SURVEY: Cryptocurrencies -- wave of the future or disaster waiting to happen?

[KhaoNiaw]

4 minutes ago, Sharp said:

In Miami you can now get paid in Bitcoin and pay your taxes with it so its becoming an acceptable payment stream. 

Post a link that shows you can now pay your taxes in Miami in Bitcoin.

[Sharp]

9 minutes ago, KhaoNiaw said:

Post a link that shows you can now pay your taxes in Miami in Bitcoin.

https://www.newsweek.com/miami-passes-resolution-allow-paying-city-workers-bitcoin-attempt-woo-big-tech-1568784

[KhaoNiaw]

9 minutes ago, Sharp said:

https://www.newsweek.com/miami-passes-resolution-allow-paying-city-workers-bitcoin-attempt-woo-big-tech-1568784

 

could ... would

 

You're not actually telling the 100% truth, are you?. 

[Sharp]

1 minute ago, KhaoNiaw said:

 

could ... would

 

You're not actually telling the 100% truth, are you?. 

Apologies sir...I will say it another way my sister called me and she told me they are setting up a system to allow Bitcoin to be used in her state of Miami ..stay tuned !

[impulse]

Why is it mutually exclusive?  Some are the way of the future.  Others will be disasters.  Some will be both.

 

You have to differentiate between "Crypto's" and "Bitcoin" like you'd differentiate between "Energy Traders" and "ENRON".

 

And any time someone uses the term "get in on it", I think ENRON.  Cryptos will have a place in commerce and liquidity.  But Bitcoin is just a gambling mechanism.  Too volatile to use as a substitute for fiat.

 

Edited February 20, 2021 by impulse

[Sharp]

12 minutes ago, impulse said:

Why is it mutually exclusive?

 

You have to differentiate between "Crypto's" and "Bitcoin" like you'd differentiate between "Energy Traders" and "ENRON".

 

And any time someone uses the term "get in on it", I think ENRON.  Cryptos will have a place in commerce and liquidity.  But Bitcoin is just a gambling mechanism.  Too volatile to use as a substitute for fiat.

 

I suppose firstly we will have to see how Mastercard .PayPal factor in the volatility but i will say i personally think the fiat system is in for a rocky road ahead to survive in its present form 

[AlexRich]

In a word, Tulipmania. When rare tulip bulbs were selling in Holland at eye watering prices it appeared perfectly reasonable to most of the people participating. In hindsight, after the market collapsed, the same people asked themselves what they were thinking of? I think crypto currencies have similar qualities.

[Sharp]

https://twitter.com/FrancisSuarez/status/1360069847971954690?s=20

[Stygge]

Bitcoin for now is not really a currency. It´s more like digital gold.
You can´t really use bitcoins for everyday transactions a nd not likely even for bigger transactions.
The cost of every payment is about 15-20 $. Also bitcoin change value to fast for normal transactions.
If a seller wants 500 $ for a purchase and accept the equivalent to that in bitcoin. The minute after the transaction the bitcoin is worth 300 $. The seller is not willing to take that risk. Same with the buyer, He pays the equivalent to 500 $ but the next minute value changed and is now worth 800 $. For normal transactions you are not willing to take that risk/chance.
For now it´s just a fast fluctuating digital gold. Good for investment but not for paying.

[OneMoreFarang]

10 hours ago, Oww said:

You can cash in and out to 'real' money anytime if you know how. Just because you don't know how doesn't mean it's not possible. Like everything in life Bitcoin is an intelligence test. 

I hope you remember that when the exchange rate went downhill and you waited for too long to sell.

[spidermike007]

Crypto is here to stay. Many of the naysayers are investors who just were not sharp enough to see it, when the prices were right. I would never invest in something that was already at its historic peak, though it may still climb in value. I remember first becoming aware of Bitcoin when it was one cent per coin. I remember one of the first guys, who bought a pizza with 7,000 bitcoins. If the guy he sold a pizza to help onto it, he is worth $385,000,000 today. At the time I became aware of it, it was too difficult to buy or exchange. It required alot of programming skill. I think it became easier to trade, once it was in the dollar range. Oh well. Considered it again in 2014, when it was at $230. Wish I would have considered Ethereum. It was at under a dollar in 2016. It is now over $2,000. Just $3,000 would have been a nice return! $6,000,000 worth. Could have, should have. 

 

Now that the big boys are involved, and it has gone mainstream it is here to stay, though it may be volatile. 

[Sharp]

2 hours ago, spidermike007 said:

Crypto is here to stay. Many of the naysayers are investors who just were not sharp enough to see it, when the prices were right. I would never invest in something that was already at its historic peak, though it may still climb in value. I remember first becoming aware of Bitcoin when it was one cent per coin. I remember one of the first guys, who bought a pizza with 7,000 bitcoins. If the guy he sold a pizza to help onto it, he is worth $385,000,000 today. At the time I became aware of it, it was too difficult to buy or exchange. It required alot of programming skill. I think it became easier to trade, once it was in the dollar range. Oh well. Considered it again in 2014, when it was at $230. Wish I would have considered Ethereum. It was at under a dollar in 2016. It is now over $2,000. Just $3,000 would have been a nice return! $6,000,000 worth. Could have, should have. 

 

Now that the big boys are involved, and it has gone mainstream it is here to stay, though it may be volatile. 

Agreed.. 2010 is when I actually spend a few $ on some coins and from there have actually researched quite a bit on it to feel personally happy to hodl them. 

Canada just approved the first ETF s so let's see what the US does. Anyhow each to their own as they say and time will tell.. I Unbelievable or can't believe maybe but look at the last 12 months who would believe? 

[Neeranam]

5 hours ago, spidermike007 said:

Crypto is here to stay. Many of the naysayers are investors who just were not sharp enough to see it, when the prices were right. I would never invest in something that was already at its historic peak, though it may still climb in value. I remember first becoming aware of Bitcoin when it was one cent per coin. I remember one of the first guys, who bought a pizza with 7,000 bitcoins. If the guy he sold a pizza to help onto it, he is worth $385,000,000 today. At the time I became aware of it, it was too difficult to buy or exchange. It required alot of programming skill. I think it became easier to trade, once it was in the dollar range. Oh well. Considered it again in 2014, when it was at $230. Wish I would have considered Ethereum. It was at under a dollar in 2016. It is now over $2,000. Just $3,000 would have been a nice return! $6,000,000 worth. Could have, should have. 

 

Now that the big boys are involved, and it has gone mainstream it is here to stay, though it may be volatile. 

Investing a week or two after the smartest mind in the world, and richest man invested might not be a bad idea. I started buying at 88,000 baht. I'm sure it will be 88,000 dollars in a month. 

Last month,  I did a poll and I was amazed the majority voted to buy gold rather than bitcoin. Must be an age related thing. It was 30k then. Gold has gone down, btc up 90%.

 

 

[Neeranam]

Someone asked about buying a coffee with Bitcoin. 

 

Also, I paid my telephone bill years ago with a crypto, Electroneum. Now, my bills have Omisego on them. 

 

 

 

 

 

[Neeranam]

On 2/18/2021 at 2:17 PM, fdsa said:

 

To get that million worth of Bitcoin you must convert your USD to Bitcoin first, and that's where fees and middle-men appear. And then you would convert it back to fiat, with another fee and middle-man. Considering the average exchange fee of 0.5% you will pay 10'000 USD fee for a 1'000'000 USD transfer in crypto.

This pic says it all:

 

 Recently, I withdrew 1million baht from Bitkub to krungthai bank, fee 20 baht. 

 

I use a crypto debit card worldwide and get 4% back on all payments, just paid for 4 dtac bills for myself and family. 

I also can use first class airport lounges and get free Spotify and Netflix amazon prime. 

Most my money is in polkadot, on kraken, I get 12% per annum interest. 

On crypto.com exchange, I get 20% on CRO. 

 

 

 

Edited February 21, 2021 by Neeranam

[Heng]

I felt the same way about cassette tapes and compact discs (wave of the future AND disaster waiting to happen).  Thank goodness those things are now history, way too stressful. 

Edited February 21, 2021 by Heng

[Blumpie]

The only thing that I am filled with is regret - I remember when bit coin was around 200 bucks thinking I'd never invest in that.

To be honest, with Musk getting on board the chances of it failing have fallen dramatically.  Gold is no longer invested in, bitcoin is.  Will it last?  Big rewards, big risks.  Hats off to people who got rich off it.  Be sure that you are rich and not rich in a value that can turn worthless in a heartbeat.  

[Sharp]

32 minutes ago, Blumpie said:

The only thing that I am filled with is regret - I remember when bit coin was around 200 bucks thinking I'd never invest in that.

To be honest, with Musk getting on board the chances of it failing have fallen dramatically.  Gold is no longer invested in, bitcoin is.  Will it last?  Big rewards, big risks.  Hats off to people who got rich off it.  Be sure that you are rich and not rich in a value that can turn worthless in a heartbeat.  

Regret we all have BUT you may think you are late but NOT! 

Please read the attached with relevant links if you really want to understand Bitcoin and the FULL potential still available to us all' 

Its a 20 minute read that just might change your life .

https://twitter.com/PrestonPysh/status/1300462461888401409?s=20

[fdsa]

17 minutes ago, Sharp said:

Regret we all have BUT you may think you are late but NOT! 

Please read the attached with relevant links if you really want to understand Bitcoin and the FULL potential still available to us all' 

Its a 20 minute read that just might change your life .

https://twitter.com/PrestonPysh/status/1300462461888401409?s=20

 

If there is a whole FULL potential waiting to unleash then why one Bitcoin transaction still takes about an hour to complete, costs about 10 bucks, and spends the comparable amount of electricity as the whole household for a day?
These problems were already known 10 (ten) years ago but still nothing was done to address them. What are Bitcoin developers waiting for? When will they unleash the FULL potential?

If Bitcoin is not an everyday payment method then, but a store of value similar to gold, maybe the FULL potential resides in some different cryptocurrency?

 

So many questions, so few answers...

[Peter Denis]

In order for the Bitcoin exchange-rate to keep on rising (I don't want to use the word 'value'), it continually needs 'new blood' i.e. new entrants pumping the despised fiat-money in the scheme.

Without such constant demand Bitcoin will stop rising. That is because the Bitcoin exchange-rate is determined ONLY by the demand (the combined number/amount of people willing to buy Bitcoin at the current price-level) vs the supply (the combined number/amount of people willing to sell Bitcoin at the current price-level).  When those on the supply-side are convinced that it will keep on rising, they are not inclined to sell their precious digital gold (hence the famous HODLers, not willing to sell their Bitcoin at any price).  That limited supply, drives up the price but obviously there is also a limit to the price-level those that want to buy Bitcoin are willing to pay for it.  Where both sides meet the Bitcoin exchange-rate is determined.

The above is also one of the reasons that Bitcoin-holders are continually making efforts to convince the rest of the world to step into the scheme.  Some are indeed convinced that those not participating are 'missing out' on the fabulous gains it can provide (Everybody Rich), but there is also a fair bit of Self-Interest in those efforts trying to get new entrants with fresh fiat-money in the scheme.  As mentioned higher without 'new blood' the Bitcoin exchange-rate will inevitably decline.  It is the perfect Self-fulfilling Prophecy, when enough people are convinced that it will keep rising (thus triggering demand and restraining supply) the exchange-rate will indeed keep rising.

>> So with large investors now stepping into the scheme and some governments starting to accept Bitcoin for certain purposes and stepping into Bitcoin becoming easy, Bitcoin will keep on rising.  Of course it will not rise to the moon, but the sign of the times are such that everybody currently stepping into Bitcoin will make a hefty profit (paid by those that stepped in last).  When you are not too late when stepping in, it will be very lucrative (that is: if you also step out in time, or at least recuperate your initial 'investment' and keep on speculating on further growth which currently is almost inevitable).  

[Sharp]

And this comment from the Federal Reserve Bank President yesterday'

Regarding whether bitcoin or other cryptocurrencies pose a threat to the U.S. dollar, Bullard stressed that competition is nothing new and has existed for centuries. “It is a currency competition, and investors want a safe haven. They want a stable store of value, and then they want to conduct their investments in that currency,” he described.

[Boomer6969]

Nothing new there

[Sharp]

 

Edited February 22, 2021 by Sharp

[Neeranam]

2 hours ago, Peter Denis said:

In order for the Bitcoin exchange-rate to keep on rising (I don't want to use the word 'value'), it continually needs 'new blood' i.e. new entrants pumping the despised fiat-money in the scheme.

Without such constant demand Bitcoin will stop rising. That is because the Bitcoin exchange-rate is determined ONLY by the demand (the combined number/amount of people willing to buy Bitcoin at the current price-level) vs the supply (the combined number/amount of people willing to sell Bitcoin at the current price-level).  When those on the supply-side are convinced that it will keep on rising, they are not inclined to sell their precious digital gold (hence the famous HODLers, not willing to sell their Bitcoin at any price).  That limited supply, drives up the price but obviously there is also a limit to the price-level those that want to buy Bitcoin are willing to pay for it.  Where both sides meet the Bitcoin exchange-rate is determined.

The above is also one of the reasons that Bitcoin-holders are continually making efforts to convince the rest of the world to step into the scheme.  Some are indeed convinced that those not participating are 'missing out' on the fabulous gains it can provide (Everybody Rich), but there is also a fair bit of Self-Interest in those efforts trying to get new entrants with fresh fiat-money in the scheme.  As mentioned higher without 'new blood' the Bitcoin exchange-rate will inevitably decline.  It is the perfect Self-fulfilling Prophecy, when enough people are convinced that it will keep rising (thus triggering demand and restraining supply) the exchange-rate will indeed keep rising.

>> So with large investors now stepping into the scheme and some governments starting to accept Bitcoin for certain purposes and stepping into Bitcoin becoming easy, Bitcoin will keep on rising.  Of course it will not rise to the moon, but the sign of the times are such that everybody currently stepping into Bitcoin will make a hefty profit (paid by those that stepped in last).  When you are not too late when stepping in, it will be very lucrative (that is: if you also step out in time, or at least recuperate your initial 'investment' and keep on speculating on further growth which currently is almost inevitable).  

Do you have any bitcoin. If not, why? 

[Neeranam]

2 hours ago, Sharp said:

And this comment from the Federal Reserve Bank President yesterday'

Regarding whether bitcoin or other cryptocurrencies pose a threat to the U.S. dollar, Bullard stressed that competition is nothing new and has existed for centuries. “It is a currency competition, and investors want a safe haven. They want a stable store of value, and then they want to conduct their investments in that currency,” he described.

Bitcoin is bigger than the USA. 

[patman30]

On 2/18/2021 at 12:03 PM, Mr Meeseeks said:

CSW is not Satoshi FYI. 

 

He's a fakir. 

i didnt mention any person or any other coin.

At least you know BTC is not Bitcoin,
although it might just be subconciously at the moment????

BitCoin is BitCoin regardless of price or people.????

[patman30]

On 2/22/2021 at 7:51 AM, Peter Denis said:

In order for the Bitcoin exchange-rate to keep on rising (I don't want to use the word 'value'), it continually needs 'new blood'

sounds like a ponzi........

this is not actually true though,
"new blood" would imply "new people" buying
when reality is to pump price
they need new tethers to buy
which are being printed out of thin air at a ridiculous pace
 

[patman30]

On 2/21/2021 at 11:11 PM, fdsa said:

So many questions, so few answers...

BTC is not bitcoin (due to protocol changes)
this will answer many of the questions you may have

BTC was hijacked and crippled
it would take over 40 years for everyone to have just 1 transaction onj BTC
mopst people are too blind to see or do not want to do any research or accept any truth
as they see number go up on BTC they think that must be the winner
BitCoin was never about making fiat profits

 

[fdsa]

9 hours ago, patman30 said:

BTC is not bitcoin (due to protocol changes)
this will answer many of the questions you may have

BTC was hijacked and crippled
it would take over 40 years for everyone to have just 1 transaction onj BTC
mopst people are too blind to see or do not want to do any research or accept any truth
as they see number go up on BTC they think that must be the winner
BitCoin was never about making fiat profits

 

 

Could you elaborate please?

Is there some secret agreement between Chinese mining pools to switch the protocol to a new version capable of a milion transactions per second once BTC price reaches a million USD? Or Bitcoin SV or similar <deleted>fork is the "real" bitcoin which will overtake BTC some day?

Either is hardly believable.

 

What I see is: Bitcoin as "BTC" is slow, expensive, and had no progress in the last several years. Surely there is a Lightning network but its total volume is mere 1000 BTC, LOL. So imho BTC price is pumping only because people (even millionaires (especially millionaires)) are too narrow sighted and know BTC only so they dump their fiats into BTC instead of looking for better alternatives.

Edited February 24, 2021 by fdsa

[patman30]

6 hours ago, fdsa said:

 

Could you elaborate please?

Is there some secret agreement between Chinese mining pools to switch the protocol to a new version capable of a milion transactions per second once BTC price reaches a million USD? Or Bitcoin SV or similar <deleted>fork is the "real" bitcoin which will overtake BTC some day?

Either is hardly believable.

 

What I see is: Bitcoin as "BTC" is slow, expensive, and had no progress in the last several years. Surely there is a Lightning network but its total volume is mere 1000 BTC, LOL. So imho BTC price is pumping only because people (even millionaires (especially millionaires)) are too narrow sighted and know BTC only so they dump their fiats into BTC instead of looking for better alternatives.

"Either is hardly believable." the problem is you do not want to believe the latter so you choose to ignore it.

What you see is bitcoin....... thats where the problem lies
yes BTC is slow etc etc, and LN is a nothing burger and is not bitcoin even if they could get it to work securely

to get better understanding of why price pumps on BTC
you need to look at and understand Tether (USDT)
they are constantly printing 100's of millions literally daily
($5 billion since Feb 8th)

trying to find a link for you to follow Tether grants only
but they have very recently removed the options from Omni explorer
and Tether have switched to issuing on Tron
there are some twitter accounts that show Whale alerts
Whale Alerts: Tether Minted at Treasury

Edited February 25, 2021 by patman30