Office Renovations And Outfitting In Bkk

[anthonyo]

hello,

i have recently leased a 5 story building here in bangkok. it needs a lot of renovations and i'm writing to see if anybody can recommend the following people...

• laborers to break down some walls and clean out the building to get it ready for painting.
  
• painter
  
• tiler
  
• plumber
  
• electrician
  

we are located on samsen road near ko san...

any ball park prices would be appreciated ... i mean how much should we pay each per hour?

also does anybody know sources of cheap good quality office furniture?

or even better a carpenter... somebody who can make office desks...

finally, does anyone have any advise to someone who has never done anything like this before?... I want to get things done as quickly as possible...

Best wishes,

Tony

[billaaa777]

I will try to help you a little before the so called experts ring in with their advice. I renovate a lot of condos in Pattaya, so I can’t help you out in Bangkok.

You are not going to be able to hire the individual workers nor are you going to want to. Try and find yourself an English speaking general contractor, which could be a Thai or expact. Check on some of their past jobs and see if they are qualified to do the work they are quoting you on. In other words, don’t hire a guy that builds furniture to knock down your walls and build your bathrooms.

All the Thai contractors will tell you they can do everything and then attempt to go find the cheapest guys they can to do the job.

Next don’t quote the job out as one project, but break it down. In your case, maybe by each floor or demolition, electrical, plumbing, etc. Set up a payment schedule based on completed work. Avoid making a big deposit, but they will need to buy supplies and materials when a job is started so plan on paying a little up front. Check on you job daily, and pay accordingly. Try to select and buy as many of the materials you can yourself. Such as the tiles, doors, etc. You are not going to know what is required to do the plumbing or electrical work, so let them do it. If you let them select the tiles, they are going to get the cheapest crap they can find, so be careful.

Thai’s are not the best at managing money. What I do and it has worked really well, is after the negotiating process has been completed I will print out a detailed spreadsheet showing payments for each portion of the job and the requirements for that section of the job. I will keep one copy and give another to the contractor. Then as the complete a section of the job I will pay them, and we will both sign each others copy of the payment schedule.

Most contractors have payroll on Friday, but some pay everyday. So you are going to need to pay them even if the entire portion of that part of the job is not completed. If 50% of the job is completed, then pay them 40%. Always keep a little of their money in your pocket until the entire job is completed. There are always going to be small problems at the end that need to be fixed and if you have paid them everything it is quite difficult to get them to come back and make those corrections.

You should be able to hire one contractor for everything you have listed. You probably need some kind of wood work done, for the doors, molding, cabinets, etc. I would look for somebody else that specializes in that field.

Good luck, hope this helps a little.

[quiksilva]

I think you are best off appointing a professional project manager to take care of all this for you, unless this is a home.

If you are in business do you really want to be spending your time managing contractors, dealing with health and safety, design issues, supply, labour, etc or making money doing what you do best? What is the cost vs benefit to your firm?

Yes yes I know some of the other views here and many will say you can save money if you do it yourself and perhaps you can (if you get it right) but if you have a business to run, you are likely to make more money concentrating on that as opposed to any savings you might make doing this project yourself.

PM if you want a list of firms I typically recommend to my clients.

[wanwipa]

Hello Tony,

This is Wan, from Bkk. I'm and interior designer. As now I'm working on a small project for my ex-bf, he's from Finland and soon will start a company in Thailand. Recently he bough a condo in Rayong and I do the renovation for the room. Build new kitchen, make new toilet, new tile, wall paint, new home furniture, make new wall and ceiling. The work is still in process. I may help you for the whole project or atlease give you some advise. I can send you sample pictures of the work or more that may help to run quick. Can contact me via e-mail. Thanks. Wan/

[Arkady]

I will try to help you a little before the so called experts ring in with their advice. I renovate a lot of condos in Pattaya, so I can’t help you out in Bangkok.

You are not going to be able to hire the individual workers nor are you going to want to. Try and find yourself an English speaking general contractor, which could be a Thai or expact. Check on some of their past jobs and see if they are qualified to do the work they are quoting you on. In other words, don’t hire a guy that builds furniture to knock down your walls and build your bathrooms.

All the Thai contractors will tell you they can do everything and then attempt to go find the cheapest guys they can to do the job.

Next don’t quote the job out as one project, but break it down. In your case, maybe by each floor or demolition, electrical, plumbing, etc. Set up a payment schedule based on completed work. Avoid making a big deposit, but they will need to buy supplies and materials when a job is started so plan on paying a little up front. Check on you job daily, and pay accordingly. Try to select and buy as many of the materials you can yourself. Such as the tiles, doors, etc. You are not going to know what is required to do the plumbing or electrical work, so let them do it. If you let them select the tiles, they are going to get the cheapest crap they can find, so be careful.

Thai’s are not the best at managing money. What I do and it has worked really well, is after the negotiating process has been completed I will print out a detailed spreadsheet showing payments for each portion of the job and the requirements for that section of the job. I will keep one copy and give another to the contractor. Then as the complete a section of the job I will pay them, and we will both sign each others copy of the payment schedule.

Most contractors have payroll on Friday, but some pay everyday. So you are going to need to pay them even if the entire portion of that part of the job is not completed. If 50% of the job is completed, then pay them 40%. Always keep a little of their money in your pocket until the entire job is completed. There are always going to be small problems at the end that need to be fixed and if you have paid them everything it is quite difficult to get them to come back and make those corrections.

You should be able to hire one contractor for everything you have listed. You probably need some kind of wood work done, for the doors, molding, cabinets, etc. I would look for somebody else that specializes in that field.

Good luck, hope this helps a little.

This is excellent advice. I have recently renovated a 6 storey building using contractors recommended by one of the partners in the business and they were a complete nightmare. The usual tactic is to get a lot of workers on the job for the first few days to show impressive progress and then start trying to accelerate the payment schedule using all kinds of bogus excuses. Once they are happy with their advance payments they will send most of the workers on to another job to repeat the some process. If they are not happy with their advance payments, they will bombard you with calls demanding money to buy materials or pay workers who have threatened to walk off the job etc, knowing that you want it finished as soon as possible. Often the reality is that they need cash to pay off debts that are unrelated to your job. Many are not capable of finishing interiors to an acceptable standard and often don't hang around to finish the the job and get the final payment. They know it is hard to collect the last 10% either because their work is shoddy and/or late or because Thai Chinese customers are just looking for any excuse to save money. Frequently you have to find another contractor to finish the job and repair damage done by the original one.

I would agree that you should separate the price quotation into materials, labour and profit and buy materials yourself for major items or give the exact specification and cost. I would agree that better educated contractors that can speak English will often produce better results for a better price and are more likely to be on time in the end, although hole in wall operators may appear cheaper on the surface. However, some of them just do a Slick Willy presentation in English but cannot deliver the goods.

I would avoid contractors who rely totally on subcontractors and don't have their own labour. They have no control over the quality of work and frequently get into quarrels about money with their subcontractors. Subcontracting specialist jobs is OK. I would also insist on a proper contact for a largish job.