The Constitutional Tribunal Disbands Thai Rak Thai - Election cheating

[sriracha john]

oops.... Sorry, Sudarat... perhaps I spoke too soon... you may have "other" things to do to occupy your time in the near future:

Politician implicated in Bt900-million computer project scandal

An investigation into the corruption scandal surrounding the Public Health Ministry's Bt900million computer procurement has implicated a politician who was now stripped of electoral rights, Deputy Public Health Minister Vallop Thaineua disclosed Tuesday.

He declined to identify that politician by name.

"But we have already forwarded the case to the National Counter Corruption Commission (NCCC)," Vallop said.

- The Nation

[Jai Dee]

EC says TRT members not charged by court may request usage of original TRT name in new party

The Election Commission (EC) of Thailand indicates that members of the Thai Rak Thai Party who have not had their political rights revoked may appeal for the establishment of a new political party under the Thai Rak Thai name.

Election Commissioner Somchai Chuingprasert reports on an incident in which members of the Thai Rak Thai Party filed a request to continue using their old party name in the formation of a new political party. Mr. Somchai reveals that Thai Rak Thai members who have not had their political rights revoked by the Constitutional Court may carry out this motion. Other groups wishing to create a new political party may also file a request with the Election Commission of Thailand to use the Thai Rak Thai name as well.

Mr. Somchai adds that the Thai Rak Thai Party is currently in the process of settling its account books in preparation for the party's dissolution.

Source: Thai National News Bureau Public Relations Department - 06 June 2007

[sriracha john]

Here's a happy man... he doesn't have to depend on being Chairman of the Lawn Dart Tossers of Thailand...

Surapong Suebwonglee

Surapong Suebwonglee, a former key Thai Rak Thai figure, yesterday emerged as a potential leader of a new political party that ex-Thai Rak Thai members hope to set up under the old name.

Mr Surapong said he was ready to work with other party members who have not been stripped of electoral rights. Mr Surapong, who was Information and Communications Minister in the Thaksin administration, is one of those tipped to head the new party to be set up. He was not a Thai Rak Thai executive of the party and therefore escaped the five-year ban. However, he said he must consult other ex-Thai Rak Thai figures on the chances of his assuming the leadership. Pongthep Thepkarnchana, another ex-Thai Rak Thai executive, said former party members were ready to revive the Thai Rak Thai banner, although the Election Commission had said earlier that the new party might not be allowed to use the old party name. The banned executives will take supporter roles as the new party prepares for the general election tentatively set for December. The new party will also adopt Thai Rak Thai policies as its own.

Continued here:

http://www.bangkokpost.com/News/06Jun2007_news01.php

Edited June 6, 2007 by sriracha john

[hammered]

EC says TRT members not charged by court may request usage of original TRT name in new party

The Election Commission (EC) of Thailand indicates that members of the Thai Rak Thai Party who have not had their political rights revoked may appeal for the establishment of a new political party under the Thai Rak Thai name.

Election Commissioner Somchai Chuingprasert reports on an incident in which members of the Thai Rak Thai Party filed a request to continue using their old party name in the formation of a new political party. Mr. Somchai reveals that Thai Rak Thai members who have not had their political rights revoked by the Constitutional Court may carry out this motion. Other groups wishing to create a new political party may also file a request with the Election Commission of Thailand to use the Thai Rak Thai name as well.

Mr. Somchai adds that the Thai Rak Thai Party is currently in the process of settling its account books in preparation for the party's dissolution.

Source: Thai National News Bureau Public Relations Department - 06 June 2007

Hey so anyone can sety up a party and claim the TRT name. I wonder who will be first? Maybe we can have a knuckle over the horrible logo too. Mind you maybe someone should tell whoever wants it that the Shinawatras are reportedly no longer bankrolling the TRT so it may mena less of a windfall than expected. Then again it may justy be that the Shinawatras will now have an easier time in the courtrooms.

[Plus]

Here we have a buch of people, banned from politics for five years, looking for loopholes to circumvent the ban.

Soon we'll have a few parties entirely made of nominees, democratically elected.

If this is not a travesty of law, than what it is?

Not one of those TRT execs accepted any responsibility so far, except Pinij who ersigned from NLA.

[hammered]

Interesting reading the front page of th Post this morning. Right at the end of the main article it has Somsak predicting that the main political players will be Dems, Mahachon, Chart Thai and Matchima. No mention of the rump TRT successor. And this form a fairly astute politician. I wonder what he thinks will happen to the rump TRT?

[Plus]

They banned execs only and only party list MPs were punished, vast majority of MPs are still in the race and need to find a sponsoring party. Matchima or Mahachon will take them on, maybe other regional parties absorbed in TRT will resurrect themselves, if other exTRT groups manage to set up a party for them, they'll join as well.

[Jai Dee]

PM confident new political parties will be allowed to form within 2 weeks

The Prime Minister is confident registration of new political parties may be initiated within 2 weeks.

Prime Minister Gen Surayud Chulanont report that the government's relaxation of enforcement for the Council for Democratic Reform's 15th Announcement will allow polticial parties to engage in political activities. Gen Surayud reports that the registration of new political parties will also be permissible in the next two weeks, following the National Legislative Council's decision on the matter. Greater opportunities for public participation in politics will also be allowed.

The Prime Minister added that a firm date for elections cannot be ascertained at present due to many considerations involved among different groups, including the Election Commission of Thailand.

Source: Thai National News Bureau Public Relations Department - 06 June 2007

[lukamar]

Here we have a buch of people, looking for loopholes to circumvent the ban.

Thought you were talking about work permitless teachers doing border runs there for a second..

[jdinasia]

Let me get this straight JD... You need to address the way you look at right and wrong, it's not like black and white.

Before you jump on your high horse, It's nice being rich in Thailand but it's no wonder so many of them hate most of us and wish we would leave.

You are right it is NOT like black and white ....Thaksin subverted democracy ... it didn't exist here when he finally got tossed for getting the country in this mess. The Junta , IF they return democracy to Thailand in fairly rapid order will be seen as saviours of Thai democracy in the end. If the DO NOT they will be seen as just more of the same. but to talk about them as if Democracy (even though it didn't exist) is good and anything they have done is bad is just far too black and white!

as for wanting people to leave? LOL .... I am here .. am not running into that sentiment from the poor at all! Maybe you can explain that to me from Canada?

[sriracha john]

Thammarak, Pongsak face criminal charges

The National Counter Corruption Commission (NCCC) plans to press charges against former TRT party executives Gen Thammarak Isarangkura and Pongsak Raktapongpaisal. NCCC commissioner Vicha Mahakhun said yesterday that the two could face criminal charges for corruption and for intervening in the work of an independent agency, namely the Election Commission. The Constitution Tribunal on May 30 ordered that the Thai Rak Thai party be disbanded for committing electoral fraud. Former deputy party leader Gen Thammarak and former deputy party secretary-general Pongsak are allegedly connected to bribing election officer Amornwit Suwanpha. Mr Amornwit is accused of adding 61 members of the little-known Pattana Chart Thai party to the Election Commission's database so that they could contest in the April 2 election that was held last year.

Continued here:

http://www.bangkokpost.com/News/06Jun2007_news09.php

[sriracha john]

PTV Mob Gets New Name

PTV demonstrators have decided to formally call themselves the Alliance of Democracy against Dictatorship *while it's entirely understandable that their new acronym, ADD, might easily be confused with Attention Deficit Disorder, it should not be* and plan to round-up all other anti-coup protesters to join forces.

Sunday night's PTV rally was uneventful, with security by 400 police officers. Metal detectors were set up at all entrances to prevent violence instigated by third parties.

Sunday night saw about 1,000 people joining the rally, which continued until 2am. The speeches on stage continued to target the Council for National Security and praised deposed premier Thaksin Shinawatra.

PTV executive Jatuporn Prompan revealed that daily gatherings will be held from 4pm at Sanamluang until June 24, which coincides with the 76th anniversary of the change in the country's ruling system.

The group has also adopted the official title of Alliance for Democracy against Dictatorship and will invite other anti-coup groups to join their rallies against the coup-makers. A formal press conference will be held in the next couple of days to announce this.

- Thailand Outlook

[rken]

Look at the position Venezuala is in. An elected president has just band the most popular television network in the country. So much for that democracy. All democracies are not created equal.

He closed the station after Globovision encouraged an attempt on Chavez's life. There are few country leaders that would let that go on and Chavez is no different. Relating that to Thailand during the coup thee military had armed guards posted in all media outlets instantly to make sure that did not happen to them and more recently the military closed radio stations because they got a call from the ex-PM. The difference is Chavez was elected and the military was not.

And I wonder why they would do a thing like that. He is so bad that the largest station in the country would risk there very existance to criticise him. Don't sound like a sound buisness move to me. There must be some reasons why they have taken this stance other that cocaine and Oil becoming the two biggest exports of the country and to mention budding up with Castro, the leader of Iran and dont forget Korea. Or do you love them to. Next you'll be comparing Bush 2 to Hilter and blaming the US for 911.

[hammered]

A quote from Alexander Tyler:

“A democracy cannot exist as a permanent form of government. It can only exist until the voters discover that they can vote themselves largesse form the public treasury. From that moment on, the majority always votes for the candidates promising the most benefits from the public treasury with the result that a democracy always collapses over loose fiscal policy followed by a dictatorship. The average age of the world’s greatest civilizations has been 200 years.”

[Plus]

It is not, perhaps, unreasonable to conclude, that a pure and perfect democracy is a thing not attainable by man, constituted as he is of contending elements of vice and virtue, and ever mainly influenced by the predominant principle of self-interest. It may, indeed, be confidently asserted, that there never was that government called a republic, which was not ultimately ruled by a single will, and, therefore, (however bold may seem the paradox,) virtually and substantially a monarchy.

ATTRIBUTION: ALEXANDER FRASER TYTLER, LORD WOODHOUSELEE, University History, vol. 1, book 2, chapter 6, p. 216 (1838).

>>>>

Either way, it's damning.

[ColPyat]

It is not, perhaps, unreasonable to conclude, that a pure and perfect democracy is a thing not attainable by man, constituted as he is of contending elements of vice and virtue, and ever mainly influenced by the predominant principle of self-interest. It may, indeed, be confidently asserted, that there never was that government called a republic, which was not ultimately ruled by a single will, and, therefore, (however bold may seem the paradox,) virtually and substantially a monarchy.

ATTRIBUTION: ALEXANDER FRASER TYTLER, LORD WOODHOUSELEE, University History, vol. 1, book 2, chapter 6, p. 216 (1838).

>>>>

Either way, it's damning.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Alexander_Tytler

Alexander Fraser Tytler, Lord Woodhouselee (October 15, 1747 - January 5, 1813)

http://lorencollins.net/tytler.html

....

And that is where the vice of misattribution lies. Perhaps the words speak the truth of democratic governments; or perhaps they do not. But either way, attributing the words to a scholar who never spoke them is to lend to them an authority and reliability that they do not deserve. Anonymous quotes, which these almost certainly are, should not be given fictitious attributions merely to lend credence to the messages they impart. To do so is to favor persuasiveness over accuracy, and to sacrifice truth for the sake of image.

-----------------------

Yes, damning...

Edited June 6, 2007 by ColPyat

[rken]

It is not, perhaps, unreasonable to conclude, that a pure and perfect democracy is a thing not attainable by man, constituted as he is of contending elements of vice and virtue, and ever mainly influenced by the predominant principle of self-interest. It may, indeed, be confidently asserted, that there never was that government called a republic, which was not ultimately ruled by a single will, and, therefore, (however bold may seem the paradox,) virtually and substantially a monarchy.

ATTRIBUTION: ALEXANDER FRASER TYTLER, LORD WOODHOUSELEE, University History, vol. 1, book 2, chapter 6, p. 216 (1838).

>>>>

Either way, it's damning.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Alexander_Tytler

Alexander Fraser Tytler, Lord Woodhouselee (October 15, 1747 - January 5, 1813)

http://lorencollins.net/tytler.html

....

And that is where the vice of misattribution lies. Perhaps the words speak the truth of democratic governments; or perhaps they do not. But either way, attributing the words to a scholar who never spoke them is to lend to them an authority and reliability that they do not deserve. Anonymous quotes, which these almost certainly are, should not be given fictitious attributions merely to lend credence to the messages they impart. To do so is to favor persuasiveness over accuracy, and to sacrifice truth for the sake of image.

-----------------------

Yes, damning...

here, here

[A_Traveller]

Not wishing to exacerbate the argument, quite the reverse, but the quotation was sourced, not unreasonably from Respectfully Quoted which many would view as reasonably authoritative.

It so happens that I too recognise it as one which has been subject to criticism {but only because of a friendship with a Scottish historian} as to authorship but I don't think it would be fair to impune the original posters motives as to deliberately posting a quotation knowing it to be falsely attributed.

Benefit of the doubt anyone?

Regards

PS don't know if this link will work, but the book [universal History] is scanned and on line. Searching for 'pure and perfect democracy' brings up page 216

Page 216

/edit add link & add book title + scanned//

Edited June 6, 2007 by A_Traveller

[rken]

Look at the position Venezuala is in. An elected president has just band the most popular television network in the country. So much for that democracy. All democracies are not created equal.

He closed the station after Globovision encouraged an attempt on Chavez's life. There are few country leaders that would let that go on and Chavez is no different. Relating that to Thailand during the coup thee military had armed guards posted in all media outlets instantly to make sure that did not happen to them and more recently the military closed radio stations because they got a call from the ex-PM. The difference is Chavez was elected and the military was not.

Aren't you stretching the truth a little bit. He has accused them of attempts on his life. No arrests as of yet no trial, just accusations. What better way to silence the opposition party and freedom of the press. Now he is threatening to shut down another station, he is accusing it of supporting attempts on his life also. He is also threatening to nationalize the banks as well as the steel industry. Castro socialism at its best. Sorry not buying your justification.

[Jai Dee]

CNS Chairman insists military could not set up political party

The Royal Thai Army Commander-in-Chief and Council for National Security (CNS) Chairman, Gen. Sonthi Boonyaratglin, reiterates that the Royal Thai Army could not set up a political party.

After an informal meeting with Defence Minister Boonrawd Somthas, Gen. Sonthi says the meeting was unrelated to politics. Gen. Sonthi says he has ensured Gen. Boonrawd that the current situation is under control.

As for the rumor saying the CNS may set up a new political party as a nominee for the CNS in the future, Gen. Sonthi insists that the army could not establish its own party. He adds that it is normal for certain sides to come up with issues to defame the CNS.

Source: Thai National News Bureau Public Relations Department - 06 June 2007

[Mid]

CNS Chairman insists military could not set up political party

as opposed to retired military officers ..??

[ColPyat]

Not wishing to exacerbate the argument, quite the reverse, but the quotation was sourced, not unreasonably from Respectfully Quoted which many would view as reasonably authoritative.

No problem with that. My answer was also not directed at the original poster. We all know that democracy naturally poses certain problems and is not the ideal system, but staying with Churchill's quote...

My answer was directed at the secondary poster who used the extension of this quote to prove his often shown disregard for Democracy in itself and support for dictatorial forms of government as something that is even worth thinking about.

Anyhow, lets get back to the topic...

Edited June 6, 2007 by ColPyat

[rken]

My friend emailed this to me. Any thoughts

To put this in context - the Thai Rak Thai (Means Thais love Thais) was the ruling party under then Prime Minister Taksin who is living in Sydney after being deposed by the current military government.

In addition it has happened within 3 months of the next election. Thai law says you must be a member of a party for a minimum of 90days to stand for office. Simple arithmetic will show that in the vacuum of these dissolutions of both parties the only people left will be the minor parties. Back in context of Australia in means the CURRENT members of the Democrats, Greens, and the Smokers Party will be the only ones eligible for standing for parliament. Again simple arithmetic will tell you that they will not have enough to fill a parliament so the election is forfeit and the current non elected military junta "sadly but for the benefit of the country will hold onto power just a bit longer" until a new set of officials can be found and new elections in say 3 years can be done.

For Thailand and anyone living here includind foreigners this is a very serious development

[A_Traveller]

My friend emailed this to me. Any thoughts

To put this in context - the Thai Rak Thai (Means Thais love Thais) was the ruling party under then Prime Minister Taksin who is living in Sydney after being deposed by the current military government.

In addition it has happened within 3 months of the next election. Thai law says you must be a member of a party for a minimum of 90days to stand for office. Simple arithmetic will show that in the vacuum of these dissolutions of both parties the only people left will be the minor parties. Back in context of Australia in means the CURRENT members of the Democrats, Greens, and the Smokers Party will be the only ones eligible for standing for parliament. Again simple arithmetic will tell you that they will not have enough to fill a parliament so the election is forfeit and the current non elected military junta "sadly but for the benefit of the country will hold onto power just a bit longer" until a new set of officials can be found and new elections in say 3 years can be done.

For Thailand and anyone living here includind foreigners this is a very serious development

FYI there are presently, after the dissolutions, 32 licenced political parties in Thailand and if there's to be an election in December, that's presently @ 180 days away. It is possible that the EC will allow some form of expedited party registration, though the process is said to normally take about 6 months.

Regards

EC Parties Lst

/edit typo //

Edited June 6, 2007 by A_Traveller

[rken]

My friend emailed this to me. Any thoughts

To put this in context - the Thai Rak Thai (Means Thais love Thais) was the ruling party under then Prime Minister Taksin who is living in Sydney after being deposed by the current military government.

In addition it has happened within 3 months of the next election. Thai law says you must be a member of a party for a minimum of 90days to stand for office. Simple arithmetic will show that in the vacuum of these dissolutions of both parties the only people left will be the minor parties. Back in context of Australia in means the CURRENT members of the Democrats, Greens, and the Smokers Party will be the only ones eligible for standing for parliament. Again simple arithmetic will tell you that they will not have enough to fill a parliament so the election is forfeit and the current non elected military junta "sadly but for the benefit of the country will hold onto power just a bit longer" until a new set of officials can be found and new elections in say 3 years can be done.

For Thailand and anyone living here includind foreigners this is a very serious development

FYI there are presently, after the dissolutions, 32 licenced political parties in Thailand and if there's to be an election in December, that's presently @ 180 days away. It is possible that the EC will allow some form of expedited party registration, though the process is said to normally take about 6 months.

Regards

EC Parties Lst

/edit typo //

Thanks for the info

[jdinasia]

Not wishing to exacerbate the argument, quite the reverse, but the quotation was sourced, not unreasonably from Respectfully Quoted which many would view as reasonably authoritative.

No problem with that. My answer was also not directed at the original poster. We all know that democracy naturally poses certain problems and is not the ideal system, but staying with Churchill's quote...

My answer was directed at the secondary poster who used the extension of this quote to prove his often shown disregard for Democracy in itself and support for dictatorial forms of government as something that is even worth thinking about.

Anyhow, lets get back to the topic...

Yes dictatorial govt's like Thaksins are NOT worth thinking about

[Mid]

Tribunal threatens jail term against criticsJune 6, 2007 : Last updated 05:46 pm (Thai local time)

The Constitution Tribunal would not tolerate "non-academic" criticism over its rulings of the dissolution cases of the Thai Rak Thai Party and the Democrat Party, tribunal secretary-general Paiboon Warahapaitoon said Wednesday. He warned those insulting the judges would be put in jail.

The comments based on academic purposes were welcome not only among the tribunal's cases but also other courts, he said.

If the criticism was a type of allegations or using abusive words, however, the persons would be regarded for ruining the national stability because the tribunal judges were state officials, Paiboon said.

Any insult on them would receive tougher punishment than on the ordinary people, he said, adding the police were collecting evidence related to those insulting the tribunal.

The punishment term could be serving seven years in prison.

The Nation

all animals are equal , some more so than others ..........................................

[Mid]

Chaturon says CNS deliberately delays party registration

Thai Rak Thai group leader Chaturon Chaisang attacked the Council for National Security (CNS) for deliberately slowing the process to allow party registration.

"It was a deliberate tactic to delay the process in order to eradicate and destroy those who oppose the CNS, especially those who used to be Thai Rak Thai Party members,'' Chaturon said.

He was commenting after the Cabinet suspended the ban on political-party activity, but has asked the Council of State to study whether it can lift the ban on party registration.

The Nation

[slimdog]

FYI there are presently, after the dissolutions, 32 licenced political parties in Thailand and if there's to be an election in December, that's presently @ 180 days away. It is possible that the EC will allow some form of expedited party registration, though the process is said to normally take about 6 months.

Regards

EC Parties Lst

Forming a new Political party is quite a straight forward process, and can probably be done in a matter of days, providing that all the paperwork is in order. Where the process becomes more difficult is to re-establish a former political party, as before this can be done, the former political party must be fully audited, as state funds are provided to political parties in order to carry out their work. Therefore for TRT to be re-established could take 6 months or longer, (maximum 12 months).

Historically the constitutional court has dissolved around 10 political parties per year since it's formation in 1998, some because the political party has merged with another party. The most common form of dissolution is because a party has failed to comply with Section 29 of the organic law of Political parties which states that a Party has 180 days to acquire 5000 members spread throughout the Kingdom, and have representative offices in each region.

[chuchok]

If the criticism was a type of allegations or using abusive words, however, the persons would beregarded for ruining the national stability because the tribunal judges were state officials, Paiboon said.