensible or ridiculously high.

[Neeranam]

11 minutes ago, sometimewoodworker said:

If that price is high or not very much depends on the design of your fence and fixing methods. As that seems to be not apparent  there’s no way to say if it’s sensible or ridiculously high.

He said metal tubing, about half way down the wall and 3 feet above. I never understood when he talked about the types of screws he would use. Also a horizontal tube between the uprights. I need to talk to him again, after the alternative guy gives  quote. 

[sometimewoodworker]

Just now, Neeranam said:

He said metal tubing, about half way down the wall and 3 feet above. I never understood when he talked about the types of screws he would use. Also a horizontal tube between the uprights. I need to talk to him again, after the alternative guy gives  quote. 

That means that you are totally dependent on the wall structure for support. Probably not the design I would choose unless the wall is significantly stronger than you suggested. 
 

That design will add an extra amount of leverage to the wall that could be too much. If the supports go into the earth by at least 50cm that would be safer.

[Neeranam]

3 minutes ago, sometimewoodworker said:

That means that you are totally dependent on the wall structure for support. Probably not the design I would choose unless the wall is significantly stronger than you suggested. 
 

That design will add an extra amount of leverage to the wall that could be too much. If the supports go into the earth by at least 50cm that would be safer.

He said the wall was very strong. I had thought it wasn't due to the narrowness of it. He actually said he wasn't an expert and was willing to do whatever I wanted. I'll suggest that and see his reaction -  thanks.

[sometimewoodworker]

1 hour ago, Neeranam said:

He said the wall was very strong. I had thought it wasn't due to the narrowness of it. He actually said he wasn't an expert and was willing to do whatever I wanted. I'll suggest that and see his reaction -  thanks.

Did you try the push test?

[Yellowtail]

Make sue you know what you're getting. Don't agree to anything without a drawing/sketch  and a bill of materials. Will the tubing be painted or galvanized? 

 

5K a day for a contractor that knows what he's doing and has a truck, tools and a couple workmen to help him  is not much in the scheme of things. Keep in mind, you own the property have to look at it every day, so your focus should be on getting a fence you love.

[bankruatsteve]

10 hours ago, sometimewoodworker said:

he said that would be for his team of 3 to work on it.

He won't be paying his team more than B500/day each.  Go figure.

[bankruatsteve]

Just for compare... we had 33m of fence built a few months ago for B10K labor which included digging out a hedge.  Team of 3-4 took about 1 week including rain delays.  Photos before painting (by my wife).

 

Edited December 23, 2020 by bankruatsteve

[sometimewoodworker]

1 hour ago, Yellowtail said:

Make sue you know what you're getting. Don't agree to anything without a drawing/sketch  and a bill of materials. Will the tubing be painted or galvanized? 

Th OP is supplying materials, so his choice.