Maximum 15a allowed

[sead]

So. The electrical guys are installing and I got a visit from government who has to check and approve the job. I bought a nice 50a circuit box with 14 circuit breakers. The guy from government want to install from outside to my house 15a  cable and he wants to use a 25 cable. I told him I need 50a from outside because I'm having 5 aircons and fans in all rooms. He says can not. With 15a I can't have the light on and use my water boiler. Anyone knows wth thus is all about and how to solve this

[WEBBYB808]

Thats all I ever seen brought to houses in Villages.   15A to any house.  You need your own transformer  and a way to step up the amps and a disconnect  box installed 

[sead]

1 minute ago, WEBBYB808 said:

Thats all I ever seen brought to houses in Villages.   15A to any house.  You need your own transformer  and a way to step up the amps and a disconnect  box installed 

The electrician just now promised it will be enough for a couple of aircons and pc and fans in all rooms. That's gonna be interesting

[WEBBYB808]

2 minutes ago, sead said:

The electrician just now promised it will be enough for a couple of aircons and pc and fans in all rooms. That's gonna be interesting

I had a house two aircons, One Refrigerator,  One TV. A microwave...  and during brown outs, or times of high usage i barely got enough power

[sead]

1 minute ago, WEBBYB808 said:

I had a house two aircons, One Refrigerator,  One TV. A microwave...  and during brown outs, or times of high usage i barely got enough power

Oh dear. Well I have a campervan and it's a 15a breaker. When I have my heating on and I want to make tea and boiling my water. It goes of. Is it possible to have 2 power supplies on 1 adress?

[WEBBYB808]

4 minutes ago, sead said:

Oh dear. Well I have a campervan and it's a 15a breaker. When I have my heating on and I want to make tea and boiling my water. It goes of. Is it possible to have 2 power supplies on 1 adress?

You just need to get some inverters,  transformers and bridges to meet requirements 

[Jerno]

49 minutes ago, WEBBYB808 said:

Thats all I ever seen brought to houses in Villages.   15A to any house.  You need your own transformer  and a way to step up the amps and a disconnect  box installed 

What is the voltage of the inbound 15amps?  How does a transformer increase amps unless by increasing voltage?

Edited January 9, 2022 by Jerno
.

[WEBBYB808]

2 minutes ago, Jerno said:

What is the voltage of the inbound 15amps?  How does a transformer increase amps unless by reducing voltage. 

220-240 Volts DC

[Jerno]

40 minutes ago, WEBBYB808 said:

You just need to get some inverters,  transformers and bridges to meet requirements 

For us interested dummies, how does this electrical equipment work to increase amps?

[Guest Isaanlife]

1 hour ago, sead said:

The electrician just now promised it will be enough for a couple of aircons and pc and fans in all rooms. That's gonna be interesting

Never trust a Thai electrician.

 

Do your own load analysis.

 

Add up the average amps used for each device and you will have the answer.

 

Realize when some high power devices first start up, they are higher amp draw than nominal

Edited January 9, 2022 by Isaanlife

[Moonlover]

I suggest that the O/P goes and visits this thread. It's a few years old, the info is still valid.

 

[MrJ2U]

We paid to have 3 phase wiring brought to our house. It cost us about 18,000 baht to reach from the main road/transformer.

 

I needed that because we have 8 Air-conditioners and 4 water pumps on our property.  Not including fans,TV's, washing machines,pool, etc.,

 

I'm not an electrician but you need 3 phase wiring brought to your house.

 

Heres a link in an older Asia Now the resembles your problem.

 

https://aseannow.com/topic/998559-how-to-wire-a-house-using-3-phase/

 

 

...And heres some prices from PEA.

I live in Issan so prices will differ in different areas;

 

https://images.app.goo.gl/ki8ufBdgAvYtRQDX9

[Jerno]

1 hour ago, WEBBYB808 said:

220-240 Volts DC

And again, how does inverters,  transformers and bridge increase amps?  Can you please explain for the sake of us electrical illiterates.

[Jerno]

41 minutes ago, MrJ2U said:

We paid to have 3 phase wiring brought to our house. It cost us about 18,000 baht to reach from the main road/transformer.

 

I needed that because we have 8 Air-conditioners and 4 water pumps on our property.  Not including fans,TV's, washing machines,pool, etc.,

 

I'm not an electrician but you need 3 phase wiring brought to your house.

 

Heres a link in an older Asia Now the resembles your problem.

 

https://aseannow.com/topic/998559-how-to-wire-a-house-using-3-phase/

 

 

...And heres some prices from PEA.

I live in Issan so prices will differ in different areas;

 

https://images.app.goo.gl/ki8ufBdgAvYtRQDX9

Are there restrictions in who or where 3 phase can be supplied to a house?  Why is there 15A single phase limit?  Is it simply aspect of paying more for 3 phase?

[Guest Isaanlife]

2 hours ago, MrJ2U said:

We paid to have 3 phase wiring brought to our house. It cost us about 18,000 baht to reach from the main road/transformer.

 

I needed that because we have 8 Air-conditioners and 4 water pumps on our property.  Not including fans,TV's, washing machines,pool, etc.,

 

I'm not an electrician but you need 3 phase wiring brought to your house.

 

Heres a link in an older Asia Now the resembles your problem.

 

https://aseannow.com/topic/998559-how-to-wire-a-house-using-3-phase/

 

 

...And heres some prices from PEA.

I live in Issan so prices will differ in different areas;

 

https://images.app.goo.gl/ki8ufBdgAvYtRQDX9

Can you share what your electric bill is?

[sead]

2 hours ago, MrJ2U said:

We paid to have 3 phase wiring brought to our house. It cost us about 18,000 baht to reach from the main road/transformer.

 

I needed that because we have 8 Air-conditioners and 4 water pumps on our property.  Not including fans,TV's, washing machines,pool, etc.,

 

I'm not an electrician but you need 3 phase wiring brought to your house.

 

Heres a link in an older Asia Now the resembles your problem.

 

https://aseannow.com/topic/998559-how-to-wire-a-house-using-3-phase/

 

 

...And heres some prices from PEA.

I live in Issan so prices will differ in different areas;

 

https://images.app.goo.gl/ki8ufBdgAvYtRQDX9

Will check into this. I'm thinking of challenging the electrician that guarantees it's enough with 15a  into house. And after if it isn't then get some more simehow

[Crossy]

There is often confusion over the meter sizing, not helped by the PEA people being just as confused.

 

Generally the following are offered:-

• 5/15 - Up to 15A max, suitable for your shed.
• 15/45 - Up to 45A max, most of us manage with this size (this is sometimes called a "15 Amp" meter, hence the confusion).
• 30/100 - Up to 100A, not offered everywhere.

All can be offered in single-phase or 3-phase.

 

@sead which of these are you being offered by PEA?? Do you have a temporary "construction" meter? What type is it, the meter will be marked (or post a photo)?

 

Has anyone done a prospective load calculation? As a quick and dirty guesstimate I think you would be OK on a 15/45 single-phase as an absolute minimum (I suspect this is what your sparks is actually offering), 30/100 would be better (but probably not available).

 

As a comparison, we have 3 beds and lounge with A/C and 3 x 6kW water heaters. Obviously this lot isn't often all running at once. We have a 15/45 on a 50A incoming breaker, the incomer has never opened on overload.

[MrJ2U]

10 hours ago, Jerno said:

Are there restrictions in who or where 3 phase can be supplied to a house?  Why is there 15A single phase limit?  Is it simply aspect of paying more for 3 phase?

It's just more expensive.

 

You'll be able large loads.

 

Best to head down to your local PEA.  Bring someone who speaks Thai.

 

They we're very helpful.

 

They'll come out and see what they'll need, give you a price.  It'll take a week or or longer to even get them started on it.

 

Best get on it as soon possible. 

 

Good luck.

 

 

[MrJ2U]

9 hours ago, Isaanlife said:

Can you share what your electric bill is?

It's cheaper now in the cooler season.  It was a nice 4,500 last month.

 

But it can get close to 9,000-10,000  in the hotter months.

 

Our Mitsubishi Aircons can be put on "Feels Like" mode which alternates between 24 C and "Dry" mode automatically, saving electricity while being comfortable.

 

Pool pump is a "variable speed pump".  Expensive but pays for itself in electricity savings.

 

All our lights indoors are LED and our entire outdoor areas are solar lights on timers.

 

The solar lighting is better than I expected, very impressed.

 

 

[MrJ2U]

9 hours ago, sead said:

Will check into this. I'm thinking of challenging the electrician that guarantees it's enough with 15a  into house. And after if it isn't then get some more simehow

What size (BTU) are you using?

 

All our air cons are on 30 amps.

 

Neighbors have a 9 btu.  Seems ok on 15amp but lights dim when its on.  I wouldn't be comfortable with our appliances plugged into that situation.

 

Also, if you have electric instant water heaters in your shower, they'll need more than 15 amps for sure.

 

 

 

Maybe get another electrician in to see.  PEA should know of a few.  Thats where a Thai speaker helps.

 

 

[Guest Isaanlife]

1 hour ago, MrJ2U said:

It's cheaper now in the cooler season.  It was a nice 4,500 last month.

 

But it can get close to 9,000-10,000  in the hotter months.

 

Our Mitsubishi Aircons can be put on "Feels Like" mode which alternates between 24 C and "Dry" mode automatically, saving electricity while being comfortable.

 

Pool pump is a "variable speed pump".  Expensive but pays for itself in electricity savings.

 

All our lights indoors are LED and our entire outdoor areas are solar lights on timers.

 

The solar lighting is better than I expected, very impressed.

 

 

Thanks for all the info!

[sead]

So after my gf called the PEA yesterday and asked for an upgrade.  1 woman and 2 guys came to my house to check today. Again they guaranteed that it will be enough power. Let's see in couple of weeks when it's finished.. Ty all for information and help. I will check for the smaller AC to use in the rooms.

Edited January 10, 2022 by sead

[Crossy]

16 minutes ago, sead said:

So after my gf called the PEA yesterday and asked for an upgrade.  1 woman and 2 guys came to my house to check today. Again they guaranteed that it will be enough power. Let's see in couple of weeks when it's finished.. Ty all for information and help. I will check for the smaller AC to use in the rooms.

 

Yeah, I'm 99% sure your "15 Amp" meter will end up being a 15/45. You should be fine.

 

[sead]

7 hours ago, Crossy said:

There is often confusion over the meter sizing, not helped by the PEA people being just as confused.

 

Generally the following are offered:-

• 5/15 - Up to 15A max, suitable for your shed.
• 15/45 - Up to 45A max, most of us manage with this size (this is sometimes called a "15 Amp" meter, hence the confusion).
• 30/100 - Up to 100A, not offered everywhere.

All can be offered in single-phase or 3-phase.

 

@sead which of these are you being offered by PEA?? Do you have a temporary "construction" meter? What type is it, the meter will be marked (or post a photo)?

 

Has anyone done a prospective load calculation? As a quick and dirty guesstimate I think you would be OK on a 15/45 single-phase as an absolute minimum (I suspect this is what your sparks is actually offering), 30/100 would be better (but probably not available).

 

As a comparison, we have 3 beds and lounge with A/C and 3 x 6kW water heaters. Obviously this lot isn't often all running at once. We have a 15/45 on a 50A incoming breaker, the incomer has never opened on overload.

I just talked to my gf and she said she showed them the diagram where it said 15/45a and that's what I want. They said that's what I'm getting and all other houses have 5/15a. This has happened alot of times when I want to buy internet or other technical sources then it's total confusion until I show them some paper and suddenly when they point out then it's all clear

[sead]

4 minutes ago, Crossy said:

 

Yeah, I'm 99% sure your "15 Amp" meter will end up being a 15/45. You should be fine.

 

It was 15/45 Ty. 

[sead]

So Ty all. After PEA arrived today I got clarified that I got 15/45 

Now my electrician want to put a 25 cable whereas I want to go with an 50 from outside into my house. ALU is cheaper. Any difference. I go 35m from the box.

Best regards

[Crossy]

9 minutes ago, sead said:

So Ty all. After PEA arrived today I got clarified that I got 15/45 

Now my electrician want to put a 25 cable whereas I want to go with an 50 from outside into my house. ALU is cheaper. Any difference. I go 35m from the box.

Best regards

 

25mm² will be just fine in copper for a 35m distance (actually 16mm² copper would be OK but might be limited by PEA regs).

 

If you want to go Al then you need to go one size bigger (so actually 25mm² Al would be OK) and you will need to have copper pigtails spliced on the end to avoid connection issues in your main breaker (keep the splice outside the house), but for such a short run is it really worth the saving?

 

If it was a long run the I'd definitely go Al, much cheaper and rather less likely to wander off in the night.

 

[sead]

1 hour ago, Crossy said:

 

25mm² will be just fine in copper for a 35m distance (actually 16mm² copper would be OK but might be limited by PEA regs).

 

If you want to go Al then you need to go one size bigger (so actually 25mm² Al would be OK) and you will need to have copper pigtails spliced on the end to avoid connection issues in your main breaker (keep the splice outside the house), but for such a short run is it really worth the saving?

 

If it was a long run the I'd definitely go Al, much cheaper and rather less likely to wander off in the night.

 

Hahahah. Ty for info. 

[flbkk]

To the ones asking how to increase the apps. Looks like OP and all his neighbors are on the same transformer. It increases the voltage from a higher voltage down to the household 240 V. They are only willing to give you 15 A, so as not to overload that transformer. If you get them to put a dedicated transformer just for you, it will step down the same high voltage to the 240 V house power, but it will not be shared with neighbors, and you can have whatever amps you want.

Edited January 10, 2022 by flbkk

[RocketDog]

19 hours ago, Jerno said:

What is the voltage of the inbound 15amps?  How does a transformer increase amps unless by increasing voltage?

 

I'm going to step in until @Crossy shows up.

 

Close, and good question. You are correct to be skeptical.

 

Watts(power) = Volts * Amp (RMS).

One cannot increase the available power but can trade off amps for volts or vice versa. 100v * 1 Amp =100 Watts. 1V * 100A = 100W.

One good resson for using 220v in many countires is simple. To deliver the same power to a load lower currents are needed if the voltage is higher. Lower current allows less copper, so wiring is cheaper.

 

Wiring conductors are rated by temperature rise reached when conducting current (amperes). The conductor heats because it has resistance. The power dissipated in the wire is a function of the current it carries and its intrinsic resistance, not the voltage: P = A * A * R. So by using higher voltage the same wire can carry more power with the same power dissipation (heat) by lowering the current. Do a search for Ohm's Law; it's not rocket surgery.

 

Overhead power lines operate at tens of kilovolts or higher for this same reason. At lower voltage the power wires would become solid copper bars, very expensive.

Long ago, for historical reasons Edison convinced the American authorities to use 120VDC power, which eventually became 60Hz AC, but remained at 120V. So American homes have large copper conductors usually 12AWG, for 20A breakers. Copper has traditionally been cheap in America because it's easily been mined there.

 

At this point changing to 220V would save a lot of cost, but hey, America just prints the money it needs, so who cares?

 

Some day the Piper will come calling for his pay and it will be a sad time. That's why exactly why I'm taking my assets out of America and into offshore banks in different currencies. I laugh when Americans on this forum angst about putting money into 'untrustworthy' Thai banks and losing their 0.1% interest. But that's another rant.