Story Of My Thai Citizenship Application

[thunder18]

Hi, what is the best way to close the existing visa without getting any "unusual" stamps and handwritings (such as "Visa is cancelled due to obtaining Thai citizenship", mentioned by the previous posters) on my foreign passport? I want to keep my foreign passport as clean as possible. :)

 

Will leaving the country as foreigner and come back as Thai work for this purpose? Say, heading to Cambodia by land, leave Thailand as foreigner (=visa is closed, body is left Thailand), swap the passport to Thai and re-enter to Thailand as Thai next minute? Will physical entering to Cambodia be required, or I may just come across the Thai passport check booth, swap the passports in my pockets and re-enter as Thai (without doing any entry to Cambodia)? Or will that be better to fly to Cambodia, but not cross by land?

 

Thanks.

[GarryP]

1 minute ago, thunder18 said:

Hi, what is the best way to close the existing visa without getting any "unusual" stamps and handwritings (such as "Visa is cancelled due to obtaining Thai citizenship", mentioned by the previous posters) on my foreign passport? I want to keep my foreign passport as clean as possible. :)

 

Will leaving the country as foreigner and come back as Thai work for this purpose? Say, heading to Cambodia by land, leave Thailand as foreigner (=visa is closed, body is left Thailand), swap the passport to Thai and re-enter to Thailand as Thai next minute? Will physical entering to Cambodia be required, or I may just come across the Thai passport check booth, swap the passports in my pockets and re-enter as Thai (without doing any entry to Cambodia)? Or will that be better to fly to Cambodia, but not cross by land?

 

Thanks.

I would be very hesitant to depart using my foreign passport. There have been a number of posts on this subject. But my understanding of this is that once you gain citizenship, if you use your foreign passport in Thailand, in theory you could have your Thai citizenship revoked. I realize that the risk would be very small, but why risk it at all after all you have been through to get Thai citizenship in the first place. 

[thunder18]

11 minutes ago, GarryP said:

my understanding of this is that once you gain citizenship, if you use your foreign passport in Thailand, in theory you could have your Thai citizenship revoked

I have no plans to use foreign passport in Thailand once I obtain Thai citizenship (it is in progress at the moment). My question was about closing the existing visa in foreign passport and use only Thai ID while in Thailand. I simply want to close the visa without collecting any "strange" stamps on my foreign passport.

Will the scenario (described in my previous post) work?

 

 

[Big Guns]

I'm in the same situation. I simply went to immigration this week and they wrote in my passport that I'm now a Thai citizen. As Garry P stated if you use your foreign passport to leave Thailand you are breaking the rules of being a Thai citizen so its best not to do that. Your best solution is to go to immigration and get them to write in your passport as I and many others have done.

[thunder18]

1 minute ago, Big Guns said:

went to immigration this week and they wrote in my passport that I'm now a Thai citizen. As Garry P stated if you use your foreign passport to leave Thailand you are breaking the rules of being a Thai citizen so its best not to do that.

Frankly speaking, I do not think that [being a foreigner entering Thailand earlier before] leaving Thailand as foreigner will break Thai laws on this. I may simply inform them that yes, I am closing the existing visa by leaving the country - it is common way of closing/changing the visas, and the only entering stamp and arrival card are on my foreign passport, thus I am leaving with it to have the loop closed. Being prohibited to use foreign pasport while leaving via checkpoint - I may say that I am prohibited to use it while visiting to the immigration on Thai soil, too.... :)

However, these are just my speculations. Would be interesting to read the official requirements and the process steps, if there is any.

[GabbaGabbaHey]

41 minutes ago, thunder18 said:

I have no plans to use foreign passport in Thailand once I obtain Thai citizenship (it is in progress at the moment). My question was about closing the existing visa in foreign passport and use only Thai ID while in Thailand. I simply want to close the visa without collecting any "strange" stamps on my foreign passport.

Will the scenario (described in my previous post) work?

 

 

You could get the strange stamp, renew your foreign passport and have the previous one lost. No?

[thunder18]

1 minute ago, GabbaGabbaHey said:

You could get the strange stamp, renew your foreign passport and have the previous one lost. No?

To have my foreign passport be renewed I will have to fly to my homecountry and request it while in there, wait and get the new passport, then fly back to here. There is no service to request it remotely and have it be sent to me via mail. All will take around a month abroad or so.

 

And then the 2nd question will arise: how can I enter back to Thailand as Thai, if I won't have any departure stamps in Thai passport (I shall leave Thailand as foreigner to have Thai visa closed, so the departure stamp will be in the foreign passport)? Will they accept a Thai person coming back to Thailand from nowhere, with new and totally-blank passport? As per Thai immigration on the checkpoint - this Thai person will have no records of departures and so still be in Thailand, but now coming from abroad?? :)

 

Questions. Lots of questions...

[GarryP]

8 minutes ago, thunder18 said:

To have my foreign passport be renewed I will have to fly to my homecountry and request it while in there, wait and get the new passport, then fly back to here. There is no service to request it remotely and have it be sent to me via mail. All will take around a month abroad or so.

 

And then the 2nd question will arise: how can I enter back to Thailand as Thai, if I won't have any departure stamps in Thai passport (I shall leave Thailand as foreigner to have Thai visa closed, so the departure stamp will be in the foreign passport)? Will they accept a Thai person coming back to Thailand from nowhere, with new and totally-blank passport? As per Thai immigration on the checkpoint - this Thai person will have no records of departures and so still be in Thailand, but now coming from abroad?? :)

 

Questions. Lots of questions...

I don't understand the problem. When I visited my father last year, I simply left Thailand on my Thai passport and returned on the same passport. 

 

You could just not bother cancelling your current visa (the risk would be small and you could plead ignorance, i.e. that you did not know it was required). Go get a Thai passport and leave Thailand on that. Then there would be no strange stamps/writing in your home country passport. You should avoid using your foreign passport while in Thailand and at the border anyway.   

[aidenai]

1 hour ago, thunder18 said:

Will leaving the country as foreigner and come back as Thai work for this purpose? Say, heading to Cambodia by land, leave Thailand as foreigner (=visa is closed, body is left Thailand), swap the passport to Thai and re-enter to Thailand as Thai next minute?

I read somewhere on here that this won't work on land borders as your Thai passport hasn't been stamped-in at the Cambodian side. Therefore you can't get a stamped-out. By air the process seems to work.

[thunder18]

3 hours ago, GarryP said:

I simply left Thailand on my Thai passport and returned on the same passport. 

My question was about leaving with foreign passport and return with Thai one.

 

3 hours ago, GarryP said:

You should avoid using your foreign passport while in Thailand and at the border anyway.  

Yes, I know that.

But what will be the risks to use it just once - to leave the country on that (closing the visa and all that), and come back as Thai (armed with thai passport only)? That was my question. They won't bother to catch (and depart?) the person that is already departing by himself, no? :)

 

3 hours ago, aidenai said:

I read somewhere on here that this won't work on land borders as your Thai passport hasn't been stamped-in at the Cambodian side. Therefore you can't get a stamped-out. By air the process seems to work.

Noted. Will try air then. With AirAsia it is even cheaper than land ride.... :)

Will there be any questions asked on arrival, such as "Where is your point/stamp of departure? What flight have you arrived on?", if I just present them the blank Thai passport once arrived to Cambodia? They won't even able to find this Thai person (Thai passport) on the passenger's list, as I will be boarding as foreigner (foreign passport will be well hidden at that time).

Sorry, not much experience with all of this yet.....

 

Edited November 15, 2017 by thunder18
spella

[skyaslimit]

Applying as a PR although having a Thai family, do I still need a criminal clearance certificate from my embassy? (I have submitted one when applied for the PR)

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[GarryP]

5 minutes ago, thunder18 said:

My question was about leaving with foreign passport and return with Thai one.

 

Yes, I know that.

But what will be the risks to use it just once - to leave the country on that (closing the visa and all that), and come back as Thai (armed with thai passport only)? That was my question. They won't bother to catch (and depart?) the person that is already departing by himself, no? :)

 

Noted. Will try air then. With AirAsia it is even cheaper than land ride.... :)

Will there be any questions asked on arrival, such as "Where is your point/stamp of departure? What flight have you arrived on?", if I just present them the blank Thai passport once arrived to Cambodia? They won't even able to find this Thai person (Thai passport) on the passenger's list, as I will be boarding as foreigner (foreign passport will be well hidden at that time).

Sorry, not much experience with all of this yet.....

 

Why do you have to leave on a foreign passport? Why can't you leave on your Thai one? 

[Mattd]

3 minutes ago, thunder18 said:

My question was about leaving with foreign passport and return with Thai one.

The one thing that could possibly be a problem here is when entering Thailand on a new unused Thai passport, if this passport was issued in Thailand by MFA, then there is a possibility that it may not work on the e-gates, due to there being no exit registered on the passport.

If that was the case and you had to go to a manned immigration desk, then they may question why this is so and how did you exit Thailand in the first place, why take the risk if you do not have to?

I would imagine that the percentage of Naturalised Thai's that go through the airports is low, so in itself could attract attention.

[thunder18]

Just now, GarryP said:

Why do you have to leave on a foreign passport? Why can't you leave on your Thai one? 

Because I would like to close the existing visa, stamped on foreign passport. It was suggested here to close it rather to ignore and keep it.

To have it closed without "strange" stamps that Bkk Immigration is putting on the foreign passport - I am thinking of the way to close it by leaving the country (as foreigner), and re-enter back to Thailand as Thai. This way I will "peacefully" close it with a common departure stamp only.

[NewlyMintedThai]

You close the existing visa with immigration at Chaengwattana after you receive your Thai nationality. Not by going out on your foreign passport and coming back on a new Thai one — I would not advise doing that.

 

 

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[thunder18]

2 minutes ago, Mattd said:

you had to go to a manned immigration desk, then they may question why this is so and how did you exit Thailand in the first place, why take the risk if you do not have to?

I would imagine that the percentage of Naturalised Thai's that go through the airports is low, so in itself could attract attention.

Will the true explanation of "I left with foreign passport, have travelling a bit, closed foreign passport while up there, and now coming back home as Thai" work in this case? They have to accept a Thai person back to Thailand after all the questions, I assume. :)

 

I have experience where I swapped my old passport to new one (same nationality, just different books) while in between of 2 countries, being crossed by land. Presented blank unused passport on arrival, stopped right there and asked about departure stamp, displayed that on my old passport - no further questions asked, visa granted on new unused passport, and wecomed into the country. But that was for the 2 same-citizenship books, not dual.

 

There are dozens of dual-citizenship persons around the globe - how do they swap their passports while in transit?

 

 

 

[thunder18]

8 minutes ago, NewlyMintedThai said:

You close the existing visa with immigration at Chaengwattana after you receive your Thai nationality

They stamp the foreign passport with their "Visa closed due to obtaining thai nationality" stamp, as it was said here.

I am trying to avoid this stamp.

[NewlyMintedThai]

The matter is not swapping passports. I do that all the time. The matter is using your original nationality in Thailand after being naturalized — which is expressly forbidden. Just go to immigration and get it closed out. Why potentially make problems for yourself?


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[GabbaGabbaHey]

19 minutes ago, skyaslimit said:

Applying as a PR although having a Thai family, do I still need a criminal clearance certificate from my embassy? (I have submitted one when applied for the PR)

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Normally yes, since I'm in that exact category and I have been asked for it about two months ago (Note you don't need to prepare in advance, the request will be -or not- in the set of letters you get on your interview day).

[thunder18]

1 minute ago, NewlyMintedThai said:

Just go to immigration and get it closed out. Why potentially make problems for yourself?

 

[NewlyMintedThai]

Well, then in my opinion you’re taking a big risk. You’ll have to decide if it’s worth it or not.


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[skyaslimit]

Really? I have never left Thailand after being a PR, so how could I could be involved in any criminal activity abroad?

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[skyaslimit]

Normally yes, since I'm in that exact category and I have been asked for it about two months ago (Note you don't need to prepare in advance, the request will be -or not- in the set of letters you get on your interview day).

Really? I have never left Thailand after being a PR, so how could I could be involved in any criminal activity abroad?

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[NewlyMintedThai]

Playing logic games isn’t going to get you out of the requirement. If you want to be a Thai citizen, you are going to have to jump through the hoops and get all the boxes ticked. That’s all there is to it.


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[thunder18]

8 minutes ago, NewlyMintedThai said:

Well, then in my opinion you’re taking a big risk. You’ll have to decide if it’s worth it or not.

Is there any way to close visa [at Immigration Chaeng Wattana] without being stamped on foreign passport?

They can stamp their common "visa closed/used/cancelled" stamps - I am OK with that, but how to avoid the stamp that says "...obtained thai nationality"? Is that stamp in Thai or English?

Edited November 15, 2017 by thunder18

[GarryP]

22 minutes ago, thunder18 said:

Because I would like to close the existing visa, stamped on foreign passport. It was suggested here to close it rather to ignore and keep it.

To have it closed without "strange" stamps that Bkk Immigration is putting on the foreign passport - I am thinking of the way to close it by leaving the country (as foreigner), and re-enter back to Thailand as Thai. This way I will "peacefully" close it with a common departure stamp only.

But then what you are doing is wrong. 

 

As I said before, simply not reporting to have your visa cancelled would pose very little risk and is not necessarily wrong (you could plead ignorance as  I do not believe it is written anywhere that you actually have to cancel your visa, although it appears to be  common practice). However, leaving Thailand on a foreign passport when you are Thai is definitely wrong (whether or not you are ultimately caught out). 

 

Think about it. Are they going to arrest you for overstaying your visa, when you are already a Thai citizen? No. You may get asked why you didn't cancel your visa, at which time you could simply answer that you did not know you had to. If they tell you to cancel your visa at that time because it is no longer valid, you simply answer that it is not possible to do so as you no longer have that passport in your possession. You have done nothing illegal and you get to keep your home passport clean.    

[thunder18]

8 minutes ago, GarryP said:

simply not reporting to have your visa cancelled would pose very little risk

Yes. I am taking it as an option. :)

So far no one pointing to the official requirements and/or procedure of closing the visa due to obtaining Thai nationality. Is there any official pages related to the process?

 

8 minutes ago, GarryP said:

Are they going to arrest you for overstaying your visa, when you are already a Thai citizen? No.

There will be a risk if I ever decide to enter Thailand as a holder of the passport of my current nationality (I have no plans to cancel my current citizenship). Then there will be problems on arrival - with all the overstay, missed 90-days reports and all of that sht. :)

So better to have it properly closed. That is the plan.

 

Edited November 15, 2017 by thunder18

[NewlyMintedThai]

You should not consider reentering Thailand on your original passport, or ever using it in some other official capacity in Thailand ever again. There are very few specific rules which might result in the revocation of your Thai citizenship...this is one of them.


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[NewlyMintedThai]

By the way, I just looked at my old original passport and could find no stamp indicating that I had adopted Thai citizenship. The cancellation appears to have been done in immigration’s database only. This was seven years ago, mind you.


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[thunder18]

3 minutes ago, NewlyMintedThai said:

You should not consider reentering Thailand on your original passport, or ever using it in some other official capacity in Thailand ever again. There are very few specific rules which might result in the revocation of your Thai citizenship...this is one of them.

Yes, informed that. However no one knows the future. This rule may get void tomorrow, or I may re-decide entering next day, or anything else....it may or may not happen in the future. No one knows. Tomorrow only will tell.

 

However the overstayed visa linked to my original name/foreign passport will lay in their database records forever, and there will be no way to change that fact once it gets "overstayed" just by not being closed properly. Just think about it - if this fact may pop up in the next 20...30 years by any kind of those far future rules...

So the plan is to have it closed once I get my thai ID issued.