8 minutes ago, gunderhill said:

Just  putting some perspective  onto things, people  seem  to think these  days that  no one should  die and we all  live forever.

I would maybe have used another example that fits closer to the current virus rather that the Black Death bacteria that was usually spread by fleas.

Yawn

 

Just as Boris is reporting a possible 'third wave' in the UK too

 

The ruling class don't want to give up the power and wealth they've gained promoting this massive overreaction 

29 minutes ago, Bkk Brian said:

Sorry I have no idea what your saying or trying to get across to me

no idea what "ir" saying or trying to get "across to you" ?

I apologize... no dual or binary idea on my side (if there should have a side to cross... i think i'm not engage with that idea, it is not my intention to practice the world like this, for me, there is no border between you and me in the opinion to share, it is not a duck fight intention there).

Which word or part do you failed to understand ? I will be happy to help you to understand and that you help me to be clearer if you really want it to be.

You are very welcome.

25 minutes ago, Bkk Brian said:

I would maybe have used another example that fits closer to the current virus rather that the Black Death bacteria that was usually spread by fleas.

but we should win credibility to just compare what can be really compared... it is interesting to look at the number (all of them) and to compare, effectively.

Just do it.

just 69 cases today

50 minutes ago, spidermike007 said:

 

Incorrect. The AIDS pandemic took out 36 million people between 1981 and today. First identified in Democratic Republic of the Congo in 1976, HIV/AIDS has truly proven itself as a global pandemic, killing more than 36 million people since 1981.

 

The flu pandemic of 1968 took out a million people. A category 2 Flu pandemic sometimes referred to as “the Hong Kong Flu,” the 1968 flu pandemic was caused by the H3N2 strain of the Influenza A virus, a genetic offshoot of the H2N2 subtype.

 

The Asian flu of 1956 took out over 2 million souls. Asian Flu was a pandemic outbreak of Influenza A of the H2N2 subtype, that originated in China in 1956 and lasted until 1958. In its two-year spree, Asian Flu traveled from the Chinese province of Guizhou to Singapore, Hong Kong, and the United States. 

 

Then of course we had the epic Flu pandemic of 1918. Often wrongly referred to as the "Spanish flu". Between 1918 and 1920 a disturbingly deadly outbreak of influenza tore across the globe, infecting over a third of the world’s population and ending the lives of 20 – 50 million people. And over 500 million were infected. 

 

So, it is not like we were unprepared. At least we should not have been. We just recently had the pandemic of 2009, which was quite deadly. While most cases of pandemic H1N1 were mild, globally it is estimated that the 2009 pandemic caused between 100,000–400,000 deaths in the first year alone. 

 

If certain rather non visionary sorts had not dismantled the pandemic offices of the CDC, and ignored most protocols, this might not have been as severe, at least in the US. 

 

https://www.mphonline.org/worst-pandemics-in-history/

 

 

 

 

now, please, do adjust your number and provide the rate in percent f the world population at any time you were talking (so true) about.

It should give us a better idea about what you are talking really about that can be compared.

But what is very new is to add to a kind of little epidemic time, the effect of fear and panic and the lock down, the poverty, the suicide, and all that is the effect of our so nice preparation and governmental choices (under dramatic big international companies influential powered people, so powered than to have more than the PID of a country in the pocket, and this situation is very new in the human history, isn't it ?).

So we should be able to look a bit wisely to be aware about the reality of a complex world interest game as it is and not simplify everything all the time as "peau de chagrin" (or "The Wild Ass's Skin" H de Balzac wrote it and you should read it).

thank you very much for your job to be free to thinking by this way.

 

10 minutes ago, jerolamo said:

now, please, do adjust your number and provide the rate in percent f the world population at any time you were talking (so true) about.

It should give us a better idea about what you are talking really about that can be compared.

But what is very new is to add to a kind of little epidemic time, the effect of fear and panic and the lock down, the poverty, the suicide, and all that is the effect of our so nice preparation and governmental choices (under dramatic big international companies influential powered people, so powered than to have more than the PID of a country in the pocket, and this situation is very new in the human history, isn't it ?).

So we should be able to look a bit wisely to be aware about the reality of a complex world interest game as it is and not simplify everything all the time as "peau de chagrin" (or "The Wild Ass's Skin" H de Balzac wrote it and you should read it).

thank you very much for your job to be free to thinking by this way.

 

 

I do agree with you that there are alot of interests at stake, and that very little of what we are being told about Covid is accurate. In the past there were no lockdowns. This is the first time in history we have experienced near total lockdowns. It is an experiment in insanity, in my opinion, when a nation deliberately chooses to shut down it's own economy. 

 

This is certainly the first time in history (first wave of Covid excluded) that most of the worlds economies were deliberately shut down. Even during all 51 of the major bubonic plagues, between 541AD In Europe and Western Asia, and the last one to happen in China in 1946, the Japanese smallpox plague of AD735, the Mexican smallpox plague of 1519, the massive influenza plague of 1616, which took out an estimated 50% of more, of the local populations in Europe, and North America, the Russian cholera epidemic of 1846, the worldwide flu pandemic of 1889, and of course the infamous Flu pandemic of 1918, which took out an estimated 20-100 million people, ports were locked down, and some isolation was done, but economies were never totally shut down. Makes one wonder what it truly going on. 

 

If anything, the numbers of the past were more significant, than they are today, as the population of the world was far less. 
 

Edited March 24, 20215 yr by spidermike007

21 minutes ago, cyril sneer said:

just 69 cases today

You mean the 34/35 song, no way.

A post with a link to an unapproved video source has been removed. 

Repeat after me: "I believe everything that comes out of Anutin's mouth. He is the cleverest person on earth and has never told a lie or made an inaccurate prediction."

21 hours ago, Chernsarmkhuat said:

Yes Thai people need a test, the Thai man I was on the mini van with going from the airport to our Assigned State Quarantine hotel said he missed the first flight he was booked on. He lived in a remote area of the USA and the test results takes longer. By the time he got to a major center the  72 hours was up. His test was overdue by 3 minutes. He had to be tested again and take a later flight. 

Thai nationals flying back to Thailand are not required by Thai authorities to have a PCR-test, unlike foreigners. This doesn't mean some airlines or some airports will not require one.

Old news, that was yesterday. Today the numbers look much better. Why scare everyone after the fact? 

2 hours ago, jerolamo said:

now, please, do adjust your number and provide the rate in percent f the world population at any time you were talking (so true) about.

1958 Global population was 2.9 billion in 1968 it was 3.5 billion today is about 7.8 billion so in 1958 the percentage of deaths from the flu was 0.034% in 1968 the percentage of deaths from flu was 0.028% and today the percantage of deaths from covid are 0.035% so not a huge difference but a small or even similar number in percentage terms and certainly not twice as bad or even ten times as bad as has been suggest on this forum during the pandemic.

21 hours ago, KhunMorris said:

 

The Thai people nor the ex pat  community simply don't want the virus here. We don't have universal health care. Please respect that.

 

Sincerely 

 

Morris 

You seem to be representing both the expat and the Thai community.Very good of you,how can you be both?You are Thai right?

Why not just pick one of  the above ,it gives you more credibility .

9 hours ago, gunderhill said:

A  2%  death rate I disagree 

Black Death killed about half of all Londoners; from 1347 to 1351, it killed between 30% and 60% of all Europeans.

I'm just guessing; but, there is a possibility that medicine has advanced a little in the 670 years that have passed between 1351 and 2021.  I could be wrong; but, I doubt it. 

 

Gotta love the news media - especially the headlines

Thailand population - 69.63 million

C19 cases - 28,277

Percentage - 0.0406

 

Hysteria Rules !

On 3/23/2021 at 2:54 PM, Sheryl said:

IDC was an accident waiting to happen. Just as the cramped lodgings and work conditions of migrant workers in the seafood industry were.

 

Apparently 297 out of the 337 cases were at IDCs. So non-IDC cases just 40. Plus the 46 found on contact tracing = 86 cases of local transmission not counting the IDC outbreaks. In line with recent trends.

 

 

As with other trends in recent Outbreaks, Thais seem to be immune to this Covid thing.

Not a single guard, Canteen Cook or Cleaner has contracted the Virus in IDC

Amazing Thailand

9 hours ago, FarFlungFalang said:

The WHO said they were useless and so did  Dr Fauci that's good enough for me.I don't care that they did a back flip latter possibly after investing in mask manufacturing companies who knows.All the studies say stuff like the following quote from the link you provided

"A total of 21 studies met our inclusion criteria. Meta-analyses suggest that mask use provided a significant protective effect"

See that? Meta-analysis "suggest" it doesn't say proves only suggests or "indicates" or "possibly".If you bother to actually read these so called studies you realise that most just pick numbers from data collected about infections but didn't actually do a randomised double blind study did they?Why not?Because they are unethical.So it remains unproven how or if masks are effective. 

You really don't understand the language of science do you? Few studies will ever say "these data prove the theory" because there are no absolutes when it comes to human health.

 

And the fact that you think Fauci changed his mind on masks because he possibly invested in mask manufacturing proves how tight your tinfoil hat is. He's a scientist and there wasn't science to support wearing masks at that point. When there was evidence, he changed his stance because that's what scientists do; they follow the science.

https://www.reuters.com/article/uk-factcheck-fauci-outdated-video-masks-idUSKBN26T2TR

 

And the WHO did not say masks were unnecessary.

https://www.reuters.com/article/uk-factcheck-masks-idUSKBN29X2S5

 

 

Edited March 24, 20215 yr by DJBenz

20 hours ago, Bkk Brian said:

giving happiness to the people,

Have I missed something? When did that happen?

Maybe being unemployed and hungry with no benefits to help is a new kind of happiness.

48 minutes ago, Cake Monster said:

As with other trends in recent Outbreaks, Thais seem to be immune to this Covid thing.

Not a single guard, Canteen Cook or Cleaner has contracted the Virus in IDC

Amazing Thailand

Yes. How is this possible?

1 hour ago, Cake Monster said:

As with other trends in recent Outbreaks, Thais seem to be immune to this Covid thing.

Not a single guard, Canteen Cook or Cleaner has contracted the Virus in IDC

Amazing Thailand

 

I think results of testing of Thai staff of IDCs is pending. Quite likely there will be some positives.

A post with a link to an unrecognized source has been removed as well as a reply. 

Edited March 24, 20215 yr by metisdead

4 hours ago, FarFlungFalang said:

1958 Global population was 2.9 billion in 1968 it was 3.5 billion today is about 7.8 billion so in 1958 the percentage of deaths from the flu was 0.034% in 1968 the percentage of deaths from flu was 0.028% and today the percantage of deaths from covid are 0.035% so not a huge difference but a small or even similar number in percentage terms and certainly not twice as bad or even ten times as bad as has been suggest on this forum during the pandemic.

correct.

I would like everybody to be precise with numbers and also with words used that it should help us to have a more constructive opinion to share.

 

For example, when mass media said "x new cases", but in fact it is new positive tested, it is very different than real "new cases".

 

Also (but this is in my country only, i don't know other), when they said in TV and news papers: "x new death from COVID", in fact on the official police paper declaration acts, for most of them in this account, there is clearly writing: "die for unknown reason, but suspected to be covid due to the sanitary situation". That is very different (and hospital win money from subventions when someone die because of suspected of covid). So, in french for example, we can have a proof that the number estimated by the news papers and the TV news are wrong (full fake) and over estimated. And when you go to see INSEE (a french and official national organism to count things reference source) number of death by year, you can clearly see that... yes, it was wrong.

 

In Thailand now, last year, someone we know as a neighborhood neighbor (47 years old) die (in a week). I was surprise because the man, even if he was drinking sometimes (to much sometimes but enough to be maybe an alcoholic), was in apparent good condition. I asked my wife how does he die (the symptoms)... and was thinking a problem with his liver... she told me that he has difficulties to breath, can not eat easy, no taste for food, headache, then at the end, the last day, blood in the mooth, no breath, and die.

I tell her:

_"it looks like strong sars-cov-2 virus charge to become a covid case without any treatment, does he has a treatment ?",

_she answered: "paracetamol".

_"Does he has been tested ?"

_"no, he no had money for that" (and he is not farang, so...)

well... you can be free to conclude what ever you want from there, we will never know the real situation as  long as the situation will not become really evident (as it is in a strong virus killer epidemic is, there is no more doubt around).

3 hours ago, DJBenz said:

You really don't understand the language of science do you? Few studies will ever say "these data prove the theory" because there are no absolutes when it comes to human health.

 

And the fact that you think Fauci changed his mind on masks because he possibly invested in mask manufacturing proves how tight your tinfoil hat is. He's a scientist and there wasn't science to support wearing masks at that point. When there was evidence, he changed his stance because that's what scientists do; they follow the science.

https://www.reuters.com/article/uk-factcheck-fauci-outdated-video-masks-idUSKBN26T2TR

 

And the WHO did not say masks were unnecessary.

https://www.reuters.com/article/uk-factcheck-masks-idUSKBN29X2S5

 

 

So are you suggesting that masks have not been "proven" to be significantly effective in reducing the spread of the coronavirus from these studies and that it's only that the data indicates or suggests that they are significantly effective,and with the presentation of an experiment that proves wether they or are not effective it will be undecided and that wearing masks is really erring on the side of caution without conclusive proof that they work effectively?If you say there are no absolutes in human health I would only have to find one absolute in human health to prove you wrong.So what do you mean precisely when you say " because there are no absolutes when it comes to human health."

Many doctors are also businessmen so if they invest in the area of their expertise to maximise they profits it would be quite natural and no tin foil hat or conspiracy theory would be required the imagine that occurring.There is a doctor in my area that I've met that is enormously wealthy from doing exactly that.

Testing is a waste of time.

Blanket vaccination in Thailand is now a priority.

2 minutes ago, FarFlungFalang said:

So are you suggesting that masks have not been "proven" to be significantly effective in reducing the spread of the coronavirus from these studies and that it's only that the data indicates or suggests that they are significantly effective,and with the presentation of an experiment that proves wether they or are not effective it will be undecided and that wearing masks is really erring on the side of caution without conclusive proof that they work effectively?If you say there are no absolutes in human health I would only have to find one absolute in human health to prove you wrong.So what do you mean precisely when you say " because there are no absolutes when it comes to human health."

Your inability to grasp basic scientific consensus doesn't validate your anti-mask pseudoscience. I provided links to systematic reviews of in excess of 200 studies that support mask usage to reduce the spread of COVID.

 

On the other hand you posted a "Masks don't work" link from a professor (Denis Rancourt) whose study was removed from Researchgate for being demonstrably wrong, which just illustrates how you will hang onto any information, however suspect, that supports your confirmation bias.

 

https://www.researchgate.net/publication/343263629_A_Complete_Debunking_of_Denis_Rancourt's_Mask_Don't_Work

 

https://www.psychologytoday.com/gb/blog/logical-take/202007/yes-masks-work-debunking-the-pseudoscience

3 hours ago, DJBenz said:

You really don't understand the language of science do you? Few studies will ever say "these data prove the theory" because there are no absolutes when it comes to human health.

 

And the fact that you think Fauci changed his mind on masks because he possibly invested in mask manufacturing proves how tight your tinfoil hat is. He's a scientist and there wasn't science to support wearing masks at that point. When there was evidence, he changed his stance because that's what scientists do; they follow the science.

https://www.reuters.com/article/uk-factcheck-fauci-outdated-video-masks-idUSKBN26T2TR

 

And the WHO did not say masks were unnecessary.

https://www.reuters.com/article/uk-factcheck-masks-idUSKBN29X2S5

 

 

yes i agree that some scientist follow the science.

You can also agree the fact that to get a contract to study something on a subject (in science too), you also need an invest source (and there is no more place for public invest source on this point, or only a little place with lower budget in some rare countries who escape the free market point of new God).

So, because a human need to work for win money (scientist or not), you can also understand how (the link) there is also a lot of scientist who follow the invest interest in priority number one (they have to if they want to eat something, they don't have any power without an invest).

Do you deny this fact ? It is a real big problem actually to be judge and party interested in the same time.

It was a so big problem in the past that the law sentences were harder than this day as it becomes something current to be judge and party interested... (you can call this: corrupted)

It is also, for many countries, a problem with the law (many laws recognize this as a huge problem, but still with evidences proof, no trail...).

So you can understand why the credibility of many are down to zero for the most instructed and citizen part of the world wide population, and much more dependently with the origin of the information is coming from.

On 3/23/2021 at 2:36 PM, brewsterbudgen said:

Hopefully the government won't be panicked into having another lockdown! If it wasn't for social media hyperbolizing the situation, few would be bothered and life could go on as normal.

 

   Big Bosses , of social media / World News ..

    Has vast control  of our,  Goverments stratergy .

    We , the fodder just do as we are told , democratically .

2 minutes ago, jerolamo said:

So, because a human need to work for win money (scientist or not), you can also understand how (the link) there is also a lot of scientist who follow the invest interest in priority number one (they have to if they want to eat something, they don't have any power without an invest).

Do you deny this fact ? It is a real big problem actually to be judge and party interested in the same time.

You write in such an obtuse manner it is difficult to fully understand your points, but to address the above that is the precise point of peer-review. Any scientist submitting to a scientific journal of any merit must declare any conflicts of interest, funding, links to interested parties etc.

 

When the study is peer-reviewed this can be taken into account and the review made accordingly, based on the merits of the study - not the funding. Well reviewed studies will be used by others and will further research, poorly reviewed studies tend to go nowhere.

25 minutes ago, DJBenz said:

Your inability to grasp basic scientific consensus doesn't validate your anti-mask pseudoscience. I provided links to systematic reviews of in excess of 200 studies that support mask usage to reduce the spread of COVID.

Sorry I'm having trouble finding the link you posted to the 200 systematic reviews you mentioned.